Guild Wars 2

SneakyTouchy.6043:

MailMail.6534:

Please enlighten me. When/where have malicious situations been instated against players in other games?

And you’re right. The system is such a mess and punishing enough. The devs are very busy. I doubt they’d waste their time targeting players. The idea is really laughable.

When and where is irrelevant for two reasons. First, it’s a matter of fact that devs are human and all humans have a chance to behave poorly, lie, and cover up their poo to maintain their position. Secondly, there’s no evidence that Anet is doing it, so it’s not really a point worth supporting. I’m just saying that it’s not ridiculous to suspect based on human nature.

My biggest suspicion for these problems comes from this:

<Deviation default=“350” min=“30” max=“350”

This allows players with 1100 MMR to match up against players with 1800 MMR if the match deviates from 1450 MMR. This is virtually the entire spectrum of the PVP player base. Players are not being split into any form of ladder like they were during the first 4 or 5 seasons. This probably explains why matchmaking feels nearly instantaneous when populations are low. It’s putting players together from opposite ends of the bell curve.

This. This game has never had a strong PvP scene in my opinion and it’s only gotten more and more small. Low population in general with this kind of deviation is just asking for problems.

Maybe if Anet had a better approach to balance with good turnaround and feedback PvP would take off and they’d have a healthy pool of skill levels to pull from at all hours.

Nah, won’t happen. Thanks for the ignorant shield bash nerf by the way pvp devs.

Where’s the spvp leaderboard list?
Why isn’t there an easy way to see your group rating vs your enemies rating?

If you have nothing to hide.. why make it so difficult to find out these things?

Im taking ss of post game player names. I want to know total ratings and see how unfair these games have been.

BTW: am gold3 and just got a teammate saying he needs this win to hit gold himself. Im going to guess we were vs all golds maybe even some plats XD I mean at this point all we can do is guess or confront your teammates after game since GW makes sure to hide their rigged matchmaking system by doing away with any real transparency concerning yours and your enemies total ratings.

At the start of the match, add all players to your friends list and nickname them so you remember what team they were on. Screenshot friends leaderboard. After the match, screen shot the leaderboard again.

This will tell you everyone’s ranking at the time the match started, and tell you how much they gained/lost after the match.

Sadly, this can only be done about once per day since the leaderboard seems to take forever to update with new friends once you’ve already checked it. Would be much simpler if Anet would just show everyone’s pre-match rating and gain/loss on the scoreboard at the end of the match.

Shaogin.2679:

At the start of the match, add all players to your friends list and nickname them so you remember what team they were on. Screenshot friends leaderboard. After the match, screen shot the leaderboard again.

This will tell you everyone’s ranking at the time the match started, and tell you how much they gained/lost after the match.

Sadly, this can only be done about once per day since the leaderboard seems to take forever to update with new friends once you’ve already checked it. Would be much simpler if Anet would just show everyone’s pre-match rating and gain/loss on the scoreboard at the end of the match.

DW Evan is going to leave us a link to show us how to find that info in-game. Prove to us all how transparent GW2 is.

……just wait.

Sir, my of friend just bought his kitten HoT edition and he destroyed this ranked pvp system so badly 25 games without 1 win, seriously Anet. This is the work ranked MM game I have been playing.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm is a joke.

Evan Lesh.3295:

I’ll just leave this here:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

Then why are platinum players getting qued with gold players? Please explain this if MMR is the reason the REAL reason how are people platinum 2 and up getting gold tier players? I myself even got a SILVER player on my team once when I was in the top 250. The MMR system is a joke still and needs to be worked on still. As to Anet having a naughty list I don’t doubt it. And what’re you going to do about the players being paid to throw games?? It’s half way through the season and players have yet to be banned. GJ anet…

WizardBro.4510:

Evan Lesh.3295:

I’ll just leave this here:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

Then why are platinum players getting qued with gold players? Please explain this if MMR is the reason the REAL reason how are people platinum 2 and up getting gold tier players? I myself even got a SILVER player on my team once when I was in the top 250. The MMR system is a joke still and needs to be worked on still. As to Anet having a naughty list I don’t doubt it. And what’re you going to do about the players being paid to throw games?? It’s half way through the season and players have yet to be banned. GJ anet…

Queue times
Player population

Faux Play.6104:

WizardBro.4510:

Evan Lesh.3295:

I’ll just leave this here:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

Then why are platinum players getting qued with gold players? Please explain this if MMR is the reason the REAL reason how are people platinum 2 and up getting gold tier players? I myself even got a SILVER player on my team once when I was in the top 250. The MMR system is a joke still and needs to be worked on still. As to Anet having a naughty list I don’t doubt it. And what’re you going to do about the players being paid to throw games?? It’s half way through the season and players have yet to be banned. GJ anet…

Queue times
Player population

Pretty much this. The longer you are in the queue the more the search widens.

Now if the system is taking a pool of 10 players within range of eachother, and splitting them into two balanced teams, it would still work out theoretically.

However, if the system is forming a team of 5 players, then looking for another team of 5 players to match them against, this is where we would see these examples of teams being “stacked”.

I was under the assumption that the matchmaker was forming balanced teams from a pool of 10 players, but if this isn’t the case, then that is most likely a major contributer to the issues players are having with stacked teams, especially during times when population is low.

I myself had a match where I was teamed up with 3 top players. The opposing team was just a group of average players. We won 500-18. Match wasn’t entertaining at all. I could of afk’d the whole match and it wouldn’t of mattered.

I believe another large contributer to the issue is the duo queue. Now I am a huge advocate of being able to team up with friends, but there are many cases where a match would be more balanced if certain players were placed on opposite teams, but if they are grouped then they are essentially preventing the matchmaker from creating a more balanced match.

Also, now that we have an avenue for 5v5 team pvp through the automated tournaments, it wouldn’t be such a big deal anymore for ranked pvp to move to a completely solo queue model. I also believe that adjusting rating based off your team’s average mmr vs the other team’s average mmr would be a much better approach.

Following the same policy…
Ill just leave this here…. and give no answer…

yeah, read this

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Investigating-Rigged-Match-Making/first#post6647466

@Evan Lesh

I’ve read that.

Several times now I’ve asked this question: The pseudo code, as written, implies that “dishonor” can be added to an account to give it worse matches. It also states that dishonor lasts much longer than the dishonor timeout most players think of. (How long?)

In addition, players using an alt to manipulate matches were recently given “dishonor stacks.” All this implies that ANET can and does punish accounts by giving them dishonor.

Is this the case? if so, who can do this? In game GMs? A person told me, in-game, that they were considering changing my rating. Of course, I have no idea whether they actually could.

More broadly though, I think that ANET has simply miscalculated. Match quality needs more priority over speed and strict limits on player rating differences need to happen.

Ithilwen.1529:

@Evan Lesh

I’ve read that.

Several times now I’ve asked this question: The pseudo code, as written, implies that “dishonor” can be added to an account to give it worse matches. It also states that dishonor lasts much longer than the dishonor timeout most players think of. (How long?)

In addition, players using an alt to manipulate matches were recently given “dishonor stacks.” All this implies that ANET can and does punish accounts by giving them dishonor.

Is this the case? if so, who can do this? In game GMs? A person told me, in-game, that they were considering changing my rating. Of course, I have no idea whether they actually could.

More broadly though, I think that ANET has simply miscalculated. Match quality needs more priority over speed and strict limits on player rating differences need to happen.

Each dishonor lasts 4 hours with a timeout of 30s. It is taken into consideration in the matchmaking. Dishoner distance “-100” stacks “-50”
10 stacks for abandon, 3 for que dodge, 1000 if gm bans

Thank you, source please. Are gm’s able to assign dishonor?

Ithilwen.1529:

Thank you, source please. Are gm’s able to assign dishonor?

That’s from the link Evan posted. Actually I mistook all the 0s from a gm ban it’s actually more than I put. You can see it in the code but you have to scroll down to the breakdown of dishonor for the duration, stacks

Ithilwen.1529:

Thank you, source please. Are gm’s able to assign dishonor?

Do you think a gm is out to get you?

Do you get dishonour if you cancel the Q before ready match appears?
- I needed to go to the bathroom : for example?

TPMN.1483:

Do you get dishonour if you cancel the Q before ready match appears?
- I needed to go to the bathroom : for example?

If you leave the que before it pops no, but if it does and you decline then yes. I believe that is how it works

I wondered the same thing last season. It was just weird how I was in Ruby the season before and then I was literally stuck in bronze last season. The people I would get matched up with just wouldn’t play the game. I didn’t understand.

It really does seem like your account get’s flagged so you are perpetually put in matches you ought to lose.

Oh…players say well, that’s crazy then explain how I am from 1 season before from bronze alllllll the way up to gt3 / pt1?

I know my experience is not the mainstream but people don’ believe or understand if you get trapped down in those lower ranks…you…will…not…get…out.
I do honestly believe that they flag players accounts. Becasue I would start to climb and then would hit an exact loss streak. No, not slightly lose more than I win I mean 10+ games back to back. I should have hovered…not loss streaked all the way back down.

There’s no explanation how someone goes from Ruby down to the amber equivalent then back up. How does that happen?!

I can’t conspire as to why but I will continue to say there is nothing nice to be said about the decisions the devs make that work on PVP in this game. literally nothing.

There’s like 100’s of 1000’s nice things that are in this forum that no one wanted to hear.
Since there’s no point in offering suggestions…there’s no point in tip-toeing around the subject. I can’t say…Mmm, I play semi competitively but, it’s not my main squeeze. AFter last season I was done…I play casually but I am competent so. I play a game every so often…I most spend time picking out Legionaries in the pit.

Taltevus.3289:

I know my experience is not the mainstream but people don’ believe or understand if you get trapped down in those lower ranks…you…will…not…get…out.

I believe this rumor has been debunked before in the past where players deliberately derank themselves then move back up from bronze/silver back up.

Only way for some one to get stuck in their rating is if their win-rate is below 53% (l2p issue) and their win gains are incredibly low.

Not many trust what the developers say. They all feel there is unseen manipulation behind the scenes. And how are we to trust them? If every real issue we point out gets silenced? Even if someone did post the truth about matchmaking it would be deleted. So how can we give proper feedback on systems like this?

Sadly we have no choice but to trust them and their MMR system because we are not the devs.

Saiyan.1704:

Taltevus.3289:

I know my experience is not the mainstream but people don’ believe or understand if you get trapped down in those lower ranks…you…will…not…get…out.

I believe this rumor has been debunked before in the past where players deliberately derank themselves then move back up from bronze/silver back up.

Only way for some one to get stuck in their rating is if their win-rate is below 53% (l2p issue) and their win gains are incredibly low.

There’s a logical hole in this assumption.

If there is a hidden MMR beneath what’s displayed, and if players have had those numbers either inflated or dropped, any player with a high rating would still be able to tank their numbers and build them back up. The current question is whether or not ratings are being inflated or dunked through malicious intent to serve an ideological justice kitten, or through a logical error in the matching algorithm.

There were cases back in season 3 and 4 where players would find themselves locked at the bottom of ruby, but upon creating a brand new account, could work all the way up to legendary while still being unable to break ruby on their main account. It was found that the disparity was forced to such extremes that you couldn’t even tank your MMR through solo play if you got it high enough. You could literally sit there in spawn and watch your team win every 4v5 you threw at them. Tanking had to be done with a team, and when it was successful, they did actually end up getting locked at the bottom. Those seasons were deliberately designed to put all the worst players on one team and all the best on the other.

In order to give players a chance to fight at their own level, they have been asking that this disparity be removed. It doesn’t appear that there’s currently any actual algorithm working to balance members because people have been posting proof of it.

Yeah I tested that myself once during the old pip system. My main account was just stuck in ruby for hundreds of matches. Then one day I sign into my gf’s old account out of sheer curiosity and was able to play her into legendary in a little less than 110 games. Went back to my main account and it seriously took like 350 games to even approach the end of diamond. That actually kittened me off. I almost quit GW2 that season.

And this is why I don’t play ranked, too much random bs decides if you increase or decrease in it

Evan Lesh.3295:

I’ll just leave this here:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/PvP_Matchmaking_Algorithm

A couple of suggestions
The dishonor should be removed from matchmaking. Currently yes it’s a penalty to that player but also to the quality of everyone in the match. Increase the lockout for dishonor but never let it affect matchmaking.

The -100 to double professions should be removed or altered. There are a couple of options here. Either remove it completely or only have it affect those with the same build. Ex. A glass staff ele doesn’t contribute in the same way as a healbot tempest. In this example the penalty shouldnt apply at all. There are those who avoid the healbot for as long as possible before changing to be able to advance, but that’s balancing errors.

Zelulose.8695:

Not many trust what the developers say. They all feel there is unseen manipulation behind the scenes. And how are we to trust them? If every real issue we point out gets silenced? Even if someone did post the truth about matchmaking it would be deleted. So how can we give proper feedback on systems like this?

Sadly we have no choice but to trust them and their MMR system because we are not the devs.

Or do what I and some others have done. Trust in our own long term observations. And don’t feed the system more fodder.

I’ll tell yall guys what. I have more balanced and entertaining fights solo roaming in WvW on non stealth classes. Lately all more PvP matches in Ranked have been crap feasts. When I am fighting more stacked teams then I’m getting put on. Yeah I don’t really care what even dev is saying.

I AM PURPOSELY being giving more unfair matches then many others. ANet needs Smite’s MM. That game has highly entertaining matches from bronze and up.

Anyways ANet GG WP you win ANet. Look at my totally hours played in game vs sPvP played now compared to before you started punishing me for who knows what. Only solace is I didn’t fall for the same crap this season. I gave ANet two matches in Ranked PvP season. Got the same stuff.

Guess what guys!? I’ll end Season 6 with 2 placement matches played GGWP again. At this point I am highly entertained that ANet personally is willing to throw me under the bus like that.

PS# Most WvW solo roamers are more skilled at PvP then most of the top 250. When their isn’t a MM to stack matches in their favor. Just thought I’d throw that in there. :p

Guess in the end. The jokes going to be on ANet as more and more and more players stops feeding themselves to the non competitive, not fun or engaging, stacked matches.

Reaper Alim.4176:

I can’t win matches, this is clearly Anet’s fault!

FEAR NOT! SPECIAL SALE!
[Tin Foil Hat] HALF OFF! ONLY 25 GOLD!!!!

Zelulose.8695:

Not many trust what the developers say. They all feel there is unseen manipulation behind the scenes. And how are we to trust them? If every real issue we point out gets silenced? Even if someone did post the truth about matchmaking it would be deleted. So how can we give proper feedback on systems like this?

Sadly we have no choice but to trust them and their MMR system because we are not the devs.

It would be nice if Anet kind of debunked the rumors though.

For instance showing the team ratings of each team. Like in S6 a player in silver showed in a Screen Shot facing a Duo in the top 10.

I mean seasons 1-? you could see your team mates rank. Why stop?

There is just so many holes in GW2 PvP when it comes to a competitive system. Were not even talking fun, for me the games PvP and WvW action just are not fun right now. That goes for alot of people but when it comes to creating fair matches and proper ways of seeing where people rank, it does a terrible job.

For instance Helseth created a new character and started in bronze, it took him 100 or so games to get to Plat 2. That means for 90 or so games he was mopping people left at right.

In LoL it took me 5 games to get from Silver V to IV and the + wins only get higher with more wins you get. Anet PvP system in just too many ways doesnt make sense, from moving up or down.

Last example, i believe this is true if someone could double check. The Ele from TCG who had won B2B World Tournaments got stuck in gold when Solo Queing. This is far less a knock against him but Anet ability to balance classes. This person might be the best support player in the game but it means nothing and the ranks i believe showed that. ( i heard this threw someone else, so im not 100% sure on its authenticity)

That’s an interesting point.

If you punsih a player with dishonor you are in fact punishing the next lower tier of players. They get “blessed” with the punished player.

In my opinion here it is a little different. There are classes which are really good only in an organized team other less.
Mesmer meta for example is one of the best soloing class of the game becouse it is strong in 1vs 1, it has mobility , it can also bunker a bit (shield , sword 2 , distortion let you survive a bit ) and it can also give a little support with its aoe healing and heal on shatter. It is not the best probably in any of them but when you go alone you can try easily to adapt to your team. Mender Scrapper is on the same spot… great support, good damage and good bunkering ( no mobility) … so you can try to put what your team misses. On the other end in your example elementalist is only an heal machine so it is quite obviouse that in solo it is much harder . Probably one should try to modify build based on the team composition in that case but other builds are not that great

im probably on the naughty list then,win 1 lose 4