Guild Wars 2

Lordrosicky.5813:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

It’s OP because I SAY SO!

Tell you what either make a mesmer and show us your ESL gameplay or /thread

I could probably reroll mesmer after 1 day and improve my rating just because of how op the clone spam is

This just shows your ignorance and lack of clue about mesmer in general. How many mesmers do you see per team in any tier? If it was so easy and op, why isn’t everyone playing it?

I seriously hope you will roll mesmer and actually try playing it. You will fail miserably I bet. You need LOADS of practice to make it viable in spvp in any tier. And then, you will still face hard counters, which is why you have better mobility than most of the other classes.

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

You lose against mesmers because you’re playing with necro and did you know that you can dodge moa?

fumbii.3582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

You lose against mesmers because you’re playing with necro and did you know that you can dodge moa?

Gold/silver mesmers shouldnt be owning me. Something is seriously wrong

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

No, they can’t. Condi chrono is strong but it can’t carry as hard as you say it can, especially not after the continual sustain nerfs to both chrono and core mesmer.

Lordrosicky.5813:

fumbii.3582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

You lose against mesmers because you’re playing with necro and did you know that you can dodge moa?

Gold/silver mesmers shouldnt be owning me. Something is seriously wrong

When you play at a bronze skill level, anything is possible!

Lordrosicky.5813:

fumbii.3582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

You lose against mesmers because you’re playing with necro and did you know that you can dodge moa?

Gold/silver mesmers shouldnt be owning me. Something is seriously wrong

you said before you got placed bronze. soooooooo

sophiewhite.3149:

Lordrosicky.5813:

fumbii.3582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Supreme.3164:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Moonsinn.5382:

I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.

Lol the window to attack the doesnt exist. They can chain invukns or blocks whilst clone spamming for huge dps. Then just blink away for the few seconds they can be attacked. Their condi clear is mad too

But..

1) They can’t sit on top of traps/wells whose CD starts the second they’re used

2) They can’t hold a point

3) You don’t see 2-3 mesmer teams winning consistently every teamfight where one team lacks strong condi clear

4) You don’t need outstanding condi clear ( like your build loaded with condi clear to 70-80% total) to win against condi mesmer

5) They have no god mode, where they have pulsating stability and just advance without fear into the thick of battle

6) Blurred frenzy root them…they don’t walk towards you while blocking the kitten out of everything

7) You don’t see bad mesmers being carried by passive sustain…they die in few secs

8) They can be CCed for a change…not like most other professions that truly fart stability/block for hours to no end

9) New players don’t roll a mesmer for easy win..they die in 2s using them, they need loads of practice.

In a game dominated by cheesy mechanics…you still don’t find videos like this..for mesmer:

-Necromancer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcho3twIK2g

-DragonHunter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWRWW3tb4Rw

-Warrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpxIggT6thM

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

You lose against mesmers because you’re playing with necro and did you know that you can dodge moa?

Gold/silver mesmers shouldnt be owning me. Something is seriously wrong

you said before you got placed bronze. soooooooo

Yeh I placed at 1000 and now at legend.

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

If you don’t know how to handle moa you should play thief, we get 3 dodges in moa form….

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Lordrosicky.5813:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

It’s OP because I SAY SO!

Tell you what either make a mesmer and show us your ESL gameplay or /thread

I could probably reroll mesmer after 1 day and improve my rating just because of how op the clone spam is

Ok show video tomorrow c ya then

Remember boys, tonight’s video night!

apharma.3741:

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

I think changing the active effect of signet of illusions to just reduce the CD of every shatter by half of their entire CD (so assuming you are running illusions line, MW would instantly get ~5 sec cut from its CD, and distortion would get 21 seconds cut off its CD. It doesn’t reset them entirely but is still pretty kitten strong considering it does affect 4 skills (all of which can be traited to apply torment, confusion and vuln).

apharma.3741:

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

IMHO, I think the concept of Mesmer is intriguing, especially the mechanics (execution of concepts can always be improved). Personally speaking, and you have to go way back in RPG history (original D&D), it reminds me of what the Illusionist was supposed to be (or at least my recollection of it). That may be one of the reasons I enjoy Mesmer so much (clones/phantasms/shatters, etc.) it really is the ‘illusionist’ factor. I wouldn’t change the mechanics though, that’s what makes it so much fun and as far as I know, unique in RPG games. As far as GW2 sPvP, difficult to get used to fighting against, but not op.

@OP Can you please practice dogging shatters, and stop hugging them when they pop CS. Also learn to doge moa, if your HP is getting low and the life force bar is all you have left you should save a doge.

The game gives you TONS of tells to actively read mesmers in 1v1 matchups, and it is your job to learn it. (unless you are dying to stealth shatters, but there is much worse in the category of “burst with no tell” and then we can talk about anticipation, and debate the fairness of stealth shatters in the context of the meta.)

Many, if not the vast majority of players in this game of any decent rating, or skill level do not have issues fighting against mesmers, or pushing them off point. I don’t know if that is your lack of effort to learn them, or if its due to ineptitude. Mesmer has few really good matchups, and is countered 1v1 by majority of the meta even by those competing for the same role. I can understand your frustration when your main is struggling in the meta, but if you are getting lost in clones, and fail to doge obvious animations, that is not a valid call for nerfs; you have to better yourself.

Daishi.6027:

@OP Can you please practice dogging shatters, and stop hugging them when they pop CS. Also learn to doge moa, if your HP is getting low and the life force bar is all you have left you should save a doge.

The game gives you TONS of tells to actively read mesmers in 1v1 matchups, and it is your job to learn it. (unless you are dying to stealth shatters, but there is much worse in the category of “burst with no tell” and then we can talk about anticipation, and debate the fairness of stealth shatters in the context of the meta.)

Many, if not the vast majority of players in this game of any decent rating, or skill level do not have issues fighting against mesmers, or pushing them off point. I don’t know if that is your lack of effort to learn them, or if its due to ineptitude. Mesmer has few really good matchups, and is countered 1v1 by majority of the meta even by those competing for the same role. I can understand your frustration when your main is struggling in the meta, but if you are getting lost in clones, and fail to doge obvious animations, that is not a valid call for nerfs; you have to better yourself.

It is impossible. You have 2 dodges. Save it for moa and you get crushed by shatters. Dodge the shatters and you get moaed. Either way, mesmer crushes even without moa. Porting around and clone spamming whilst perma invuln

Soothsayer.9206:

apharma.3741:

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

IMHO, I think the concept of Mesmer is intriguing, especially the mechanics (execution of concepts can always be improved). Personally speaking, and you have to go way back in RPG history (original D&D), it reminds me of what the Illusionist was supposed to be (or at least my recollection of it). That may be one of the reasons I enjoy Mesmer so much (clones/phantasms/shatters, etc.) it really is the ‘illusionist’ factor. I wouldn’t change the mechanics though, that’s what makes it so much fun and as far as I know, unique in RPG games. As far as GW2 sPvP, difficult to get used to fighting against, but not op.

The mechanics can be changed without removing the illusionist factor from mesmers. Something along the lines of making all phantasms utility constructs like iAvenger and then buffing our personal damage. That way, it would still be very beneficial to have 3 phantasms out and shattering them would temporarily hamper us at the cost of immediate usefulness, but if we didn’t have 3 phantasms up our sustained damage would still be the same.

Soothsayer.9206:

apharma.3741:

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

IMHO, I think the concept of Mesmer is intriguing, especially the mechanics (execution of concepts can always be improved). Personally speaking, and you have to go way back in RPG history (original D&D), it reminds me of what the Illusionist was supposed to be (or at least my recollection of it). That may be one of the reasons I enjoy Mesmer so much (clones/phantasms/shatters, etc.) it really is the ‘illusionist’ factor. I wouldn’t change the mechanics though, that’s what makes it so much fun and as far as I know, unique in RPG games. As far as GW2 sPvP, difficult to get used to fighting against, but not op.

It may be unique but the way it works now doesn’t make it good mechanically in PvP, PvE or WvW. A mesmer is balanced sustained damage wise around phantasms in a power build however they have very low health pools and so are easily killed by AoE in PvP and WvW.

Then they’re also summoned on an enemy which also has 2 problems. First that it gives the enemy quite a measure of control over your damage, more so than most classes and secondly they disappear when the target dies but have considerable cool downs on them which makes mesmers terrible damage dealers in PvE.

It all adds up to mechanics that don’t work, they should have stayed with clones summoning only but allow flip over effects for swapping places or short range teleports like phase retreat and iLeap. Get rid of phantasms and adjust sustained damage and skills appropriately.

Your nerf suggestions are misplaced. In fact the view is shallow in terms of trying to balance the problem. The real issue with the meta condi chrono build is the particular synergy of traits and utilities etc.

Here’s the first thing you could do to adjust things. Remove Illusionary Reversion from the Chronomancer line. The trait is great, so it should be recycled, and I’d say add its effect into the Domination line either as a minor, or adding it to Rending Shatter, or to Mental Anguish. This will help reduce the spam factor of Condi chronomancers using the Illusions line with Maim the Disillusioned. They can still burst all their shatters, but the return on replacement clones is going to take a shave.

Meanwhile both core power mesmer and power chrono take a buff. But since they don’t get the same reward for shatter spam that condi chrono with maim does, this will not negatively impact the game.

This would be a good first start.

Its like your reading my mind.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Do-you-really-feel-like-a-CHRONOMANCER/first#post6314211

Ross Biddle.2367:

Your nerf suggestions are misplaced. In fact the view is shallow in terms of trying to balance the problem. The real issue with the meta condi chrono build is the particular synergy of traits and utilities etc.

Here’s the first thing you could do to adjust things. Remove Illusionary Reversion from the Chronomancer line. The trait is great, so it should be recycled, and I’d say add its effect into the Domination line either as a minor, or adding it to Rending Shatter, or to Mental Anguish. This will help reduce the spam factor of Condi chronomancers using the Illusions line with Maim the Disillusioned. They can still burst all their shatters, but the return on replacement clones is going to take a shave.

Meanwhile both core power mesmer and power chrono take a buff. But since they don’t get the same reward for shatter spam that condi chrono with maim does, this will not negatively impact the game.

This would be a good first start.

I like your idea much more than tampering with the mechanics of the profession and losing its current identity/uniqueness. Currently, my biggest issue is using shatters for both offensive and defensive purposes at once (e.g. RI) – make them entirely offensive if so much damage is going to be tied to them. For example, reassign RI to buff glamour utilities in some way (or something of that ilk), thus making Inspiration a “Glamour” trait line and possibly making it a more supportive line in the process. Renegotiating traits and trait lines and simply making them more synergetic with certain builds, weapons sets and utilities. It’s been awhile, but wouldn’t that be more akin to the 5 trait line era b4 they condensed traits?

some classes excel at dueling.
classes with slow/obvious skill animations will lose to a half decent dueling class unless you bait dodges and know when and how to counter each classes skills.

Tfw forums are just now figuring out, after basically every team ever has used mesmer at one point in the past 6(?) months, that mesmer is good

Mesmer is just good. It’s not crazy OP. It’s just good. The only ‘imbalanced’ part about Mesmer is mantras, where they’re either ultra god mode or just really useless, depending on the matchup.

Portal breaks pvp too

You see a portal? Lay your traps and wells. From that point on, you know to change your strategy if it’s really an issue. Yes Mesmer can be annoying, but if you’re having that much trouble, you should train with a good Mesmer user. Learn from that. You want to know where they are? Watch the one that moves the most. Too many clones? You can easily get rid of them before most mesmers can shatter them on you. Don’t spam your skills in a panic if that’s an issue. Learn from the fights. Everyone in this game complains about most classes every season. Duel with each other, this helps.

So where’s that gameplay video at? You said you’d be a pro in a day

Xula de Neiva.9508:

You see a portal? Lay your traps and wells. From that point on, you know to change your strategy if it’s really an issue. Yes Mesmer can be annoying, but if you’re having that much trouble, you should train with a good Mesmer user. Learn from that. You want to know where they are? Watch the one that moves the most. Too many clones? You can easily get rid of them before most mesmers can shatter them on you. Don’t spam your skills in a panic if that’s an issue. Learn from the fights. Everyone in this game complains about most classes every season. Duel with each other, this helps.

The funny thing is if you watch Helseths stream he often does duels with other pro players to get better. Even then he’s heavily reliant on Moa to get the kill if he can at all, if he fat fingers a button in continuum split then he’s not much of a threat for the next 72s until it’s back up. Takes a while and a fair bit of set up for condi mesmer to kill anything on equal skill now and the necessity of moa just shows mesmer isn’t that strong.

I mean, let’s be honest here, how many times have you seen a genuinely useful mesmer on ranked? I think on my team once and on the enemy team maybe once I can remember. Rest of the time they keep jumping into team fights with gravity well against a DH and 2 eternal champion warriors.

Lordrosicky.5813:

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

It’s “not ok” that you lose to Mesmers? And, by implication, they need to be nerfed because you lose to them?

Wow, just wow. That’s very revealing.

Ithilwen.1529:

Lordrosicky.5813:

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

It’s “not ok” that you lose to Mesmers? And, by implication, they need to be nerfed because you lose to them?

Wow, just wow. That’s very revealing.

Lol its just so op. Dont pretend its not. Everyone knows it. Look at the damage they can do whilst be incredibly hard to kill

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ithilwen.1529:

Lordrosicky.5813:

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

It’s “not ok” that you lose to Mesmers? And, by implication, they need to be nerfed because you lose to them?

Wow, just wow. That’s very revealing.

Lol its just so op. Dont pretend its not. Everyone knows it. Look at the damage they can do whilst be incredibly hard to kill

you think your so good you shouldnt be beat by mesmers period? news flash. your not the best player you think you are.

sophiewhite.3149:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ithilwen.1529:

Lordrosicky.5813:

….I rest my case..and I don’t play mesmer or thief, just saying

New players can easily face role on mesmer and be carried by clone and shatter spam.

I lose to gold mesmers, even silver mesmers cause me problems. This is not ok.

It’s “not ok” that you lose to Mesmers? And, by implication, they need to be nerfed because you lose to them?

Wow, just wow. That’s very revealing.

Lol its just so op. Dont pretend its not. Everyone knows it. Look at the damage they can do whilst be incredibly hard to kill

you think your so good you shouldnt be beat by mesmers period? news flash. your not the best player you think you are.

Did i say that? I suck. But i should still be able to beat silver mesmers. Happy? Do you understand these comments?

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

I haven’t had this problem, sure I’ve dodged and got hit by a clone but I put that down to I dodged too soon or too late and one hit me. I’m not saying it’s not happening only that I haven’t seen it happen and only really heard of this from you and after 10 pages of bugs forum no mention of it nor have I seen a post in the mesmer subforum.

If someone has a video of clones hitting through dodges it would help figuring out what’s happening at least for the devs. I have no problems with it being fixed if it is happening though because that’s obviously not the way it should work, you should be able to dodge all attacks.

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

Shatters don’t ignore dodges…

apharma.3741:

Xula de Neiva.9508:

You see a portal? Lay your traps and wells. From that point on, you know to change your strategy if it’s really an issue. Yes Mesmer can be annoying, but if you’re having that much trouble, you should train with a good Mesmer user. Learn from that. You want to know where they are? Watch the one that moves the most. Too many clones? You can easily get rid of them before most mesmers can shatter them on you. Don’t spam your skills in a panic if that’s an issue. Learn from the fights. Everyone in this game complains about most classes every season. Duel with each other, this helps.

The funny thing is if you watch Helseths stream he often does duels with other pro players to get better. Even then he’s heavily reliant on Moa to get the kill if he can at all, if he fat fingers a button in continuum split then he’s not much of a threat for the next 72s until it’s back up. Takes a while and a fair bit of set up for condi mesmer to kill anything on equal skill now and the necessity of moa just shows mesmer isn’t that strong.

I mean, let’s be honest here, how many times have you seen a genuinely useful mesmer on ranked? I think on my team once and on the enemy team maybe once I can remember. Rest of the time they keep jumping into team fights with gravity well against a DH and 2 eternal champion warriors.

Not sure i did the reply thing right

I have dueled with great mesmer users, and Helseth isn’t the only great one, he’s just advertised the most if you will.

Most players using any class that isn’t their main will end up trying to do what you described. I tend to use moa if im waiting for my skills from cd (the ones i need only) or if foe team players are putting too much pressure i’ll moa one then another and let someone else with the best cleave to do their thing if that’s the best strat for that moment. Moa should be treated as situational. Gravity well, wells in general are dumb in pvp, for me. It’s so easy to walk out of or use a blink (or any skill that lets one get out of it) to get out of Gravity well for example. It’s useful when in a fray because if you aren’t focused, it will give moment for your team to recover. Situational. It’s no wonder people have been using moa instead. And even then, Moa is avoidable, as others have stated.

As for ranked mesmers; in my experience, i’ve seen a decent number of good mesmers. Some scary ones that obliterate. And yeah, there are also mesmer users who definitely need to practice more. So honestly, faceroll is bs. Again, that’s skill. Mesmers are squishy, that’s why you have to be annoying af with the class. Same with a good thief. They can destroy you in an instant if that player knows when to come in and do their thing. Or a revenant, and hey now, yeah they are lacking, but i’ve met a scary af rev this season. O__O nearly one shots or eats them up in a couple seconds. Terrifying lol. SURPRISE MOFO!

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

Well I can agree with you on your main point. S5 is a huge success, it made me buy HOT because it finally bought back some in game casual competition for the casual player. Game is actually healthy currently.

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

So, if what you are saying is true, then trolling people on the forums makes S5 a success, what in the world sort of logic is that? Furthermore, goading people into discussions that effect a particular profession is somehow a good thing especially because it raises the ire and now wastes the time and energy of so many? Mesmer is already on the verge of being nerfed into irrelevancy and you think this is good for both community and players? So, why encourage people to spread malcontent over a venue that is supposed to be enjoyable?
By the way, probably should encourage him to stick to his day job, competitive fishing is probably a lot more work than playing GW2 and trolling forums.

Soothsayer.9206:

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

So, if what you are saying is true, then trolling people on the forums makes S5 a success, what in the world sort of logic is that? Furthermore, goading people into discussions that effect a particular profession is somehow a good thing especially because it raises the ire and now wastes the time and energy of so many? Mesmer is already on the verge of being nerfed into irrelevancy and you think this is good for both community and players? So, why encourage people to spread malcontent over a venue that is supposed to be enjoyable?
By the way, probably should encourage him to stick to his day job, competitive fishing is probably a lot more work than playing GW2 and trolling forums.

I like Henry. He sparks unique conversations instead of the usual, boring and repeated conversations being parroted over and over. Even when it is a tired conversation like balance he makes it unique enough for me to click which I can’t say for other people.

You shouldnt put too much stock on how much a ‘’nerf profession’’ thread is going to have on the game. The developers may certainly read these forums but no drug is going to make anyone follow through on a decision based on what they read here.

If you don’t want to give a thread like this traffic then don’t comment on it. If you find the current conversations boring then create your own one and see if people want to talk about it here.

Say what you will about the duke here but he gets people talking.

nothelseth.4621:

Soothsayer.9206:

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

So, if what you are saying is true, then trolling people on the forums makes S5 a success, what in the world sort of logic is that? Furthermore, goading people into discussions that effect a particular profession is somehow a good thing especially because it raises the ire and now wastes the time and energy of so many? Mesmer is already on the verge of being nerfed into irrelevancy and you think this is good for both community and players? So, why encourage people to spread malcontent over a venue that is supposed to be enjoyable?
By the way, probably should encourage him to stick to his day job, competitive fishing is probably a lot more work than playing GW2 and trolling forums.

I like Henry. He sparks unique conversations instead of the usual, boring and repeated conversations being parroted over and over. Even when it is a tired conversation like balance he makes it unique enough for me to click which I can’t say for other people.

You shouldnt put too much stock on how much a ‘’nerf profession’’ thread is going to have on the game. The developers may certainly read these forums but no drug is going to make anyone follow through on a decision based on what they read here.

If you don’t want to give a thread like this traffic then don’t comment on it. If you find the current conversations boring then create your own one and see if people want to talk about it here.

Say what you will about the duke here but he gets people talking.

{sigh} I just wish it were that easy (although I agree in principle). Not to mention that when threads like this are started people in the broader community, especially for those who are not inoculated, take these threads quite seriously. Life is already to short and stressful and it just gets old seeing some get humor at the expense of others especially when you see so many contributing thinking that this is a thread that is supposed further a meaningful discussion.

nothelseth.4621:

Soothsayer.9206:

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

So, if what you are saying is true, then trolling people on the forums makes S5 a success, what in the world sort of logic is that? Furthermore, goading people into discussions that effect a particular profession is somehow a good thing especially because it raises the ire and now wastes the time and energy of so many? Mesmer is already on the verge of being nerfed into irrelevancy and you think this is good for both community and players? So, why encourage people to spread malcontent over a venue that is supposed to be enjoyable?
By the way, probably should encourage him to stick to his day job, competitive fishing is probably a lot more work than playing GW2 and trolling forums.

I like Henry. He sparks unique conversations instead of the usual, boring and repeated conversations being parroted over and over. Even when it is a tired conversation like balance he makes it unique enough for me to click which I can’t say for other people.

You shouldnt put too much stock on how much a ‘’nerf profession’’ thread is going to have on the game. The developers may certainly read these forums but no drug is going to make anyone follow through on a decision based on what they read here.

If you don’t want to give a thread like this traffic then don’t comment on it. If you find the current conversations boring then create your own one and see if people want to talk about it here.

Say what you will about the duke here but he gets people talking.

it took 1 thread from 1 guy complaining about ap to get it removed from the pvp leaderboards.

nothelseth.4621:

Soothsayer.9206:

nothelseth.4621:

henry is easily the goat baiter

for years hes been able to trick the forum into having a wild wall of text discussion for 5+ pages by writing simple small statements as facts

glad to have you back man, proof that s5 was a success

u should go into competitive fishing

So, if what you are saying is true, then trolling people on the forums makes S5 a success, what in the world sort of logic is that? Furthermore, goading people into discussions that effect a particular profession is somehow a good thing especially because it raises the ire and now wastes the time and energy of so many? Mesmer is already on the verge of being nerfed into irrelevancy and you think this is good for both community and players? So, why encourage people to spread malcontent over a venue that is supposed to be enjoyable?
By the way, probably should encourage him to stick to his day job, competitive fishing is probably a lot more work than playing GW2 and trolling forums.

I like Henry. He sparks unique conversations instead of the usual, boring and repeated conversations being parroted over and over. Even when it is a tired conversation like balance he makes it unique enough for me to click which I can’t say for other people.

You shouldnt put too much stock on how much a ‘’nerf profession’’ thread is going to have on the game. The developers may certainly read these forums but no drug is going to make anyone follow through on a decision based on what they read here.

If you don’t want to give a thread like this traffic then don’t comment on it. If you find the current conversations boring then create your own one and see if people want to talk about it here.

Say what you will about the duke here but he gets people talking.

Pretty sure this goes against the forums code of conduct regardless.

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

I haven’t had this problem, sure I’ve dodged and got hit by a clone but I put that down to I dodged too soon or too late and one hit me. I’m not saying it’s not happening only that I haven’t seen it happen and only really heard of this from you and after 10 pages of bugs forum no mention of it nor have I seen a post in the mesmer subforum.

If someone has a video of clones hitting through dodges it would help figuring out what’s happening at least for the devs. I have no problems with it being fixed if it is happening though because that’s obviously not the way it should work, you should be able to dodge all attacks.

You’re misunderstanding. It doesn’t hit through dodges. It just waits till your dodge is over then hits you after.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

I haven’t had this problem, sure I’ve dodged and got hit by a clone but I put that down to I dodged too soon or too late and one hit me. I’m not saying it’s not happening only that I haven’t seen it happen and only really heard of this from you and after 10 pages of bugs forum no mention of it nor have I seen a post in the mesmer subforum.

If someone has a video of clones hitting through dodges it would help figuring out what’s happening at least for the devs. I have no problems with it being fixed if it is happening though because that’s obviously not the way it should work, you should be able to dodge all attacks.

You’re misunderstanding. It doesn’t hit through dodges. It just waits till your dodge is over then hits you after.

This only happens if you dodge away from the clones. If you dodge through the path of the clones they’ll explode on you as you dodge them. This is how people have known to properly dodge shatters since the launch of GW2.

Fay.2357:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

I haven’t had this problem, sure I’ve dodged and got hit by a clone but I put that down to I dodged too soon or too late and one hit me. I’m not saying it’s not happening only that I haven’t seen it happen and only really heard of this from you and after 10 pages of bugs forum no mention of it nor have I seen a post in the mesmer subforum.

If someone has a video of clones hitting through dodges it would help figuring out what’s happening at least for the devs. I have no problems with it being fixed if it is happening though because that’s obviously not the way it should work, you should be able to dodge all attacks.

You’re misunderstanding. It doesn’t hit through dodges. It just waits till your dodge is over then hits you after.

This only happens if you dodge away from the clones. If you dodge through the path of the clones they’ll explode on you as you dodge them. This is how people have known to properly dodge shatters since the launch of GW2.

It happens even if you dodge into them, I mainly see it happen that way when running Thief With UC something about it causes the clones to not explode until after the dodge ends. I have seen it in very rare cases without UC but those are far and few in between.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Fay.2357:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

Cynz.9437:

I don’t think mes are broken, only things i would changes is
- CS shouldn’t reset elites. Maybe allow cs reduce CD on elite but not complete reset
- clones really should stop running at light speed. I understand they wanted to stop kiting of the shatters however issue is not that shatters became undodgable. If you dodge into shatter, the clones assume you didn’t dodge but moved and instead of stopping for shatter actually continue to chase you. Idc what they do it but shatters should be consistent so you have chance to dodge them instead of eating full condi crap despite dodging into shatter.

The problem with your second point is that HoT brought a lot of movement speed for everyone so shatters without superspeed simply don’t hit anymore unless detonated instantly at 0 range.

Swiftness might make them able to hit but there’s still the problem of people can just run and kite the shatters easily assuming moderate distance to the clones. It doesn’t bode well for new elite specs though, there’s nothing more depressing than seeing shatters on base mesmer chasing after someone with swiftness and never being able to catch them.

1 boon shutting down a class mechanic and needing a trait to counter.

I understand the issue but shatters ignoring dodges is not OK. Imagine all my attacks would land on your regardless what you did. This is how it is fighting mes atm.
They need to fix it somehow, maybe make clones actually register the dodge better instead of ignoring it….

I haven’t had this problem, sure I’ve dodged and got hit by a clone but I put that down to I dodged too soon or too late and one hit me. I’m not saying it’s not happening only that I haven’t seen it happen and only really heard of this from you and after 10 pages of bugs forum no mention of it nor have I seen a post in the mesmer subforum.

If someone has a video of clones hitting through dodges it would help figuring out what’s happening at least for the devs. I have no problems with it being fixed if it is happening though because that’s obviously not the way it should work, you should be able to dodge all attacks.

You’re misunderstanding. It doesn’t hit through dodges. It just waits till your dodge is over then hits you after.

This only happens if you dodge away from the clones. If you dodge through the path of the clones they’ll explode on you as you dodge them. This is how people have known to properly dodge shatters since the launch of GW2.

It happens even if you dodge into them, I mainly see it happen that way when running Thief With UC something about it causes the clones to not explode until after the dodge ends. I have seen it in very rare cases without UC but those are far and few in between.

What’s probably happening there is that UC actually pushes you past the hitbox of the clones so quickly that they register it as simply moving you out of their range again. That’s going to be a problem limited to UC, no other class or trait choice should produce that result.

Like I say beepboopbop and Blaquefyre, I haven’t seen this happen myself, I’ve been hit by maybe one clone which I put down to poor timing but the conditions from 1 clone is hardly worth caring about. This includes playing UC on thief in WvW with Pi instead of EA against condi and power mes.

If it truly is a problem with the game make a video showing it to the devs and ask for a fix but I place the blame on my skill for poor dodging on the few times I am hit. Most of the time dodge works fine.

@Fay

I believe it to be a combination of both UC and the Superspeed on the Illusions, I have also seen it happen with other movement skills like Ancestrals Grace through them.

@apharma

I can try to get a video of it (no promises 6 year old Graphics card problems), I mainly only see it with UC, I am not stating it’s game breaking just highly annoying, I don’t depend on my Daredevil’ Dodges to explode the clones any more, I don’t have the issue whenever I am playing Core Thief which is more what I have been playing lately in WvW and PvP.

Super bait thread but only one response needed to end this debate, portal.