Guild Wars 2

Was it intentional to make the mesmer skill decoy (and trait desperate decoy) ignore the reveal debuff? This seems unfair to me and I would like to see it changed in the December 10th patch.

What are you talking about?..
OH MY GOD OH WOW

It is a stun-breaker on a long cd. What do we get instead, if that gets killed? The whole idea of the stun-breaker/trait is for emergency-situations. And you want to prevent that? Fine, what do we get instead? Kittens?

Bacon.4918:

Was it intentional to make the mesmer skill decoy (and trait desperate decoy) ignore the reveal debuff? This seems unfair to me and I would like to see it changed in the December 10th patch.

Its probably because Decoy doesn’t give you the Stealth buff it gives you the Decoy buff which does the same thing… but isn’t the Stealth buff

The other mes stealth skills give revealed, for what it’s worth.

This was raised in the mesmer forums so many months ago but no clarification was given. As it’s not giving stealth but a separate buff it may be intended.

Decoy is not the same as Stealth.

If i gain Stealth on my Mesmer (f.e. with Prestige) and then attack a mob while Stealthed i get revealed.
However i can still gain Decoy-stealth.

I think its safe to conclude that Decoy is a seperate ability from Stealth and is not effected by Revealed. It also does not stack in duration with Stealth.

stealth is stealth and revealed should work the same. no 2 different rules for different classes

Peow peow.2189:

stealth is stealth and revealed should work the same. no 2 different rules for different classes

^^this

Again decoy is NOT stealth it’s you know…decoy. Seriusly are you plain dumb or what? All mesmer’s stealths give revealed debuff…

Smells like ppl just trying to qq bout pu mesmers bringing up ridicolous excuses…made my day

Stealth is not actually stealth either.

It’s total invisibility.

Mesmers OP! Nerf!

Decoy=making you invisible
Stealth=making you invisible

It does the exact same thing…I want a Backstab for my Longbow Ranger, doing 8k dmg in one hit but name it kittenstab, so it would be unblockable-undodgeable…

Its not Backstab you noobs, its kittenstab….

Peow peow.2189:

stealth is stealth and revealed should work the same. no 2 different rules for different classes

- Stealth debuff was introduced to limit the spamable stealth skills from thief ( cloak and dagger )

My question to you is :
Why isn’t all damage mitigation on other characters have a debuff once used ?

- Stealth is a defensive way of thief / mesmer .

- Should stun/knockback/fear… put a stun debuff on the player so he cant do another stun in 4 secs, cause stun/knockback/fear….. kinda works as a defensive way to.

- Should the use of protection/swiffness/ vigor add a debuff on the user , they are all defensive ways.

- Should dodge / evade have a debuff once you dodge ? Cause guess what … its a defensive way of playing.

Be glad they added the stealth debuff so you cant spam it anymore, no need to overnerf it, cause its probably a l2p issue that you will be able to beat with a bit of practice (stealth doesn’t make you imune to aoe’s/damage ) .

I think mesmers will be the next FOTM beginning late December or maybe January. I’m being completely serious.

They should make the thief 25% stealth trait and the mesmer 25% health trait work the same way. Honestly it would be fine if both ignored revealed, but making one ignore revealed while the other doesn’t is kind of strange.

NevirSayDie.6235:

I think mesmers will be the next FOTM beginning late December or maybe January. I’m being completely serious.

They should make the thief 25% stealth trait and the mesmer 25% health trait work the same way. Honestly it would be fine if both ignored revealed, but making one ignore revealed while the other doesn’t is kind of strange.

Well, for me to blindly agree on that, it would have to take, that stealth worked in the same way on the two classes. It doesn’t. Try running a PU-mesmer, and after that (or face) a stealth-based thief. The difference is noticeable. Stealth is used in a very different manner on the two classes (should be obvious for one like you).

So without having the necessary knowledge to properly judge thieves, I can’t just say “of course it should”.

blackwater mesmer = spam invis all day… but it is not fine on cnd thief eh?

Mostly good responses so far. I hope someone from Anet sees this thread and can provide an answer for everyone.

The other pressing suggestion I have for the balance team would be to look at the mesmer/guardian vigor on critical traits which allows these classes to maintain near permanent vigor. Modification of these traits only seems fair in light of the removal of other classes access to “permanent vigor” in the upcoming December 10th patch; especially considering these traits only require a 5 point investment.

Decoy is not just a regular stealth. Mesmer summons a clone on his/her place and is going stealth deceiving opponents. I think it was meant for it to be that way, otherwise it would be useless as a deception.

Caro.2730:

Decoy is not just a regular stealth. Mesmer summons a clone on his/her place and is going stealth deceiving opponents. I think it was meant for it to be that way, otherwise it would be useless as a deception.

Funny thing is this won’t fool anyone r20+ (even from “Hotjoin Heroes” learn this) it mostly acts as +1 clone + invis.

That being said whys this topic even exist?

It’s one of 4 Mes invis skills.

Lol veil is a 90 sec mushroom in sPvP so ignoring that.

Mass invis is 90 sec and an elite and the only other invis is torch. Both of which have poor invis times that don’t even stack with decoy. If a mesmer is attacking mid stealth and forcing reviled on himself he’s losing over all invis time if they are popping decoy instantly after.

Lol but surely the one auto attack between invis on a long c/d is OP.

Cynz.9437:

blackwater mesmer = spam invis all day… but it is not fine on cnd thief eh?

If you can’t see the difference, I can’t help you. No one can.
Try playing PU-mesmer vs a stealth-based thief that is not overeager and then come back. It takes nothing else than not being overeager as thief to “out-stealth” a mesmer … it is even written in stone in the thief-forum.

That being said, stealth is one of many things that are OTT in the game imo.

Poxxia.1547:

Cynz.9437:

blackwater mesmer = spam invis all day… but it is not fine on cnd thief eh?

If you can’t see the difference, I can’t help you. No one can.
Try playing PU-mesmer vs a stealth-based thief that is not overeager and then come back. It takes nothing else than not being overeager as thief to “out-stealth” a mesmer … it is even written in stone in the thief-forum.

That being said, stealth is one of many things that are OTT in the game imo.

my point is that i understand why there is revealed debuff on thieves…i don’t understand why mesmers get special threatment

“Gain stealth and summon an illusion to attack your foe.”

Change tooltip or fix bug.

Cynz.9437:

my point is that i understand why there is revealed debuff on thieves…i don’t understand why mesmers get special threatment

They don’t get special treatment, they just get different treatment. After all they aren’t thieves and have a class of their own. Mesmer’s stealth cannot be abused, it’s still much shorter that the stealth of a thief, who can spam it with combo fields. People just don’t get it that mesmer was meant to use stealth to deceive their opponents… Thieves do that to kill them in one backstab.

Stealth for thieves: Mostly offensive, but also can be defensive of course.
Stealth for mesmers: Only defensive.

That’s why they are treated differently.

First of all, Revealed is a debuff against “stealth”, whereas mesmers use invisibility, not stealth. So I think Revealed is just bugged at it’s current form, as it prevents mesmers from using invisibility. So ANet should do one of the two things:

• clarify in description it prevents CLOAKING,
• or fix it to prevent only STEALTH

So, let’s clear up a bit of misconceptions.

Decoy provides stealth. Not some other mystical ability called ‘invisibility’ or whatever. The decoy stealth provides boons from Prismatic Understanding, and it will apply revealed to you if you attack from it.

That being said, the application and the buff is somehow different. It forces the mesmer into stealth through a revealed debuff, and this probably has something to do with the different buff icon being used.

It’s not overpowered, and it forcing it to function as other stealth skills wouldn’t break the whole mechanic either. This is really just a non-issue that needs a bit of clarification from Anet as to whether it’s a bug or intended.

Archaon.6245:

Again decoy is NOT stealth it’s you know…decoy. Seriusly are you plain dumb or what? All mesmer’s stealths give revealed debuff…

Smells like ppl just trying to qq bout pu mesmers bringing up ridicolous excuses…made my day

mesmer trait. “Increase stealth duration”- this also increases decoy..therefore it’s a stealth. The decoy icon that is being referred to is your clone presence, much the same as you’ll receive an icon from binding blade on guardian when it is not retracted yet. So they’re not dumb, they do in fact have it correct. Decoy is not its own entity, but a stealth skill.

Cynz.9437:

Poxxia.1547:

Cynz.9437:

blackwater mesmer = spam invis all day… but it is not fine on cnd thief eh?

If you can’t see the difference, I can’t help you. No one can.
Try playing PU-mesmer vs a stealth-based thief that is not overeager and then come back. It takes nothing else than not being overeager as thief to “out-stealth” a mesmer … it is even written in stone in the thief-forum.

That being said, stealth is one of many things that are OTT in the game imo.

my point is that i understand why there is revealed debuff on thieves…i don’t understand why mesmers get special threatment

And my point is: Stealth (even if it does the same) doesn’t serve the same purpose on the two classes. Primarily due to the difference in access.
Mesmers will most likely survive with the debuff; I do think it is a bit steep, since it basically handicaps/cripples one of our stunbreakers.

Mesmer can’t do stealth attacks so this really isn’t such a big deal. Thief needs the revealed debuff because otherwise they could backstab => blindpowder => backstab again.