Guild Wars 2

I can’t stop laughing.

SuperKorean.7345:

Thief Shortbow 5 is the most overpowered skill in this game.

Let me give you 1 Example =

A.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. Your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down.

3. The Thief will chase you down , you die , you have to wait for the re-spawn.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain more points.

B.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. The Thief makes mistake and the Thief’s health is low.

3. The Thief will run away with 20% health and go decap or +1 somewhere else.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain points.

Whether A or B happens, You encounter Thief. -> The Enemy Team will gain points.

Why ?

Because Thief has superior mobility.

If you make mistake , you will die. You cannot run away from Thief mobility.

If the Thief makes mistake , the Thief will run away and do something else.

You cannot chase down the Thief’s mobility.

Even if the Thief lose fights , the Thief can just run away from the fight,
and contribute points by decaping or +1 somewhere else.

Only the Thief can do this, the other 8 classes cannot do this.

If the other 8 classes lose fights, they die and they have to wait for re-spawn.

How to fix this?

Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.

And also, Shadow Step cooldown should be 60 sec. Or reduce the range down to 900.

And also, add 20 sec internal cool-down to the “Unhindered Combatant Dash” Trait

By the way, Thief is my most played class. I played Thief for more than 10,000 hours.

Been playing Gw2 for 9 years straigt aye on Thief alone Aye?

Let’s see /age of your thief

saerni.2584:

I can’t stop laughing.

I mean, QoL tweaks like nerfing sb5/steal so thief can be properly balanced would actually be good for both thief and sPvP, instead of the bad designed, gimmicky role that thief has and ever had.

saerni.2584:

I can’t stop laughing.

+1

What the hell did I just … ?
I am not sure what is worst.
Is it that you complain about being killed by Thief when he/ she attacks you when you are very low on Health or that you’ve played 10 000 hours just on Thief and in just 5 years?
I mean, it is totaly not my place to judge others, but… you might have lost some braincells due to excesive amount if time spent playing per day, resulting in post/ suggestion like this.

Honestly I have faced good Thieves in matches where I was not playing my Main, and in 90% of cases they did not get away simply because I know what a CC is or atleast when to use it. It comes down to how fast are you able to react.

And No. A 20% HP Thief running away is really not going to magically +1 anyone, cause all that random DMG floating around in team-fights tends to kill 100% Thief, let alone 20%.

And No. A 20% HP Thief running away is really not going to magically provide its team a + Points by decapping as the Thief just rendered the fights in to 5v4 in your favor, by not being able to kill you, leaving you alive and not being able to join any fights effectively due to Thief having low health, not the mention the time Thief just wasted by trying to kill you, becoming the most useless member of the Enemy Team simply by not playing the Thief in the way it is currently fit for Conquest.

Ergo:

Scenario A – Anybody, even the worst players of worst classes will kill you when you are low on Health and with Defensive skills on cooldown, because you are low on Health and with Defensive skills on cooldown.

Scenario B – Congratulations! You just gained short-time advantage that can be quickly used to destroy Enemy team and break its rotations!

counter the thief action with your ally thief action

problem solved

Thief would be fixed by giving steal a cast time. Probably won’t fix the abuse of stealth to use a steal to land a backstab, but untelegraphed skills should always be weak instead of playing this guessing game of where the thief is.

1- 1/4 cast time on steal.
2- Pulmonary Impact 10 second ICD.
3- Headshot initiative cost increased by 2 initiative.

A class with that damage and mobility should not be king of interrupts/cc as well.

^ ok.

All Blocks have a 1/2 a second activation time.
add an extra 30 seconds coll down on all Invulabilty skills.
Invulabilty skills reduce duration of 1 second.

That way all builds that can face tank a thief and easy counter presuer them off point will be more balanced.

When Thief fights he spent initiative, right? He is low on health and he wants to run away but has only 3 initiative left. Weapon swap to SB + 3 initiative (IF you take Quick Pockets in Trickery) or Stealth and wait for initiative, but you won’t get it enough to use SB #5 more than once.
So can you elaborate how can Thief just spam SB #5 when trying to get away from combat? The only way he can do that, if he doesn’t use any initiative while fighting and he just waits until his health drops below 20% and voila! Catch me now, you kittens, ha ha ha.

Sifu.9745:

When Thief fights he spent initiative, right? He is low on health and he wants to run away but has only 3 initiative left. Weapon swap to SB + 3 initiative (IF you take Quick Pockets in Trickery) or Stealth and wait for initiative, but you won’t get it enough to use SB #5 more than once.
So can you elaborate how can Thief just spam SB #5 when trying to get away from combat? The only way he can do that, if he doesn’t use any initiative while fighting and he just waits until his health drops below 20% and voila! Catch me now, you kittens, ha ha ha.

When I fight people i always save all my initiative so i can swap to short bow and spam 5 because it’s THAT OP!

If you don’t save all your initiative to spam shortbow 5, you’re just a bad thief.

I hope most people here are joking, cause this is saddening. Dont take the scenarios OP gave too literally. What he said is that either A: you have low health low cds, in which case its nearly impossible to kite a thief cause he has so many tools to gank you, some of them even instant and that can deal heavy dmg (steal+pi), or either B: thief is low hp or on a losing fight, and he can just disengage and decap or +1 something else.

What this means is that thief abuses superior mobility from things like sb5 and shut down potential from steal bursts, and sucks at everything else. Having a class nearly impossible to chase or kite is straight up bs, and playing a class that can only play a very specific roaming role cause its the only thing that its good at is straight up bs.

Thief finishes almost dead player… OP
Thief runs from a fight he lost…. OP

Sifu.9745:

When Thief fights he spent initiative, right?

Wrong.

Teef main source of melee damage = auto-attacking (dagger, staff, sword).

ANets intention for optimal teef play is to use ini for defense mechanics (evade, blind, interrupt or disengage). They clearly stated that in the patch that buffed dagger auto attacks by 40%.

Btw.: I’d love to see a 1/4 sec. cast time on steal. This would fix all the ridiculous burst openings out of nowhere.

Staff 2 into steal
D/P 5, 2 into steal, backstab
D/D 5 into steal, backstab
S/P 3 into steal
… and all that nonsense

saerni.2584:

I can’t stop laughing.

+

Luto.1938:

Thief finishes almost dead player… OP
Thief runs from a fight he lost…. OP

Dont make a fool of yourself, it has never been saidthat it was OP cause it could finish low HP players, its BS cause theres no counterplay attached to some of his mechanics, and so hes forced to abuse them cause the rest of his kit is bad. I dont udnertsnad all the kitten forum warriors here when itsnot about getting some rolling nerfs to thieves, but rather make QoL changes to obv bad mechanics

Captain Obvious.6951:

When I fight people i always save all my initiative so i can swap to short bow and spam 5 because it’s THAT OP!

If you don’t save all your initiative to spam shortbow 5, you’re just a bad thief.

Well, i play d/d condi thief and if i don’t spend initiative i am pretty much dead. But if i do spend initiative (#3 is my favorite one) my opponents die, what a surprise
Autoatacking on thief only works on d/p Theif, which is the most boring spec in the game. But even d/p needs tu use #5 and then #2 for stealth attacks which is a lot of initiative spend. Who wants to rely on aa only? Staff AA? Sword AA? Pistols AA? REALLY????
If you don’t mind i rather kill my enemies with spending initiative than autoatacking and dealing zero pressure to them and then run away with SB #5. Is it ok if i really want to kill something?
Good luck with autoatacking and escaping with SB #5, you left Point and noone cares if you just run away alive. You have so many great defensive skills which costs initiative, i have no clue why should i ignore them all with exception of SB #5?

Edit: Oh, and btw, SB #3 has saved my life more times then SB#5. Great skill for kiting and evading attacks.

Sifu.9745:

Captain Obvious.6951:

When I fight people i always save all my initiative so i can swap to short bow and spam 5 because it’s THAT OP!

If you don’t save all your initiative to spam shortbow 5, you’re just a bad thief.

Well, i play d/d condi thief and if i don’t spend initiative i am pretty much dead. But if i do spend initiative (#3 is my favorite one) my opponents die, what a surprise
Autoatacking on thief only works on d/p Theif, which is the most boring spec in the game. But even d/p needs tu use #5 and then #2 for stealth attacks which is a lot of initiative spend. Who wants to rely on aa only? Staff AA? Sword AA? Pistols AA? REALLY????
If you don’t mind i rather kill my enemies with spending initiative than autoatacking and dealing zero pressure to them and then run away with SB #5. Is it ok if i really want to kill something?
Good luck with autoatacking and escaping with SB #5, you left Point and noone cares if you just run away alive. You have so many great defensive skills which costs initiative, i have no clue why should i ignore them all with exception of SB #5?

Edit: Oh, and btw, SB #3 has saved my life more times then SB#5. Great skill for kiting and evading attacks.

He was obviously joking

SuperKorean.7345:

saerni.2584:

I can’t stop laughing.

If you don’t agree with my opinion, please refute my opinion.

Sorry, I thought your post was satire. Thief is more mobile but a relatively mobile opponent can keep up unless trying to race the thief across the entire map. (Which seems like a bad use of their time).

Generally, I agree with the other posters. A thief at 20% isn’t going to be a very effective +1 and just aimlessly bouncing around isn’t going to help their team that much.

Also, if you are caught with zero defensive abilities available I’m not sure why you would expect to survive against any class whatsoever. It’s just not a realistic expectation.

The Scenario’s listed here assume too many variables. It’s nonsense, and a statement made in a vacuum where rotations and good decision making don’t exist on part of the “victim” team.

Zenith.7301:

Thief would be fixed by giving steal a cast time. Probably won’t fix the abuse of stealth to use a steal to land a backstab, but untelegraphed skills should always be weak instead of playing this guessing game of where the thief is.

1- 1/4 cast time on steal.
2- Pulmonary Impact 10 second ICD.
3- Headshot initiative cost increased by 2 initiative.

A class with that damage and mobility should not be king of interrupts/cc as well.

Headshot is fine. Pulmonary impact is still very strong, but its the trait that needs an ICD. Put a 5-10 second CD on Impacting disruption and it would be fine.

Krysard.1364:

Luto.1938:

Thief finishes almost dead player… OP
Thief runs from a fight he lost…. OP

Dont make a fool of yourself, it has never been saidthat it was OP cause it could finish low HP players, its BS cause theres no counterplay attached to some of his mechanics, and so hes forced to abuse them cause the rest of his kit is bad. I dont udnertsnad all the kitten forum warriors here when itsnot about getting some rolling nerfs to thieves, but rather make QoL changes to obv bad mechanics

I was only referring to
“1. You encounter Thief.
2. Your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down.
3. The Thief will chase you down , you die , you have to wait for the re-spawn.
4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain more points.”

I mean really… if your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down, and your still in combat… there’s not much you can do v.s any class. Thieves are the most mobile and they sacrifice defense to be the most mobile. Meanwhile there are other classes with more defense who also do good damage and can teleport to player. (Guard, Rev are two.)

SuperKorean.7345:

By the way, Thief is my most played class. I played Thief for more than 10,000 hours.

I assumed you were joking about this topic. I am upset to be wrong about that.

Thief Shortbow 5 is the most overpowered skill in this game.

[Obnoxious chuckling noises]

If you make mistake , you will die. You cannot run away from Thief mobility.

You assume the thief is close by from a fight you were losing, in which case you experienced a 2v1 or +1. In any situation where you are outnumbered and the people facing you are semi competent, you should down.

If the Thief makes mistake , the Thief will run away and do something else.

You cannot chase down the Thief’s mobility.

SB5 requires 6 init. If you allow a thief to get away with SB5 alone, he or she was plinking you with auto attacks and nothing else.

Even if the Thief lose fights , the Thief can just run away from the fight,
and contribute points by decaping or +1 somewhere else.

This is their job because they can rarely win fights on their own.

Only the Thief can do this, the other 8 classes cannot do this.

See above.

Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.

no.

And also, Shadow Step cooldown should be 60 sec. Or reduce the range down to 900.

And also, add 20 sec internal cool-down to the “Unhindered Combatant Dash” Trait

Also no.

Stun thieves. make them burn SS, then unload. Any time a thief is not on an unguarded or weakly guarded point, en route to a point, or helping +1, he or she is useless to their team .

Your proposal removes not only their ability to quickly decap but also forces them to respawn on lost fights.

It appears that you’re using the fact that a skilled thief will not down in a lost fight to claim that thief is overpowered, when in fact a thief that loses a fight has not contributed at all to point gain and that totally counts as a win.

This is not the case. It’s merely that thief does not succeed at any role -but- this in the current meta.

Edit:

SuperKorean.7345:

Please Nerf Thief Mobility and buff something else.

I can agree with this and -only- this. Though not to the extent that you wish to nerf mobility.

For my information, what build did you use during the pvp league noted in your sig? DP shortbow? What evade trait?

Luto.1938:

Krysard.1364:

Luto.1938:

Thief finishes almost dead player… OP
Thief runs from a fight he lost…. OP

Dont make a fool of yourself, it has never been saidthat it was OP cause it could finish low HP players, its BS cause theres no counterplay attached to some of his mechanics, and so hes forced to abuse them cause the rest of his kit is bad. I dont udnertsnad all the kitten forum warriors here when itsnot about getting some rolling nerfs to thieves, but rather make QoL changes to obv bad mechanics

I was only referring to
“1. You encounter Thief.
2. Your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down.
3. The Thief will chase you down , you die , you have to wait for the re-spawn.
4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain more points.”

I mean really… if your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down, and your still in combat… there’s not much you can do v.s any class. Thieves are the most mobile and they sacrifice defense to be the most mobile. Meanwhile there are other classes with more defense who also do good damage and can teleport to player. (Guard, Rev are two.)

They dont sacrifice defense to be the most mobile, they are forced to do so. Thats what Ive been saying the whole time. And thats what I want to be changed. Thief mobility is just unreasonable, but they need it to be so or they are useless. Why it has been like this for so many years, I still dont know.
Also, lets give a random scenario, and dont take it too literally like all the dumwits on this forum. Youre relatively low on health(like 30%) cause youve just won a fight or w/e, but you still have dodges/def cds. Guess what? A thief jumps you from stealth at 2k range and bursts you down. Rev has a telegraphed port, Guard port can be easily predicted, and the dmg is low per se. Not thief’s. Thats the whole point. It happens every day, everyone can relate to. Youre just happily leaving a fight, apparently youre safe, and from nowhere appears a thief that kills you from stealth/instant skills. Theres no counterplay to steal, and Thief gets carried so much by it, which is bad design. Change it, for the sake of QoL, and balance thief elsewhere so hes not forced to play the role hes now.
The same can be said for sb5. Not going to be so simple, but so you can get the idea, imagine that somehow you rework it and it becomes actually good for 1v1 situations. Now you have a class with rly good mobility, that can properly duel, but it doesnt have godlike decap potential or overall mobility out of combat.

Condi is essentially in the game for the sole purpose of killing fleeing thieves.

The answer is clear as day people! Buff condi.

Ok so lets nerf guard blocks

Necros shroud again

Rangers range

Eles asepcts

Revs energy source

Warriors might stacking and endure pain

Mesmers shatter

Engis turrets need another nerf

See how stupid that sounds

You want to nerf a weapon skill on a profession based on mobility………..did you think that through?

(if you did youre lying)

Thieves’ short bow 5 is one of the only exhaustible abilities in terms of mobility

Nerfing steal is an even dumber idea imo

What you want thieves to have to run around like everyone else moving slow asf cause if that’s the case then why even have thief as a profession anymore?

I mean sure nerf it, but in return I want perma swiftness, oh wait that’s gonna cause ppl to kitten even more

I feel like youre new here tbh

Thief has kitten near 0 defenses, no blocks, no invuln period, nothing besides stealth and mobility, and you want to nerf the core reason the profession exists? I’m sorry, but to me that’s just stupid

If youre health is low and your defensive cd’s aren’t up….any class can kill you regardless, not just thief

Ive did it to people on my burn guard, necros, ranger, and Mesmer, it’s not something specific to thief so idk where you were going with that

Well no kitten we’re gonna run at low health

Invis doesn’t equal invincibility and we have nothing besides evades which people over exaggerate to the extreme ( we really only 1 more than everyone else, the only difference is that we get a trait that gives us vigor to work with and even then, no, perma evades are no longer a thing)

So what you want me to stand there and let you kill me?

Foh

Fat Disgrace.4275:

^ ok.

All Blocks have a 1/2 a second activation time.
add an extra 30 seconds coll down on all Invulabilty skills.
Invulabilty skills reduce duration of 1 second.

That way all builds that can face tank a thief and easy counter presuer them off point will be more balanced.

Many of them already do. Try using unrelenting assault to dodge something.

Invulnerability skills are 60 sec cd. Stealth and steal are a fraction.

You hardly get to complain when you’re the class that gets a utility skill that stunbreaks twice, teleports twice, clears 2 conditions all in one skill.

You have the lowest cooldowns of any class and the majority of your damage is from autoattacks, so your pitiful pleas about initiative costs being shared across weapons means nothing when all you use initiative for is to interrupt or enter stealth.

You are not affected by chill or mesmer interrupt cd increases. You are not affected by immobilize.

Lord Velar.1509:

you want to nerf the core reason the profession exists? I’m sorry, but to me that’s just stupid

If the core reason this profession exists is to be doomed on a decap/+1 role, and abuse steal, well thats sad. Really, how can be anybody against giving thief better mechanics and more role viability?

SuperKorean.7345:

Thief Shortbow 5 is the most overpowered skill in this game.

Let me give you 1 Example =

A.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. Your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down.

3. The Thief will chase you down , you die , you have to wait for the re-spawn.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain more points.

B.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. The Thief makes mistake and the Thief’s health is low.

3. The Thief will run away with 20% health and go decap or +1 somewhere else.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain points.

Whether A or B happens, You encounter Thief. -> The Enemy Team will gain points.

Why ?

Because Thief has superior mobility.

If you make mistake , you will die. You cannot run away from Thief mobility.

If the Thief makes mistake , the Thief will run away and do something else.

You cannot chase down the Thief’s mobility.

Even if the Thief lose fights , the Thief can just run away from the fight,
and contribute points by decaping or +1 somewhere else.

Only the Thief can do this, the other 8 classes cannot do this.

If the other 8 classes lose fights, they die and they have to wait for re-spawn.

Only a Thief can chase down a Thief and finish off a Thief.

If your team doesn’t have Thief and the other team has Thief, the enemy Thief will run around all over the map and your team cannot counter this.

How to fix this?

Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.

And also, Shadow Step cooldown should be 60 sec. Or reduce the range down to 900.

And also, add 20 sec internal cool-down to the “Unhindered Combatant Dash” Trait

By the way, Thief is my most played class. I played Thief for more than 10,000 hours.

You are correct and they should be nerfed. Shadowstep as a utility is really OP. It should have been nerfed a long time ago. It wont happen though.

“Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.”
Rest is OK!

If you’re actually Korean and playing this game for 5-6 hours a day every day for 5 years, then I’m sure you can figure out how to counter a team with a thief.

THIS JUST IN:

Infiltrator’s Arrow: This skill no longer inflicts blind. Initiative reduced from 6 to 5.

Ppl cant stop blameing thief for everything, if you lose, you lose because you didnt have thief in ur team, in other hand when you got one in ur team you lose because of him. Btw any class would kill you when ur skills are on cooldown, and when thief unload his burst he can’t run away(not enough initiative), if you rly have 10k h on thief you would know how to counter it, condi of glass doesnt mather, i love when they waste Steal for nothing, after that yeah most of them will run away. Shadow step cd is fine, could be lil lower, but it’s ok.

Vitro BR.9031:

“Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.”
Rest is OK!

Do you even know how many initiative it cost right now? In case you don’t, it cost 6 initiative, thief w/o trickery has 12 in total. 6 initiative is way to much since it doesn’t do dmg.

Time and time again I have seen 20+ peeps in WvW target and fail to kill a running thief.

I-Win OR I-Run just makes a mockery of everyone else’s gameplay. It’s as if the game designer wants to mock anyone foolish enough to play WvW. Whether its OP or not, it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. End of.

Simple cure is to tag a ‘cannot de-target’ effect for a small period onto jump effects. Thieves are not the only ones who exploit the game’s dire targeting mechanism – which after five years still seems to have an unfair spew of micro-bugs.

lilypop.7819:

Time and time again I have seen 20+ peeps in WvW target and fail to kill a running thief.

I-Win OR I-Run just makes a mockery of everyone else’s gameplay. It’s as if the game designer wants to mock anyone foolish enough to play WvW. Whether its OP or not, it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. End of.

Simple cure is to tag a ‘cannot de-target’ effect for a small period onto jump effects. Thieves are not the only ones who exploit the game’s dire targeting mechanism – which after five years still seems to have an unfair spew of micro-bugs.

Good thing Shadow steps don’t force people to de target…

And last I checked this is the Pvp Subforum not WvW.

I’m sure the devs laugh as much as I laugh reading some of these posts.

elez.4617:

Ppl cant stop blameing thief for everything, if you lose, you lose because you didnt have thief in ur team, in other hand when you got one in ur team you lose because of him. Btw any class would kill you when ur skills are on cooldown, and when thief unload his burst he can’t run away(not enough initiative), if you rly have 10k h on thief you would know how to counter it, condi of glass doesnt mather, i love when they waste Steal for nothing, after that yeah most of them will run away. Shadow step cd is fine, could be lil lower, but it’s ok.

Asur.9178:

I’m sure the devs laugh as much as I laugh reading some of these posts.

These two posts just reinforced what I said

The witch hunt is so real that ppl are complaining about a skill that do 0 damage and cost a lot of initiative, like, dmn near half your initiative

People cant be pleased, this is why the devs laugh about pvp

If youre complaint actually made sense I’d agree with you, but this is just too stupid

imo there’s nothing wrong with SB. I personally never have outside PvE mapping and never needed it or thought “if I had SB, i could have done better”

Once I got the idea that I didnt need it and learned to do without, i found that I got way better at teefing. I used to think that SB was king of a staple but for me, if im in a fight, i fight to win, not to run. I prefer more DPS myself than what the SB can provide.

There’s a reason why thieves/rogues/ninjas were masters of mobility. If he runs, you won that engagement. If you get beat, then learn to adapt your playstyle. There is much init waste when SB 5-ing away. I’m far from perfect at any class, however I get better because I know how to adapt :p

Now, lets have some bacon and be friends.

Zenith.7301:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

^ ok.

All Blocks have a 1/2 a second activation time.
add an extra 30 seconds coll down on all Invulabilty skills.
Invulabilty skills reduce duration of 1 second.

That way all builds that can face tank a thief and easy counter presuer them off point will be more balanced.

Many of them already do. Try using unrelenting assault to dodge something.

Invulnerability skills are 60 sec cd. Stealth and steal are a fraction.

You hardly get to complain when you’re the class that gets a utility skill that stunbreaks twice, teleports twice, clears 2 conditions all in one skill.

You have the lowest cooldowns of any class and the majority of your damage is from autoattacks, so your pitiful pleas about initiative costs being shared across weapons means nothing when all you use initiative for is to interrupt or enter stealth.

You are not affected by chill or mesmer interrupt cd increases. You are not affected by immobilize.

Unrelenting Assault is fine. Its not to specifically dodge something, its damage + suvivial to stay in a fight. To dodge something there is normal dodge and shiro…
(AND you can use quickness sigill to secure a faster cast of it)

Actually your post tells me you have no kittening clue.
First: shadowstep clears 3 condis and if you want that immediatly you actually waste your second stunbreak
second: the second stunbreak is limited to be used in a timeframe of 10sec, backport is limited to a certain spot
third: port and stunbreaks on other classes have around 30-40sec cd and usually offer their own stuff (lighting flash ez to trait for reduced cd and grant regen/vigor -> condiremove). so its ok to have it on 50sec, considering is has more to offer. The trait to reduce that cd competes with a strong condiremove and was NEVER used in any meta specc, so much to that.

Lowest cooldowns my kitten Someone did the kittening math and it turned out thief actually has MORE cooldown overall then any other class and you know why? Because initiative is a delayed GLOBAL cooldown system. Both weaponsets share the same cooldown-pool. Thats one of the reasons, why you almost always use shortbow as second weaponset. Stealth with normal blackpowder+heartseeker combo needs 9 initiative. Thats equal to a 9sec cd and leaves you with 6 intiative. Thats one SB5. 3 skills and you most likely didnt even interrupted the heartseeks and that point. Doesn´t seem that great now, right?
Trickery is mandatory because the whole initiative system is built around having 15 initiative instead of the baseline 12.

Furthermore: “You are not affected by chill or mesmer interrupt cd increases” not on weaponskills, yes. utilities still are affected by it. Sadly that trait isn´t played for years because power mes sucks (compared to condi mes in pvp). Trait was weirdly designed in the first place. Trait revamp juni 2015 was terrible and did the first step into the insane powercreep HoT brought us. (remember CEle burn spike?vamp-rune meta?)
“Not affected by immobilize”? The kitten you talking about? Of course thieves are affected by immobilize. You have to use a rather valuable ressource to get rid of it. A dodge. To compensate that thief got more dodges, that got nerfed decently in the last patches though. Lets not forget other classes get PASSIVE reduction on movement-impairing conditions (engi: mecha legs 33%; chrono: time marches on 25%; warrior: dogged march 33%) or clear them with movement (warriors sprint).

Last: “Invulnerability skills are 60 sec cd”
Not all my friend and some builds have more than one…

To other people wanting steal to have a 1/4sec cast. Deadeye has exactly that. Lets look how that turns out.

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

There’s a reason why thieves/rogues/ninjas were masters of mobility. If he runs, you won that engagement. If you get beat, then learn to adapt your playstyle. There is much init waste when SB 5-ing away. I’m far from perfect at any class, however I get better because I know how to adapt :p

Considering you don’t get points for the other player running away, no you didn’t win. At best you can call that a stalemate. People don’t like thief because they can beat it in a fight, yet the thief can disengage so easily that it can slip away from a fight where it was beaten, and then come back later.

lilypop.7819:

I-Win OR I-Run just makes a mockery of everyone else’s gameplay. It’s as if the game designer wants to mock anyone foolish enough to play WvW. Whether its OP or not, it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. End of.

From what I saw in the demo weekend mirage can easily chase a thief long enough to kill him. Which also means that you have to deal with two super mobile specs in 3 weeks.

Another thing to keep an eye on is if they decide to add mounts to wvw in the future, it would make thiefs mobility compleltly irrelevant.

OriOri.8724:

Bigpapasmurf.5623:

There’s a reason why thieves/rogues/ninjas were masters of mobility. If he runs, you won that engagement. If you get beat, then learn to adapt your playstyle. There is much init waste when SB 5-ing away. I’m far from perfect at any class, however I get better because I know how to adapt :p

Considering you don’t get points for the other player running away, no you didn’t win. At best you can call that a stalemate. People don’t like thief because they can beat it in a fight, yet the thief can disengage so easily that it can slip away from a fight where it was beaten, and then come back later.

I guess for some, winning is more than just the points (myself I pvp for the fights over caps/points. Someone runs away from me while fighting, I won that interaction and won a feel good moment) Doesnt mean I dont try to win the overall match, just that i know I will eventually get the cap so i fight away.