Necromancer is awkward
“Most durable scholar class”
“Necro is the king of attrition”
“Necro is good at locking down their opponent once they’ve engaged him”
Of course, Chapman then left the dev team at anet and necromancer continue to be a punching bag up to this day.
That sounds about right. I can’t stand playing necro, it’s just a blob that sucks up attacks with no deftness or grace.
Necro has actually some decent 1v1 potential. I mean, every class has good and bad 1v1 matchups, but necro is by no means bad.
Playing a necro without a good support – preferably ele – on your team is pure masochism to begin with. But ye, condi necro feels somewhat awkward atm. In all honesty, I thought that the change to Deathly chill (where it only applies bleed) was only meant to be temporary measure….but it has been like that for quite some time now. With all the amounts of condi cleanse, bleeds+poison as your main dmg source just dont cut it anymore.
The power variant with blighter’s boon is much more self sufficient atm….although it still needs support from teammates.
Necro has actually some decent 1v1 potential. I mean, every class has good and bad 1v1 matchups, but necro is by no means bad.
Playing a necro without a good support – preferably ele – on your team is pure masochism to begin with. But ye, condi necro feels somewhat awkward atm. In all honesty, I thought that the change to Deathly chill (where it only applies bleed) was only meant to be temporary measure….but it has been like that for quite some time now. With all the amounts of condi cleanse, bleeds+poison as your main dmg source just dont cut it anymore.
The power variant with blighter’s boon is much more self sufficient atm….although it still needs support from teammates.
I don’t think I’d go as far as to say say necromancer is bad, getting hit by their condi bursts in team fights can be devastating, it feels incomplete. The pressure can be good, but nothing special. I don’t think I ever hear people saying “Oh we NEED a necro on our team to deal with so and so.”
Someone before this comment mentioned necro is kinda like a blob and thats true lol, you go in, throw some condis and you’re just kinda “there” due to no defensive capabilities. The great healthpool is appreciated but does almost nothing to help since most power builds can tear right through anything with poor defenses.
I don’t think I’d go as far as to say say necromancer is bad, getting hit by their condi bursts in team fights can be devastating, it feels incomplete. The pressure can be good, but nothing special. I don’t think I ever hear people saying “Oh we NEED a necro on our team to deal with so and so.”
I think you have misunderstood me there. I never said, that necro was bad, only that it needs tons of support to work properly.
It just bothers me that the power variant works so much more independently than the condi variant. The vast majority of a condi necro’s pressure comes from poison and bleed, which isn’t good enough any more imo. For those conditions to actually become scary, you need high stacks, which you can barely get anymore with the amount of condi cleanse each class has.
Just look at all the other viable condi specs; mainly Mesmer and Warrior. Their main damage comes from a mix of Torment/Confusion/Burning, which condi necro barely has access to.
A necro’s main selling point atm, is it’s boon corruption, which helps it break bunkers like ele, druid, engi and even warrior and guard to some extend (or at least decently pressure those two). Most top-teams still have necros on their team for this especially….So no: necro definitely isn’t bad.
My necro is a melee. Don’t get close, close you die. Vice versa, I don’t get close to enemy, I die. Its not awkward, depends how you play.
Actually all my builds can be melee because I built them that way. Except my warrior, although a melee, it dies easy. everyone kept saying warrior is overpowered, i am still in the dark here…
Guild Wars 2 Forever
(edited by SweetPotato.7456)
everyone kept saying warrior is overpowered, i am still in the dark here…
Cuz warriors are immune to all forms of damage and have insane passive healing. The passive healing on warriors is like the active healing on a menders druid.
Might sound crazy but I think they should dump the stability skill off reaper shroud and work in a Break Bar into the functionality of base shroud. Take foot in the grave and make it so you break stun on entrance and exit but also take zero dmg/condi dmg for 3 seconds (duration of the breakbar stun) if bar is broken.
Might sound crazy but I think they should dump the stability skill off reaper shroud and work in a Break Bar into the functionality of base shroud. Take foot in the grave and make it so you break stun on entrance and exit but also take zero dmg/condi dmg for 3 seconds (duration of the breakbar stun) if bar is broken.
Revenants had a breakbar on crystal hibernation. Needless to say, it wasn’t a good idea in practice.
Necro sucks vs. power (burst/dodge) builds : Revenant, Thief, Warrior, thats all.
Depending on power or condi build these matchups get worse/better.
Jumping spots can help u a lot when pressured, Condis either your own or those applied to you always help you (power well, condi consumption/-transfer).
Thats why necros role in 1v1 or teamfight is fine. It just falls behind when u look at mobility and sustain (condibuild). Sustain on power build (spite/bloodmagic/Reaper) is a lot better, thats why most necros in solo-queue play power build.
That sounds about right. I can’t stand playing necro, it’s just a blob that sucks up attacks with no deftness or grace.
Oo. Then you are not doing it right? I have adjusted current meta to my liking and have good sustain to maintain health and life force while 1 v 2 or 3 until help arrives. It doesn’t always work out but I enjoy it. I am not condi (any more) so it is hard to get top stats and in order to get a daily I have to res someone, defend or cap which is a little harder but I get by.
There are many who do not understand certain classes because they do not understand them. I have used YouTube or Twitch to better understand…. say…thieves who many say are so OP (I personally can’t play the profession at all in PvE or PvP) and can take them down or make ’em run on both my Necro and Ranger. Though not an easy task it is possible once you let them run their stuns out, break ’em and then chew ’em down. Mesmers to me are the hardest class to take down.
EDIT: Spelling >:
Granted Death – Necro
Consumed Hate – Thief
Unlucky Scrub – Ranger
Consumed Hate – Thief
Unlucky Scrub – Ranger
(edited by usnedward.9023)
The noobs will line up to tell you how easy the Necro is to play and how they have 2 health bars lol. Necros are one of the hardest classes to play and are the worst 1v1 class at least the condi builds. That doesn’t mean I think they need a lot of buffs they really don’t I would be happy with changing the reaper grandmaster chill trait back to how it was originally and some nerfs to the ridiculous ways Warriors just shrug off condition damage. Its a group class that shines if you can stay alive for a period of time and it is hard to stay alive for long on one against competent players in a solo queue environment. At least in the old team queue you could group with others who understand how easy it was to kill you and would be there to rez or pressure off you.
If you convert chill damage to be as it was in the good old days it would be a really big buff.
Losing the chill damage and obtaining bleed we lost 1/3-1/4 of our condition damage.
obtain it back will grant us the dps we totally lack to be compared to other classes.
The Reaper is a DPS elite specializzation and we’re playing it as a boon corruption without damage…
Sustain on power build (spite/bloodmagic/Reaper) is a lot better, thats why most necros in solo-queue play power build.
Spite, Blood, Reaper is crap.
Every power build not using Soul Reaping is crap.
4% Shroud Degen AND 10 second shroud cooldown is just too much.
Necro sucks vs. power (burst/dodge) builds : Revenant, Thief, Warrior, thats all.
Power Reaper sucks vs. Warriors like a lot of other builds do, as warrior is broken in terms of 1v1 (in teamfights it’s not!).
It does not suck vs. Thieves or Revs.
(edited by KrHome.1920)
If you convert chill damage to be as it was in the good old days it would be a really big buff.
Losing the chill damage and obtaining bleed we lost 1/3-1/4 of our condition damage.
obtain it back will grant us the dps we totally lack to be compared to other classes.
The Reaper is a DPS elite specializzation and we’re playing it as a boon corruption without damage…
I think they needed to find a middle ground, back when HoT first came out warrior sucked against necro because not only was the chill/condi damage amazing, but the warrior’s main condi defense, berserker’s stance, was nerfed to being a boon so they could just corrupt it and make the whole utility useless.
I’m glad they reverted it back as it was needed for berserker’s stance, but I feel like necro needs it’s edge back too. Right necro cannot handle 1v1s really at all except maybe against something like scrapper. To me, if you’re not a support as in, your main goal is to do damage and not heal/tank for people, then you should be able to handle 1v1s much better than this.
Sustain on power build (spite/bloodmagic/Reaper) is a lot better, thats why most necros in solo-queue play power build.
Spite, Blood, Reaper is crap.
Every power build not using Soul Reaping is crap.
4% Shroud Degen AND 10 second shroud cooldown is just too much.
Necro sucks vs. power (burst/dodge) builds : Revenant, Thief, Warrior, thats all.
Power Reaper sucks vs. Warriors like a lot of other builds do, as warrior is broken in terms of 1v1 (in teamfights it’s not!).
It does not suck vs. Thieves or Revs.
10 sec. shroud cd has never been too much… Cause everyone used to play it with unblockable marks. You dont stay in shroud for ages anyway… and doesnt matter to stay 0.25 seconds longer in shroud when focused.
with Blighter’s Boon you get 1% Lifeforce for every boon applied and another 1% from Chilling Victory for hitting chilled foes. You get a lot of might through spite, heal on hit with BM and Might by hitting foes, boons through well of power and ‘you are all the weaklings’. + Protection from casting wells.
Furthermore you can play with ‘Your Soul is mine’ and get even more Lifeforce reg. .
Staff : Axe/warhorn with paladins amulett.
No problem in Gold/Platin Tier on EU.
Nothing is wrong with Necromancer. It’s the only class that doesn’t make a mockery of Line-of-Sight, especially via teleports, and furthermore, can’t simultaneously attack while defending. Both of these problems run rampant in all other classes. All the Necromancer has is two dodges and health. The only thing the Necromancer needs is Stability to protect key skill usage.
i7-6700K – M.2 PCIe 512GB R/W:2500/1500MB/s
GTX 980M – SSD 512GB R/W:550/520MB/s
17.3" 1080p – 32GB 2400MHz DDR4
GTX 980M – SSD 512GB R/W:550/520MB/s
17.3" 1080p – 32GB 2400MHz DDR4
(edited by Jayce.5632)
It’s like necro just got left behind by the powercreep…
4% Shroud Degen AND 10 second shroud cooldown is just too much.
The baseline cooldown of shroud is 10seconds. Soul Reaping has a trait to reduce it to 6, but that trait is rarely taken because it requires giving up another generally more important trait.
Unless you are talking about how the degen is too much and therefore that mandates soul reaping?
Sanity is for the weak minded.
YouTube
YouTube
(edited by Crinn.7864)
I agree Necro need a buff somewhere like stability or something and a tad more to DPS oh yeah and also speed up base attack key 1. I think this would balance the necro and give a fighting chance against good warriors and when you have no life force.
still hoping for a 1sec invuln when entering shroud in death magic. and then death magic getting buffs. then shroud degen -50% baseline. more life force on aa’s. more pulsing aoes or ways to put down counter pressure to get people to back off, preferably something without 35 or 40sec cds. I think that’s a good start.
Team Deathmatch for PvP – Raise the AoE cap for WvW – More unique events for PvE
Sigh,
As someone who has mained Necromancer since launch at PvP, I know what a change Necromancer has taken from being a tanky bruiser class to a now squishy one.
Let me start off by saying, Necromancer IS THE BEST teamfighter in this game. Do NOT even argue with this statement as that is the truth and nothing BUT the truth. With that being said, Necromancer’s DPS potential is off the roof. Yes, I am fairly aware that people tunnel focus you at the first mid fight and with Necromancer being squishy as it is, it will kill a lot of unexperienced Necromancers. But there are counters to this.
Kite correctly, know map layout and know where Steal can’t work on you (against thieves)
With Thief Comps I take Shout Heal and Flesh Wurm for the Life Force so Shroud can save you
Coordinate with the support on you’re team
Always stay in ranged if you are low on Life Force, this is the #1 mistake that most necromancers make
If you are focused, use Spectral Armor to gain Life Force as damage you take is converted into LF
Rise even with it’s nerf state, can still overwhelmingly do Damage Mitigation out from you and trigger traps from Dragonhunters
If you are Solo Qued I highly recommend taking the Power Build with Paladin’s as THIS WILL help you.
Flesh Wurm can be used for vertical mobility to disengage immediately and it’s a stun breaker. Also, to prevent your Wurm from being killed before you use it be smart and don’t be putting it to the most obvious of spots.
Reaper’s Mark is an underrated mark for Necromancer. My most favorite use of it is against thieves, I lay the mark directly where I am standing while I’m ranging down other marks or Scepter/Axe skills.
Yes, I am quite aware that Necromancer can’t take many 1v1 matchups (except for Engineer, we eat Engineer’s for breakfast, lunch, and dinner for 1v1’s well condi necros that is) And yes I am completely aware that the class has turned into Downstate 9000. But this does not mean AT ALL that Necromancer is in a terrible spot. Do not think that going down all the time or not being able to 1v1 a lot of classes makes Necromancer automatically terrible and need a buff instantly. An experienced veteran Necromancer with the right build and even better, a good support on the team can inflict a lot of pain in teamfights, and I mean A LOT OF PAIN. Especially an Elementalist/Necromancer Duo can do A TON of damage to people in teamfights.
Would I wanna see Necromancer being able to 1v1 again or at least have its damage reduced a bit while buffing its sustain so it can survive longer? Maybe, but the identity of Necromancer right now is a very high damage teamfighter with the drawback of being squishy if in the hands of people not prepared to take the focus they will be getting.
Also, I’d like to list a couple of 1v1s that Necromancer can take and potentially win, keep in mind player skill and the builds that players are running is taken to account as well. If you want to get in depth and ask questions and call me an idiot and say, “LOL NO WAY NECRO CAN WIN THAT MATCHUP YOU IDIOT” or the exact opposite “LOL NO WAY NECRO CAN’T WIN THAT MATCHUP YOU IDIOT” I will do thorough explanations of the matchup if you guys want.
Necromancer vs Engineer= Condi wins this very easily
Necromancer vs Condi Warrior= Depends on player skill and build. Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Mesmer= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Revenant= Depends on player skill, and build Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Druid= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Power Warrior= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Dragonhunter= Depends on player skill and AWARENESS cough dont step on traps cough Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Burn Guard= Condi wins this very easily if player skill is high
Necromancer vs Necromancer= Depends on player skill and build, either way a necro wins lol
Necromancer vs Thief= Depends on Life Force, player skill, and build. Necro can win
Necromancer vs Elementalist= Don’t ever take this 1v1, as it’s never ending.
Also, I’d like to list a couple of 1v1s that Necromancer can take and potentially win, keep in mind player skill and the builds that players are running is taken to account as well. If you want to get in depth and ask questions and call me an idiot and say, “LOL NO WAY NECRO CAN WIN THAT MATCHUP YOU IDIOT” or the exact opposite “LOL NO WAY NECRO CAN’T WIN THAT MATCHUP YOU IDIOT” I will do thorough explanations of the matchup if you guys want.
Necromancer vs Engineer= Condi wins this very easily
Necromancer vs Condi Warrior= Depends on player skill and build. Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Mesmer= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Revenant= Depends on player skill, and build Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Druid= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Power Warrior= No just no just run don’t bother don’t be an idiot
Necromancer vs Dragonhunter= Depends on player skill and AWARENESS cough dont step on traps cough Necro can win this tho
Necromancer vs Burn Guard= Condi wins this very easily if player skill is high
Necromancer vs Necromancer= Depends on player skill and build, either way a necro wins lol
Necromancer vs Thief= Depends on Life Force, player skill, and build. Necro can win
Necromancer vs Elementalist= Don’t ever take this 1v1, as it’s never ending.
Those are terrible matchups unfortunately, this means a skilled necro player cannot deal with warriors, mesmers, eles, druids and it’s a 50/50 chance against DHs, thieves and revenants but has one good matchup against scrapper.
The issue isn’t that necros are complete garbage, but that other professions are doing their job better with necros having a niche. For example, good warriors can kill necros, eles, scrappers, mesmers, druids, revenants so if the team fight were to fail, they can peel off and 1v1 a node. Mesmer can fill the condi role while being able to win against necros with superior mobility and more 1v1 potential.
You could say necro is the better team fighter over mesmer, but do I really want to give up my mesmer slot for something that requires my team to carry it, has worse mobility, almost no 1v1 presence, no disengage outside flesh wurm (which can be killed) and in general just worse matchups? Again, necro isn’t terrible it ahs it’s uses, but they’re niche. A dps role that requires so much support and no 1v1 presence is just awkward lol
In the history of MMOs, you’d be hard pressed to find a class weaker than Necros at the start of any competitive match.
With zero life force, a large percentage of all necro traits, defenses, and abilities are useless. You’re literally playing with half a deck.
How do you build life force?
Here’s the real kicker…you HAVE to put yourself in harms way and attack…even worse…you not only have to attack, but you have to BE attacked to build life force at any reasonable rate.
Oh…and you have virtually no damage at 1200 range, so you have to get in close range AND you wear cloth AND you have almost no stability AND you have zero defenses that scale against a zerg.
On top of that, you have the worst mobility for rotating and almost no support or bunker build. Virtually any class can 1v1 you by simply kiting or going toe-to-toe.
If a Necro is going to be so much weaker than every other class at the beginning of the game, then it needs to be OP when it has full life force and able to easily kill 1v2 with full life force. However, this NEVER is the case unless you bring up the most extreme mismatches in player skill.
In the history of MMOs, you’d be hard pressed to find a class weaker than Necros at the start of any competitive match.
With zero life force, a large percentage of all necro traits, defenses, and abilities are useless. You’re literally playing with half a deck.
How do you build life force?
Here’s the real kicker…you HAVE to put yourself in harms way and attack…even worse…you not only have to attack, but you have to BE attacked to build life force at any reasonable rate.
Oh…and you have virtually no damage at 1200 range, so you have to get in close range AND you wear cloth AND you have almost no stability AND you have zero defenses that scale against a zerg.
On top of that, you have the worst mobility for rotating and almost no support or bunker build. Virtually any class can 1v1 you by simply kiting or going toe-to-toe.
If a Necro is going to be so much weaker than every other class at the beginning of the game, then it needs to be OP when it has full life force and able to easily kill 1v2 with full life force. However, this NEVER is the case unless you bring up the most extreme mismatches in player skill.
The mechanics of necro in general right now have no synergy. They want you to build life force by being in big fights but they can’t handle being focused. They want reaper to be a strong melee fighter but it can’t get close to anything and win the fight. They want necro to mostly stay at range yet it has no disengage outside of flesh wurm so you’re mostly just having to just walk away and that’s it.
The condi damage is awesome, but when the source of it is so easy to abuse and force out/focus, it’s just not really worth it.
In the history of MMOs, you’d be hard pressed to find a class weaker than Necros at the start of any competitive match.
With zero life force, a large percentage of all necro traits, defenses, and abilities are useless. You’re literally playing with half a deck.
How do you build life force?
Here’s the real kicker…you HAVE to put yourself in harms way and attack…even worse…you not only have to attack, but you have to BE attacked to build life force at any reasonable rate.
Oh…and you have virtually no damage at 1200 range, so you have to get in close range AND you wear cloth AND you have almost no stability AND you have zero defenses that scale against a zerg.
On top of that, you have the worst mobility for rotating and almost no support or bunker build. Virtually any class can 1v1 you by simply kiting or going toe-to-toe.
If a Necro is going to be so much weaker than every other class at the beginning of the game, then it needs to be OP when it has full life force and able to easily kill 1v2 with full life force. However, this NEVER is the case unless you bring up the most extreme mismatches in player skill.
The mechanics of necro in general right now have no synergy. They want you to build life force by being in big fights but they can’t handle being focused. They want reaper to be a strong melee fighter but it can’t get close to anything and win the fight. They want necro to mostly stay at range yet it has no disengage outside of flesh wurm so you’re mostly just having to just walk away and that’s it.
The condi damage is awesome, but when the source of it is so easy to abuse and force out/focus, it’s just not really worth it.
Condi Mesmer and even my condi Ranger has more condi burst than Necro. In fact, both are also easier to disguise/surprise. They also are nowhere near the liability that a necro is at the start (and midmatch too).
Let’s put it in the most simplest of terms…How many times have you seen any class run away from a solo necro sitting on a node? How many times have you seen a team say to focus someone OTHER than a necro at the start of a match? How many times have you seen a Necro with a clutch play, quicker rotation, or win a 1v2 compared to other classes? How many other professions need to be babied and supported by teammates (in a game where only 2 man premades max)?
If these things are not a problem, then you have perfect evidence why GW2 is not as popular as it should be. Some of the most obvious things in the game (with all classes) go totally unaddressed and ignored in PvP.
Necro is a class whose main defense doesn’t scale to number of opponents, unlike blocks and evades and invulnerability and teleports. Your shroud blocks just as much damage against 3-4 people attacking you as it blocks against 1.
Moreover, necromancers have BAR NONE THE WORST HEAL SKILLS IN THE GAME. They heal for nothing, have fairly long cd’s for the pitifully low healing they do, and they also got large cast times.
Reaper shroud is a DPS loss over their non-deathshroud weapons. Greatsword/dagger auto do more DPS than reaper shroud 1 by a good margin. So shroud is a turtle form with limited offensive pressure.
More importantly, shroud has no access whatsoever to utilities or elites for some messed up reason. Your signet passives don’t even work while in shroud, so your power signet passive is useless.
The main mechanic of reaper, chill, is useless against warriors and thieves.
Moreover, it’s a bad attrition class because all its skills have long cast times and obvious tells, it has poor self healing, and it doesn’t generate life force to compensate for the rate of loss of health and shroud.
Reaper doesn’t outlast, it must kill its targets quickly, and reaper simply doesn’t have the damage or CC to accomplish that burst demand.
Stability from reaper shroud needs to have its nerf reverted and the stability needs to continue to work after exiting reaper shroud.
If greatsword skills won’t be sped up to be reliable, then they need to deal a lot more damage across the board so that in the rare chance they do connect, they finish off an opponent instead of tickling them.
(edited by Zenith.7301)