Guild Wars 2

I d really like to see necro passives like spinal shivers gone and also the aoe output nerfed. As a tradeoff i d like to see some damage avoiding utilities or traits like other professions already have. A bit of stab would be nice aswell. This is meant for pvp as here necro dmg is over the top right now, sustain is way below average therefore.

Another idea for pvp would be banning HoT specs completely from pvp to get rid of the power creep introduced with elite specs. The game was pretty balanced before HoT, only broken thing was cele amu, which got removed now and stealth bursts which might need to be looked at then.

You know that if you ban HoT spec you lose also Reaper’s Shroud which solved some old necro isues. A little bit of mobility, stability and melee attacks instead of slow cast life blast and 0 stability that was countered easily in many ways.

I don’t really care about passives etc i can live without them but agree the sustain is low and sometimes can be even unplayable low with pug players. We need damage avoiding skills/traits. Or remove other classes 100% damage avoiding and balance from there or change every 100% damage avoiding to 33% 50% damage mitigation etc.

Yeah so basically you want to take away what makes us viable at higher levels?

I’d rather stay a tissue paper class than be subjected to having my only viable role taken away.

The only viable role now is broken af. Damage is way over the top. And i don t see deathshroud as an issue, it worked quite well. The stab problem was alrdy pointed out although without reaper u can go for foot in the grave which i rly liked on core necro.

Patrick.2987:

The only viable role now is broken af. Damage is way over the top. And i don t see deathshroud as an issue, it worked quite well. The stab problem was alrdy pointed out although without reaper u can go for foot in the grave which i rly liked on core necro.

The damage is actually mid-level. Condi-Mesmer, condi warrior, power warrior, power rev, and guard all have notably better pressure than us.

Our viability is pinned on poison cleave (for stopping those rezzes and cutting down on healing) and boon removal.

The only skill on core deathshroud worth the time it takes to cast it, is the #3. The rest of the kit is crap even before HoT.

Better learn sth about the class i guess then

As if necro wasn’t already unplayable in the current meta.

necro is kinda , well i wouldn’t say kitten but meh in solo queu.So whenever I come across a good necro player who doesn’t die in one go. my eyes ball out and go like WTF!!!????

Necro is fine and actually needs buffs to sustain in the form of evades, blocks dodges.

Patrick, do you ever played a necromancer?
Because seems you never did.

The necromancer dps is one of the lower of this game (and not only in sPvP), have only a single combo (Rs5+Rs4, and is good only if traited) that is the more thelegraphed and slow combo in all GW2 (4 seconds of execution), and you can clean/dodge/block/evade/invul/resistance it with a insane amount of skills (that the necromancer totally lack), making that combo the worst dps skill of the game, still if it’s our Only dps combo.
Also, a mesmer that make a scepter rotation (even without using the Fx skills and don’t using any trait) can do much better with not a single problem of be interrupted or evaded by a single teleport/movement skill.

The necromancer is the worst dps class of the moment (fighting against the ele for the bottom of the barrel) and have really bad condition weapons (the staff is only a utility weapon and the scepter is bad if compared to more or less every other condi weapon of the game -talking about damage-).

The necromancer can be a thorn in the feet for his boon corruption ability or for his minion spam (that make you miss the real enemy -sometimes- if you use AoE skills), but nothing more. Not damage for shure.

Patrick.2987:

I d really like to see necro passives like spinal shivers gone and also the aoe output nerfed.

Fool, it’s thanks to Major Master:Chill of Death trait’s damage that we can “easily” kill someone with a GS power build.

Patrick.2987:

As a tradeoff i d like to see some damage avoiding utilities or traits like other professions already have. A bit of stab would be nice aswell. This is meant for pvp as here necro dmg is over the top right now, sustain is way below average therefore.

We have dont have to nerf our (poor) damage to obtain a new skill.
We have to improve Wurm, like reduced CD, the abiliy (new button) for move the minion underground to a new location and give to the master protection/immunity on death. Seriously, who make use of Necrotic Traversal’s poison damage?

Patrick, do you ever played a necromancer?
Because seems you never did.

Probably twice as much as u did. And i did actually in pvp, where thanks might stack and procs like spinal shivers on top of aeo marks the dmg output is rly strong. As i m asking for some defensive utility options i have to give sth in return. And that can only be our aoe dmg, as it is one of the best in pvp right now, if not the best.

Are you…. talking about power necro? O_O

Ye necro currently using power.

Thing is, necro dmg is not even high, you mainly bring nec cause it makes it easier for your team to kill things due to chill, posion and corrupts, not for its actual dmg output

If you use Power, then i have to tell you that the skills you’re talking about are just BAD if compared to all the other dps class skills.
Staff marks as AoE Strong Damage? Where? When? How?
At your best, using a power build as you play, the Putrid mark (with Berserker, rune of trangth and 25 stack of Might, to make the example) have a power of 1700 with a CD of 20 sec. And the other marks have a power of 700-430-350.
And Spinal Shiver have a power of 1800 (if delete 3 boons and always with 25 stack of might).
If you seriously think that the Staff and the Spinal Shiver skill/trait are OP, you need to try other classes and see how insanely strong they are.
Some example, but with and without might stacks:
-DH LB2: 1770 (no might) / 2330 (25 might) – 4 sec CD
-Thief Backstab: 2000 (no might) / 2670 (25 might) – 0 to x sec CD (depending on when you turn back in stealth)
-Engi hammer 3: 2780 (no might) / 3660 (25 might) -12 sec CD
-Mesmer sword 2: 2000 (no might) / 2660 (25 might) – 12 sec CD
-Revenant sword 3: 2400 (no might) / 3150 (25 might) – 12 sec CD
-Warrior GS 2: 4900 (no might) / 6450 (25 might) – 8 sec CD (but yes, make a full hit is hard in sPvP, you can see only half of that damage, that is still 2450/3200)
-Elementalist Dagger (Fire) 3: 1700 (no might) / 2200 (25 might) – 12 sec CD
-Ranger LB 2: 3300 (no might) / 4400 (25 might) – 10 sec CD

And all that other classes have a Lot of devensive skills, like block, immunity, resistance, direct damage immunuty, stealth and movement skills.
the necro only have an extra LF pool that is barely decent in 1v1 (if you use it as a shield and then chose to don’t inflict any good damage) but totally useless over more than 1 enemy.

If you still think that the necromancer have too much AoE Damage potential or anyway damage (expecially with a Power Build), you need to try other classes and see how bad the necro is as a DPS.
If you want to tell about damage on a necro you can talk about the axe, that have a good damage, but totally not about the Staff.

I am not talking about power necro as this is not viable anyway. Furthermore why do u think necro is still a strong pickup? Because it has lot of heals? Lot of sustain to bunker a point? It is just a pickup cause of amazing aoe pressure. I am talking about the currently best build which is ofc spite, bloodmagic, reaper. If u think a sustain buff is fine without giving up dmg output i don t need to argue any further. If u say power nec is underpowered you are right, this is why it is not used. If i say nerf rev mobility no one would argue hammer has no leaps. And again this is referring to two things. First of all ofc the dmg output on full offense build, second it is only refered to necro as i play it myself. Ofc other professions are over the top in other aspects like thief mobility compared to pre hot same for scrapper sustain compared to engi e.g. I won t comment on these as i don t play them and have no clue what to actually improve.

What facts that necro dmg is too strong would you like to see? Play vanilla and play reaper and tell me they are same lvl. If that is the case i am totally wrong.

Patrick.2987:

I am not talking about power necro as this is not viable anyway.

You just said you were talking about PowerNecro – here is the quote;

“Ye necro currently using power.”

Patrick.2987:

I am not talking about power necro as this is not viable anyway. Furthermore why do u think necro is still a strong pickup? Because it has lot of heals? Lot of sustain to bunker a point? It is just a pickup cause of amazing aoe pressure. I am talking about the currently best build which is ofc spite, bloodmagic, reaper. If u think a sustain buff is fine without giving up dmg output i don t need to argue any further. If u say power nec is underpowered you are right, this is why it is not used. If i say nerf rev mobility no one would argue hammer has no leaps. And again this is referring to two things. First of all ofc the dmg output on full offense build, second it is only refered to necro as i play it myself. Ofc other professions are over the top in other aspects like thief mobility compared to pre hot same for scrapper sustain compared to engi e.g. I won t comment on these as i don t play them and have no clue what to actually improve.

What facts that necro dmg is too strong would you like to see? Play vanilla and play reaper and tell me they are same lvl. If that is the case i am totally wrong.

You was talking about power necro (your words: “Ye necro currently using power.”), spinal shiver damage (that is barely good only on a power build) and staff aoe damage with might spam (if you’re not using a power build the staff damage is even worst than what I described because the staff have a really poor condition damage. At best you can send away some conditions spammed on you by your enemy, nothing more)

If you compare the Core class and the Reaper, the reaper will win without mercy. That because the Elite Specializzations are stronger than the Core class and WE ALL KNOW THAT.
The problem is not if the reaper is stronger than the core class and for that need to be nerfed in damage, the problem is that the reaper have the weaker dps of the game, expecially in sPvP.
Your example don’t make any sense.

The Only AoE pressure skills are the Rs5+Rs4 combo, that spam poison and have a good damage. But it is so easy to avoid that if you don’t use it with the best timing you will hit no one or get CCed and/or stripped off the shroud by aoe and focus before you’ll be able to inflict any good damage. And in 1v1/2v2 fights against classes with good mobility is totally useless (if you play against decent players).

The necromancer is good only for his boon corruption, nothing more.
But for shure it use damaging skills and can inflict damage, then you have to take in consideration that he can inflict you damage and kill you if you start the fight too easy as “it’s just a necro, let’s play around and have fun”.
but from this to say that the necromancer have too much AoE damage there’s an Abyss.

Necro is an attrition class to complain about short term damage from them is ludicrous.

How about stepping out of the aoe.
Just a thought here.
I understand that it can be difficult to dodge immovable red circles on the ground,
but give it try.
You never know.

Silv.9207:

If you compare the Core class and the Reaper, the reaper will win without mercy. That because the Elite Specializzations are stronger than the Core class and WE ALL KNOW THAT.

I don’t think that holds true.

The only inherent advantage reaper has over core is Reaper’s shroud, but in a necro v necro duel RS isn’t all that exciting. The stability it has is a liability in a necro duel and it’s extremely easy to kite. And then Shouts are unilaterally unpowered in a 1v1 to begin with.

Anecdotally as someone who mains necro and tends to swap around between reaper and core, I find that I win my necro 1v1s easier with core than with reaper, simply because of core having a fuller toolkit when it comes to dueling condi classes.

Necros are weak when alone, i dont think nerf damage output would be good.

The real issue is the damage output of other classes mixtured with with stacked necros.

ReV hammer Stacked spammers, DH Ji trappers stacked, and a few others, Anet increased the aoe/cleave spam on this game, while they should reduce it and make some aoe classes unique.

Dont change necro, changes all the other classes cleave/aoe spam… to just a few skills.

Even my heavy modded skyrim is way more balanced than this game. XD

Anet needs to design classes in pvp in mind and then adapt them do pve, the aoe/cleave spam in this game makes it horrible to watch, reason why pvp isnt that much observed, people get disgusted with all the splash damage.

Patrick.2987:

Better learn sth about the class i guess then

Yes, you should.

I’m surprised to see a complaint about necro atm. As thief , even though they are a focus target for me, I don’t see them as OP or doing too much dmg. It’s kinda their class fantasy, if you don’t wnna get kittened by aoe then move out of it and stop tunnel visioning the necro? They are like locks in WoW, supposed to be this tanky caster without mobility so the only way to get you off them is aoe and CC.

DH traps are 10x worse imo

This thread is totally futile. ESpecs are going nowhere, live with it instead of pining for “the good old days”.

A nerf necro thread?really? IS this for real?dude… nerf…. NECRO?

As some might not have noticed, i want to see aoe dmg getting nerfed on necro as a tradeoff to gain sth different. If you only buff sustain it is just another broken revenant.

Aeolus.3615:

Necros are weak when alone, i dont think nerf damage output would be good.

The real issue is the damage output of other classes mixtured with with stacked necros.

ReV hammer Stacked spammers, DH Ji trappers stacked, and a few others, Anet increased the aoe/cleave spam on this game, while they should reduce it and make some aoe classes unique.

Dont change necro, changes all the other classes cleave/aoe spam… to just a few skills.

Even my heavy modded skyrim is way more balanced than this game. XD

Anet needs to design classes in pvp in mind and then adapt them do pve, the aoe/cleave spam in this game makes it horrible to watch, reason why pvp isnt that much observed, people get disgusted with all the splash damage.

+1 modded skyrim is more balance than this ? kitten? game.The balance of this game is the worst I have never seen. I try staff thief today and make 9 times jumping , jump in , jump out, just pass two keys dodge and staff 5. This is brainless just spam two keys and don’t have any danger. I don’t know how do they can make a game like that.

Patrick.2987:

As some might not have noticed, i want to see aoe dmg getting nerfed on necro as a tradeoff to gain sth different. If you only buff sustain it is just another broken revenant.

Actually we don’t have enough damage to tradeoff for something.
All the other classes have Better dps (also AoE dps) than us and Also highly better defensive skills. Why have we to tradeoff something that we barely lack to obtain something other classes already have with more benefits than us?

Necromancer already had his tradeoff payed in sPvP from when ANet removed Chill damage, defensive amulets, buffed the dps of some other classes and let us into the dust with a spam-n-die build that even the top esl team find hard to play.

It is as good as other professions so with a sustain buff it is just too strong.

Patrick.2987:

It is as good as other professions so with a sustain buff it is just too strong.

If you think that our dps, expecially aoe, is good as the same way a DH dps is, you really missed some points in this sPvP meta.
Or the Ranger dps. or Revenant dps. Or Thief dps. But yes, they are more a single target class, that can burst a necro 100 to 0 in 3 seconds without any problem.
The only problem is that they all have a insane amount of defensive skills and traits that grant them block/invulnerability, movement, stealth (not the reve) and condi clean (not the reve but he can burst you down easy before you can inflict any decent condi damage to him). They also have huge attacks, burst combo (ranger Lb2+petF2 or thief backstab or reve sword+staff dps combo) and hige CC to kill you easier.

Seriously, if you look to all the other classes we have a bad dps or a incredibly bad build to have a good one. You can play in berserker and inflict good to huge damage with axe and greatsword as a necromancer (if you’re good enough to do it), but you will never survive to tell it to anyone.
And as a condition build a warrior, engineer or mesmer can do insane damage compared to ours, with huge defensive skills at the same time (unless for the engi that is a little squishy than the common build, but still able to flee if needed).

Silv.9207:

Patrick.2987:

It is as good as other professions so with a sustain buff it is just too strong.

If you think that our dps, expecially aoe, is good as the same way a DH dps is, you really missed some points in this sPvP meta.
Or the Ranger dps. or Revenant dps. Or Thief dps. But yes, they are more a single target class, that can burst a necro 100 to 0 in 3 seconds without any problem.
The only problem is that they all have a insane amount of defensive skills and traits that grant them block/invulnerability, movement, stealth (not the reve) and condi clean (not the reve but he can burst you down easy before you can inflict any decent condi damage to him). They also have huge attacks, burst combo (ranger Lb2+petF2 or thief backstab or reve sword+staff dps combo) and hige CC to kill you easier.

Seriously, if you look to all the other classes we have a bad dps or a incredibly bad build to have a good one. You can play in berserker and inflict good to huge damage with axe and greatsword as a necromancer (if you’re good enough to do it), but you will never survive to tell it to anyone.
And as a condition build a warrior, engineer or mesmer can do insane damage compared to ours, with huge defensive skills at the same time (unless for the engi that is a little squishy than the common build, but still able to flee if needed).

So you actually talk about dps, which is not proper to use in pvp, as we should talk about dmg potential across a short time. This is not pve. Second thing u say is ranger damage is higher with more defensive skills, which is not true. Next you tell me u run axe and greatsword which does not need any further comment. And condi engi with massive survivability is new to me aswell.

Balance is made from top tier down to low tiers. There we won t find a single dragonhunter but a necro in almost every team. I think it is because necro is one of the worst damaging professions in the game. We should just give it invulns, stealth and bloccks on top of all the corrupt and dmg output which is mainly aoe thanks to well, staff and reapershroud.

But yeah sure bad builds are underpowered, this is why they are not picked on top lvl. Every profession has this. And again i think revenant and other elite specs are over the top aswell, but i m not refering to them. This post is about bringing necro elite spec in line with core necro or gameplay improvement in soloq.

Patrick.2987:

We should just give it invulns, stealth and bloccks on top of all the corrupt and dmg output which is mainly aoe thanks to well, staff and reapershroud.

Staff isn’t high dps, or even mediocre dps. Staff is a utility weapon used for fear access, condi transfer, and LF gen.

Reaper Shroud does apply notable damage, but it doesn’t apply any more than any other AoE profession.

Boon corruption on necro is done in scepter not staff and is primarily single target with the except of a few skills.

Boon corruption is done by signets and well mainly and staff auto for lf? idk if this is worth.

Patrick.2987:

Boon corruption is done by signets and well mainly and staff auto for lf? idk if this is worth.

Scepter has been the go to weapon for corrupts since they put boon corrupt on the scepter auto chain.

Also signetmancer has been depreciated for awhile now by newer curses-based corruption builds. Even then the old spite-bloodmagic corruption build still favored scepter because scepter stacks bleed way better than staff which is important for proc’ing the vamp siggy trait in blood magic.

I know Necro doesn’t really have much else to take away at this point, but that doesn’t mean taking it away is the correct course of action…