Guild Wars 2

Hi all,

I was just wondering what was the reason of the no stacking profession rule that has been decided for ESL tournament.

1) Professional teams need help to avoid taking inefficient comp ?
2) Stacking teams is an obvious evidence of abysmal ballance quality ?

If 2) then isn’t it dangerous to keep obvious op builds hidden by artificial limiting rules ?

And what about profession that can cover different roles with different build ?

It’s #2.

Balance was and still is terrible, which leads to profession stacking of the handful of ridiculously overpowered builds. We saw this in season1 and it was extremely boring to see the same comps over and over with little variation or chance for dynamic play. ESL is trying to stop that by forcing teams to use a few of the less powerful builds for variety.

If they really wanted to see interesting play, they should just ban all elite specs.

I don’t really know what you’re asking but I do know that they are implementing it due to how horrendously boring season 1 of pro league was. Double mesmer and double rev was very plain to watch and when anet kittens up and creates a God tier build like chronobunker, stacking the class becomes way too powerful and resulted in easy carrying teammates in ranked, and a very boring pro league.

Jelzouki.4128:

I don’t really know what you’re asking but I do know that they are implementing it due to how horrendously boring season 1 of pro league was. Double mesmer and double rev was very plain to watch and when anet kittens up and creates a God tier build like chronobunker, stacking the class becomes way too powerful and resulted in easy carrying teammates in ranked, and a very boring pro league.

Boring maybe…but as you raised it..there were god tier builds…and we saw it.
Good way to manage the problem is to shave the builds that are obviously too efficient.
With new esl rules…op builds will remain as tournaments will no more enlight them.
This is lazzy way to fix balance issues.

Kicast.1459:

Jelzouki.4128:

I don’t really know what you’re asking but I do know that they are implementing it due to how horrendously boring season 1 of pro league was. Double mesmer and double rev was very plain to watch and when anet kittens up and creates a God tier build like chronobunker, stacking the class becomes way too powerful and resulted in easy carrying teammates in ranked, and a very boring pro league.

Boring maybe…but as you raised it..there were god tier builds…and we saw it.
Good way to manage the problem is to shave the builds that are obviously too efficient.
With new esl rules…op builds will remain as tournaments will no more enlight them.
This is lazzy way to fix balance issues.

This … I agree , for the life of me, I don’t know why they always shows pro esl player builders before the game start?? Like all it does is channel the community to the same build.

Since ESL is marketing, anet wants to make it entertaining to watch. They likely decided that class stacking was somewhat responsible for s1 and they don’t want a repeat of that.

Fivedawgs.4267:

I agree , for the life of me, I don’t know why they always shows pro esl player builders before the game start?? Like all it does is channel the community to the same build.

Yeah it’s not like creating a build is rocket science here in GW2. Take the best traits/traitlines, runes and sigils, have a look at the current meta and pretty much everybody should be able to come up with a build which is 90% equal to the current meta build.

On the other hand most teams do have players who are streaming and by just asking them you will nearly always get their ESL builds.

In the end meta builds are exactly what they are called, the best builds – meta – in the current patch.

It’s always amazing how some people think here on the forums.

Schtizzel.5497:

Fivedawgs.4267:

I agree , for the life of me, I don’t know why they always shows pro esl player builders before the game start?? Like all it does is channel the community to the same build.

Yeah it’s not like creating a build is rocket science here in GW2. Take the best traits/traitlines, runes and sigils, have a look at the current meta and pretty much everybody should be able to come up with a build which is 90% equal to the current meta build.

On the other hand most teams do have players who are streaming and by just asking them you will nearly always get their ESL builds.

In the end meta builds are exactly what they are called, the best builds – meta – in the current patch.

It’s always amazing how some people think here on the forums.

Oh really … you mean to tell me that in process of reciprocating a pro player build, one has no chance to come up/make his own build? ? OMG even thinking has a meta .. Why God Why!!!

The no class stacking rule was probably made to stop the double Mesmer, double revenant that all teams ran in the pro league. As much as I absolutely love the pro league and am so hyped I can’t believe it for the finals, if i am honest the meta could have been a bit more entertaining in season 1 so I hope this rule works for season 2.

I don’t have an issue with removing class stacking from ESL tournaments. My issue is, what about SoloQ classes stacking together? A team with Double Druid healbots are the new bunker mesmers prepatch. Teams are going to move up the upcoming ladders abusing stackable druids.

Honestly, we need to remove stackable traits or amulets on a class per team. Only 1 class per team should be allowed to use the same grand master traits, or, have that stackable class share amulets so that they can’t have the same build/playstyle. These are better than completely removing stackable class’s all together, imo.

I’m not sure if the OP understands what questions are. Just putting a question mark at the end of a sentence doesn’t make something a question, lol.

Dahkeus.8243:

I’m not sure if the OP understands what questions are. Just putting a question mark at the end of a sentence doesn’t make something a question, lol.

Well it seems you are willing start a phylosophical debate. While I am sure you are a pretty interesting person full of knowledge who only aims to enlight world mediocrity, I am not sure the current topic is the most appropriate place for it. You are talking with people who obviously don’t know what a question is after all.

Thank you for your constructive remark.
Ps: Maybe you have a good proposal for reason on esl stacking rule ?

Saiyan.1704:

I don’t have an issue with removing class stacking from ESL tournaments. My issue is, what about SoloQ classes stacking together? A team with Double Druid healbots are the new bunker mesmers prepatch. Teams are going to move up the upcoming ladders abusing stackable druids.

Honestly, we need to remove stackable traits or amulets on a class per team. Only 1 class per team should be allowed to use the same grand master traits, or, have that stackable class share amulets so that they can’t have the same build/playstyle. These are better than completely removing stackable class’s all together, imo.

Your idea adds a lot more conditions to the matchmaking algorithm than just removing class stacking.

Israel.7056:

Saiyan.1704:

I don’t have an issue with removing class stacking from ESL tournaments. My issue is, what about SoloQ classes stacking together? A team with Double Druid healbots are the new bunker mesmers prepatch. Teams are going to move up the upcoming ladders abusing stackable druids.

Honestly, we need to remove stackable traits or amulets on a class per team. Only 1 class per team should be allowed to use the same grand master traits, or, have that stackable class share amulets so that they can’t have the same build/playstyle. These are better than completely removing stackable class’s all together, imo.

Your idea adds a lot more conditions to the matchmaking algorithm than just removing class stacking.

+1 to Saiyan.

Removing class stacking is a PITA for all players that know how to switch to have a better comp at the start of the game. This feature is a strong feature that encourage all players to know how to COMP and what is weak or strong versus other classes.

Removing class stacking should not removed class switching. And so, Falselight got a true solution to the real problem of class stacking.

Its a vey intresting idea not to allow the same amulet. And no its not so complicated. Not alowign the same class or amulet is more or less equal. Just not directly visible.

Removing amulet stacking changes very little practically while adding another condition to the matchmaking. If there were 5 amulets that were all functionally distinct then it might be worth thinking about. However many amulets are effectively redundant or allow for a roughly similar build such as Viper/Sinister/Merc, Berserker/Marauder/Paladin. They’re different but they’re not distinctly different. Moreover there are some doubles that can still work very well with two different amulets i.e revenant.

The rock/paper/scissors issues of counter-comping can be more easily addressed through class balancing while the issues brought up by class stacking are much more difficult to balance away. Removing class stacking fixes the issue of class stacking full stop. To me it seems to be the simpler and more obvious choice.