Guild Wars 2

Not a whining thread, just putting it up for anyone unaware of it. Constant avoids, really hard to hit with anything.

I think I’ve beaten it with condition damage but only if they didn’t get a surprised backstab or anything in first.

I can’t believe this Omg kill him before he lays eggs

Thats an old build btw…

1) 4 initiative cost,
2) 2 hit skill with only evade on second hit,
3) bad pathing for second hit
4) Very easy to dodge.

Also, that’s a S/D build, they don’t have backstabs (unless it’s on a second weapon setup)

Build is out there for quite a while but hard to master because of point 3

Just wait untill it starts stealing all of your boons constantly because lolnocooldowns

lolwut? new meta?
lolno. l2p.

I always loved S/D.
In the thief forum, it is common sense that FS is bad and S/D is underpowered. False.

Actually this is one of the most complete and versatile weapon set thief has. It isn’t stupid like P/D conditions or D/D backstab.

Anyway I bet we’ll see a new meta once FS get buffed. IMHO it doesn’t need a buff at all.

sorrow.2364:

I always loved S/D.
In the thief forum, it is common sense that FS is bad and S/D is underpowered. False.

Actually this is one of the most complete and versatile weapon set thief has. It isn’t stupid like P/D conditions or D/D backstab.

Anyway I bet we’ll see a new meta once FS get buffed. IMHO it doesn’t need a buff at all.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

FS is bad and S/D is underpowered.

OH dagger is horribad and the whole set is clunky and unreliable.

S/D was killed the day they nerfed tactical strike and OH dagger.

They not only should buff FS ( and they will), they should also give this set more dmage and revert the nerf to tactical strike ( or buff it slightly, in order to get a 2.5 daze with runes or sigils) .

It may be the most complete and skillful set in all theif arsenal, but does bad literally EVERY thing ( control, support, evading, damage).

S/D is totally NO GOOD.

Mrbig.8019:

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

FS is bad and S/D is underpowered.

OH dagger is horribad and the whole set is clunky and unreliable.

S/D was killed the day they nerfed tactical strike and OH dagger.

They not only should buff FS ( and they will), they should also give this set more dmage and revert the nerf to tactical strike ( or buff it slightly, in order to get a 2.5 daze with runes or sigils) .

It may be the most complete and skillful set in all theif arsenal, but does bad literally EVERY thing ( control, support, evading, damage).

S/D is totally NO GOOD.

I know that being used to P/D or backstab can make everything else look underpowered.

Now that they revert revealed to 3s, they have buffed enough S/D.
Being able to daze people for 2.5s every 3 second isn’t balanced, in case you didn’t know.

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

FS is bad and S/D is underpowered.

OH dagger is horribad and the whole set is clunky and unreliable.

S/D was killed the day they nerfed tactical strike and OH dagger.

They not only should buff FS ( and they will), they should also give this set more dmage and revert the nerf to tactical strike ( or buff it slightly, in order to get a 2.5 daze with runes or sigils) .

It may be the most complete and skillful set in all theif arsenal, but does bad literally EVERY thing ( control, support, evading, damage).

S/D is totally NO GOOD.

I know that being used to P/D or backstab can make everything else look underpowered.

Now that they revert revealed to 3s, they have buffed enough S/D.
Being able to daze people for 2.5s every 3 second isn’t balanced, in case you didn’t know.

P/D is totally useless.

the only decent build a thief has is D/P burst, that is far from being overpowered, and will also brutally nerfed next patch.

you can daze for 2 secs with mesmer runes/sigil of paralyzation every 4 secs ( revelead timer) that is far from being balanced ( in fact it’s underpowered) due to set damage being so low and due to numerous counters available ( stability, DODGE OMG) while also requiring positioning and a quite big ini management, adding these to the big damage loss gained by slotting mesmer runes/sigil of paralyzation instead of ogre runes/fire sigil.

If you want to talk about it, at least get your stuff sorted before talking.

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

And they’re also going to nerf mug lol.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-cF3F3FGWw-1-K5wOFd0;9;5T-T9;127A;128B4;0Ucl6P;1KJG4KJG46RD

Needless to say, decent build but brings little utility and dps to the table.
With the buff to FS, it’ll have better sustain gaining access to prot/regen and may open room for more offensive options in sigil/amulet

Mrbig.8019:

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

There is no point into have a reasoning with you.
You are too biased toward your profession. This statement is utterly stupid to be said by a impartial point of view.

Mrbig.8019:

sorrow.2364:

I always loved S/D.
In the thief forum, it is common sense that FS is bad and S/D is underpowered. False.

Actually this is one of the most complete and versatile weapon set thief has. It isn’t stupid like P/D conditions or D/D backstab.

Anyway I bet we’ll see a new meta once FS get buffed. IMHO it doesn’t need a buff at all.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

FS is bad and S/D is underpowered.
[b] FS is balls to the wall easy to hit. Requires far less set-up than something like Hundred Blades and hits like Backstab. The set is underpowered though.

S/D was killed the day they nerfed tactical strike and OH dagger.
[b]S/D and S/P continued after their primary nerfs for many users outside of the limelight due to Haste. Not that S/D was ever in the limelight even before the tactical nerf.

They not only should buff FS ( and they will), they should also give this set more dmage and revert the nerf to tactical strike ( or buff it slightly, in order to get a 2.5 daze with runes or sigils) .
Tactical strike is fine where it is, in all honesty. They should keep it like Surprise shot on the shortbow, complementary but not defining. If anything I wished it removed a boon so S/P could get past it’s barriers but whatever.

It may be the most complete and skillful set in all theif arsenal, but does bad literally EVERY thing ( control, support, evading, damage).
S/D is more complete than the shortbow? It’s moving towards that but I think you and Sorrow have something in your eyes. It has a strong 2, a workeable 3 a rarely useful 4. 5 and stealth work alright.

You can make an evade S/D if you want but it’s only niche is really Foefire where Graveyards huge radius allows you to throw him on there as a sort of temporary off-tank who with a spike. Otherwise you’re generally playing a faux backstab spike with FS, trying to be tanky and flopping with shadow arts, or venom sharing.
The weapon set is still strong enough to deal with most people, that isn’t its issue, it’s why take S/ instead of D/ even if S/ can accomplish something, and generally you’ll be better with D/ outside of niches.

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

There is no point into have a reasoning with you.
You are too biased toward your profession. This statement is utterly stupid to be said by a impartial point of view.

Lol it’s common knowledge that thief is bad, aside D/P burst, in tPvP.

Go outside of hotjoin for a moment and try the thief, ANY OTHER thief build aside D/P burst with ANY OTHER utility skills aside Shadow refuge, shadowstep and sin signet and take a look at how effective and useful to your team you are.

Even devs said “thief is strong at low elo , but struggles at higher ratings”.

If you believe thief is good , you can draw your own conclusions.

ensoriki.5789:

Mrbig.8019:

sorrow.2364:

I always loved S/D.
In the thief forum, it is common sense that FS is bad and S/D is underpowered. False.

Actually this is one of the most complete and versatile weapon set thief has. It isn’t stupid like P/D conditions or D/D backstab.

Anyway I bet we’ll see a new meta once FS get buffed. IMHO it doesn’t need a buff at all.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

FS is bad and S/D is underpowered.
[b] FS is balls to the wall easy to hit. Requires far less set-up than something like Hundred Blades and hits like Backstab. The set is underpowered though.

S/D was killed the day they nerfed tactical strike and OH dagger.
[b]S/D and S/P continued after their primary nerfs for many users outside of the limelight due to Haste. Not that S/D was ever in the limelight even before the tactical nerf.

They not only should buff FS ( and they will), they should also give this set more dmage and revert the nerf to tactical strike ( or buff it slightly, in order to get a 2.5 daze with runes or sigils) .
Tactical strike is fine where it is, in all honesty. They should keep it like Surprise shot on the shortbow, complementary but not defining. If anything I wished it removed a boon so S/P could get past it’s barriers but whatever.

It may be the most complete and skillful set in all theif arsenal, but does bad literally EVERY thing ( control, support, evading, damage).
S/D is more complete than the shortbow? It’s moving towards that but I think you and Sorrow have something in your eyes. It has a strong 2, a workeable 3 a rarely useful 4. 5 and stealth work alright.

You can make an evade S/D if you want but it’s only niche is really Foefire where Graveyards huge radius allows you to throw him on there as a sort of temporary off-tank who with a spike. Otherwise you’re generally playing a faux backstab spike with FS, trying to be tanky and flopping with shadow arts, or venom sharing.
The weapon set is still strong enough to deal with most people, that isn’t its issue, it’s why take S/ instead of D/ even if S/ can accomplish something, and generally you’ll be better with D/ outside of niches.

Of course i don’t believe S/D is more complete than the shortbow, but still is the most complete set among all others.

The point is that it doesn’t do anything very well, nothing ( as you said) that you wouldn’t be able to accomplish with a D/P set.

You have less damage, less control ( head shot is 10 times more powerful than tactical strike, currently) less utility ( BP, istant interrupt) and even less tankability ( BP alone gives the thief more survivability than a full acro, FS spamming, thief) .

I’m saying tactical strike should be buffed because the trade off for bringing mesmer runes/sigil of para in order to increase TS effect of mere 0,5 secs instead of going full damage with ogre runes and fire sigil, is NOT BALANCED.

There’s no point in increasing TS duration via runes/sigil when you could have so much more damage with other stuff.
And TS, due to positional requiring, not istant nature and all the stuff of S/D ( bad damage, bad control, bad everything, but these problems exist even for S/P) is not balanced when compared to stuff like Backstab.

With mug nerf, thief design issues will suddenly be glaring.

lol hot join

Jzaku.9765:

Just wait untill it starts stealing all of your boons constantly because lolnocooldowns

HAH

Just because Anet ‘buffed’ something doesn’t mean its good.
1 random boon isn’t something great.
Being forced to use the new second attack after flanking strike, which doesn’t have an evade on it, means you can’t spam evade if you had to like you can now.

Mrbig.8019:

Lol it’s common knowledge that thief is bad, aside D/P burst, in tPvP.

Go outside of hotjoin for a moment and try the thief, ANY OTHER thief build aside D/P burst with ANY OTHER utility skills aside Shadow refuge, shadowstep and sin signet and take a look at how effective and useful to your team you are.

Even devs said “thief is strong at low elo , but struggles at higher ratings”.

If you believe thief is good , you can draw your own conclusions.

Basing their opinion around common knowledge is what stupids do.
I don’t want to believe you are stupid. Either I want to believe that your only argument against is “common knowledge” or a “try from yourself”, like I didn’t.

Thief is powerful at what it is supposed to do. The only problem is that elementalist overshadow him, that’s all.

That doesn’t mean that there isn’t something that can use a buff, that means that this something which needs a buff isn’t FS and that thief isn’t that bad as you are depicting it.

Mrbig.8019:

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

There is no point into have a reasoning with you.
You are too biased toward your profession. This statement is utterly stupid to be said by a impartial point of view.

Lol it’s common knowledge that thief is bad, aside D/P burst, in tPvP.

Go outside of hotjoin for a moment and try the thief, ANY OTHER thief build aside D/P burst with ANY OTHER utility skills aside Shadow refuge, shadowstep and sin signet and take a look at how effective and useful to your team you are.

Even devs said “thief is strong at low elo , but struggles at higher ratings”.

If you believe thief is good , you can draw your own conclusions.

You’re right that thief has very few builds that work, but you’re wrong that that setup is the only one that works.

Chesire.9043:

Not a whining thread, just putting it up for anyone unaware of it. Constant avoids, really hard to hit with anything.

I think I’ve beaten it with condition damage but only if they didn’t get a surprised backstab or anything in first.

If Jumper is good at one thing, it’s making the hot join heroes angry

Trigr.6481:

If Jumper is good at one thing, it’s making the hot join heroes angry

Archer Henchman.2534:

Mrbig.8019:

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

There is no point into have a reasoning with you.
You are too biased toward your profession. This statement is utterly stupid to be said by a impartial point of view.

Lol it’s common knowledge that thief is bad, aside D/P burst, in tPvP.

Go outside of hotjoin for a moment and try the thief, ANY OTHER thief build aside D/P burst with ANY OTHER utility skills aside Shadow refuge, shadowstep and sin signet and take a look at how effective and useful to your team you are.

Even devs said “thief is strong at low elo , but struggles at higher ratings”.

If you believe thief is good , you can draw your own conclusions.

You’re right that thief has very few builds that work, but you’re wrong that that setup is the only one that works.

and what else ?

S/P venom share ?

S/P venom share is a “decent” build, but is still mediocre. There’re tons of builds out there for other profession which can offer a lot more than a venom sharing thief ( terror necro, for example).

The point is exactly this: there’s nothing a thief can do other classes can’t do better.

Aside burst.

Which will be nerfed.

Hi, Jumper, I was pleasantly surprised to see you play S/D.

I am S/D fans, Roc Goemon, I am always remember your D/P high DPS killing.

I don’t know how it’ll play out, depends on how well the new S/D #3 tracks in the new system. If it does it well and is gonna be stealing boons…I don’t see why it wouldn’t be very good.

Does nobody see the inherent flaws with stealing boons for survivability?

Let me state a couple of these:

1. You engage without boons and limited burst due to the nature of the weapon set and the nerf to Mug

2. You need to attack bunkers to actually gain access to boons that make you sturdier

3. Most boons are constantly reapplied by those “depending” on them. Stealing a boon at a time that lasts 3 seconds will have little to no impact

4. You need to be able to stay in the fray and actually in melee range of your target to steal boons.

5. The Thief post patch will be just as squishy as he’s now when engaged. So if you get bursted to 30%, what will you do? Turn around and say "oh, no problem, I am just going to steal that regen that will tick for 130 (you know it will be scaling with your stats, don’t you) on me and I’ll be fine!?

6. There are quite a few classes who will retain their burst capabilities and not offer any boons to you, because they do not rely on boons for their survivability

Med.6150:

Does nobody see the inherent flaws with stealing boons for survivability?

Let me state a couple of these:

1. You engage without boons and limited burst due to the nature of the weapon set and the nerf to Mug

2. You need to attack bunkers to actually gain access to boons that make you sturdier

3. Most boons are constantly reapplied by those “depending” on them. Stealing a boon at a time that lasts 3 seconds will have little to no impact

4. You need to be able to stay in the fray and actually in melee range of your target to steal boons.

5. The Thief post patch will be just as squishy as he’s now when engaged. So if you get bursted to 30%, what will you do? Turn around and say "oh, no problem, I am just going to steal that regen that will tick for 130 (you know it will be scaling with your stats, don’t you) on me and I’ll be fine!?

6. There are quite a few classes who will retain their burst capabilities and not offer any boons to you, because they do not rely on boons for their survivability

lol finally someone understanding it.

As i said in another thread, i hope this will be the first of many, needed, changes to the thief.

But believing that boon hate will solve thief issues ( that were glaring EVEN BEFORE mug was nerfed) is crazy, really.

We need help in weapon sets, traits and base damage.

Mrbig.8019:

The point is that it doesn’t do anything very well, nothing ( as you said) that you wouldn’t be able to accomplish with a D/P set.
it has its niches but more or less yup
You have less damage, less control ( head shot is 10 times more powerful than tactical strike, currently) less utility ( BP, istant interrupt) and even less tankability ( BP alone gives the thief more survivability than a full acro, FS spamming, thief) .
The head shot vs Tactical comparison mmm….I think you’re off. Really tactical isn’t about interrupting but it is certainly usable for that purpose while headshot is, Tactical gives you a free way of either starting initiation or re-engaging after you’ve stealthed. Similar to surprise shot, it’s not bread n butter it is a complementary lead in, even if you use S/P with headshot Tactical keeps that use as a way of re-engaging in inexpensively (instead of using Pistol whip) and it certainly going to give you more damage for re-engaging than headshot will. I keep comparing Tactical to Surprise shot, because it’s more akin to that.
I’m saying tactical strike should be buffed because the trade off for bringing mesmer runes/sigil of para in order to increase TS effect of mere 0,5 secs instead of going full damage with ogre runes and fire sigil, is NOT BALANCED.
The trade off for bringing Svanir runes for Ice drake venom sucks too but so what? You should move past the TS daze effect.

And TS, due to positional requiring, not istant nature and all the stuff of S/D ( bad damage, bad control, bad everything, but these problems exist even for S/P) is not balanced when compared to stuff like Backstab.
Landing the daze on TS is easy as hell the position requirement is nearly non-existant because the system is VERY, VERY lax in regards to this. It’s harder to land the blind then the daze. I don’t see why putting greater pressure on a stealth skill is ideal especially if the idea is more upfront sustainability as stealth is about removing yourself from the equation (and losing that node). It’s pretty fair where it is right now. If I was changing TS it be just because players in WvW and Spvp are honestly playing a different weapon set (to me) as the style of usage is honestly different as a result of the daze change and the disconnect in reveal (that is happening).

Med.6150:

Does nobody see the inherent flaws with stealing boons for survivability?

Let me state a couple of these:

1. You engage without boons and limited burst due to the nature of the weapon set and the nerf to Mug

2. You need to attack bunkers to actually gain access to boons that make you sturdier

3. Most boons are constantly reapplied by those “depending” on them. Stealing a boon at a time that lasts 3 seconds will have little to no impact

4. You need to be able to stay in the fray and actually in melee range of your target to steal boons.

5. The Thief post patch will be just as squishy as he’s now when engaged. So if you get bursted to 30%, what will you do? Turn around and say "oh, no problem, I am just going to steal that regen that will tick for 130 (you know it will be scaling with your stats, don’t you) on me and I’ll be fine!?

6. There are quite a few classes who will retain their burst capabilities and not offer any boons to you, because they do not rely on boons for their survivability

You need to take it all in. S/ already has Inf strike which is a significant boon to the sets longevity. CnD for stealth aids in this as well as having Flanking strikes evade, we might lose the ability to cancel FS to chain evades so eh it might actually go down. However at present S/D already removes boons, adding them to your own does increase the sets survival because 1) You’re removing a threat already (might or fury for instance) and increasing it to your own which can let you hit harder (and thus apply more pressure before they can fell you) or become sturdier.
It’s not some magic boon but since S/D is already fairly sturdy increasing it more isn’t going to be a problem.
Not really anything to complain about.

If you get bursted to 30% in S/ you press 2 and you leave. You are alive. GG, or you press Shadow step, same as a D/ thief. Or you hit CnD and walk away. Or you deselect your target, and start using FS like Disabling shot, canceling it for the evade (assuming that can still be done).

I think you’re right with low boon duration being poor.

6. Is just how it is, same is true for Warriors taking Empowered or a necro using Corrupt boon. Etc, sometimes there just aren’t boons. That’s even true now that if you’re using FS sometimes you run into a guy with none and you just have to deal.

ensoriki.5789:

You can make an evade S/D if you want but it’s only niche is really Foefire where Graveyards huge radius allows you to throw him on there as a sort of temporary off-tank who with a spike. Otherwise you’re generally playing a faux backstab spike with FS, trying to be tanky and flopping with shadow arts, or venom sharing.
The weapon set is still strong enough to deal with most people, that isn’t its issue, it’s why take S/ instead of D/ even if S/ can accomplish something, and generally you’ll be better with D/ outside of niches.

With the upcoming patch its niche seems to be killing bunkers but it won’t be a quick kill. A main-hand dagger thief would be better against everything else.

One thing I’ve noticed this past month is more and more players are stacking boons. They create a balanced build with good damage output with lots of boons to help stay alive. People are really going to hate the new warrior and thief boon hate mechanics. There are so many builds that rely on keeping all boons or certain boons up 100%.

heres a hint from a thief, do not stay in the same spot… MOVE! all the FS will miss…

btw are ppl already training for the next patch?! xD

Volrath.1473:

heres a hint from a thief, do not stay in the same spot… MOVE! all the FS will miss…

btw are ppl already training for the next patch?! xD

lol i am.

sadly the set is too inferior to D/P, and i believe that even with boon hate incoming, it will still be.

with the only difference that now we won’t be good even as burst proff.

Volrath.1473:

heres a hint from a thief, do not stay in the same spot… MOVE! all the FS will miss…

Practice.

Mrbig.8019:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Mrbig.8019:

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

S/D is grossly bad and underpowered, along with 70% of other thief sets ( condi builds, S/P, S/D, P/P, P/D) and along with 80% of thief traits and U-skills.

There is no point into have a reasoning with you.
You are too biased toward your profession. This statement is utterly stupid to be said by a impartial point of view.

Lol it’s common knowledge that thief is bad, aside D/P burst, in tPvP.

Go outside of hotjoin for a moment and try the thief, ANY OTHER thief build aside D/P burst with ANY OTHER utility skills aside Shadow refuge, shadowstep and sin signet and take a look at how effective and useful to your team you are.

Even devs said “thief is strong at low elo , but struggles at higher ratings”.

If you believe thief is good , you can draw your own conclusions.

You’re right that thief has very few builds that work, but you’re wrong that that setup is the only one that works.

and what else ?

S/P venom share ?

S/P venom share is a “decent” build, but is still mediocre. There’re tons of builds out there for other profession which can offer a lot more than a venom sharing thief ( terror necro, for example).

The point is exactly this: there’s nothing a thief can do other classes can’t do better.

Aside burst.

Which will be nerfed.

That’s rather incorrect. Venom share isn’t decent. Its trash. I don’t think a single thief in the top 500 runs it. I’m really baffled that people keep talking about it; its bad. Every thief of note runs a build tailored to dealing physical damage.

But there are other ways to run physical damage than d/p burst, and there are builds that provide more total damage output than 25/30/0/0/15.

Start thinking about which classes you’re bringing to a team fight, and what your thief is accomplishing in those situations. Think about what build setups make you effective in the maximum amount of situations. What is your thief trying to do in fights? Burst people down, then try to neut their back point? If so, yes, the mug nerf hurts. The objective of thieves playing like that is to pull people someone to the backpoint, then quickly capitalize on a 5v4 mid with a spike to create a 5v3 situation.

If that stops working because of the mug change, start thinking about other things that your thief can do and then do those.

Med.6150:

Does nobody see the inherent flaws with stealing boons for survivability?

Let me state a couple of these:

1. You engage without boons and limited burst due to the nature of the weapon set and the nerf to Mug

2. You need to attack bunkers to actually gain access to boons that make you sturdier

3. Most boons are constantly reapplied by those “depending” on them. Stealing a boon at a time that lasts 3 seconds will have little to no impact

4. You need to be able to stay in the fray and actually in melee range of your target to steal boons.

5. The Thief post patch will be just as squishy as he’s now when engaged. So if you get bursted to 30%, what will you do? Turn around and say "oh, no problem, I am just going to steal that regen that will tick for 130 (you know it will be scaling with your stats, don’t you) on me and I’ll be fine!?

6. There are quite a few classes who will retain their burst capabilities and not offer any boons to you, because they do not rely on boons for their survivability

Have you seen the video someone linked few posts ago?
That video alone shows you why you are wrong.

S/D is not about burst, it is about sustained damage. If you run that weapon set as a full glass cannon, of course you are going to die. Spend some trait points into Acrobatics and Shadow Arts and you’ll see how squishy thieves are… if you manage to hit them.

[quote=1913691;ensoriki.5789:]

sorrow.2364:

Med.6150:

Does nobody see the inherent flaws with stealing boons for survivability?

Let me state a couple of these:

1. You engage without boons and limited burst due to the nature of the weapon set and the nerf to Mug

2. You need to attack bunkers to actually gain access to boons that make you sturdier

3. Most boons are constantly reapplied by those “depending” on them. Stealing a boon at a time that lasts 3 seconds will have little to no impact

4. You need to be able to stay in the fray and actually in melee range of your target to steal boons.

5. The Thief post patch will be just as squishy as he’s now when engaged. So if you get bursted to 30%, what will you do? Turn around and say "oh, no problem, I am just going to steal that regen that will tick for 130 (you know it will be scaling with your stats, don’t you) on me and I’ll be fine!?

6. There are quite a few classes who will retain their burst capabilities and not offer any boons to you, because they do not rely on boons for their survivability

Have you seen the video someone linked few posts ago?
That video alone shows you why you are wrong.

S/D is not about burst, it is about sustained damage. If you run that weapon set as a full glass cannon, of course you are going to die. Spend some trait points into Acrobatics and Shadow Arts and you’ll see how squishy thieves are… if you manage to hit them.

what sustained damage ?

S/D damage is laughable.

HGH engi has good sustained damage

shatter mesmer has good sustained damage

ele dps has good sustained damage

Thief sustained is laughable EVEN when built as a glass cannon, guess how it is when built for survival.

C’mon please.

Mrbig.8019:

what sustained damage ?

S/D damage is laughable.

HGH engi has good sustained damage

shatter mesmer has good sustained damage

ele dps has good sustained damage

Thief sustained is laughable EVEN when built as a glass cannon, guess how it is when built for survival.

C’mon please.

Yes, yes.
I understood your point.
Thief is incredibly bad and it should be buffed in every aspect.
Seriously… Stop this.

sorrow.2364:

Mrbig.8019:

what sustained damage ?

S/D damage is laughable.

HGH engi has good sustained damage

shatter mesmer has good sustained damage

ele dps has good sustained damage

Thief sustained is laughable EVEN when built as a glass cannon, guess how it is when built for survival.

C’mon please.

Yes, yes.
I understood your point.
Thief is incredibly bad and it should be buffed in every aspect.
Seriously… Stop this.

ok , i got it.

You’re ten years ahead, in the new thief meta.

Silly me.

I don’t know where thief will fit in after this patch. I heard nothing that was addressing the massive aoe that is in this game. spamming a single target boon strip/steal evade attack isn’t going to do a whole hell of a lot when you are standing in aoe conditions from engies and necros laughing as you twirl around like a buffoon.

I heard the sotg cliff notes and all I can say is I expect the thief and warrior to now be equal and terrible in the new meta come april 30th. warrior will be buffed…slightly…nothing to address the real problem though (that they fall over to conditions like crazy) and thief will be nerfed. both will be tier C garbage that fill no roles that other classes don’t fill and better.

The only thief that will be viable (and truly the only thief really viable now) is one that is carried by four superstar teammates that handle dmg and dish dmg very well on their own…so that the thief can just vulture a target once at 50%. However, even in those teams where the thief has four superstars…i would suppose a team opposing it with five superstars not playing a thief…will ultimately prevail.

R.I.P warrior 3/26/2013
R.I.P thief 4/30/2013

I said before that I felt the devs were honing in on a truly epic game balance by homogenizing the player base into only one profession. By having everyone play one profession..all abilities are balanced..cause everyone has the same abilities. We started with 8 profs… we’re going to be down to 6. I guess by Jan 2014… we should have our prof winner!

Could of sworn even the devs said Flanking strike is really easy to avoid which is why they are changing it.

I agree with the above comments that this method of boon hate is a terrible idea. It won’t help the thief against real boon heavy classes like mesmers, guardians, and elementalists because they can reapply the majority of boons instantly and the random nature of stealing them. It will only have an impact on the easily abused mechanics like HGH 25might stack or classes like thieves and warriors that don’t have many boons and they’re on long cooldowns.

Without a mechanic to make the target incapable of gaining new boons for a brief period of time, this whole system will have no function use whatsoever.

Atherakhia.4086:

I agree with the above comments that this method of boon hate is a terrible idea. It won’t help the thief against real boon heavy classes like mesmers, guardians, and elementalists because they can reapply the majority of boons instantly and the random nature of stealing them. It will only have an impact on the easily abused mechanics like HGH 25might stack or classes like thieves and warriors that don’t have many boons and they’re on long cooldowns.

Without a mechanic to make the target incapable of gaining new boons for a brief period of time, this whole system will have no function use whatsoever.

The boons I strip are usually the might stacks because they are the most frequently applied boon, and that is the one boon that no boon stacking build can live without. FS removes the last applied boon. D/D ele damage is downright laughable without that 25 stack of might.

D/P and shortbow is still the most kitten kitten ever. They don’t need to land a cloak and dagger because a cheap heartseeker does it for them on a blind field, and their shortbow auto and cluster hits like a truck.

Lol plz a good S/D thief will beat a good D/any thief any day simply because when you combine sword with some acrobatics, you literally become the fastest profession in the game. You’re the most agile with infiltrator’s, FS, withdraw, shadowstep/roll for initiative. You can get to anywhere really fast assuming you have a shortbow, and even without it, you still have high endurance regen, swiftness on dodge, and infinite teles. Not to mention, you do extremely high steady dmg with your auto attack and can strip (soon steal) boons at will. The really kool part bout this spec is its ability to sync well with any utilities you prefer (deceptions, stealth, signets, and even traps) yea thats rite, traps too because infiltrator’s teles you too an enemy and while they’re immobilized, just set the trap and watch it activate instantly.

First off: Backstab IS the current thief profession. Anyone arguing otherwise simply doesn’t know what they are talking about.

Having said that, and now having practiced some s/d, the mobility is pretty nice. Perhaps we’ll get a mobile sustained damage build out of this. I hate being forced to play a non-face-melting-dps thief but, if A-net must listen to all the whine “thief kills me to fast”… and I must then play this new… whatever it is.. then so be it. Sucks, but so be it.

annoying yes, effective no (not yet).

fierotecknics.5961:

First off: Backstab IS the current thief profession. Anyone arguing otherwise simply doesn’t know what they are talking about.

Having said that, and now having practiced some s/d, the mobility is pretty nice. Perhaps we’ll get a mobile sustained damage build out of this. I hate being forced to play a non-face-melting-dps thief but, if A-net must listen to all the whine “thief kills me to fast”… and I must then play this new… whatever it is.. then so be it. Sucks, but so be it.

If you think “thieves kill me too fast” is a whine, then perhaps your posts should be disregarded in the future.

There’s no other class who can spike my necromancer down from 22k hp into 3-4k hp left in that short a time span, not even mesmers.

At least with mesmers you can see the shatters running to you. With the thief it’s all a lottery of whether he will get off the backstab or not.

Sword thieves should be the baseline for their design — highly mobile, but they should not be doing the kitten burst they do. No, you don’t need basilisk venom for your combo.

Vence.6974:

Lol plz a good S/D thief will beat a good D/any thief any day simply because when you combine sword with some acrobatics, you literally become the fastest profession in the game. You’re the most agile with infiltrator’s, FS, withdraw, shadowstep/roll for initiative. You can get to anywhere really fast assuming you have a shortbow, and even without it, you still have high endurance regen, swiftness on dodge, and infinite teles. Not to mention, you do extremely high steady dmg with your auto attack and can strip (soon steal) boons at will. The really kool part bout this spec is its ability to sync well with any utilities you prefer (deceptions, stealth, signets, and even traps) yea thats rite, traps too because infiltrator’s teles you too an enemy and while they’re immobilized, just set the trap and watch it activate instantly.

Exept you have no way of keeping up with a fast moving target like a dagger thief can with heart seeker. Infiltrators does a short immobilize, then you have to burn 2 initiative to teleport back to reuse it which will pretty much always teleport you AWAY from the person you’re trying to kill. The 4 skill for the offhand is rarely ever worth the initiative. Once you’ve used up your teleports, your options for getting back into the fight is very limited.

Vence.6974:

Lol plz a good S/D thief will beat a good D/any thief any day simply because when you combine sword with some acrobatics, you literally become the fastest profession in the game. You’re the most agile with infiltrator’s, FS, withdraw, shadowstep/roll for initiative. You can get to anywhere really fast assuming you have a shortbow, and even without it, you still have high endurance regen, swiftness on dodge, and infinite teles. Not to mention, you do extremely high steady dmg with your auto attack and can strip (soon steal) boons at will. The really kool part bout this spec is its ability to sync well with any utilities you prefer (deceptions, stealth, signets, and even traps) yea thats rite, traps too because infiltrator’s teles you too an enemy and while they’re immobilized, just set the trap and watch it activate instantly.

Hello, i welcome to you Black Powder.

It’s a pusling blind field, pulsing blind every sec, basically S/D rate of attack.

A simple blind field totally neglects 90% of an S/D thief damage, due to how slow sword attacks are. Better if i do not mention Flanking strike.

If a D/P thief loses to an S/D thief, he’s simply bad.

Nah, horrible.

Nah, he should change proff or uninstall.

Blinding powder =/= Black powder. Otherwise you’re right. /P kittens on S/.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Blinding powder =/= Black powder. Otherwise you’re right. /P kittens on S/.

Yep, my bad.

Fixed.