Guild Wars 2

So, I came back after playing other games, let’s try how GW2 is these days. Rolled a dps warrior, went to do a PvP daily.
Got to a 1v1 match.
Spotted a thief a behind a corner, I was expecting him but I had meelee weapons equipped and I didn’t want to switch to avoid the switch cd. I started running towards him to engage in meelee. Then something happened and I was dead. In about a second.
Checked log. Cluster bomb 5k, Backstab 8k, 2x Cloak and dagger 2,5k apiece.
gg

Granted, I was trying out new weapon combinations and I didn’t play (GW2) for quite some time but this is not okay. Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.

I am not even going to bother finding out how this is “reasonable” or “doable” according to gear and traits available.

I am moving to next game. Hopefully this will be different when (if ever) I come back… I feel very disappointed.

Owned by brain lol.

Edward.7362:

So, I came back after playing other games, let’s try how GW2 is these days. Rolled a dps warrior, went to do a PvP daily.
Got to a 1v1 match.
Spotted a thief a behind a corner, I was expecting him but I had meelee weapons equipped and I didn’t want to switch to avoid the switch cd. I started running towards him to engage in meelee. Then something happened and I was dead. In about a second.
Checked log. Cluster bomb 5k, Backstab 8k, 2x Cloak and dagger 2,5k apiece.
gg

Granted, I was trying out new weapon combinations and I didn’t play (GW2) for quite some time but this is not okay. Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.

I am not even going to bother finding out how this is “reasonable” or “doable” according to gear and traits available.

I am moving to next game. Hopefully this will be different when (if ever) I come back… I feel very disappointed.

Cool, have fun…but if you’re giving up this easily, I don’t anticipate that you’ll have much success in other games either. =P

Take a look at the forums and you’ll see that the warrior is widely considered one of (if not the) strongest professions in the game and the thief is in a relatively mediocre spot. The only complaints you tend to see about thieves are either 1) from WvW players that don’t like how thieves can escape from losing fights or 2) new players who don’t understand thief mechanics yet.

so basically you rolled class you didn’t play (if ever) for very long time
you played set you never tried before
you didn’t try to counter thief by any means or put any effort for it

you play probably the most broken class atm and complain about most crappy class (after ele) in pvp atm? really????

jokes are, thieves probably will get nerfed again because of posts like this heh

So basically you haven’t played for a while, wanted to try a new weapon combo, and then got owned by a Thief and got scared off by high damages.

/facepalm

“Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.”

/lol

Make sure to practice up if you ever come back, we all get a bit rusty coming back. Other than that you’re just making a fool of yourself.

There is no excuse to being killed in one second. Period.

Quincy: Funny that you talk about brain when this is not about brain (being outsmarted). This is about reaction time. Not very bright… lol

Dahkeus: I play almost excusively PvP. I don’t see how me having the most op class has anything to do with the fact that I got killed in such a short time. I wasn’t talking about thief escaping. From what I understand thief was supposed to be a burst class limited by initiative. When I left the game thief was able to practically perma stealth and burst in those tiny frames when he was visible (so he was able to get initiative all the time without being practically limited). Now I see that this class can kill heavy armor class in a second. I don’t want to spend several weeks figuring out how to counter a class that can do that and honing my reflexes to fit between a split of a second and my ping. My only reaction to a thief could be to dodgeroll right away as I see him to avoid burst if he chooses to do so. Anyway my post is not about if it’s possible to counter a thief – it’s quite obvious it is, my post is about the fact that I got killed in about a second. I don’t think this kind of burst belongs to PvP and I don’t have fun when playing against it.

Cynz: I levelled warrior to 80, played about 50-100 sPvP with her. I didn’t counter the thief as I didn’t have time to do so. One second to avoid death – on shot chance is just not okay. I could have as well played any class and I would get killed the same since warrior had the highest hp/armor of all classess as far as I know. Roll or die… Yes, I hope this post will contribute to thieves being nerfed, thank you.

SeratedOcean: I didn’t get scared by high damage. I was disgusted by the timeframe it was dealt in. /facepalm yourself . Practice? THIS was an attempt to play some low level PvP. Apparently one-shotting passess as being an accepted part of this game. If you think that it’s okay that I get killed in a second and your response to it is /facepalm, /lol and ltp, then you are either a showoff or you lost touch to what is appropriate response time.

If your reflexes are that bad then take defy pain and endure pain, one of the easiest, if not best, ways to deny a quick burst.

i dunno about Edward but i play my warrior very casually and i seldom die to thieves in a few seconds unless they have really really high burst damage + condition overload and caught my warrior at a bad time.

here is a video of my warrior doing 1 vs 1 with one of my guild members, he’s playing a thief. like the most of our casual guild members, he mostly plays PvE / WvW and only recently started trying out sPvP since the 10 Dec 2013 patch.

max 480p only no 720p hd sowee. no wide screen.

http://youtu.be/a_DT1QWLG0Y

Were you using zerker amulet? Did he have high bloodlust stacks and might stacks?
Such number i would expect on a zerker…

As warrior your chances should be atleast even against a backstab thief.

Lol.

First of all, between all of those attacks, you would’ve lived at least 5x as long as you said you did.

If you’re a warrior, you should have at least a small advantage over a BS thief, and most likely a very distinctly superior one. Of course, this isn’t accounting for using an nonoptimal build.

i play a full glass mesmer and thieves never kill me in 1 second lol

pretty sure u cant even cast cloak and dagger that fast let alone all of those spells

Its a fast paced game. 1sec kills are possible for thieves, you need to be able to deal with this with good reactions.

Coulter.2315:

Its a fast paced game. 1sec kills are possible for thieves, you need to be able to deal with this with good reactions.

Yeah, not against warrior’s in PvP they aren’t.

I mean, if the thief was running full GC, probably had a bunch of might stacks (think 15+), full bloodlust, probably fury, fulfilled both his conditional 25 point minor damage traits, was running executioner, the warrior was running full glass with no additional toughness and vitality, didn’t dodge, didn’t block, didn’t use Endure Pain, didn’t use Fear me, and wasn’t running defy pain then maybe…..

You physically can’t all use those skills in a second.

evilapprentice.6379:

Coulter.2315:

Its a fast paced game. 1sec kills are possible for thieves, you need to be able to deal with this with good reactions.

Yeah, not against warrior’s in PvP they aren’t.

I mean, if the thief was running full GC, probably had a bunch of might stacks (think 15+), full bloodlust, probably fury, fulfilled both his conditional 25 point minor damage traits, was running executioner, the warrior was running full glass with no additional toughness and vitality, didn’t dodge, didn’t block, didn’t use Endure Pain, didn’t use Fear me, and wasn’t running defy pain then maybe…..

Well either the original poster is mistaken or has not reported correctly. Regardless the game requires you to be able to deal with avoiding fast burst and thats all I’m saying.

Edward.7362:

THIS was an attempt to play some low level PvP. … then you are either a showoff or you lost touch to what is appropriate response time.

Well I usually stop responding at this point, but “attempt to play some low level PvP” So you expect to be in a low level PvP jumping into a game? Yup LTP/Practice your twitch I’ll just stop right here.

learn to play and try again.

makes a thief

Perhaps you hit a lag spike? You can get bursted down instantly (from your perspective) if this happened while your communication with the server was slow.

For the most part, max-burst TTK versus a heavy will be a few seconds. If it is shorter, then there may be some exploiting or something.

You might also be going against very polished players as soloQ (might be new depending on how long you were gone) starts you off with a pretty high MMR. If you play a few matches it should get you to a spot where opponents are on your level. Its really fun when you get there!

Good luck regardless of what you do. Feel free to describe in more detail your build if you want some more constructive feedback about what you can do better to survive such encounters.

SerratedOcean.7398:

So basically you haven’t played for a while, wanted to try a new weapon combo, and then got owned by a Thief and got scared off by high damages.

/facepalm

“Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.”

/lol

Make sure to practice up if you ever come back, we all get a bit rusty coming back. Other than that you’re just making a fool of yourself.

/lol indeed. you tell em serrated, we don’t need noobs like the op getting interested and participating in our extremely low population spvp and wvw games. also, pros like us need to keep these terrible profession designs around as long as possible so we can be all cool and /facepalm and stuff when people have legitimate concerns and complaints.

keep it real broski! /high five

Perhaps a dodge or two might have been in order

oh look a noob has no clue about the game and god killed and now he tells this bs to himself to make him feel better. nothing new. “in about a second” sure thing pal. stick to solitaire

@Edward: hope you realize that it is the same for thief… reagrdless how good they are, 1 wrong move, 1 second and they are dead.

8k is not one shot chance, especially not on warriors…besides technically it wasn’t 1 sec

clusterbomb has like 1000 years travel time and half second cast, CnD has half second cast as well, to get behind target also requires time so let’s assume that guy was very fast so it was another half second… not to mention revealed debuff which is another 4 seconds

so i assume fight went like this:
CnD 0,5 sec cast
backstab (positioning) 0,5 sec
4 sec revealed
clusterbomb 0,5 sec + 0,5 sec till it landed (at least)
3 sec he did AA?
0,5 sec CnD
0,5 sec positioning for BS

so all together, in best case possible, in best positioning possible, w/o any delay etc. 6 sec…. that is more than enough time to react…. glass thief usually doesn’t even have that much time to react, they literary get 1 shot

Perhaps it is just me that understood the original post in a different way.
The way I read it, it was about how pvp is in terms of damage, not about thief in particular.

It was about how pvp is designed in gw2?
I think I read somewhere, that some of the competitive tournament people have also expressed, that the game would benefit from lowering the overall damage output. (I could be mistaken in this though.)

Cynz.9437:

@Edward: hope you realize that it is the same for thief… reagrdless how good they are, 1 wrong move, 1 second and they are dead.

8k is not one shot chance, especially not on warriors…besides technically it wasn’t 1 sec

clusterbomb has like 1000 years travel time and half second cast, CnD has half second cast as well, to get behind target also requires time so let’s assume that guy was very fast so it was another half second… not to mention revealed debuff which is another 4 seconds

so i assume fight went like this:
CnD 0,5 sec cast
backstab (positioning) 0,5 sec
4 sec revealed
clusterbomb 0,5 sec + 0,5 sec till it landed (at least)
3 sec he did AA?
0,5 sec CnD
0,5 sec positioning for BS

so all together, in best case possible, in best positioning possible, w/o any delay etc. 6 sec…. that is more than enough time to react…. glass thief usually doesn’t even have that much time to react, they literary get 1 shot

I think the he counted his “1” second reallllly slow. Eh, people tend to exaggerate.

Deimos Tel Arin: Nice video but your health never perishes within a second. It goes down steadily. I did like your duel but that’s unfortunately not what I have experienced.

Muchacho: Yessir. Zerker amulet and no toughness / vitality. I think it amouned to 2.6k armor and 21k health (or so).

BlackBeard: Lag spike is possible. Actually thinking about it it might have been one. Although it was a very convenient one. My concern was exactly what you say, I would expect ttk to kill heavy armor user with high health pool to last longer then a second. That’s my sole concern and the point of the whole thread. If I can get killed so fast something is wrong.

Arganthium: lol yourself. The whole point of this thread is to point out that I did not. If it were 5 seconds I would have had time to pop my Endure Pain or roll. I might be rusty, but 5 seconds just watching the monitor with blank stare? GW2 required reaction time may be shorter than in other mmos but if you can kill somebody in one “global” (usually 1,5 sec) it is usually a sign of that something’s broken. So no, I wasn’t watching my screen for 5 seconds mesmerized by his nice graphics…

evilapprentice: We got to Skyhammer. He was alone on his team, I was alone on my team. I went to capture the southern node. As I saw he wasn’t capping either of the two others I expected him to come on me. He apeeared behind a corner with a shortbow. I decided not to switch to ranged as not to incure the switch cd and ran to him hoping to get to meelee. Right after he finished his shortbow animation, he appeared behind me and dealt the rest on the damage within a second or so. Definitely not 5-6 seconds as some have suggested.

Cynz: That’s quite possible and I think sad if you have a class that can be killed so fast. I see that as another problem (for thieves) and not like an argument why it’s okay to kill others in the same short amount of time. Combat log: Cluster bomb 5k, backstab 8k, Cloak and Dagger 2.5k Cloak and Dagger 2.5k. Dead. And that’s how the fight unfolded from what I have seen. I saw him shoot shortbow then he appeared next to me and I was dead within a second or so. Checked wiki. Backstab + 2x CnD is 1,25 sec (2x 1/2 and 1x 1/4) according to it. No four seconds staring at each other.

Reesha: The post was to point out that me as a player that is not playing GW2 non-stop came to try it out and I got totally owned within a very short time period. Whether it’s a problem of the whole game or of one paricular class/build I don’t know. What I know is that I was disgusted by it and decided to write about it. This was my experience with GW2 sPvP and it was not good.
I see that I must have hit a sensitive spot.

The rest or the people that answered had only hate rant so I won’t bother answering them (hope I didn’t overlook a constructive response).

aye, Edward,
thanks for the reply!

i think you may have experienced a lag spike.

in the past where u still played guild wars 2, did you experience lag pikes often?

i connect to guild wars 2 servers from malaysia, the ping is around 200ms – 500ms but overall there is no lag.

however, sometimes lag spikes occur and i find my warrior standing there in suspended animation.

I wouldnt recommend pvping as warrior with only 2600 armor if you are new or rusty. Warriors dont have the same abbundance of tools as other classes have to soak or avoid damage. High armor is quite crucial for warriors to avoid getting globaled like that.

Dont get me wrong. It is possible as experienced player. I wouldnt do it as new player though. Those few hundred extra bits of armor make an enormous difference.

Edward.7362:

So, I came back after playing other games, let’s try how GW2 is these days. Rolled a dps warrior, went to do a PvP daily.
Got to a 1v1 match.
Spotted a thief a behind a corner, I was expecting him but I had meelee weapons equipped and I didn’t want to switch to avoid the switch cd. I started running towards him to engage in meelee. Then something happened and I was dead. In about a second.
Checked log. Cluster bomb 5k, Backstab 8k, 2x Cloak and dagger 2,5k apiece.
gg

Granted, I was trying out new weapon combinations and I didn’t play (GW2) for quite some time but this is not okay. Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.

I am not even going to bother finding out how this is “reasonable” or “doable” according to gear and traits available.

I am moving to next game. Hopefully this will be different when (if ever) I come back… I feel very disappointed.

As a warrior, there are some good condi or soldier builds around.

Start with those, to get more accostumed to the fight.

At first, I too was surprised and killed by thieves. It’s normal for newcomer, just like Bull’s Rush→Frenzy→100b, which is one of the hardest bursts to pull off, but is a famous “noobkiller”.

However, if I’m not mistaken backstab combo goes something like this:

Cloack and Dagger → Steal while using this, ending up in stealth → Backstab.

Cloack and Dagger has half a second cast time, if hits the thief goes stealth.
Steal makes the thief teleport to the target, if it hits grants an object which is profession specific and can be used once (in case of warriors, a spinning ability similar to axe #5, except it reflects projectiles).

The idea is: Thief initiates Cloack and Dagger from far away, and finishes near to you. Once entered in Stealth, can backstab you.

If you fight a d/p thief, they’ll go in stealth using Black powder+heartseeker and then teleport to you.

In general, expect thieves to teleport to you when they see you.

When they are in stealth, they’ll try to get to your back to deal max damage. Move in narrow circles and use your Greatsword or your sword to make random changes in direction.

Well, he makes a fair point: No matter what, any game where you can die in like less than 5 seconds can’t ever really be competitive. You have to account for mistakes, inattention, etc. Mounting a good defense is a lot more challenging than being offensive in here.

tl/dr: 1) you couldn’t have died as war from that dmg alone
2) this attack chain still can’t be executed in 1 sec simply due to revealed debuff

weither it is bad or not to have class that can be one shot so they can also do high dmg in short period of time is different story, if you try to discuss it you might as well open a can full of worms

it seems like anet is fine with the fact that thieves have 0 defensives but stealth and mobility by justifying it with high dmg (which is by all means i still not the highest, and sustained is still pretty bad actually)… but i can only assume based on current state of thieves

btw, from what i know eviscerate can hit for 13+k in one hit and wars don’t even have to sacrifice THAT much of survivability for it..

you listed 18k dmg, the war base HP is 18 372 though, unless you unequiped amulet you should have had higher HP than that so there is no way those attacks alone killed you, not to mention you still had plenty of time to use heal

still not possible to have your numbers…why?
well here we go: cluster bomb cast is 0.5 sec
let’s assume he actually was standing on top of you so minus travel time
how could he land backstab w/o being in stealth? i assume he used first CnD for it which is 0.5 sec cast, then backstab 1/4… then he had to have revealed debuff for 4 sec

unless he went other scenario which went like this: clusterbomb -> CnD -> CnD -> backstab
the thing with this scenario is that even if he chained CnD, he would still had to wait till stealth from first CnD weared off otherwise he would get revealed debuff

let’s assume he doesn#t run SA tree, CnD would give him 3 sec stealth, so we would have: cluster bomb (0.5), CnD (0.5) -> 3 sec stealth wait out -> CnD (0.5) -> backstab 1/4 sec

either way no matter how you turn it it is no where at 1 sec simply due to revealed mechanics

my best assumption is that Deimos is probably right that you completely lagged out and probably saw everything happening within a second

Deimos Tel Arin: When lag spikes occur they are consistent and usually tied to increased internet usage such as friday afternoon/evening or others experience spikes too. Most of the time I have stable connection – sitting round 45-80 ms. Yesterday I was using WTFast program and it reported decrease from 80ms to 50ms and two spikes during the whole session (I played WvWvW before too but it was rather slow with border hopping so I decided to get the laurel from sPvP). I don’t experience character running in one place at all. There have been disconnects but they are quite rare. All in all I would say my connection to GW2 is quite healthy. Hence I find it rather unlikely that the spike occured at exactly that moment when I was being attacked. But whatever, stuff happens.

Locuz: Thank you for advice. I went for it since I played with the same build and gear (except weapons) before and I was doing fine – could kill most (except bunkers) and almost never died (even to thieves). I was using sword/shield + rifle and this time I went for mace/mace + rifle to see how it works.
What took me by surprise was that I have never seen such fast death. Except when I was playing my ele in zerker gear and got jumped by thief. Actually, this was exactly the same feeling (regarding the survivability).
I guess the only way how to get into the play is to start with tank then.

I have decided to give it another go. I will assume that what happened was a lag spike and not something intended by the design of the game.

redslion: Thank you for explanation. I’ll roll something more tanky (probably sword+shield + longbow PVT gear).

Cynz: Thank you too for the time you took to explain and answer my post. I have a low-level thief so I might try to get over my feelings against thieves and level it to 80 to learn the mechanics first-hand.
P.S.: Your atack order doesn’t match my combat log. It was in this order: Cluster bomb, Backstab and two times CnD. But then, maybe the game doesn’t record it in the right order for some reason.

you don’t need to lv to 80 tbh, just make a thief and go to pvp

as for war build, i see most ppl run either hambow or condi sword/longbow, you might wanna try that if you wanna join the bandwagon

as far as combat log, it might have been in wrong order due to lag

Cynz.9437:

you don’t need to lv to 80 tbh, just make a thief and go to pvp

as for war build, i see most ppl run either hambow or condi sword/longbow, you might wanna try that if you wanna join the bandwagon

as far as combat log, it might have been in wrong order due to lag

Cynz he could have used smoke screen, then cluster bomb for stealth as opening, but i don’t get why 2 CnD at the end, when he could just land a HS and do more dmg.

Nerien.5412:

Cynz.9437:

you don’t need to lv to 80 tbh, just make a thief and go to pvp

as for war build, i see most ppl run either hambow or condi sword/longbow, you might wanna try that if you wanna join the bandwagon

as far as combat log, it might have been in wrong order due to lag

Cynz he could have used smoke screen, then cluster bomb for stealth as opening, but i don’t get why 2 CnD at the end, when he could just land a HS and do more dmg.

I don’t know if thieves use smoke screen much. If not, they’ll use CnD twice for the combo: CnD, Steal, Backstab, Evade/dodge until you can CnD again.

And about builds… if you like warrior, DON’T play those builds.XD

They are the limited OP crap. IMHO warriors offers a lot more.

Locuz.2651:

I wouldnt recommend pvping as warrior with only 2600 armor if you are new or rusty. Warriors dont have the same abbundance of tools as other classes have to soak or avoid damage. High armor is quite crucial for warriors to avoid getting globaled like that.

Dont get me wrong. It is possible as experienced player. I wouldnt do it as new player though. Those few hundred extra bits of armor make an enormous difference.

Plserino tell me u r jokerino. Berserkers stance defy pain not to mention shield

redslion.9675:

I don’t know if thieves use smoke screen much. If not, they’ll use CnD twice for the combo: CnD, Steal, Backstab, Evade/dodge until you can CnD again.

By op’s combat log, he opened with cluster bomb, following with a backstab, the conclusion I got from that, is that he used cluster bomb for blast finisher to get stealth. And by the op’s word, he didn’t waited long enough for use 2xCnD after the backstab.

Nerien.5412:

redslion.9675:

I don’t know if thieves use smoke screen much. If not, they’ll use CnD twice for the combo: CnD, Steal, Backstab, Evade/dodge until you can CnD again.

By op’s combat log, he opened with cluster bomb, following with a backstab, the conclusion I got from that, is that he used cluster bomb for blast finisher to get stealth. And by the op’s word, he didn’t waited long enough for use 2xCnD after the backstab.

Right, I forgot there was a cluster bomb. I was saying that because I rarely see Smoke Screen used, but I don’t play thief so I don’t know.

full power warrior meet full power thief. simple.

it’s hard not to hate when you make an op full of lies and bullcrap and then you even say you’re not gonna bother with learning the game.

haters going to hate?
I have sympathies with the op, thieves can still essentially 1 shot, even on tanky proff’s (happened to my Mesmer with 1.9k toughness) Kind of a 1 trick pony now though, I think anyway as I don’t play a thief. The same character spent most of the rest of the match dead as it was pure glass and died to incidental aoe lol ( I spectated it to see what was up).

dylan.5409:

haters going to hate?
I have sympathies with the op, thieves can still essentially 1 shot, even on tanky proff’s (happened to my Mesmer with 1.9k toughness) Kind of a 1 trick pony now though, I think anyway as I don’t play a thief. The same character spent most of the rest of the match dead as it was pure glass and died to incidental aoe lol ( I spectated it to see what was up).

Thieves certainly don’t have a monopoly on high burst damage. Mesmers, warriors, and even engies can all do similar if not better burst damage with the right spec. Yes, they are really squishy…but thieves are just as squishy if not more so.

I mean, the war the OP describes should be able to burst a target just as easily if not easier.

Also, If he had a longbow equipped, he could have just lolpainted the ground in fire, then double dodged and the thief would have burned to death before he could even get close enough to touch him.

@OP: The problem you have described is a problem of bad matchmaking. Since you obviously have no idea what you are doing in pvp after such a long time, you shouldn’t get matched against people who do. This game was originally built around active mechanics (including active defenses), which has somewhat deteriorated over time with all the AI/AoE/Passive stuff added/buffed in the game, but the core of active play has somewhat remained present. The reason you feel like gw2 is imbalanced as a person coming over from other games is simple:

most other games are about eating damage and just using the right combination of spells to defeat the enemy. That means passive defenses play a larger role in those, and consequently the playstyles of those games are vastly different. Even if classes do have active defenses, their strategic use is too different from how dodge in gw2 works.

There exists not a single class in gw2 that will be ok with just standing still and eating damage from a DPS character, not even if you are pressuring the other character yourself. You simply need to dodge some attacks otherwise you are going to end up dead. You apparently didn’t dodge anything, judging from what you described. But that’s not the problem of the game, that’s the problem of you being a newbie getting matched against an experienced player, therefore the problem of matchmaking

Edward.7362:

So, I came back after playing other games, let’s try how GW2 is these days. Rolled a dps warrior, went to do a PvP daily.
Got to a 1v1 match.
Spotted a thief a behind a corner, I was expecting him but I had meelee weapons equipped and I didn’t want to switch to avoid the switch cd. I started running towards him to engage in meelee. Then something happened and I was dead. In about a second.
Checked log. Cluster bomb 5k, Backstab 8k, 2x Cloak and dagger 2,5k apiece.
gg

Granted, I was trying out new weapon combinations and I didn’t play (GW2) for quite some time but this is not okay. Having some freaking 1v1 1-second ttk predators is not cool at all.

I am not even going to bother finding out how this is “reasonable” or “doable” according to gear and traits available.

I am moving to next game. Hopefully this will be different when (if ever) I come back… I feel very disappointed.

Clusterbomb has a 1/2 Second Cast-time and the Detonate has a full second cast time.
Backstab has a 1/4th second cast-time but it also requires time for stealthing and positioning (lets say 3/4 second).

Cloak and Dagger has a 1/2 second cast-time. Two of them equal 1 second.

1 1/2 + 1 + 1
3 1/2 seconds.

So I came back after playing some other games, made a dps class that i have no experience in pvp but I grinded alot of mobs, and went to grind pvp achievments. Then at first match I saw a mesmer. I was too lazy to switch my weapons and just ran towards him, then out of no where more mesmers popped up, ran to me and exploded. I was dead in 0.01 sec.

Granted I was trying weapons I never used and played my class as a dps and I did not use any utilities, I did not dodge, I did not try to do anything. Having this insane time to kill on good players like myself is unacceptable. I am not even going to bother finding anything else about this previously mentioned occurrence – I am not interested how to improve my gameplay because it is impossible in other games to die so fast for me, thus the logical move is to go and play them.

Hopefully when I come back the combat would be a lot slower and I wont be needing to react to anything, since having a second or a few seconds to press a button is apparently too hard.

Wow Lukin so much hate. You ruined my day. You are an evil person.

Funny thing about this is if you even sneezed that thief would have died. Anything that can burst that hard dies to a poke.

That was also an extremely good thief. He’s basically doing a perfect combo, using the travel time of cluster bomb to get an amazingly strong and well timed spike. What he did wasn’t simple. You got outplayed. Hard.

The Gates Assassin: Yeah, that’s what I figured. He used the cluster bomb to add to spike.
I also suspect that he used some sort of stun (poison?) or perhaps some root. I think I tried to use dodge as it’s my usual reflex against suddenly appearing rogues but I am not 100% sure so I didn’t mention it earlier. Nonetheless as I stated before I am not interested in exploring how or why it is okay for him to kill me that fast (not in this topic anyway). It is quite obvious I was outplayed, I can live with that (actually I expected to be outplayed).
What I don’t think is okay is that he can pull that off. (Although kudos to him for using all resources he had at his disposal. Provided he didn’t cheat ofc.)

It seems that the PvP community here is happy with the state of the game and hateful towards anybody suggesting otherwise. I don’t like how my attempt to point out that something in this game is not fun – as the term “game” should imply – and it turned out to be a rich soil for overzealous personal attacks and claims that I am a liar.

Sad, sad…

Edward.7362:

The Gates Assassin: Yeah, that’s what I figured. He used the cluster bomb to add to spike.
I also suspect that he used some sort of stun (poison?) or perhaps some root. I think I tried to use dodge as it’s my usual reflex against suddenly appearing rogues but I am not 100% sure so I didn’t mention it earlier. Nonetheless as I stated before I am not interested in exploring how or why it is okay for him to kill me that fast (not in this topic anyway). It is quite obvious I was outplayed, I can live with that (actually I expected to be outplayed).
What I don’t think is okay is that he can pull that off. (Although kudos to him for using all resources he had at his disposal. Provided he didn’t cheat ofc.)

It seems that the PvP community here is happy with the state of the game and hateful towards anybody suggesting otherwise. I don’t like how my attempt to point out that something in this game is not fun – as the term “game” should imply – and it turned out to be a rich soil for overzealous personal attacks and claims that I am a liar.

Sad, sad…

You’re not going to enjoy fighting every class and build in the game. When you face a thief, you have to be fast. I LOVE fighting thieves. It’s like a dance of death. On the other side, I generally don’t like fighting heavy AI based builds. That doesn’t mean it should be gone from the game. Some players love those builds where they are the master of their army and some players love taking out that army. There’s been a lot of arguments over the PU build which relies heavily on confusing the opponent and using phantasms + stealth. Some find it lame to fight, others don’t.

What really matters is two things:

1. Power output to skill required ratio
2. Counterplay

How easy was the combo he did? Not very easy. Is it the hardest thing to pull off, no, but it’s sure as hell not easy.

How much could you have done about it? If you see a thief, you need to get your cooldowns ready. It’s VERY hard for a thief to come out of no where without wasting shadow refuge now. I believe you also said that clusterbomb critted for 5k. That’s damage that you do when you’re facing another berzerker, so I’m guessing you didn’t go very much into defense or tactics. When you go full glass, you risk getting shattered. That thief had the same risk you did.

That’s just prep wise. As I’m sure you’ve read, you can see this stuff coming if you watch carefully. Skilled thieves will do this a lot. They are masters of coming at the WORST time and nuking you. If you see a thief coming, they’ve already done something wrong

no one should be able to kill one in a second or two, or even 3.

ofc you can, with some experience, prevent this, but in my personal opinion, a burst like that should never exist in a mmorpg.