Guild Wars 2

I mainly play Guardian and Ele and this is my view on the recent nerf.

From the wording on the patch notes, it seems like Quickness was a big problem in WvW which I can understand. It’s hard to see what’s going on in a huge zergfest.

Quickness was not a big problem in SPvP. The only complaints I ever heard about it in SPvP was about Rangers having access to quickness on pet swap with no punishment.

In order to make my point clearer I’m going to list out every way to gain Quickness in SPvP.
Utility Skills

• Frenzy – Warrior: Lasts for 5s and you take 50% more damage for the duration.
  • 60s CD.
• Elixir U – Engineer: Lasts for 5s with a chance to gain Frenzy (take 50% more damage) or Haste (cannot regenerate endurance).
  • 60s CD.
• Quickening Zephyr – Ranger: Lasts for 5s and you cannot be healed for the duration.
  • 60s CD.
• Haste – Thief: Lasts for 5s and you cannot regenerate endurance for the duration.
  • 60s CD.

Elite Skills

• Time Warp – Mesmer: Lasts for 10s.
  • 210s CD.
• Zealot’s Fervor – Guardian: #4 skill on Tome of Wrath. Lasts for 3s and can be cast twice in the duration of the Elite Skill.
  • 15/180s CD.

Traits

• Last Chance – Warrior: Gain quickness for 4s when you strike a foe with less than 25% hp.
  • 90s ICD.
  • 30 trait points required.
• Critical Haste – Thief: 10% chance to get quickness for 2s on a critical hit.
  • 30s ICD.
  • 20 trait points required.
• Instinctual Bond – Ranger: When you are downed, y our pet gains quickness for 5s.
  • 50s ICD.
  • 30 trait points required.
• Zephyr’s Speed – Ranger: You and your pet gain quickness for 2s when you swap pets.
  • No ICD, however pet swap is on 20s CD.
  • 5 trait points required.

Other

• PvP Superior Rune of Balthazar (4): Gain quickness for 5s when you fall below 20% hp.
  • 90s ICD.
• PvP Superior Rune of the Orrian (6): Gain quickness for 5s when you fall below 20% hp.
  • 90s ICD.
• PvP Superior Sigil of Rage: 10% Chance on critical to gain quickness for 3s.
  • 45s ICD.

All these CDs are raw (no CD reduction traits accounted for).

As you can see, most classes that have access to quickness either have a substantial CD on the skill/traits, have to make a big tradeoff to get access to quickness (such as a large number of trait points, taking runes of Balthazar/Orrian over something more useful, or taking more damage/no endurance regeneration), or both.

This is not the case when it comes to Zephyr’s Speed. This gives Rangers quickess for 2s every 20s for only 5 trait points when other classes have to spend at least 20 trait points to get quickness for a short amount of time on a long CD.

As you can see, the problem with quickness wasn’t that it was too strong in SPvP, but that rangers had extremely easy access to it with no repercussions.

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders—but reducing ALL quickness just like that without changing anything else is a huge hit to classes which currently revolve around access to quickness such as the Warrior.

I would like to suggest that the quickness stays the way it is in WvW/PvE and is reverted back to what it was for SPvP. After all, you have to balance separate aspects of the game differently. And please, for the love of all that is holy, don’t wait a full month to do this. There are certain game-breaking things that you cannot wait a full month to change.

Thanks for reading,
Acandis

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh. You could goto sleep, wakeup and that same battle is still going on.

You missed the entire point of this thread because you got too butttthurt over one comment. Good job.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used to just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy. You encounter like 100x more thieves there so you learn how to not get hit by those pretty quickly in wvw.

I think quickness kind of needed a nerf, most of it was telegraphed completely and when burnt it meant you gained the advantage if you kept majority of your hp.
But they definitely need to improve the other skills so that the classes still retain the dps.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used ot just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy.

Then you were playing against bad players, they exist in hotjoin too.

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used ot just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy.

Then you were playing against bad players, they exist in hotjoin too.

Apparently tpvp also then if you wanna go that route.

If you’ve ever went from gvg to arenas then you know how it feels.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used ot just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy.

Then you were playing against bad players, they exist in hotjoin too.

Apparently tpvp also then if you wanna go that route.

If you’ve ever went from gvg to arenas then you know how it feels.

Low lvl tpvp (since I left, maybe it’s all low level now), and no I went from GvG to AB, RA was too trash.

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used ot just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy.

Then you were playing against bad players, they exist in hotjoin too.

Apparently tpvp also then if you wanna go that route.

If you’ve ever went from gvg to arenas then you know how it feels.

Low lvl tpvp (since I left, maybe it’s all low level now), and no I went from GvG to AB, RA was too trash.

AB was the lowest form of pvp possible you didn’t even need to res sig! the whole idea of this is being you are used to interacting with 16 players and then drop it down to 8, making everything so much easier.

Jax.5261:

I think quickness kind of needed a nerf, most of it was telegraphed completely and when burnt it meant you gained the advantage if you kept majority of your hp.
But they definitely need to improve the other skills so that the classes still retain the dps.

I’ve already expressed I didn’t think quickness needed a nerf in SPvP, I think the only thing this nerf has accomplished is making Eles even harder to kill.

Jax.5261:

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

And yet not a single group of guys with loud sPvP titles (such as Ransacker) displayed ability not being something more then lootbags for coordinated WvW guild. Even though survivability is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

This guy (refhlex) is spreadin wisdom in every thread i open stop teaching ppl how to pvp when u obviously never played any high end pvp in this game.

Now to the point of this thread, i think the change to quickness was actually good, but just like every month no new builds will pop up, nothing has changed in the meta. Weak builds/classes are still weak and strong ones are still strong. They need to pick up the pace and start making more changes becase its very kittening boring the current state of the game.
Also i think whats holding the warrior back is really the PvE, as far as i know warrior is very strong in there and i think this changes were more thought out for PvE than PvP.

Rednik.3809:

Jax.5261:

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

And yet not a single group of guys with loud sPvP titles (such as Ransacker) displayed ability not being something more then lootbags for coordinated WvW guild. Even though survivability is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

Couple of things, if you show me a good wvw player using good mechanics (and I mean actually good mechanics not just knowing simple weapon rotations) then I’m definitely open to changing my mind, the fact is I haven’t yet and I’m not likely to.
Secondly nobody cares about titles and they were probably bad. But the average good tPvP’er is miles ahead of the average good WvW’er.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Jax.5261:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Now, I don’t WvW so I don’t know if quickness is that big of a problem in there—though I’d imagine it’s hard to avoid really telegraphed abilities when all you do is PvE all day and you follow the blue-marked commanders

You do realize that wvw’ers will line up and just go at it for hours at a time sometimes, players vs players on the frontlines yea?

Lot more action goes on in wvw than I’ve ever seen in spvp.

When you have say the green keep and stonemist tension, that is one of the spots people will go at it for hours and hours at. This is nothing but fighting, no capping a small circle at all, all 100% fighting. Feels a lot more like arenas/gvg that way tbh.

And yet not a single wvw stream I have ever seen has displayed a player with a decent ability to dodge. Even though doding is considered a standard asset to just being decent at PvP.

I used ot just run up to the frontlines do my mesmer combo lay out 1-3 people and run back behind my safezones.

I couldn’t tell you about other players, but when I went back to spvp from doing non stop fighting it felt like going from gvg to arenas.

It felt kinda really easy.

Then you were playing against bad players, they exist in hotjoin too.

Apparently tpvp also then if you wanna go that route.

If you’ve ever went from gvg to arenas then you know how it feels.

Low lvl tpvp (since I left, maybe it’s all low level now), and no I went from GvG to AB, RA was too trash.

AB was the lowest form of pvp possible you didn’t even need to res sig! the whole idea of this is being you are used to interacting with 16 players and then drop it down to 8, making everything so much easier.

RA actually was. If you really want to debate this we can talk in PM, but I’m not going to derail the thread further.

Acandis.3250:

Jax.5261:

I think quickness kind of needed a nerf, most of it was telegraphed completely and when burnt it meant you gained the advantage if you kept majority of your hp.
But they definitely need to improve the other skills so that the classes still retain the dps.

I’ve already expressed I didn’t think quickness needed a nerf in SPvP, I think the only thing this nerf has accomplished is making Eles even harder to kill.

And that is your opinion, but I think it did for the improvement of the game, quickness ruins the viewability of the game making it less viable as an esport and makes it harder for newer players to react to certain abilities. I definitely do not endorse the severe nerfing of the warrior though and I think other changes should be made to make the ele beatable rather than reinstating quickness.

guza.6170:

This guy is spreadin wisdom in every thread i open stop teaching ppl how to pvp when u obviously never played any high end pvp in this game.

I played some tournies when they got released. Which can be considered high end at the time because paids were not even available.

If you think that someone who put in by math on average 14.5 hours a day for 2.5 months didn’t know what he was doing, especially with quite a past in guildwars 1 making team builds for gvg, making the top team builds every day in codex, making single character builds (part of making team builds), probably even making balance managers of some games straight up quit their jobs.

I don’t know what to tell you, I had people I could have played high end with as I got invited to the guild from being a gw1 player, however I refused to play this spvp because it is not enjoyable, and does not take anywhere near the awareness that gvg takes, period. I could’ve been running this game on the #1 team most likely, but said it’s not worth the effort. Why do something you don’t enjoy just to prove a point? I was boycotting it to prove a larger point.

They should revert resing and finishing moves back to 100%. Using the consoles, etc. as well.

Actually the only problem was time-warp. Other things never had such a great impact (frenzy, haste etc.)
PS: Please stop answering REHFLEX. He just joking around like meaning WvW has anything to do with skill or he is able to kill some hotjoin players.
Stop feed the troll!

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Actually the only problem was time-warp. Other things never had such a great impact (frenzy, haste etc.)
PS: Please stop answering REHFLEX. He just joking around like meaning WvW has anything to do with skill or he is able to kill some hotjoin players.
Stop feed the troll!

I really thought I played less tournaments than I could count on my fingers and toes but my stuff says otherwise, I only played for ~2months. Judging by my wvw kills that should be obvious most of it was wvw.

http://s12.postimg.org/f48ss98l9/look.gif

And just want you to know, I quit before eles were complained about and were the highest valued in skill everyone saying they suck atleast until I started running them. Running glass cannon ele for all that. Going kitten near round 3 every time. This is because I wasn’t a complainer but made my own builds and found things that worked. Leader not a follower.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Actually the only problem was time-warp. Other things never had such a great impact (frenzy, haste etc.)

Even time warp wasn’t that big of a deal IMO, the CD is pretty big. But even if it was just timewarp that was the problem, it doesn’t warrant a nerf for the whole quickness effect.

Acandis.3250:

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Actually the only problem was time-warp. Other things never had such a great impact (frenzy, haste etc.)

Even time warp wasn’t that big of a deal IMO, the CD is pretty big. But even if it was just timewarp that was the problem, it doesn’t warrant a nerf for the whole quickness effect.

That’s the perfect answer that every teacher want to hear once from a student. This is exactly what I wanted to point out with that. In conclusion it’s good for Time-Warp but bad for the rest of the skillz/traits/runes/sigils. (no sarcasm inteded here)

R E F L H E X.8413:

I don’t know what to tell you, I had people I could have played high end with as I got invited to the guild from being a gw1 player, however I refused to play this spvp because it is not enjoyable, and does not take anywhere near the awareness that gvg takes, period. I could’ve been running this game on the #1 team most likely, but said it’s not worth the effort. Why do something you don’t enjoy just to prove a point? I was boycotting it to prove a larger point.

I dont care why u didnt play this game and saying u could have been in the best team means nothing when u were not, also this isnt gw1 so whatever u did there doesnt make u knowledgeable in gw2. If u dont undestand why u are not in a position to teach ppl how to play when u never played paids against top teams and u quit the game long ago then i dont know what else to tell u. Put what u are preaching into practice and then talk, altho u cant really do that because noone plays this game seriously anymore.

guza.6170:

R E F L H E X.8413:

I don’t know what to tell you, I had people I could have played high end with as I got invited to the guild from being a gw1 player, however I refused to play this spvp because it is not enjoyable, and does not take anywhere near the awareness that gvg takes, period. I could’ve been running this game on the #1 team most likely, but said it’s not worth the effort. Why do something you don’t enjoy just to prove a point? I was boycotting it to prove a larger point.

I dont care why u didnt play this game and saying u could have been in the best team means nothing when u were not, also this isnt gw1 so whatever u did there doesnt make u knowledgeble in gw2. If u dont undestand why u are not in a position to teach ppl how to play when u never played paids against top teams and u quit the game long ago then i dont know what else to tell u. Put what u are preaching into practice and then talk, altho u cant really do that because noone plays this game seriously anymore.

I’m not teaching people how to play I am showing them how their logic is flawed. They haven’t found the good builds but want to complain about the one that they see being the only viable option to be nerfed.

It’s like if pb were to be removed from the game, I could say well, atleast I can still make pd viable. Something that noone in the game thought was possible, and we made it happen.

Same goes for eles, I was playing eles when everyone thought running an ele was hopeless and I was dominating the tournaments on the ele and then hear a name for the build I was running a few days later by some “top player” using it on stream. This is when eles started to turn around and be seen as good.

I even told legend I am going to stop all these people kittening about eles by running one myself, and I did. If there is one thing you knew about me in guildwars that would be people saying ele takes the most skill being unacceptable, so I had to turn that around, and I did. It was my fault.

U did nothing for eles, good players never complained about eles being weak. I played ele since BWE1 and i never thought it was weak or unviable. And now u preach to warriors who played this game for 7 months testing diffrent builds to try and find a viable tPvP build that wasnt all about 100b burst when u never actually tested how this would work in tPvP vs a good team.

Yes i know what the hotjoin opinion on ele was, that doesnt change the fact most teams even back then had an ele in them.

guza.6170:

Yes i know what the hotjoin opinion on ele was, that doesnt change the fact most teams even back then had an ele in them.

In tpvp they were non existent. Again you were playing a different game. As I was the only ele in that tpvp pretty much for the only day or two I played in it then started seeing “evasive arcana” pop up as a build. I didn’t look at what someone else came up with, I just know the original.

I don’t really see people who play one build 100% of the time as having a reason to even test another build. Much less go into a lot of detail trying to create one. They had an improved pistol whip, they had no reason to use anything else or even try to look for something better. Thieves acted like the sky was falling on PW nerf as well. However this was not an HB nerf this was a quickness nerf.

I just posted this in the poll thread about quickness:

I think it’s exactly the kind of balancing they should be extremely careful with because it globally affects classes in different ways: e.g. complaints about Warrior’s reliance on haste to be viable.
While high crit builds such as thieves that can run the sigil (+ trait) have RNG haste and that nerf was welcome.
The pet swapping/stomping Rangers use is another example of a positive nerf, because it was a cheap, unavoidable way to snowball of the already weak downed state of certain classes.

The best way to nerf quickness is tweaking the drawbacks already linked to the skills (no healing for Rangers) seperately for each class and taking away RNG elements that are impossible to counter with skill.

(Too bad, Relfhex high jacked this thread. This is the SPVP section, not the WvW section…)

Did you see any rangers breaking the game with their 5 trait point quickness? Cause I didn’t. Most rangers were under performing even with quickness on pet swap. I saw lots of people building guardians and eles, even glass thieves, but rangers never reached FotM and yet they still get nerfs.

Shiren.9532:

Did you see any rangers breaking the game with their 5 trait point quickness? Cause I didn’t. Most rangers were under performing even with quickness on pet swap. I saw lots of people building guardians and eles, even glass thieves, but rangers never reached FotM and yet they still get nerfs.

I’m sorry, I actually have no clue what you’re referring to when you say they were never in the FotM. Could you explain how they weren’t?

Stof.9584:

I just posted this in the poll thread about quickness:

I think it’s exactly the kind of balancing they should be extremely careful with because it globally affects classes in different ways: e.g. complaints about Warrior’s reliance on haste to be viable.
While high crit builds such as thieves that can run the sigil (+ trait) have RNG haste and that nerf was welcome.
The pet swapping/stomping Rangers use is another example of a positive nerf, because it was a cheap, unavoidable way to snowball of the already weak downed state of certain classes.

The best way to nerf quickness is tweaking the drawbacks already linked to the skills (no healing for Rangers) seperately for each class and taking away RNG elements that are impossible to counter with skill.

(Too bad, Relfhex high jacked this thread. This is the SPVP section, not the WvW section…)

no d/x thief would ever use sigil of rage. It relies on attacks with high attack frequencies. P/P, S/D, and S/P builds used it so they could be on par with d/x in terms of damage (P/P was still unviable with it). Even before the nerf, you’d probably be better off with sigil of fire since it is okittensec cooldown opposed to sigil of rage’s 45 second cooldown but now there is no point in using it.
edit: and the 2 sec of quickness from petswap was fairly obvious when it was going to occur. You see a ranger running towards a down body? what do you think he is going to do?

R E F L H E X.8413:

guza.6170:

Yes i know what the hotjoin opinion on ele was, that doesnt change the fact most teams even back then had an ele in them.

In tpvp they were non existent. Again you were playing a different game. As I was the only ele in that tpvp pretty much for the only day or two I played in it then started seeing “evasive arcana” pop up as a build. I didn’t look at what someone else came up with, I just know the original.

I don’t really see people who play one build 100% of the time as having a reason to even test another build. Much less go into a lot of detail trying to create one. They had an improved pistol whip, they had no reason to use anything else or even try to look for something better. Thieves acted like the sky was falling on PW nerf as well. However this was not an HB nerf this was a quickness nerf.

in tPvP, bad eles were non existant, good eles were already playing in top teams, since day one…much like good engis were the only ones playing engi
also, your stats show that you’re pretty much an hotjoin hero.

Shiren.9532:

Did you see any rangers breaking the game with their 5 trait point quickness? Cause I didn’t. Most rangers were under performing even with quickness on pet swap. I saw lots of people building guardians and eles, even glass thieves, but rangers never reached FotM and yet they still get nerfs.

Please tell me more about the depths of the MMR ladder.

SPvP is to the rest of this game (PvE, WvW) as Quantum Mechanics is to Basic force physics.
The depths of spvp goes over many people’s heads.

I wanted to add constructively to this conversation as well

Thief:
Haste- lose endurance and cannot regen endurance- this negative effect was always masked by the fact that the thief can teleport. Who needs to dodge when you can teleport.

Ranger:
Quick Zephyr: When using troll unguent, Because it is not a heal but a regen over time, Popping ranger quickness did not actually prevent the ranger from healing

Warrior:
Frenzy- 50% extra damage. This was the double edge sword of the quickness abilities because the warriors utilizing quickness were already build glassy with minimal toughness. And then on top of that you took 50% more damage.

If all quickness sources made you take double damage from the beginning there would not be any issue with them.
Except maybe time warp since it was elite, but we all knew how balanced that was to begin with.

Acandis.3250:

Jax.5261:

I think quickness kind of needed a nerf, most of it was telegraphed completely and when burnt it meant you gained the advantage if you kept majority of your hp.
But they definitely need to improve the other skills so that the classes still retain the dps.

I’ve already expressed I didn’t think quickness needed a nerf in SPvP, I think the only thing this nerf has accomplished is making Eles even harder to kill.

Quickness didn’t kill eles nearly as well as a good, consistent chain of boonstripping did.

I love how you say rangers were unfair with quicjkness when it was the only period of time where they did any form of burst that other classes didn’t need quickness for, and the only reason rangers exist in spvp is because you have to stand on their traps when they throw it at a circle.

Introduce any format besides conquest and rangers go in the garbage bin as they were only decent at debunkering/roaming and haste stomping.

I agree with the quickness nerf because it was gamebreaking but what i don’t understand is why it took 7 months for them to realize this and why was it nerfed with 50%.
They always take pride in not moving fast with balance changes because they don’t want to have a “wak-a-mole” style of balance. It took them 7 months to balance something that has been broken since beta. I am very disappointed with the way the devs handle balance and with all the lying.

Noctis Assassin.4035:

no d/x thief would ever use sigil of rage. It relies on attacks with high attack frequencies. P/P, S/D, and S/P builds used it so they could be on par with d/x in terms of damage (P/P was still unviable with it). Even before the nerf, you’d probably be better off with sigil of fire since it is okittensec cooldown opposed to sigil of rage’s 45 second cooldown but now there is no point in using it.
edit: and the 2 sec of quickness from petswap was fairly obvious when it was going to occur. You see a ranger running towards a down body? what do you think he is going to do?

My point with those examples was to show how varied the source of quickness effectively was.
I don’t think any d/x thief would use quickness in tpvp, but it’s pretty devastating for new players to face, on top of everything else the thief throw at them.
And with the lack of hard cc in this game, quickness on stomp is broken. There are only a handful of abilities that will be able to interrupt fast enough if they happen to be off cd.

The fact that it was decided to nerf quickness was neither a good or a bad decision, imo, it’s how they nerfed it that was unthorough and shortsighted.

Everyone who played against me knows I was pretty much the best mesmer in that game, getting them to admit that however is a different story.

Mesmer was the only class I played by choice even though I was good at others with nearly all the pvp armors possible, a q9 dom bds, and in 2010 had an unbelievably high amount of skillpoints all on a pvp character.

The guy who was pretty much the one making the metas each day in codex, pretty much the decider the rest of the team would ask me for my opinion before we went in, or what I thought, and we ran codex and everyone knows this.

its ok man, ur the best.
I think u should make a team with SAtaarcoeny, u 2 are perfect for eachother.

guza.6170:

its ok man, ur the best.
I think u should make a team with SAtaarcoeny, u 2 are perfect for eachother.

Best statement of the day. I almost lost faith in this thread for a second

Want to talk best sellers?

I got two ideas that will make greatest hits and games of the years in their genres, one of them is potentially guildwars in a rts, and the other is potentially guildwars 3 with a different name if I don’t work with anet.

I wrote a guide before, never did anything serious but did make a few thousand off of it.

I agree with the quickness nerf even though it made my 100b warrior bad :l
Now that they nerfed quickness they can look at how powerfull (mainly) elementalist and guardian bunkers really are and nerf those or boost other classes

Acandis.3250:

reducing ALL quickness just like that without changing anything else is a huge hit to classes which currently revolve around access to quickness such as the Warrior.

Overall nice post, but about this part:

Warrior didn’t revolve around quickness. It only did if you wanted it to, if that’s the way you played it. I never played anything but warrior, and I’m happy with the quickness nerf. I’ve been saying it was too powerful since beta. I personally didn’t take a hit at all, in fact I’m relatively stronger now cause quickness thieves and rangers are bothering me less.

I do think that with the current effects some of the cooldowns (including frenzy) are too high. For frenzy I think they could pretty much halve the cd without it being overpowered in its current state.