Guild Wars 2

Even the sunshine pumping casters summarized it:

Guardians have NO mobility
Guardians have NO pressure
Guardians have NO sustain
Guardians have the lowest HP pool
Guardians is the ONLY class in game without a passive movement speed increase.

Thanks Karl, at least WvW zerglings aren’t dying to longbow 5 anymore though #InAGoodPlace

Says no one in WvW.

Guardians have NO SUSTAIN?

have you watched arken 2v1 a point with berserker ammy?

f3, f2, Renewed Focus, Shelter, Blocks, etc. = no sustain?

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

I am not saying guardians are in a good spot for all the unjustified nerfs they got, but cmon..

Everything you listed there does not equate to sustain at all.

And no one takes staff in pvp and even outside of that, their mobility is completely garbage. If JI didn’t require a target, I’d be saying something different.

phokus.8934:

Everything you listed there does not equate to sustain at all.

And no one takes staff in pvp and even outside of that, their mobility is completely garbage. If JI didn’t require a target, I’d be saying something different.

Saying NO is different than Noone uses it. NO is nothing at all. It just sounded weird to me.

I think its better to ask to improve on what you Currently have like staff. Instead of saying NO, NONE, etc

So heal, blocks, etc, are not sustain? LOL. what is then?

StickerHappy.8052:

I think its better to ask to improve on what you Currently have like staff.

I lol’d. I’m sure they’ll start listening now after years of ignoring us because guardian is “in a good place”.

I’d figure you could look beyond what the OP said and see that they’re trying to make a point.

But healing (with Smiter’s Boon) is not sustained damage at all. It’s Smite Condition but not generally used/setup to do damage on top of a player. I’m not sure why you’re saying block is sustain damage when it’s not a reflect nor does it have a damaging effect.

This, of course, is using the Meditrapper build.

phokus.8934:

I’d figure you could look beyond what the OP said and see that they’re trying to make a point.

But healing (with Smiter’s Boon) is not sustained damage at all. It’s Smite Condition but not generally used/setup to do damage on top of a player. I’m not sure why you’re saying block is sustain damage when it’s not a reflect nor does it have a damaging effect.

This, of course, is using the Meditrapper build.

Meditrapper can get 2 f2s that heal for 4k each, remove 3 conditions when traited, Trap heal.

2 5 second blocks with Stab. all with renewed focus Focus block, etc.

How is that not sustain? Sustain does not always mean healing.

At what time do they speak about Guardian?

StickerHappy.8052:

Guardians have NO SUSTAIN?

have you watched arken 2v1 a point with berserker ammy?

f3, f2, Renewed Focus, Shelter, Blocks, etc. = no sustain?

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

I am not saying guardians are in a good spot for all the unjustified nerfs they got, but cmon..

The guy you mentioned (not sure who Arken is) could have very well done that, but was it against high level opponents?

No one should be using outdated shelter or staff in sPvP. Berserker’s amulet does not work on Guardian.

None of my comments are about “1v1 duel arena” situations.

I’m not trying to be mean. Your comments are the type of thinking that’s holding Guardian back right now

mrauls.6519:

StickerHappy.8052:

Guardians have NO SUSTAIN?

have you watched arken 2v1 a point with berserker ammy?

f3, f2, Renewed Focus, Shelter, Blocks, etc. = no sustain?

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

I am not saying guardians are in a good spot for all the unjustified nerfs they got, but cmon..

The guy you mentioned (not sure who Arken is) could have very well done that, but was it against high level opponents?

No one should be using outdated shelter or staff in sPvP. Berserker’s amulet does not work on Guardian.

None of my comments are about “1v1 duel arena” situations.

I’m not trying to be mean. Your comments are the type of thinking that’s holding Guardian back right now

I think arken is the best if not one of the best guardians in the game. I am talking about high level opponents here.

Okay, just tell me on the above post, thats the meta medi trappper, am I wrong that it has sustain?

the OP is a very good DH too, he should know.

I mentioned already I am all up for guard buffs. just Irks me when people are over exaggerating

This guy right here, spamming traps?

The meta medi trapper build does have access to all of those things. This is the thing though. All of those things sound nice until you try to play Guardian competitively. There’s a reason Guardian wasn’t used by more than one PvP league team (correct me if I’m wrong please).

You have to actually play Guardian and try to be the best with it to understand how much of an uphill battle we fight.

mrauls.6519:

This guy right here, spamming traps?

The meta medi trapper build does have access to all of those things. This is the thing though. All of those things sound nice until you try to play Guardian competitively. There’s a reason Guardian wasn’t used by more than one PvP league team (correct me if I’m wrong please).

You have to actually play Guardian and try to be the best with it to understand how much of an uphill battle we fight.

That is not Arken.

StickerHappy.8052:

mrauls.6519:

This guy right here, spamming traps?

The meta medi trapper build does have access to all of those things. This is the thing though. All of those things sound nice until you try to play Guardian competitively. There’s a reason Guardian wasn’t used by more than one PvP league team (correct me if I’m wrong please).

You have to actually play Guardian and try to be the best with it to understand how much of an uphill battle we fight.

That is not Arken.

Does he have a twitch or youtube? I searched gw2 arken xD

mrauls.6519:

StickerHappy.8052:

mrauls.6519:

This guy right here, spamming traps?

The meta medi trapper build does have access to all of those things. This is the thing though. All of those things sound nice until you try to play Guardian competitively. There’s a reason Guardian wasn’t used by more than one PvP league team (correct me if I’m wrong please).

You have to actually play Guardian and try to be the best with it to understand how much of an uphill battle we fight.

That is not Arken.

Does he have a twitch or youtube? I searched gw2 arken xD

He was from Zero Counterplay before. I am sure every top player knows him. Again lemme reiterate, I’m all up for guardian buffs, I hated the way they were nerfed unjustly last patch.

But sometimes people take advantage of this and spout over exaggerations.

Arken zerktrapper with scepter/focus and lb
Seems to be his opponents outplaying themselves.

And his latest video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uyjBUQjeN8
“Short, rage-induced clip on why every Guardian weapon is well below-average.”

Another fun one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5VrnYTCbzk
“Guardian/Dragonhunter bugs”

There is a reason why they changed the ESL rules to make it so you could not stack classes.

That reason is since hot it is far better to stack another ele, engi, rev then bring a guardian.

I would include warrior with guardian but given the amount of passive sustain they recently got combined with their high base health and immunity abilities they are really in a much better place then guardians.

Forget the name of the site but there was a decent number of ESL & high ranked players that ranked classes by how useful they were & how much they wanted them on their team.

Mesmer ranked S+ at top
and Guardian ranked F-

Arken’s vid on guardian weapons (Some of them, he barely covered shield & staff).
Heard he was going to do one on traits & utilities as well but that one could well be over an hour long and not cover everything wrong.

Ragnar the Rock.3174:

There is a reason why they changed the ESL rules to make it so you could not stack classes.

That reason is since hot it is far better to stack another ele, engi, rev then bring a guardian.

I would include warrior with guardian but given the amount of passive sustain they recently got combined with their high base health and immunity abilities they are really in a much better place then guardians.

Forget the name of the site but there was a decent number of ESL & high ranked players that ranked classes by how useful they were & how much they wanted them on their team.

Mesmer ranked S+ at top
and Guardian ranked F-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uyjBUQjeN8

Arken’s vid on guardian weapons.
Heard he was going to do one on traits & utilities as well but that one could well be over an hour long and not cover everything wrong.

Exactly, other classes are better doing guardian’s roles now. Like rev is better than thief.

Ubik.8315:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHFSANAp0wc

Arken zerktrapper with scepter/focus and lb
Seems to be his opponents outplaying themselves.

And his latest video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHFSANAp0wc
“Short, rage-induced clip on why every Guardian weapon is well below-average.”

Another fun one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5VrnYTCbzk
“Guardian/Dragonhunter bugs”

Thanks. Some of the videos you linked don’t work

mrauls.6519:

Thanks. Some of the videos you linked don’t work

Just search youtube for arken bigheart.

StickerHappy.8052:

Ragnar the Rock.3174:

There is a reason why they changed the ESL rules to make it so you could not stack classes.

That reason is since hot it is far better to stack another ele, engi, rev then bring a guardian.

I would include warrior with guardian but given the amount of passive sustain they recently got combined with their high base health and immunity abilities they are really in a much better place then guardians.

Forget the name of the site but there was a decent number of ESL & high ranked players that ranked classes by how useful they were & how much they wanted them on their team.

Mesmer ranked S+ at top
and Guardian ranked F-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uyjBUQjeN8

Arken’s vid on guardian weapons.
Heard he was going to do one on traits & utilities as well but that one could well be over an hour long and not cover everything wrong.

Exactly, other classes are better doing guardian’s roles now. Like rev is better than thief.

Ya rev is better in a lot of ways.

There is 2 things that thief does however that cannot be done by rev.

Those things are
1: Stealth and putting stealth on allies.
2: Disengaging from a fight

That at least keeps thieves with a few things they can do.

The only reason you would play DH or Guardian now is if you just love the class that much or you’re too much of a die hard Guardian main to abandon the class. Atm a good majority of other professions are a lot better or easier to win with once you get down the basic idea of your class/build. Traits for guard are rather all over the place and generally underwealming ,almost more than half of the utilities are obsolete or never used not because people don’t want to use them, rather they’re just bad and not really usable. And with the way things are now we’re just ouclassed vastly.

They have mobility, sustain, and pressure so I don’t get what kind of joke this “dh sux” bandwagon is.

I’m not gonna explain any of it because talking on the forums is just talking to a bunch of bad players but if you’ve actually seen a good dh you should know they’re the opposite of what op wrote.

And no, a good dh doesn’t take dragons maw so 90% of you should just stop talking.

Hammerguard.9834:

They have mobility, sustain, and pressure so I don’t get what kind of joke this “dh sux” bandwagon is.

I’m not gonna explain any of it because talking on the forums is just talking to a bunch of bad players but if you’ve actually seen a good dh you should know they’re the opposite of what op wrote.

And no, a good dh doesn’t take dragons maw so 90% of you should just stop talking.

dh is in a sucky place -_-

Hammerguard.9834:

They have mobility, sustain, and pressure so I don’t get what kind of joke this “dh sux” bandwagon is.

I’m not gonna explain any of it because talking on the forums is just talking to a bunch of bad players but if you’ve actually seen a good dh you should know they’re the opposite of what op wrote.

And no, a good dh doesn’t take dragons maw so 90% of you should just stop talking.

pro league players ranked guardians D to F tier, I have an inkling they know what they’re talking about more than you do.

and no kitten good DHs don’t take dragon’s maw, stop saying things people already know.

also lol at “16 secs of swiftness from symobl” as mobility, stacking that much swiftness requires you to STAND STILL in an effing symbol for 4 seconds, such mobility LOL.

Guards have no pressure? Are we playing the same game here?

pro league players ranked guardians D to F tier.

Where do you think the casters get their information from? I think the curcle jurking pro league players are wrong.

and no kitten good DHs don’t take dragon’s maw, stop saying things people already know.

sure they do.

also lol at “16 secs of swiftness from symobl” as mobility, stacking that much swiftness requires you to STAND STILL in an effing symbol for 4 seconds, such mobility LOL.

right, because the 600 range, 10 second cooldown teleport on sword and the 1200 range, 36 second cooldown on judge’s intervention was a different game. What was I thinking.

Karlification at its best…provide a ranged elite spec to a class dedicated to front line according to Anet designers themselves.
It is as if druid was designed for guardians and dh for ranger. For an unknown teason they switched.
With so much instant gap closers and so much projectile hate such professions are doomed.
Thanks again Karl….please focus on thieves next time…they are so toxic..they really deserve it.

StickerHappy.8052:

phokus.8934:

I’d figure you could look beyond what the OP said and see that they’re trying to make a point.

But healing (with Smiter’s Boon) is not sustained damage at all. It’s Smite Condition but not generally used/setup to do damage on top of a player. I’m not sure why you’re saying block is sustain damage when it’s not a reflect nor does it have a damaging effect.

This, of course, is using the Meditrapper build.

Meditrapper can get 2 f2s that heal for 4k each, remove 3 conditions when traited, Trap heal.

2 5 second blocks with Stab. all with renewed focus Focus block, etc.

How is that not sustain? Sustain does not always mean healing.

The context of the OP is making reference to damage. I don’t recall anyone using sustain in GW2 as an LoL context of survivability.

Hammerguard.9834:

pro league players ranked guardians D to F tier.

Where do you think the casters get their information from? I think the curcle jurking pro league players are wrong.

and no kitten good DHs don’t take dragon’s maw, stop saying things people already know.

sure they do.

also lol at “16 secs of swiftness from symobl” as mobility, stacking that much swiftness requires you to STAND STILL in an effing symbol for 4 seconds, such mobility LOL.

right, because the 600 range, 10 second cooldown teleport on sword and the 1200 range, 36 second cooldown on judge’s intervention was a different game. What was I thinking.

lets put it this way, what class would you drop on your team to bring in a guardian as a 5th and why?

Darknicrofia.2604:

Even the sunshine pumping casters summarized it:

Guardians have NO mobility

They have more moblity than necros actually so your statement is a lie.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have NO pressure

That is total lie. Guard got one of the best on point pressure thanks to stackable short CD traps. Also GL rezzing/stomping someone in mid of traps.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have NO sustain

You still have more sustain than say sf ele or thief actually lol. Besides if you play dps DH you shouldn’t have sustain on first place.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have the lowest HP pool

Again a lie, they have as much HP as eles and thieves.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians is the ONLY class in game without a passive movement speed increase.

Define passive movement increase, you mean signets? Too bad lot of those signets are not used in pvp so i don’t see your point. Guards were never meant to be mobile due to their strength in combat and bunkering.

Darknicrofia.2604:

Thanks Karl, at least WvW zerglings aren’t dying to longbow 5 anymore though #InAGoodPlace

DH has way too many cheesy spells and while i agree DH is not in best place atm their viability shouldn’t rely on cheesy gimmicky blatant broken spells. Make suggestion for redesign.

StickerHappy.8052:

Guardians have NO SUSTAIN?

have you watched arken 2v1 a point with berserker ammy?

f3, f2, Renewed Focus, Shelter, Blocks, etc. = no sustain?

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

I am not saying guardians are in a good spot for all the unjustified nerfs they got, but cmon..

This looks good on paper, but did you actually try it in wvw or pvp? I don’t think so.
I moved on from my Guard to Scrapper cause that thing is what Guardian supposed to be, versatile, deadly and survivable. Why is that? Cause I can use runes what I like and not Traveler(or speed) on every build.

Guardian/DH is in a terrible place. It’s not as bad as the Warrior/Berserker during S1 and S2 but it’s close. Here is why:

• #1 – It’s a selfish build. It doesn’t even begin to compare to the level of team support boon/heal splashing that other classes have, such as a Revenant or Druid. This is bad for a class that is slow that can’t even peel. A selfish class such as Thief can get away with being selfish because it often operates alone while peeling all over the place and getting back caps but when a class is immobile and designed to stay in team fights, it needs to be giving team support or it’s a weak link in the team. Trap Dazing is not team support.
• #2 – Not able to disengage. This is a huge problem and largely contributes to why DHs always go down in a team fight first. People know that all they have to do is pressure him in to cool downs and then he’s a sitting duck. Other classes are able to distribute their skill cycling over larger margins of time, while disengaging/returning fresh to a team fight but a DH cannot do this. He is a sitting duck and easy to kill with focus where as other classes are not. Thus he becomes a weak link in the team during more competitive play.
• #3 – Just subpar sustain. Most of the problems with DH’s sustain is indeed because it cannot disengage but there are other issues that contribute to just plain subpar sustain. (A) it relies too much on blocking and too many attacks in the game are now unblockable. (B) Relies too much on boons. With so much boon removal being tossed around nowadays, this is a problem. © It has the lowest health pool in the game. YES this is a problem after the power creep.
• #4 – It lost it’s DPS spike. When it first arrived on the scene, it had a firm and commanding DPS spike. That was the only thing that DH was good for. That was the only thing that kept it dangerous, especially in 1v1 situations. Over time it has been nerfed too much. People aren’t even concerned anymore with rolling in to DH traps. Not only has the DPS been lowered but it has the same problem over time that Hambow experienced and that is easy to spot attack streams. The traps are predictable, they are easy to set off without harm and true shot is easy to sight and dodge roll. Anyone who plays competitively, knows how to deal with the obvious DH animations. This is no good and the class just gets counter played easily.

Ultimately I can say that anyone still playing DH is robbing themself of playing a better class and if they want to sit and defend the DH, they are fooling themselves in to believing their own excuse of not wanting to learn something new. The class really is underpowered in every game mode. Upon this, every other class can do what the DH does but better:

• Raw Damage? Herald, Daredevil, Berserker, Reaper, omfg ect.. ect.. Almost every other archetype has better consistent DPS than the DH. Some with better bursts even.
• Condi Damage? Mixing burn on DH just doesn’t work out well. It becomes too glassy to be practical. Obviously Chronos/Reapers are far superior in this category.
• Healing/Cleansing? Doesn’t even begin to compare to a Druid or Tempest.
• Boons? Revenant is a better Guardian than a Guardian.
• Peeling/Backcapping? phhht… Even slow kitten Reapers are better at this than Guardians.
• Control/Decapping? Honestly those CCs on the DH are not as useful as they used to be. Everyone sees them coming. Only heavy light is useful for a practical & accurate CC with inobvious #1 spamming. So many other classes are actually far better at coordinated CC strikes.

~ It really is in a bad place right now.

Kicast.1459:

Karlification at its best…provide a ranged elite spec to a class dedicated to front line according to Anet designers themselves.
It is as if druid was designed for guardians and dh for ranger. For an unknown teason they switched.
With so much instant gap closers and so much projectile hate such professions are doomed.
Thanks again Karl….please focus on thieves next time…they are so toxic..they really deserve it.

it doesn’t make any sense for them to implement elite specs which just double down on what the base class is already good at

just make bunker guard viable again and most guardian players will be happy… after all that build’s the reason they played guard in pvp to begin with…

with mercenary amulet gone lots of classes will lose a big chunk of thier sustain. Trueshots if specced correctly can hit for 5 to 6.5 k. currently. And u can auto attack for 2 k with some good speccing.

Not that i agree with the removal of said amulet but it should benefit us. Traps will be even more op. The only thing i fear is that will result in an even worse guardian nerf.

Sarrs.4831:

Kicast.1459:

Karlification at its best…provide a ranged elite spec to a class dedicated to front line according to Anet designers themselves.
It is as if druid was designed for guardians and dh for ranger. For an unknown teason they switched.
With so much instant gap closers and so much projectile hate such professions are doomed.
Thanks again Karl….please focus on thieves next time…they are so toxic..they really deserve it.

it doesn’t make any sense for them to implement elite specs which just double down on what the base class is already good at

Lol…comon guy…did you see the other elite specs ? Seriously…what are you talking about ?
All other elite specs are just a plain and stupidly op enhancement of the core profession. (except maybe ranger which became support). Did ele loose their supportive role ?
Are daredevils new bunkers ?
Are necro tied to healing and support buffs ?
Are warriors now spell casters ?

Guardian is the only profession that has to let all what was their role for something that is underwhelming.

Kicast.1459:

…comon guy…did you see the other elite specs ?

yes

Kicast.1459:

Seriously…what are you talking about ?

do you really want a ranger elite spec that just doubles down on shooting more
do you really want a guardian elite spec that just doubles down on bunkering and booning more
if that was the intent behind elite specs why did they even bother? they’re supposed to change how you play the class

Kicast.1459:

All other elite specs are just a plain and stupidly op enhancement of the core profession. (except maybe ranger which became support).

no, warriors suck
and no they aren’t pure enhancements of what the build was pre-hot and if they were they’re getting pruned

Kicast.1459:

Did ele loose their supportive role ?

ele became more supportive and more defensive in their support than they were prior to hot. instead of providing massive mightstacks they now produce massive heals, which are pretty different jobs.

they’re now doing the job that guardians used to do- they’re being a heavy supportive bunker which sits at middle and aids the group. if you’re suggesting that elementalists and guardians did the same job prior to hot… let’s just say i’m skeptical

Kicast.1459:

Are daredevils new bunkers ?

no, but if you don’t think that daredevil gives you a bunch of defensive options, you’re being a bit silly. why do you think they all slot dash and bandit’s defense?

Kicast.1459:

Are necro tied to healing and support buffs ?

reapers are probably the closest thing to a 1:1 buff from their base class but they took quite a few nerfs last patch to their offensive capability, including deathly chill being almost completely neutered for pvp, their 2 Reaper’s Shroud abilities which provided heavy duty burst have taken non-trivial hits

if reaper’s still taken, it’s not taken because it improves significantly (sure maybe a little, but not much) on the traditional strengths of necros as a condition class- it’s being taken because it provides heavy duty defense tools in Infusing Terror, Rise! and CttB. i am skeptical that the Reaper we saw dominating season 2 is still alive and well, between these changes and the removal of merc’s amulet

Kicast.1459:

Are warriors now spell casters ?

you’re talking about guardians being not viable for any role

uhhh

wth role was warrior viable for in season 1/2, other than impromptu face to floor dirt inspections?

and zerker is a high damage/pressure specialization when warriors pre-hot were either ramping brawler builds or shout healing support builds. the changes that they’ve made last patch, chiefly the adrenal health change, provide defensive benefits for base warriors- not the berserker’s wheelhouse

Kicast.1459:

Guardian is the only profession that has to let all what was their role for something that is underwhelming.

except for warriors and thieves which weren’t just underwhelming in their own role but were underwhelming in every role imaginable

It’s funny because while DH might be suffering in pvp they’re basically mandatory in wvw.

Israel.7056:

It’s funny because while DH might be suffering in pvp they’re basically mandatory in wvw.

You mean base guardian? I believe that’s due primarily to a shout (“Stand Your Ground”) and a grand master trait (Indomitable Courage). Since I started playing the game those were two pillars that haven’t lost use because stability is helpful, but most everything else offered is replaceable.

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Even the sunshine pumping casters summarized it:

Guardians have NO mobility

They have more moblity than necros actually so your statement is a lie.

Sorry bub but your statement is off base.
Necros have 3 different ways to increase their speed to 25%… 1 of which is viable in PvP. Guards do not.

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have NO pressure

That is total lie. Guard got one of the best on point pressure thanks to stackable short CD traps. Also GL rezzing/stomping someone in mid of traps.

Misrepresented. Full trap guardian is Niche at best because they’re easily out playable/counterable. When some one is rezing a downed player…? Traps are used for stun cc’s, not bursts. Using ALL trap utilities means you have 0 options left when they fail

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have NO sustain

You still have more sustain than say sf ele or thief actually lol. Besides if you play dps DH you shouldn’t have sustain on first place.

We need sustains to survive a +1. 17k health will do but a 10k health dh (zerker amulet) simply can’t work in higher tier pvp. Not sure what you’re refering to but a Thief can disengage just fine and an Ele can sustain in a 1v1/1v2 a LOT longer than DH can. Both classes lasts longer in a team fight than DH… again, i’m curious what source you’re basing these statements from.

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians have the lowest HP pool

Again a lie, they have as much HP as eles and thieves.

And that’s fine but we don’t sustain as well as they can on point. I can give you reasons as to why our F2 & Purification are utterly fail in an “oh kitten” team fight moment. Hint: We’ll get blown up before the heal goes off = there goes our survivability. Oh, and F2 & F3 gets randomly interrupted.. again, adding to how badly we sustain.

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Guardians is the ONLY class in game without a passive movement speed increase.

Define passive movement increase, you mean signets? Too bad lot of those signets are not used in pvp so i don’t see your point. Guards were never meant to be mobile due to their strength in combat and bunkering.

Partially agree. We don’t need a speed increase in SPvP but WvW players are slow as kitten… they need a QoL change that’s for sure.

Cynz.9437:

Darknicrofia.2604:

Thanks Karl, at least WvW zerglings aren’t dying to longbow 5 anymore though #InAGoodPlace

DH has way too many cheesy spells and while i agree DH is not in best place atm their viability shouldn’t rely on cheesy gimmicky blatant broken spells. Make suggestion for redesign.

It’s not necessarily a redesign that we need. We need,

• F2 heals on activation
• F3 grants Stability on activation
• LB#5 Barriers, when activated, needs to hit other enemies and not just effect the target inside the barrier.
• LB#3 needs a 20% buff because we’ll hardly ever hit anyone with the 33% buffed damages of LB#5 in SPvP.. so the buff to LB#5 is more like a 10% changed – statistically speaking.

More importantly, Seperate WvW & PvP balances. There are not the same gamemodes…

King Cephalopod.7942:

Israel.7056:

It’s funny because while DH might be suffering in pvp they’re basically mandatory in wvw.

You mean base guardian? I believe that’s due primarily to a shout (“Stand Your Ground”) and a grand master trait (Indomitable Courage). Since I started playing the game those were two pillars that haven’t lost use because stability is helpful, but most everything else offered is replaceable.

I see mostly DHs running frontline. The new virtues are really good. Durability runes and boon duration food also make a big difference.

Israel.7056:

It’s funny because while DH might be suffering in pvp they’re basically mandatory in wvw.

base guardian with reflect and shouts yes…DH, no not really.

Israel.7056:

I see mostly DHs running frontline. The new virtues are really good. Durability runes and boon duration food also make a big difference.

What does what you see have to do with why the class has niche demand? The new virtues aren’t what make guardian near-mandatory on frontline, that would be what I listed above. Durability runes and boon food are better served on frontline heralds, but durability runes are still way too good in general. New virtues do have really good active effects, but the cast times means they don’t work as well on the frontline when you’re up to your eyeballs in AoE’s and CC and you need to keep everyone moving forward.

StickerHappy.8052:

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

LMAO you actually used symbol of swiftness as a reason ? We’re talking pvp here . Who the heck uses a staff in pvp. LOL.

Spartacus.3192:

StickerHappy.8052:

NO Mobility? Symbol of Swiftness = 16 seconds of AoE Swiftness?

LMAO you actually used symbol of swiftness as a reason ? We’re talking pvp here . Who the heck uses a staff in pvp. LOL.

standing still for 4 seconds = top kek mobility.

Israel.7056:

It’s funny because while DH might be suffering in pvp they’re basically mandatory in wvw.

Those are two completely different game modes with different rules that determine what is good.

Druid is solid in pvp and nearly worthless in WvW if you have people who can play Ele correctly.

Rev is basically just a resistance spam bot and Necros run power well spam.

I don’t think there is a single zerg build that is even close to the same as the respective class’s optimal pvp build outside of maybe rev.

Substance E.4852:

Those are two completely different game modes with different rules that determine what is good.

Druid is solid in pvp and nearly worthless in WvW if you have people who can play Ele correctly.

Rev is basically just a resistance spam bot and Necros run power well spam.

I don’t think there is a single zerg build that is even close to the same as the respective class’s optimal pvp build outside of maybe rev.

It’s not really the rules that make certain builds good in WvW but rather the scale of the fights.

A full team fight in PvP is still just 5v5 which is small by WvW standards and most of the time the players are split up around the map so there are a lot of 1v1s, 2v2s etc.

I just wan’t to know how the op factored in mobility to on point guardian… I mean they are supposed to hold their point not run from point to point like a thief. They do have a role Bunker Guardian point holders. They are lack luster right now but I have a hunch that this role will be more useful after season 3 patch. (Unless they don’t change anything of course)

Yeah guards have healing and sustain. But guards rely on active defenses like blocks which are now shut down by unblockable. Poor design of shelter negates its use as if it is hit by unblockable it does not heal. This will kill you.