Guild Wars 2

It just shows how late solo queue feature got implemented. It should be there from the start. It was not, lots of people were waiting for it. Meanwhile they played hotjoin (or did not played at all) and it shows. The amount of people who operate on the FARM GLORY principle is staggering. Match starts, 4 people going to cap close node. Situation normal. Half way through match, people zerging middle of nowhere fighting for kills. Situation normal. Hotjoin as is works like a cancer for competetive sPvP.

Introducing solo queue was a great and necessary move (albeit late). Now it is time as a form of polish to balance the rewards. People are fixated on farming their glory? Fine, let it be so. Not for me to judge what goals they have in game. But the solution is simple. Make it so that winning a match in solo queue (or team queue as well) will be the best glory/hour activity or at least equally best with some other ways. There is some organic work to be done and people must learn, they must be trained. Dont wait another year with it. Keep on with the flow and do it asap.

100 people play pvp but over 1000 play Pve, don’t expect much is what Ive learned. Pvpers dont even spend money on gems like the Pve’ers so we get no love!

100% agree……………….

Hot join needs to be destroyed. There’s too many modes and too much fragmentation.

Players who just want a quick game, and don’t care about losing/wining/progression, should join a custom arena.

We should only have 3 modes:

- Team tPvP
- Solo tPvP
- Custom Arenas

(I would vote on mists dueling as a 4th, but that’s me)

Gilgamesh.2561:

Hot join needs to be destroyed. There’s too many modes and too much fragmentation.

Players who just want a quick game, and don’t care about losing/wining/progression, should join a custom arena.

We should only have 3 modes:

- Team tPvP
- Solo tPvP
- Custom Arenas

(I would vote on mists dueling as a 4th, but that’s me)

Arent Hotjoins in Custom Arenas?

Krayiss.4926:

100 people play pvp but over 1000 play Pve, don’t expect much is what Ive learned. Pvpers dont even spend money on gems like the Pve’ers so we get no love!

Custom arenas and finishers, thats what you can pick up from the gemshop as a pvper, as it stands right now the incentive to play pvp is very low compared to pve so people stay clear of it. Unfortunately the mentality that this very topic describes helps further the problem as people would rather rage directly at other players OR write a fancy topic on the subject, than to actually adress the issue: Namely that the other player most likely was new to the playstyle that the more competitive PvP requires and such needs to be informed.

Absolutely agree OP. Hotjoin is pretty toxic.

Lue.6538:

…as it stands right now the incentive to play pvp is very low compared to pve so people stay clear of it.

Achievement points are the incentive now and that’s probably pulling some people (myself included) who wouldn’t usually play PvP. Turns out PvP is quite fun though.

But there are still a lot of PvErs who won’t play PvP, or even WvW. Some don’t want a highly competitive game mode, they just want to relax and kill some mobs at the end of the day.

Lue.6538:

Namely that the other player most likely was new to the playstyle that the more competitive PvP requires and such needs to be informed.

This is probably true. The learning curve of PvP is pretty steep and there needs to be a better introduction to it. I joined hotjoin games initially because I thought that was what PvP was, but hotjoin is a horrible mess and a bad way to learn for a number of reasons.

Krayiss.4926:

100 people play pvp but over 1000 play Pve, don’t expect much is what Ive learned. Pvpers dont even spend money on gems like the Pve’ers so we get no love!

I wouldn’t assmune that PvPers don’t spend money on gems.

I myself have brought 8000 × 6 gems + pre-ordered 1x Collectors edition and pre-ordered 1x Deluxe edition. I primarily pvp, only just got my Ele to PvE lvl 80 last month (playing as main since 1 week into release).

That’s almost $1000 (800ish + however much I had to pay as Aus not NA currency) spent on GW2 and I really only play PvP.

If guildwars 2 had of been Kickstarted and not NCSoft rammed “you know what you know where”, I would have spent $1000 on just the Kick-Start.

I have 2 copies of GW1 and each expansion as well (all but prof purchased on release at their $100 value).

I have spent more money on the Guild Wars games then I have on alcohol (considering I funded drinks for several parties in my time). I have spent more money on GW2 then the people I know that play it COMBINED. I have 2 jobs and no life because I work all the time. They’re like, new armour, I’ll just buy that with my farmed gold. If I want it I have to gem it.

transtemporal.2158:

Achievement points are the incentive now and that’s probably pulling some people (myself included) who wouldn’t usually play PvP. Turns out PvP is quite fun though.

But there are still a lot of PvErs who won’t play PvP, or even WvW. Some don’t want a highly competitive game mode, they just want to relax and kill some mobs at the end of the day.

PvP is fun, but on occasion they try to bring in the PvE players and then we end up with things like Skyhammer, where the main purpose is to battle the various map mechanics rather than to actually battle the other team. Those who do not PvP or WvW are most welcome to stick to that, but I strongly believe that there are alot of players who are staying clear of PvP alltogether simply because the amount of effort and time invested in PvP has incredibly little rewards compared to the ones you get in PvE.

transtemporal.2158:

This is probably true. The learning curve of PvP is pretty steep and there needs to be a better introduction to it. I joined hotjoin games initially because I thought that was what PvP was, but hotjoin is a horrible mess and a bad way to learn for a number of reasons.

In my opinion this falls upon the players, if you are experienced at pvping and actually know what you are doing(take a long hard look at yourself before you claim you do.) you should have no problems atleast trying to guide your team forward, should you end up with 4 people ending up rushing close, then theres really no point in ranting at them for doing so, rather explain to them why it wont work and leave it at that, you’re bound to find atleast some people who will listen.

Lue.6538:

Those who do not PvP or WvW are most welcome to stick to that, but I strongly believe that there are alot of players who are staying clear of PvP alltogether simply because the amount of effort and time invested in PvP has incredibly little rewards compared to the ones you get in PvE.

My belief is that current gamers have taken to much from the COD effect (that’s what I like to call it). The COD effect is how the multiplayer of Call of Duty Modern Warfare and its successors works. You start with a small pre-sets and work you way up to max level “unlocking” things along the way (unlocking is the key word in this effect). CoD MWF3 had dedicated servers just like CoD4, did me and my friends play on them? No even though they offered a lot less latency, a lot more anti cheat and anti hack we still played crappy old (only works in America) P2P. Why? because the severs didn’t have progression, ranking up, the feeling you get when you hear a 1 minute continuation of the guitar solo, that feeling of being bad kitten .

In the MMO world this would be the WoW effect. Getting a currency from PvP to become stronger at PvP. That’s what makes it fun, that’s the allure, I can become stronger. What GW2 offers is a game where you start on an even play field. Everyone has everything except skins. There is no ranking up to “unlock” things other then skins, there is no currency to be spent on becoming stronger, only skins.

In theory this type of PvP should have taken off and as a PvP only game it probably would have. However, since the game has PvE and WvW players are more drawn to the other parts of the game because they have Unlocks and Currency to become stronger. At the moment, if you are a primarily PvE player, the only thing you can get out of PvP is fun, no gold, no better gear, no legendary and no gems. Its a said time when people find getting out the Cheese Grater and running over their COF grinding heads is more fun (ha, more like more profitable) then playing some good old pvp.

Lue.6538:

In my opinion this falls upon the players, if you are experienced at pvping and actually know what you are doing(take a long hard look at yourself before you claim you do.) you should have no problems atleast trying to guide your team forward, should you end up with 4 people ending up rushing close, then theres really no point in ranting at them for doing so, rather explain to them why it wont work and leave it at that, you’re bound to find atleast some people who will listen.

I agree with you but unfortunately, these noble souls are far and few between. Of the 200 odd games I’ve played, I’ve seen exactly 3 players make coaching suggestions that weren’t of the “OG U NOOBS!” “WHY ARE YOU FIGHTING THERE?!” “YOU ALL SUCK!” variety.

It would be nice to help beginners from time to time and if you have the noble virtue every single pvp game that you do but after awhile you might realise its a lost cause. People just do not listen, some people do not like being told what to do and if you get abusive responses for trying to help then it kind of makes it even harder to win a game.

Communication really does win games but if your teammates aren’t inclined to listen and learn then it all falls on deaf ears. Some people also cannot concentrate on learning and playing at the same time. You have to respect those that try and teach others a better alternative but you cannot really fault people for not wanting to help in this context.

It would be nice if the players experience was uniform across the board but since there is no requirement to pvp at all then its always going to be an uphill battle guiding your team. The natural progression for players wanting to pvp should be to do hotjoins till they are comfortable then give SoloQ/TeamQ a go but since theres no requirements you can just hop into any form and do as you please.

Yep, Hot-Join was the most counter-productive feature Anet could come up with when it comes to building their pvp community, and whoever came up with the idea of Hot-join (epsecially 8v8) has NO IDEA whatsoever about how pvp community has to be built and trained. I pointed that fact out time and time and time again when the game was released, SoloQue should be on the number one priority list long before the game was even released. Hot-join was a cancer to the pvp community, it offered nothing even remotely similar to whatever the pvp in this game is supposed to be like.

The glory farm mentality is horrendous, especially because this is a team based game. There should be nothing such as individual player scores that convert into glory. There were no stats at the end of the game in GW1, the only thing that mattered is which team won, and that’s how it should be.

You know… There’s is no “I” in “Team”.

P.S. But of course, the glory farm play style wouldn’t be a problem if people weren’t kittens. But nowadays you pretty much have to face the fact that people in majority are extremely stupid and selfish (MMORPG players especially), so you have to design the game with that in mind.

Not everybody plays the game for the same reason.

Hotjoin is fun for a certain low-stress, casual playstyle.

Some people like to play a structured combination of free-for-all and objectives.

It’s also an instantaneous que pop…you can spectate other players…there is no stress on losing…and you can come/go as you please.

Only the biggest whiners would complain about having MORE PvP options than less.

Those players who are currently new to solo q and playing it like hotjoins will eventually learn to adapt or stop solo queing.

Stop freaking out and dramatizing the smallest things after 2 days of Solo Q.

@TGslasher
What did you spenf all those gems on? Pve stuff or Pvp stuff? As a pvp only a few skins you can purchase. Nothing compared to the Pve items you can purchase. Its just how they have the game oriented 99%pve 1 pvp

i have to agree that change is needed, but destroy/ban hotjoin won’t be the right way because there are much players who enjoy this format (I think).
it just shouldn’t be rewarded much more than the arenas (solo & team) which is the actual state.
players will play what they get best rewarded for. the flaw isn’t the players attitude, it’s the reward system.

imagine how soloQ population would grow if it was rewarded much better than hotjoin

Awe.1096:

. People are fixated on farming their glory? Fine, let it be so. Not for me to judge what goals they have in game. But the solution is simple. Make it so that winning a match in solo queue (or team queue as well) will be the best glory/hour activity or at least equally best with some other ways.

That would be hard to do, and people wouldn’t care too much. Why? Because winning a solo queue match is very much about luck (i.e. what teammates you get, and their professions), so you can’t just base it around your personal skill level; same reason people farming glory don’t care about winning in hotjoins either. The proper solution would be ANET fixing their unpolished glory reward system (skirmisher should be changed to on-neutral-point, not everywhere on the map; holding a point should be rewarded; etc…).

I like the idea though, matches should give more glory and rank points if you win them. Atm., especially in team queue the glory/time ratio is awful because of the longer queue times.

transtemporal.2158:

I agree with you but unfortunately, these noble souls are far and few between. Of the 200 odd games I’ve played, I’ve seen exactly 3 players make coaching suggestions that weren’t of the “OG U NOOBS!” “WHY ARE YOU FIGHTING THERE?!” “YOU ALL SUCK!” variety.

Ofcourse these are very common, it started out in early Counterstrike and Dota and has since transfered itself across the board and landed in MMOs, it is an unfortunate mentality that some players hold but remember this: Those who complain most vocally about other players talents ingame, are usually the ones who understand the least how it should be played.

That said there are solutions to this and I’m going to start drafting up one of my own because I want more people in the mists.

Psychogene.6780:

It would be nice to help beginners from time to time and if you have the noble virtue every single pvp game that you do but after awhile you might realise its a lost cause. People just do not listen, some people do not like being told what to do and if you get abusive responses for trying to help then it kind of makes it even harder to win a game.

Yes, you are going to see this quite abit, but you can’t expect everyone to listen, if you can get just 1 of 10 to listen, you’ve changed the way the game plays, if that person then gets another player to improve aswell, things will improve rather quickly.

There is however one downside with this: Not everyone agrees how the game should be played and because of that, theres going to be alot of disagreements, but there are usually some basics that everyone can agree upon.