Guild Wars 2

I hear this train of thought often and slowly I begin to think that Power takes more skill than Condi.
But is this really true?
Is it only that the opponent did not bring enough condi clears to begin with?

Yes this is true. There are not enough condi clears in the game for most classes to deal with the condition application. Next you have to look how these conditions are applied.

I main mesmer so I’ll use that as an example. Currently you are applying conditions from all your shatters. Power really only has F1 to apply their burst, and they have to combo it with weapons skills, cc, etc. The condition build not so much.

Now don’t get me wrong the best players in the world combine the combos required to make power work with the condition build, but you can have a good amount of success without that. Power you cannot.

The general rule of thumb is that this is true for all classes.

It used to be more true. Now it’s less so. A lot of the meta power builds these days are bruiser builds, which are just as tanky (if not more so) than meta condi builds.

Case in point: the “glass cannon” in this meta is the condi necromancer.

Power builds like scrapper, rev, druid, DH aren’t any riskier than condi mes or reaper. And all these builds have pretty low skill floors, but high skill ceilings once you appreciate the intricacies of the game.

EremiteAngel.9765:

I hear this train of thought often and slowly I begin to think that Power takes more skill than Condi.
But is this really true?
Is it only that the opponent did not bring enough condi clears to begin with?

Depends on the class and build. In example: hybrid condition Herald (Glint, Mallyx) now that Retribution was destroyed has no access to stability, almost no cleanses, almost no breakstuns and a very small window of condi damage reduction (due the -34% nerf on Naturalistic Resonance) and lack any viable ranged weapon. So if this build with almost 0 defense aside of a couple of evades and a couple of blocks beats you it means that you’re a worse player.

Azukas.1426:

Yes this is true. There are not enough condi clears in the game for most classes to deal with the condition application.

If people had enough clears to deal with every condi application then condi builds would be unplayable due to not being able to apply damage.

Also condi applying skills can be blocked and evaded just as pure power skills can be. The idea that condi builds somehow have it easier is false and born of salty players not adequately thinking things through.

What is “skillful”? Having to press a lot of buttons? Requiring fast reactions? Exact timing? Lots of thinking? Positioning?

It is hard to tell, what builds are more “skillful”, because different people might have different opinions on what skillful play even means.
The only thing, that is pretty obvious: The stronger a build is in a given situation, the easier it is to play it successfully. And this is completely independent from condi or power.

Crinn.7864:

Azukas.1426:

Yes this is true. There are not enough condi clears in the game for most classes to deal with the condition application.

If people had enough clears to deal with every condi application then condi builds would be unplayable due to not being able to apply damage.

Also condi applying skills can be blocked and evaded just as pure power skills can be. The idea that condi builds somehow have it easier is false and born of salty players not adequately thinking things through.

in the case of warrior instead of only applying a few weak condis (imo) every hit with power hits like a truck. one of the few cases where i disagree with the meta.

Actually there’s a lot of Power Builds easier to play than a condi build.
The classes that actually can truly play a condi build and be feared in pvp are mesmers and warriors. Revenant condi build had been nerfed and necro still totally lack of any kind of defensive skill, making him the easier class in the game to burst down (a reve, thief or warrior need only few seconds to burst down any necro build, eve the more “tanky” one).

Instead, there’s a lot of builds with direct damage easy to play: Dragonhunter trap+meditation, Revenant Herald+Shyro, Warrior, even the thief and the mesmers are easier to play in direct damage than a condi necro or reve atm.

The actual meta already was direct damage, now is even more direct damage oriented than before.

About the conditions, there’s more ways to clean/resist/reduce damage or duration on conditions than ways to protect from direct damage., expecially why some are AoE and every skills that block/immune/evade/blind also inflict condi damage (simply why you still have to hit to inflict conditions).

me on my necro having 4-5 condi cleanses and it still is not enough …. problem is that condis are 1) op in damage 2) condis are dealing “passive” dmg, you just need them apply on someone and they are doing dmg meanwhile you can run in circles, as power build you cant do that, you always have to be on top of your opponent and try to hit all your attacks in order to kill your enemy…..
TL;DR – yes condi build are noob-friendly with low risk – always reward gameplay, every condi build on every class has so many ways to apply these condis that condi clearers are not enough so eventually enemy will run out of them and he will die to condis ….

No, take thief for example. 5 spam dodge 5 dodge and do 8-12k damage. There is no set up simply press 5 and dodge. Then there is condi which is 3 and then dodge. Tell me which one takes more skill?

Warrior, is go into beserk mode and smash the F1 button, condi tend to take cleansing ire while power usually takes ire or the last stand trait. There is no set up, you smash F1 on both for the heal proc on defensive trait line.

We can go down the list but guess what they are the exact same now. Rev better power, necro better condi but thats because Anet gave them no other option. People arguing for one or the other are lost.

Blackari.2051:

me on my necro having 4-5 condi cleanses and it still is not enough …. problem is that condis are 1) op in damage 2) condis are dealing “passive” dmg, you just need them apply on someone and they are doing dmg meanwhile you can run in circles, as power build you cant do that, you always have to be on top of your opponent and try to hit all your attacks in order to kill your enemy…..
TL;DR – yes condi build are noob-friendly with low risk – always reward gameplay, every condi build on every class has so many ways to apply these condis that condi clearers are not enough so eventually enemy will run out of them and he will die to condis ….

What do you pretend? To make all classes able to clean all conditions? That will make condi totally useless.
There’s only 2 real condi class now that the necro is so easy to kill that you don’t even have to be a skilled player to burst him down and revenant mallyx had been nerfed by his survavibility reduction.
Then, there’s more ways to reduce the condition damage than direct damage.
If you don’t hit the enemy you will not inflict damage, as the same way you can with a direct damage, the only thing is that you’ll see your damage negation after some seconds instead of immediatly like on direct damage. And when Protection reduce the direct damage taken by 33%, Resistance reduce it by 100% and also make you Ignore every kind of conditions in the world (vulnerability, weakness, immobilize, fear….), making you really really strong.

Condition QWas really strong, sometimes OP, but now… now the direct damage builds can burst you down in few seconds, where a condi damage builds can’t.
There’s 6 over 9 classes that use direct damage, still while had good (or really really good) condition builds, and one of the other 3 is the necromancer, that can only use it and still is bad in almost all the fighting situation (for his totally lack of survavibility. basicly, if you lose against a necro is totally your fault).
Even mesmers and warriors, the actually two only classes really strong with conditions, frequently play in direct damage why in a large amount of situations is way better than condi.
In this meta I can fight matches without see any condition damage user.

Condition damage was OP during the bunker meta, but now that there’s no more stats to protect you and more you burst more you win there’s always lesser space for condition builds. And they require always more skills to be played.

It has nothing to do with power or condi. Usually power builds require more reactions and timing, and condi builds cd management, but either two require both, and the ultimate factor of it being skilled is the build/class mechanic.