Guild Wars 2

Is MMR profession based? I’ve seen posts saying it is and isn’t and I didn’t see anything about it on wiki which makes me think it isn’t . Looking for clear answer.

No one? Bueller?

It should be as far as I’m aware considering their changes. Also I’ve heard that when a game starts the “Team X” is based on the player with the highest MMR, and when I play my ranger or engineer I often get “Team P R I N C E” etc but I have yet to see it occur on my newer warrior or necro…so I’m assuming yes?

It feels like it is but I wasn’t sure if it was coincidence that I had worse teams on my lesser played characters.

Benjamin.8237:

It should be as far as I’m aware considering their changes. Also I’ve heard that when a game starts the “Team X” is based on the player with the highest MMR, and when I play my ranger or engineer I often get “Team P R I N C E” etc but I have yet to see it occur on my newer warrior or necro…so I’m assuming yes?

5 months ago, Evan Lesh confirmed that Team X is based on the first person to join the team. I don’t know if things have changed since then (esp since Evan did not comment on it just now), but that’s how it is.

is proffesion MMR fully seperate, or only 25% different from my highest proff. mmr ?

So when I try a new profession I actually do not have a mmr on that toon? Or does it give you some from your overall account?

What happens when people class swap? What mmr changes?

Considering PvE got a chance to drop beta key, could PVP someday get a chance to drop “show your MMR” key?

So then how do we get teams of 3+ rangers or mesmers form together if the MMR takes profession into account? This happens a lot, and a mostly mesmer team is going to struggle being on point.

nearlight.3064:

So then how do we get teams of 3+ rangers or mesmers form together if the MMR takes profession into account? This happens a lot, and a mostly mesmer team is going to struggle being on point.

Profession MMR reflects a player’s performance while playing a specific class, at least in theory. So for instance, I expect my MMR is higher on my main class than it is on thief. In your example, the system factors in those players’ MMRs on ranger and mesmer when creating the match.

You’re describing a separate issue, supposedly caused largely by the number of people queuing on those professions.

I’m curious which profession MMR is affected by the outcome of a match in which one swaps characters before the game starts. Say I queue on my thief and then switch to my ranger before a match begins. Will the outcome of the match count toward my thief MMR or my ranger MMR? Surely it’s not the latter, right? Otherwise, what is to stop players from gaming the system for an easier (or harder) match?

Malhavoc.8976:

nearlight.3064:

So then how do we get teams of 3+ rangers or mesmers form together if the MMR takes profession into account? This happens a lot, and a mostly mesmer team is going to struggle being on point.

Profession MMR reflects a player’s performance while playing a specific class, at least in theory. So for instance, I expect my MMR is higher on my main class than it is on thief. In your example, the system factors in those players’ MMRs on ranger and mesmer when creating the match.

You’re describing a separate issue, supposedly caused largely by the number of people queuing on those professions.

I’m curious which profession MMR is affected by the outcome of a match in which one swaps characters before the game starts. Say I queue on my thief and then switch to my ranger before a match begins. Will the outcome of the match count toward my thief MMR or my ranger MMR? Surely it’s not the latter, right? Otherwise, what is to stop players from gaming the system for an easier (or harder) match?

Seems like if I queue with necro (I have zero games with the class) and swap to warrior when I get ingame my warrior mmr would be effected by the win/loss. My necro would keep virgin mmr and get me qued with noobs. seems like you could do some match manipulation here.

Evan Lesh.3295:

smug.3895:

5 months ago, Evan Lesh confirmed that Team X is based on the first person to join the team. I don’t know if things have changed since then (esp since Evan did not comment on it just now), but that’s how it is.

Should still be the case.

It’s pretty clear that Team X’s MMR it is not only the MMR of the first person to join the team. Right?

nelzack.7205:

Evan Lesh.3295:

smug.3895:

5 months ago, Evan Lesh confirmed that Team X is based on the first person to join the team. I don’t know if things have changed since then (esp since Evan did not comment on it just now), but that’s how it is.

Should still be the case.

It’s pretty clear that Team X’s MMR it is not only the MMR of the first person to join the team. Right?

You know how at the beginning of the actual game it says like Team Therodin VS Team PieceofMeat? That is what he is saying. the team name is based on who enters the map first.

choovanski.5462:

Malhavoc.8976:

nearlight.3064:

So then how do we get teams of 3+ rangers or mesmers form together if the MMR takes profession into account? This happens a lot, and a mostly mesmer team is going to struggle being on point.

Profession MMR reflects a player’s performance while playing a specific class, at least in theory. So for instance, I expect my MMR is higher on my main class than it is on thief. In your example, the system factors in those players’ MMRs on ranger and mesmer when creating the match.

You’re describing a separate issue, supposedly caused largely by the number of people queuing on those professions.

I’m curious which profession MMR is affected by the outcome of a match in which one swaps characters before the game starts. Say I queue on my thief and then switch to my ranger before a match begins. Will the outcome of the match count toward my thief MMR or my ranger MMR? Surely it’s not the latter, right? Otherwise, what is to stop players from gaming the system for an easier (or harder) match?

Seems like if I queue with necro (I have zero games with the class) and swap to warrior when I get ingame my warrior mmr would be effected by the win/loss. My necro would keep virgin mmr and get me qued with noobs. seems like you could do some match manipulation here.

This is something i would VERY much like to have answered. Like he said if i make a warrior and lose 20 pvp matchs in a row on him, then always queue as him but swap to a class i am much better at after i find a game, which of the two professions mmr will be affected at the end? because if it is the second professions then that seems like a very big hole in the design.

What about multi-classing MMR then?

How does queuing with a profession I suck at and then switching to my main or second affect MMR?

Therodin.2970:

nelzack.7205:

Evan Lesh.3295:

smug.3895:

5 months ago, Evan Lesh confirmed that Team X is based on the first person to join the team. I don’t know if things have changed since then (esp since Evan did not comment on it just now), but that’s how it is.

Should still be the case.

It’s pretty clear that Team X’s MMR it is not only the MMR of the first person to join the team. Right?

You know how at the beginning of the actual game it says like Team Therodin VS Team PieceofMeat? That is what he is saying. the team name is based on who enters the map first.

yeah. But the OP is asking about MMR. I just say Team X because “x” is “x” you know? xD

Evan Lesh.3295:

nelzack.7205:

Evan Lesh.3295:

smug.3895:

5 months ago, Evan Lesh confirmed that Team X is based on the first person to join the team. I don’t know if things have changed since then (esp since Evan did not comment on it just now), but that’s how it is.

Should still be the case.

It’s pretty clear that Team X’s MMR it is not only the MMR of the first person to join the team. Right?

Not MMR, just ordering on the scoreboard. MMR is calculated with party average.

Exactly. Thanks for your answer!

Aidan Eighthrain.8612:

What about multi-classing MMR then?

How does queuing with a profession I suck at and then switching to my main or second affect MMR?

It doesn’t, because each character of yours have two different MMR. One for unranked and other for ranked arena. This method somehow avoids you being matched with players that master their profession. Say you suck with necro: you won’t be match with some one that masters mesmer. Instead you will be matched you someone that doesn’t master mesmer. So, you and your opponents will be at the same level.

Doing that, swapping alts just means you will play with the MMR of that specific alt, and that it’s not affected by playing with other alts.

If I understood correctly how match making works.

nelzack.7205:

Aidan Eighthrain.8612:

What about multi-classing MMR then?

How does queuing with a profession I suck at and then switching to my main or second affect MMR?

It doesn’t, because each character of yours have two different MMR. One for unranked and other for ranked arena. This method somehow avoids you being matched with players that master their profession. Say you suck with necro: you won’t be match with some one that masters mesmer. Instead you will be matched you someone that doesn’t master mesmer. So, you and your opponents will be at the same level.

Doing that, swapping alts just means you will play with the MMR of that specific alt, and that it’s not affected by playing with other alts.

If I understood correctly how match making works.

Im not sure if you understood the problem we were pointing out. I make a new warrior character. I purposefully lose 10 games with him and those are his only games. Then i always queue with the warrior and it matchs me against badish players because my profession mmr should be really low right? Then before the match starts i swap to my engi who i am very good with. If at the end of the game, my warriors profession specific mmr is affected then it is a good system. But if at the end of the game my engi has his profession mmr affected then the system is bad because i can just keep queueing with my warrior against worse players than me and keep beating them with my engi.

Therodin.2970:

nelzack.7205:

Aidan Eighthrain.8612:

What about multi-classing MMR then?

How does queuing with a profession I suck at and then switching to my main or second affect MMR?

It doesn’t, because each character of yours have two different MMR. One for unranked and other for ranked arena. This method somehow avoids you being matched with players that master their profession. Say you suck with necro: you won’t be match with some one that masters mesmer. Instead you will be matched you someone that doesn’t master mesmer. So, you and your opponents will be at the same level.

Doing that, swapping alts just means you will play with the MMR of that specific alt, and that it’s not affected by playing with other alts.

If I understood correctly how match making works.

Im not sure if you understood the problem we were pointing out. I make a new warrior character. I purposefully lose 10 games with him and those are his only games. Then i always queue with the warrior and it matchs me against badish players because my profession mmr should be really low right? Then before the match starts i swap to my engi who i am very good with. If at the end of the game, my warriors profession specific mmr is affected then it is a good system. But if at the end of the game my engi has his profession mmr affected then the system is bad because i can just keep queueing with my warrior against worse players than me and keep beating them with my engi.

AH! That way is way more clear :P
Well if algorithms are step by step, if you queue with one MMR the next step that would be “update” MMR, that would be for the char you played the game. I guess. Somewhere in the algorithm must be a reference for the char name ( or ID), so if you queue with one and then change char… the ID would be different and an error would be generated (because the ID don’t match).
If the MMR of the queue char is updated instead of the played char (because of a swap) that is an issue, I agree with you.

nelzack.7205:

If the MMR of the queue char is updated instead of the played char (because of a swap) that is an issue, I agree with you.

You are still not seeing the issue. What is being brought up is an exploit where you can queue to place yourself against weaker opponents by purposefully smurfing/tanking a classes mmr (which in my opinion is a stupid thing to do, but that’s besides the point).

It is a bit difficult to say what should be done in this situation, as technically speaking you were playing on the class that you switched to so, the results of the match should reflect that professions mmr. Perhaps have the results affect both classes?

I got the issue, I didn’t saw the possibility of exploit to be honest.

alemfi.5107:

Perhaps have the results affect both classes?

I don’t think so. I would be surprised if it affects two professions. Maybe a new post on this topic would be better

Evan Lesh.3295:

I can’t remember off the top of my head but I’m fairly certain new professions start at default mmr.

What do you mean by “new professions”?
If I have a mesmer character that I play with all the time, will another mesmer character share the same mmr but a thief character may have another mmr?

seems like i could make a necromancer and swap every game then. i’ll be able to queue with starting mmr eternally.

i could even throw matches on necro to build up a low mmr for the class (50+ losses no wins), so i can ensure i get players with good mmr on my team (because of how matchmaking works).

Doesn’t matter what class you are playing, matchmaking sucks in 95% of all your games.

If you are playing in EU it is impossible in the morning to find good matches, only players you get are those pve heroes that do their dailies.

Last time I tried to play gw2 in the early morning hours.

Not fun to stomp your opponent like a crappy pve mop and see your own players fail the whole game as well.

Why did the dev comment on the easy question and ignore the big one? Thinking logically he probably can’t say YES THIS IS A SERIOUS EXPLOIT PLEASE DO NOT DO IT UNTIL WE FIX IT. So i guess that means this is possible and something they didn’t think of. I always wondered if swapping for low mmr opponents was possible but i assumed it was too obvious…

After thinking about this some more, I think the most simple solution would be to have both MMRs affected by a character swap. That would keep the “penalty” small for the occasional swap but “punish” abuse by having profession specific MMRs converge.

I’m still curious about how the devs handle this.

Malhavoc.8976:

After thinking about this some more, I think the most simple solution would be to have both MMRs affected by a character swap. That would keep the “penalty” small for the occasional swap but “punish” abuse by having profession specific MMRs converge.

I’m still curious about how the devs handle this.

I can’t think of any problems that could occur from this system.

If a couple of inquiries could be answered in thread
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/50-winrate-rule/first#post5135592
we’d appreciate it.

This is in regards of 50% win rate rule and whether or not there’s outlier data effecting individual player ratings.

Evan I swap classes most matches.. will I get a loss for doing this now?

I am 90% sure that as long as you load back in before the 1:00 grace period is up, you do not get a loss for swapping characters.