Guild Wars 2

Warning: Long post ahead, slight humor has been incorporated to ease the wall of text

Now don’t get me wrong, but I enjoy GW2s pvp system, its pretty unique and down right fun. Heck I even walk away from arenas I’ve lost with a smile on my face simply because I had a fun time either way.

However, I’ve played countless mmos where my main focus was pvp. There was 12sky, WoW, Rappelz, 4story, the list goes on and on, but I’ve noticed an issue that Anet hasn’t addressed and that is how horrible necros really is in pvp. Take WoW for example. During WoD even after it’s nerf I was still able to run Demo Warlock and at times out damage the dps classes and out live some tanks.

As of right now necros is not a class I can do that with. I usually find myself getting utterly spammed and stun locked by every other class, but never another necros.

Sure it has nice condi damage if your rotation is good. Sure your can run a power/precision build and get some damage in, but that’s where it ends.

You have no way of truly kiting, you have a total of 2 cc abilities at best which last a duration to the blink of an eye to other classes and forget about trying to tank damage cause every other class can either prance around you and down you or lock you down and turn your adorable full health bar into the dark zone in a matter of seconds.

Don’t even get me started on that fail of a reaper shroud. Yes it’s nice to have a panic button or a finisher button for when you just need to squeeze out a bit of damage to down and kill your opponent, but it doesn’t last very long when it’s gone in almost an instant when you’re dealing with 2v1s which some of the other classes seem to have an easy time dealing with so long as they’re accustom to their class.

Don’t get me wrong it can be fun at times and enjoyable. Just earlier today I was hitting 300k+ in damage from conditions which put a smile on my face until I started playing against teams that weren’t blind, unaware, and wasn’t crazy enough to wait until I finished my full rotation to put pressure on me.

Any class can easily lock you down or do your job better than you. Guardians seem to never run out of boons and share a common trait with warriors which is never ending knock downs you cant avoid. Engineers and rangers out range you and while the engis have their turrets and that annoying asf non stop knock back you either try to charge through to kill the engi and get put down or you run get shot in the back like youre in south central, but the rangers like to play “I can hit you while my pet interrupts you, but you cant hit me” game. Revenants even have a game of their own they play which I imagine is “I can out live 3 of your rotations, but can you outlive 1 of mine?”. Elementalists with the right build tend to put on a poker face as if they’re taking you serious, but deep down inside theyre laughing at your attempts while healing and tanking you (I’ve literally faced and ele who 1v4d me and my team mates and we couldn’t down him….tf) and lastly, but sure as heck not least you have thieves and mesmers.

Now I do understand that mesmers have a high learning curve and I respect that…..but good ****ing lord how the heck do you decipher which clone is the actual player? Maybe I’m kittened and don’t notice that theres 1 with blonde hair while the rest have pink, but I’ve faced a few where the clones seemed endless and I literally couldn’t tell what was a clone from the player and by the time I even got them to half health I was dead….would be nice if necros had some sort of defense like that…..and no…..reaper form doesn’t count.

Thieves oh you glorious sneaky little devils. I love performing a dua with one, but I absolutely loathe having to fight one. Out of no where you’re stunned, you try to stun break, youre immobilized, you get out immobilization with %50 health left and you cant even retaliate cause it seems like theyre gone, then out of no where low and behold it turns into an Eminem song with guess who’s back and before you can even hit a keybind your back at spawn.

Every class seems to have something special about them that makes them tick, stand out, and gives them an amazing advantage over other players if they utilize it to their full potential.

Necros on the other hand…..I mean yet again theres reaper form…..I guess…..I mean the 4 seconds of grace period when youre getting focused is nice……I guess.

TL:DR PvP seems to be horribly broken and imbalanced especially when it comes to a class which has so much potential in which the developers doesn’t care to even slap a Band-Aid on

The amount of spam has literally pushed me on edge of uninstalling a few times.

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Fair enough, I will be honest I can still be considered new to the franchise since I only recently started playing earlier this year after watching Holts and Kuroi so I still have a bit to learn here and there.

There have been plenty of times where I literally just dumped all of my condis on an engi and watched him die a smug eating grin on my face

However I did come across a few which did quite a lot of damage to me and were able to lock and interrupt me quite well at times

Not sure if it’s due to inexperience of having to deal with them directly or not

Well, if you’re running one of the meta builds it’s absolutely crucial you receive support of some kind. Necros are simply not meant to be alone in PvP unless they are running some type of bunkery/tanky build.

Warriors do indeed have many CCs, however most of the CCs, if not all of them have had their cast time nerfed in a recent patch. Just time your dodges to their obvious telegraphs and you should do fine.

Guardians don’t really have too much knockback. Deflecting Shot + Shield 5 are the only knockbacks they really have. However, Spear of Justice (the tethering spear) pulls enemies. Deflecting Shot (longbow 3) and Spear of Justice are telegraphed, and can be dodged. Deflecting Shot is very obvious (bluish charge-up in front of the Guardian). A more off-meta Guardian weapon is the hammer which does have a fair amount of CC. In PvP however Hammer isn’t the best choice.

Also, it’s good for Guardians to “never run out of boons” in your case. Where are your boon corrupts? What Guardians truly do have a nice amount of are condition cleanses.

I’ve been interested in the turret Engi build I’ve been seeing in PvP, particularly the hard hitting one. Every Engi that runs turrets seems to run different specs, however there is one build that caught my eye. Won’t comment on the CC as I’ve yet to learn their build. For the most part, gyros should be better than turrets as turrets can easily be destroyed with power specs.

Rangers are definitely a tough class to duel against. They have longbow CC plus the root, and taunts. It’s tricky fighting them but can be pulled off especially in teamfights.

A good tip for Mesmers is to look for the Mesmer who has very natural movement (non-AI). Clones can never dodge like a player can. If you ever learn to play a Mesmer you should have no problem with identifying the real one. Also, the real Mesmer will show Alacrity (the purple smoky aura) right after shattering (shattering is when all the clones run to you and “explode”). When they run condi they are dangerous.

And finally Elementalists. The D/F Auramancer build is a tough one to crack, but manageable even solo. Necros (particularly condition Necros) should be able to defeat an Elementalist in a 1v1. They are significantly more vulnerable below 75% HP. There is an option in the settings that toggles enemy health percentage.

Abelisk.4527:

Well, if you’re running one of the meta builds it’s absolutely crucial you receive support of some kind. Necros are simply not meant to be alone in PvP unless they are running some type of bunkery/tanky build.

Warriors do indeed have many CCs, however most of the CCs, if not all of them have had their cast time nerfed in a recent patch. Just time your dodges to their obvious telegraphs and you should do fine.

Guardians don’t really have too much knockback. Deflecting Shot + Shield 5 are the only knockbacks they really have. However, Spear of Justice (the tethering spear) pulls enemies. Deflecting Shot (longbow 3) and Spear of Justice are telegraphed, and can be dodged. Deflecting Shot is very obvious (bluish charge-up in front of the Guardian). A more off-meta Guardian weapon is the hammer which does have a fair amount of CC. In PvP however Hammer isn’t the best choice.

Also, it’s good for Guardians to “never run out of boons” in your case. Where are your boon corrupts? What Guardians truly do have a nice amount of are condition cleanses.

I’ve been interested in the turret Engi build I’ve been seeing in PvP, particularly the hard hitting one. Every Engi that runs turrets seems to run different specs, however there is one build that caught my eye. Won’t comment on the CC as I’ve yet to learn their build. For the most part, gyros should be better than turrets as turrets can easily be destroyed with power specs.

Rangers are definitely a tough class to duel against. They have longbow CC plus the root, and taunts. It’s tricky fighting them but can be pulled off especially in teamfights.

A good tip for Mesmers is to look for the Mesmer who has very natural movement (non-AI). Clones can never dodge like a player can. If you ever learn to play a Mesmer you should have no problem with identifying the real one. Also, the real Mesmer will show Alacrity (the purple smoky aura) right after shattering (shattering is when all the clones run to you and “explode”). When they run condi they are dangerous.

And finally Elementalists. The D/F Auramancer build is a tough one to crack, but manageable even solo. Necros (particularly condition Necros) should be able to defeat an Elementalist in a 1v1. They are significantly more vulnerable below 75% HP. There is an option in the settings that toggles enemy health percentage.

Good points, I’ve come along way and I wouldn’t dare say that I’m good by anymeans, but I’m some what decent which in my words means that I can still learn a thing or two

Reading your reply and Cy’s I’m starting to wonder if it’s just that I’m putting myself in too many situations where necros doesn’t excel.

I came directly here after leaving WoW and I’m still used to the Destro warlocks meta of “run in, gain embers, chaos bolt everyone dead…..walk away” mentality

I have tried converting boons before and tbh I gave up on it cause it would seem that the second I converted them the conditions would be cleansed one way or another anyway

As for telegraphing that correlates to my previous statement of the “wow” mentality I probably still have, could be me too focused on getting an ability off to notice and dodge, then again there have been instances where I caught it and tried to dodge, but couldn’t due to no endurance…which sadly lead me to the spawn

Idk I want to try and look at as if it’s just me, but when I’m playing I don’t feel that that would be the case

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

There is 1 ability for 1 class I did forget to mention that I will never say is not broken and definitely needs to be fixed in pvp and that is the mesmers moa morph, I have never played a game, where another class can morph you into some useless creature, and you still take full damage from it.

Most of the other games at least make it to where taking any form of damage breaks the morph, I’ve literally been killed by a Mesmer (mind you I was around %70 health and had just filled my reaper bar) by them morphing me and before I knew it that “crap ton” of health I had had vanished…that ability is on my top 10 lists of utterly broken

Lord Velar.1509:

There is 1 ability for 1 class I did forget to mention that I will never say is not broken and definitely needs to be fixed in pvp and that is the mesmers moa morph, I have never played a game, where another class can morph you into some useless creature, and you still take full damage from it.

Most of the other games at least make it to where taking any form of damage breaks the morph, I’ve literally been killed by a Mesmer (mind you I was around %70 health and had just filled my reaper bar) by them morphing me and before I knew it that “crap ton” of health I had had vanished…that ability is on my top 10 lists of utterly broken

1 ability for 2 class. mes + eng
kill all your minions(all CD about 30 sec to 1 mins) + Life force + you can’t use any cleaning skill.
So Nec =The best punchbag. But the punchbag still have their role, have their duty. So I think the punchbag is fine.

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall and i can totally see mesmer being big issue for necros. Probably only classes that can survive mesmer moa, if they get hit by it, is thieves (assuming they have full endurance) and warriors thanks to passives.

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you when you run over the running show and not down.

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

Well of power doesn’t require targets, sigil of cleansing doesn’t require target, consume condis doesn’t require target.

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

Well of power doesn’t require targets, sigil of cleansing doesn’t require target, consume condis doesn’t require target.

You are in moa…. with 14 stack burning… with other 6 to 8 kinds of condi…. and if you be moa in reaper ….. ….
ya! dodge the stealth moa is ok. but i am a punchbag. i am not a super hero.

Lord Velar.1509:

As of right now necros is not a class I can do that with. I usually find myself getting utterly spammed and stun locked by every other class, but never another necros.

Condi Reaper lockdown ist by far the worst in the game. You are chilled, crippled, blinded at the same time while bleeding, burning, poisioned to death.

In sPvP it’s just annoying. In WvW it’s broken.

xeonage.1253:

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

You mean that 3 second moa? Just press button 5 and 2 of the moa skillbar and ad a dodge at the end if nessesary. GZ, you survived the whole form practically invulnerable.

I haven’t lost to to a single Engineer/Scrapper since HoT release. Reaper is the ultimate hardcounter to an Engineer/Scrapper.

There was a time when Necros were punching bags for rifle Engis due to lack of stability. These days are gone.

xeonage.1253:

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

I run trooper/soldier rune power shouts these days (since the power shroud proc boonstrip build was nerfed hard) and still have no issues with condi engis.

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

Well of power doesn’t require targets, sigil of cleansing doesn’t require target, consume condis doesn’t require target.

You are in moa…. with 14 stack burning… with other 6 to 8 kinds of condi…. and if you be moa in reaper ….. ….

What stops you from using dodges in moa and skill 5?

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

Well of power doesn’t require targets, sigil of cleansing doesn’t require target, consume condis doesn’t require target.

You are in moa…. with 14 stack burning… with other 6 to 8 kinds of condi…. and if you be moa in reaper ….. ….

What stops you from using dodges in moa and skill 5?

i don’t see them~~ man~ and i start my runing show when no viewer?. this not ok!

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

xeonage.1253:

Cynz.9437:

What you describe is not really necro issue but powercreep that has been added with HoT.
I am however surprised that you have issues with engis considering necros eat them for breakfast with ease.

Engis => stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S and see the fire chicken running show.
That is a breakfast for engis and I don’t think a punchbag need a breakfast.

Dodge, staff 4, wells, condi cleanse on weapon swap? Condi xfer works wonders. Engis moa doesn’t last long enough to be much of an issue, in my experience, although moa is indeed rather obnoxious spell overall.

stealth – moa – 14stack burning in a sec – Elixir S, there are no dodge. and there are not one condi on you. 6 to 8 ? lol. and you want staff4 to what?~ Elixir S.
Spell your 1.4 sec healing to help you want you run over the running show and not down.

I think i posted plenty of solutions to the scenario. Condi necro should not have issues with condi engi.

YA if there are another target. Condi necro is fine. If not, sorry.

Well of power doesn’t require targets, sigil of cleansing doesn’t require target, consume condis doesn’t require target.

You are in moa…. with 14 stack burning… with other 6 to 8 kinds of condi…. and if you be moa in reaper ….. ….

What stops you from using dodges in moa and skill 5?

i know how to fight with them. i just want to show the game how unbalance it is.

only matchup i hate is 1v1 thief (which you could argue just avoid the matchup) but id like to see reaper 3 when you release it it reaveals all enemies feared. that would be amazing

The only gripe with Moa I have is that it instantly kills your Mr Wurm. I imagine it also does so to other types of minions but that is a lot of shutdown on one skill. It is, however, a long CD skill with an obvious cast/skillshot/require stealth setup so it is rather fair I get punished for not seeing it coming.

@xeonage.1253:

If it was a perfectly setup Moa burst complete with immobilize + teammates assisting then it’s GG. They do happen, with experienced teams, and very often.

However in most cases in a PUG if you anticipate a Moa incoming, just spam 5 and 2 immediately, they give you evade. In fact there were a few times where I actually gain mobility (I run faster because I believe I’m a bird????) because I was Moa’d and I escape a 2v1, buying time until teammates rotate in to help. The Engi version is short enough that you can just evade the whole time and Engi lacks the means to lockdown as much as Chrono can during the Moa anyway.

@Lord Velar.1509:

Coming from someone who’s stupid enough to do ranked and unranked as Power Necro before and after the patch. I think my winrate is a solid 50% (which puts me low-mid) after the patch and it was a bit better before. This is because people now queue with less sustain/support classes and going for selfish sustain burst builds (which counter you better).

Although Fire + Air sigil is now gone it’s not an issue, in fact the loss indirectly increased our survivability vs burst builds. The downside is that your own pressure is less (and the nerf to Chilling Nova) and you need to work harder to get people to back off. (i.e. fights are now longer).

Condi Necro isn’t about stacking condi with a nicely thought out rotation. Power Necro is the same way; you look for key boons to corrupt which decrease their offensive/defensive power and “soften” them for your team to finish them. Then when they’re downed, your job is to cleave like a maniac and make sure they don’t get rezzed. You have poison, unblockable CC, stability strip, and pressure in Reaper Shroud to make rezzing extremely difficult. Just be careful that you’ll get counter CC’d/focused. By the enemy Reaper who probably marked you as target.

Engi and Ele should not be an issue. One of the only positive matchups a Necro can have is a Scrapper Hammer Engi. Try corrupting his boons and notice that after each evade he gets a small period of stability which you can freely use to CC him. You can cleave down his gyros no problem, and his skills are easy to read. Ele spews out boons like crazy and your boon corrupts can force them to use their CDs early. Corrupt stability in their Overload Earth, stop them from using their only hardhitting Overload Air, remove their Protection and you force them to use Obsidian Flesh. When OF is over, they have very little options.

Warrior, just corrupt immediately after they go into Berzerk and manage dodging Headbutt/F1’s as much as you can. Removing their Resistance greatly helps you survive.

DHs, you have to work through their CDs and remember certain traps give certain boons. When their utility skills are all on CD, they are very squishy. You just have to live through their burst first, starting with dodging out of Test of Faith, identifying True Shot and not getting pulled by Spear of Justice.

Thieves… on a bad day when I play really badly (how can it get worse) I’ll get like 2 Pulmonary Impacts, lose most of my Shroud for nothing, get my stability stacks stolen and Corrupt Boon is on CD… But to be honest, it’s not like you don’t see them coming most of the time. I know I have to check the minimap, check if they recently killed someone, where they are, and just have camera scrolled out to see their approach (I just can’t be asked, tired from work). The most prepared you can be is when you know in the next few moments they will jump you. Sometimes you can port with Mr Wurm and spam marks on your feet to have them port right into it (some will dodge + Steal though), use Corrosive Poison Cloud (blocks projectiles) for the FotM players who just spam headshot (and watch you jump around getting your heal off), have them eat a daze or corrupt (Corrupt Boon can be cast -=xXx.360.xXx=-) and turn around to pressure them etc. [If they do snipe you in a fight though, and you’re not concentrated enough to know they will jump you, you won’t react fast enough to pop Spectral + Shroud to buy time for team to peel.]

Condi Chrono, Power Rev and Mender Druid are fairly nasty matchups for you though, so just take care to avoid rotating into a fight where they focus you. Condi Rev vs Condi Necro is funny, because one moment you’re managing ok, the next you get your resistance ripped off and you’re suddenly melting from all the aids.

Ralkuth.1456:

The only gripe with Moa I have is that it instantly kills your Mr Wurm. I imagine it also does so to other types of minions but that is a lot of shutdown on one skill. It is, however, a long CD skill with an obvious cast/skillshot/require stealth setup so it is rather fair I get punished for not seeing it coming.

@xeonage.1253:

If it was a perfectly setup Moa burst complete with immobilize + teammates assisting then it’s GG. They do happen, with experienced teams, and very often.

However in most cases in a PUG if you anticipate a Moa incoming, just spam 5 and 2 immediately, they give you evade. In fact there were a few times where I actually gain mobility (I run faster because I believe I’m a bird????) because I was Moa’d and I escape a 2v1, buying time until teammates rotate in to help. The Engi version is short enough that you can just evade the whole time and Engi lacks the means to lockdown as much as Chrono can during the Moa anyway.

condi bomb -> moa and moa -> condi bomb is very difference. If you a mes you know what i said ( bomb -> stealth -> moa). Although i will stand and afk and take a coffee to see their show. But for newbie, they kill theirself. And how long CD of moa for eng and mes??? 1.5 mins? 1 mins?

Wait, condi engi is OP now? O.o

A little exaggeration maybe but in reality Necro is a class you shouldn’t play this upcoming season unless you duo a lot.

Whatever no sympathy from a lot of us. You guys were crazy meta for a year, have 2 health bars, can tank like a beast, do mad conditions and burst as well. So what you don’t have your stability anymore. Good riddance.

As someone who has played several thousand hours of necro over the past few years, I can tell you that the biggest issue is that I feel like ANET doesnt know what to do with us.

They seem to have a clear line on what most classes do, and they sorta semi fit into the trinity for dps/healing/tank. However with necros they can’t decide.

If you don’t have survivability, sustain you can not effectively carry out the vision for necro. Necros were suppose to orignally play a wearing down function, where they slowly ate away at enemies. In order to do anything slowly you also need to be able sustain, not something that necros can do on thier own at all.

So then came the next vision or incarnation for necro, Corruption, boons got really out of control for a while and it was indeed impossible to kill each other. Because everything was out of wack people were sitting on points knowing that the duels would just last forever. At this point beside nerfing dagger dagger ele, Anet gave necros a nice strong ability to corrupt. Unfortunately while this ability remains the addition of skills like resistance and such, and the increased ability to share boons has made this skill unable to keep up with the current boon meta again.

Necro’s weakness in sustain was further destroyed in the last patch by increased nerfs to our stability features and sustain. While we have a grandmaster trait that breaks stun and gives stability this is useless sitting next to our most important way of damaging. Because the stability it gives is so minute and building a tanky support necro is so useless in general (you should just roll to a different class if you want to be tanky and supportive necros tank or support functions add little to anyone.) that if your not standing way out of range and corrupting dropping damage on your opponents your team generally will constantly be trying to get you up.

This can be further evidenced in the last tournament where pro players paired all necros with a designated healbot engy, because for some reason Engi and necro pair well together and Engi has the most sucessful time of getting Necro up.

Indeed I play with my friend who plays on Engi, and yes that is exactly what he does, support me so I can live to do damage when I am focused and CC’d.

I’ll just say it, this game has too many conditions, too many boons, too many CCs, and way too many try hards, cry babies and loser “pro” players that cheat like Naru.

I haven’t played in a while but out of my main classes I play (mesmer, rev, necro and engi) necro feels best in my hands BY FAR (with mesmer being my second favourite). Did we get nerfed or something within the past like four months? I never really felt underpowered on my necro regardless of matchup and would usually go on big win streaks and 3-5 top stats per match. I mean really, necro felt a little overpowered last I played. We didn’t get hit really hard or something, did we? I’m reinstalling at the moment because it looks like Anet is finally giving real attention to PVP and WoW is boring after a month.

Nightshade.2570:

… I can tell you that the biggest issue is that I feel like ANET doesnt know what to do with every class.

fix’d

Gretzel.6790:

I haven’t played in a while but out of my main classes I play (mesmer, rev, necro and engi) necro feels best in my hands BY FAR (with mesmer being my second favourite). Did we get nerfed or something within the past like four months? I never really felt underpowered on my necro regardless of matchup and would usually go on big win streaks and 3-5 top stats per match. I mean really, necro felt a little overpowered last I played. We didn’t get hit really hard or something, did we? I’m reinstalling at the moment because it looks like Anet is finally giving real attention to PVP and WoW is boring after a month.

Seriously, Necro is now a bit strong when they remove air and fire sigil. But many people are unhappy when they are always suck in CC chains and can’t do any thing to deal with them. But i think this is a duty for a punchbag. right?

Cynz.9437:

Nightshade.2570:

… I can tell you that the biggest issue is that I feel like ANET doesnt know what to do with every class.

fix’d

lol

If you got problem with CC chains on necro,maybe slot more stun breaks,or trait to fight CC chains.Also as said milion times,you have to positiion with lil brain activity involved,dont charge into big fights without shroud or great support.The reason ppl target necros,isnt cause they are that vulnerable,its cause they are most dangerous of all in group fights.
Same as ppl dont target support cause they are easy to kill,but its just important to take support down in certain cases.

i feel after last patch,necros got much easier time in pvp,especially stabil change on warrior,and some sigils removed helped a lot.Overall good balance,i would maybe do something with gravedigger,cause honestly 1,1/4 cast time for 170 range aoe,which aint even hiting that hard is bad.Or focus is very bad with the long cast times.

xeonage.1253:

condi bomb -> moa and moa -> condi bomb is very difference. If you a mes you know what i said ( bomb -> stealth -> moa). Although i will stand and afk and take a coffee to see their show. But for newbie, they kill theirself. And how long CD of moa for eng and mes??? 1.5 mins? 1 mins?

If you’re a mes you’d know mesmer metas haven’t be using stealth for 6 seasons already. Ofc the options are there and you can talk about those odd builds minority uses, but know that you either have to sacrifice portal or signet of illusions, both of which are essential in rotation or your “condi bomb”.

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

xeonage.1253:

condi bomb -> moa and moa -> condi bomb is very difference. If you a mes you know what i said ( bomb -> stealth -> moa). Although i will stand and afk and take a coffee to see their show. But for newbie, they kill theirself. And how long CD of moa for eng and mes??? 1.5 mins? 1 mins?

If you’re a mes you’d know mesmer metas haven’t be using stealth for 6 seasons already. Ofc the options are there and you can talk about those odd builds minority uses, but know that you either have to sacrifice portal or signet of illusions, both of which are essential in rotation or your “condi bomb”.

Just a example, stealth just for who can dodge. Actual, bomb -> moa is enough. There are too confusion. 50% time, you cannot see them spell , you don’t know what they are spell, just dodge when the condi bomb are explosion. If the mes isn’t a spammmmer, the moa will coming~

xeonage.1253:

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

xeonage.1253:

condi bomb -> moa and moa -> condi bomb is very difference. If you a mes you know what i said ( bomb -> stealth -> moa). Although i will stand and afk and take a coffee to see their show. But for newbie, they kill theirself. And how long CD of moa for eng and mes??? 1.5 mins? 1 mins?

If you’re a mes you’d know mesmer metas haven’t be using stealth for 6 seasons already. Ofc the options are there and you can talk about those odd builds minority uses, but know that you either have to sacrifice portal or signet of illusions, both of which are essential in rotation or your “condi bomb”.

Just a example, stealth just for who can dodge. Actual, bomb -> moa is enough. There are too confusion. 50% time, you cannot see them spell , you don’t know what they are spell, just dodge when the condi bomb are explosion. If the mes isn’t a spammmmer, the moa will coming~

The thing is, if you get moa bursted you lose all of your defenses regardless of your class. With a few minor exceptions, the only things that will make a class more likely to survive as a moa is health pool and toughness (things like passive elixer s, defy pain can help but most classes don’t have things like that). With necro along with warrior having the highest health pool it actually makes them more likely to live long enough to get out of moa and recover than say an ele, thief or guardian.

Lord Velar.1509:

There is 1 ability for 1 class I did forget to mention that I will never say is not broken and definitely needs to be fixed in pvp and that is the mesmers moa morph, I have never played a game, where another class can morph you into some useless creature, and you still take full damage from it.

cough WoW cough

I agree with the OP, however rambling his post. It’s all true! But don’t expect any fixes anytime soon because … [favourites]

Svarty.8019:

Lord Velar.1509:

There is 1 ability for 1 class I did forget to mention that I will never say is not broken and definitely needs to be fixed in pvp and that is the mesmers moa morph, I have never played a game, where another class can morph you into some useless creature, and you still take full damage from it.

cough WoW cough

I agree with the OP, however rambling his post. It’s all true! But don’t expect any fixes anytime soon because … [favourites]

Still spouting wrong info… Polymorph in WoW transforms a player and they regen health extremely fast and any damage they take from any source ends the polymorphist’s….. which is actually balanced compared to Moa.

Easy Necro deaths is what we get when Anet decides that we somehow need plaguelands instead of a survival button that was actually useful for us.

Dirame.8521:

Easy Necro deaths is what we get when Anet decides that we somehow need plaguelands instead of a survival button that was actually useful for us.

This. <+1>

They could have added Plaguelands as the missing Well Elite for Necros, but they removed one of the best sources of sustain available to them and replaced it with more DPS, which wasn’t really needed.

Really poor move.

Necro DPS is fine – above average even – just hard to land it with the endless stunlock and focus fire.

Necros need some more stability – revert the nerfs to RS3. Maybe add stability to Spectral Walk. Bring back Plague at the very least.

Revert the nerf to Rise – just test out some small changes from a defence/stability standpoint – no need to do anything drastic.

Some other small sustain buffs would be good.

I don’t see Necro as broken-I love mine. My issue is that when a Necro takes down one-two opponents and they have the ability to rez and then kill you with help of their teammates, that’s broken. PVP here is fun, but when you get beat-stay that way. Oh and this run away stuff is nothing to brag about. PvP does stand for Player vs Play right? I loose more kills from this, you beat them and GW2 gives them a second chance with help.

Being pro necro:

1. start video recording
2. go to character select screen
3. delete necro
4. create thief
5. 11111 until necro is out of shroud
6. stun it
7. burn it down
8. begin finisher
9. teleport away
10. teleport back
11. throw ballista blueprint on corpse
12. upload to youtube
    #ProNecro2011-2017

Already said this in another thread so I’ll keep it short.

Basically, Necro right now is in a position where it’s very reliant on player skill. A lot of other classes are not. Therefore, even against equally skilled players, you’re likely to get trashed as a Necro (or, at least, you’re likely to in anything except the top mmr bracket – but even there a lot of the Necros are pretty bad). However, in saying that they’re equally skilled I would also like to say that they’re probably also pretty mediocre too.

What this increased reliance on skill means for you is that as a Necro you need to focus, and you need to play well in order to not throw games – additionally, this is also true when you have, for example, a semi-decent ele or other form of support on your team. You need to pull your own weight.

But maybe you don’t think you’re that bad at Necro.

I’m going to assume you don’t know what you’re doing wrong and just list out the main things you should be aware of and already proficient at (if you’re “good”) or soon-to-be improving at (if you’re bad or average and want to get “good”).

First of all, can you 1v1 most classes (and can you win most match-ups, as you should)? You should be able to do this even in bad matchups for a decent amount of time (if thieves are ‘instagibbing’ you all the time it’s probably not just because they’re your “counter”). Generally if you want to 1v1 well you’re going to need effective play and kiting (although this is pretty obvious as it’s a central part of conquest at any tier…). Spamming skills on any class is going to be less effective, but as a Necro you’re especially punished for this (classes like thief are too, don’t worry). The flip-side to this is that if you make effective use of yourself then you can do pretty kittening well – as I’ve seen firsthand watching players like Sinid – and, on occasion, myself – manage pressure in 1vXs.

Secondly, do you rotate correctly? Are you ensuring you will be in good fights and will be able to make value out of your rotation? Are you rotating fast enough? Are you taking the correct fights, and disengaging from others?

Moreover, how’s your awareness? Do you watch the map? Do you watch for +1s on your 1v1s and begin to kite or disengage before you’re unable to?

Are you positioning yourself correctly? Or are you running helplessly into a melee versus the 4man ele train rampaging through the node?

Are you taking advantage of your teammates? Are you staying with the Ele or alternative support class when possible? If you aren’t – like most players – please watch for this stuff. Bear in mind also that taking advantage of your teammates’ abilities doesn’t just apply to support classes. For example, Mesmers can support you (sometimes they won’t even mean to) through healing wells, peel (damage, cc, and general focus on attacking enemies to prevent or reduce how much they can do to you), portals, AoE distortion… The list goes on. The same applies for virtually any class. And, although some obviously carry more things that a Necro can take advantage of than others, they are all worthwhile to watch out for. Teamplay in gw2 is essential, and especially so for this class.

Finally, are you kiting? And, are you kiting enough?
(I know for a fact that a lot of the Necros I face aren’t)
While often overlooked it’s a pretty simple and logical thing to do. No one’s forcing you to die some “honorable” death when you have two or three people on you, and most of the time going rambo-mode into them isn’t going to work out for you. Generally, the smartest thing to do when pressured is to kite. Hop around on the rocks for a bit while managing your cooldowns and soon enough you’ll realise that Necro requires nothing more than a little intelligence to succeed.

If, as you’ve said, you struggle to kite then the first thing you need to work on is awareness. If you’re not able to kite then the thing most likely to be your problem is that you’re kiting too late. Be aware and move intelligently. However, assuming you’re already doing this, the next thing to look at is map knowledge (knowing your kittening PvP jumping puzzles). Kiting isn’t just about running in a straight line. There is terrain for a reason. And, judging by the low mmr brackets most of you who complain about Necro seem to be in, learning all the kite spots on each map should allow you to manage pressure like a god. If you’re not sure what these are just ask in map chat or look it up. Alternatively, just go into a custom arena and work them out.

“So i’ll keep it short” I said. Well…

iTz Joshz.3961:

L2P

Well here’s the rub;

• Necros are complaining about dying a lot.
• That’s a fundamental core game mechanic that other classes aren’t complaining about.
• MO has always appeared sensitive to the feelings of his playerbase. He’s on trial now as to whether he cares about one section of his customer-base or not.

Let’s see whether Mike O’Brien cares about his work, because at the moment Reapers are a class that feels visceral, meaning they’re appealing to new players, but in reality they are a perennial victim class for McLain's favourite, the thief in particular.

Can MO force McLain to nerf his favourite class? That’s basically the guild war we’re watching unfold.

Welp I’ve come to the conclusion that pvp as a whole needs to be reworked completely.

I played a couple matches today and I noticed that there is no skill in GW2s pvp.

The team that wins is the team that spams the most cc and have the burst classes.

For 3 mathes in a row that’s how we lost, getting stunned, and immobilized till we were dead and since most if not all classes can throw out huge amounts of damage, it didn’t take them long to kill us

For instance at point B I had full health, full life force, all of my conditions were out and my abilities were on cool down, the second I decided to turn on reaper shroud and jump in the middle of the fight I got knocked back, interrupted, snared, and immobilized and before I knew it not only was my shroud gone, but my health was too.

Rangers were sitting back draining people from afar which yet again is unbalanced because no ranged class should have that advantage over any other ranged class in a game where popping big numbers against other players is a thing. Even hunters in WoW are subject to getting their faces smashed in if theyre not careful and almost every class can counter them

I forgot what its called but the ability that the “leaf” race gets, the snare, yet that needs a big kitten rework. I got snared trying to contest B, I tried to break it with (its not Rise but the other one) a shout and nothing happened, I was still snared and got burst down in the blink of an eye

I can continue, but I am truly baffled at how people can defend this

The game is fun asf (otherwise I wouldn’t still be playing it obviously), but it’s hard to sit here and pretend that it doesn’t have its issues

This aspect alone is making me debate on if I’m even going to give their next installment a try.

PvP has so much potential to be great, yet it feels like Anet doesn’t even care

Lord Velar.1509:

Welp I’ve come to the conclusion that pvp as a whole needs to be reworked completely.

I played a couple matches today and I noticed that there is no skill in GW2s pvp.

The team that wins is the team that spams the most cc and have the burst classes.

For 3 mathes in a row that’s how we lost, getting stunned, and immobilized till we were dead and since most if not all classes can throw out huge amounts of damage, it didn’t take them long to kill us

For instance at point B I had full health, full life force, all of my conditions were out and my abilities were on cool down, the second I decided to turn on reaper shroud and jump in the middle of the fight I got knocked back, interrupted, snared, and immobilized and before I knew it not only was my shroud gone, but my health was too.

Rangers were sitting back draining people from afar which yet again is unbalanced because no ranged class should have that advantage over any other ranged class in a game where popping big numbers against other players is a thing. Even hunters in WoW are subject to getting their faces smashed in if theyre not careful and almost every class can counter them

I forgot what its called but the ability that the “leaf” race gets, the snare, yet that needs a big kitten rework. I got snared trying to contest B, I tried to break it with (its not Rise but the other one) a shout and nothing happened, I was still snared and got burst down in the blink of an eye

I can continue, but I am truly baffled at how people can defend this

The game is fun asf (otherwise I wouldn’t still be playing it obviously), but it’s hard to sit here and pretend that it doesn’t have its issues

This aspect alone is making me debate on if I’m even going to give their next installment a try.

PvP has so much potential to be great, yet it feels like Anet doesn’t even care

The mechanic on entangle is strong and is very different from other cc. There are some root that you need to attack otherwise it keeps pulsing immobilize. A stun break won’t clear immobilize unless it also clears generic conditions. the trait that processes it requires a fear, float, knockback, taunt.

/Forum bug

/15charrcars

Sly.9518:

I will say the amount of Woe is Necro threads is funny when the EU Unity tourney showed a lot of the teams used Necros and did well with it, it’s weird good players do well and don’t complain about Necro.

It’s weird that the EU Unity Tourny is full 5s teams with dedicated support ele, while ranked is solo/duo only.

Nobody has ever complained about Necro’s ability to do well when there is a Ele to babysit every booboo.

Sly.9518:

NeXeD.3042:

Sly.9518:

Svarty.8019:

Sly.9518:

Svarty.8019:

Sly.9518:

[something something conspiracy theory]

At least one of us is having fun.

Nope just pointing out the Woe is necro posts tied to the witch hunt for thieves, and your justification is always the same Karl McClain thief video from 2013, I think it’s been posted 4 maybe 5 times now in a week, twice in this single thread even.

I feel honoured that you see fit to follow me with such vigour.

Follow? Nah it’s just hard to miss the ridiculous of posts that you make in Pvp forums majority of which always say the same two things Woe is Necro and Teef Op… and when you link the same video from 2013 to try justify your post in a lot of them… yeah it’s not hard to figure out what the next post will be. Lol glad you feel flattered though, I find it to be very entertaining.

Good lawd get a room you two silly gooses.

Nah, this is too much fun.

But back to topic.
I will say the amount of Woe is Necro threads is funny when the EU Unity tourney showed a lot of the teams used Necros and did well with it, it’s weird good players do well and don’t complain about Necro.

But some of the people starting the Woe is Necro posts started posts about having problem with cc from PvE mobs. #kermitmeme#nonofmybusiness lol

Youre comparing set up teams to non set up teams…..you do realize that right?

A necros without any support does not do well, a necros with support does very well

For instance in a match in Beta Coliseum I pulled almost 400k in damage to where in Legacy I only pulled 230k damage. Reason being…… in Beta I had the support of an engi and ele to assist me in staying alive long enough to put that kind of damage out

In Legacy I had practically 0 support and it was a complete struggle to even get that much damage out.

Necros is a class that can deal damage, but it cannot live long enough to do so.

Pro Necros=Supported Necros

The only person I consider to be a “pro” necros is Holts since he doesn’t need anyone to hold his hand

Just avoid mesmers if you play condi necro. Your attacks are too slow to hit them and they are perma invuln. So it is just pointless to fight them, they cleanse condis more than any class probably. Also avoid thieves as they can spam headshot and kill you with ease. Then when you go into ds they run off and wait you out. The other classes you can at least hit but still you will probably die to them too. Basically this game sucks. You should play necro by going to team fights with an ele and spam all your aoe and kill everything

ArthurDent.9538:

xeonage.1253:

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

xeonage.1253:

condi bomb -> moa and moa -> condi bomb is very difference. If you a mes you know what i said ( bomb -> stealth -> moa). Although i will stand and afk and take a coffee to see their show. But for newbie, they kill theirself. And how long CD of moa for eng and mes??? 1.5 mins? 1 mins?

If you’re a mes you’d know mesmer metas haven’t be using stealth for 6 seasons already. Ofc the options are there and you can talk about those odd builds minority uses, but know that you either have to sacrifice portal or signet of illusions, both of which are essential in rotation or your “condi bomb”.

Just a example, stealth just for who can dodge. Actual, bomb -> moa is enough. There are too confusion. 50% time, you cannot see them spell , you don’t know what they are spell, just dodge when the condi bomb are explosion. If the mes isn’t a spammmmer, the moa will coming~

The thing is, if you get moa bursted you lose all of your defenses regardless of your class. With a few minor exceptions, the only things that will make a class more likely to survive as a moa is health pool and toughness (things like passive elixer s, defy pain can help but most classes don’t have things like that). With necro along with warrior having the highest health pool it actually makes them more likely to live long enough to get out of moa and recover than say an ele, thief or guardian.

A good mesmer will follow a necro around and moa him all game and basically win the game for you. It is hard to moa every other class as they can actually use dodges, invulns and blocks. Necro never dodges or uses invulns so you can just kill it with moa over and over. Elites being reset by the mesmer 5 ability is utterly stupid.

Lord Velar.1509:

Sly.9518:

NeXeD.3042:

Sly.9518:

Svarty.8019:

Sly.9518:

Svarty.8019:

Sly.9518:

[something something conspiracy theory]

At least one of us is having fun.

Nope just pointing out the Woe is necro posts tied to the witch hunt for thieves, and your justification is always the same Karl McClain thief video from 2013, I think it’s been posted 4 maybe 5 times now in a week, twice in this single thread even.

I feel honoured that you see fit to follow me with such vigour.

Follow? Nah it’s just hard to miss the ridiculous of posts that you make in Pvp forums majority of which always say the same two things Woe is Necro and Teef Op… and when you link the same video from 2013 to try justify your post in a lot of them… yeah it’s not hard to figure out what the next post will be. Lol glad you feel flattered though, I find it to be very entertaining.

Good lawd get a room you two silly gooses.

Nah, this is too much fun.

But back to topic.
I will say the amount of Woe is Necro threads is funny when the EU Unity tourney showed a lot of the teams used Necros and did well with it, it’s weird good players do well and don’t complain about Necro.

But some of the people starting the Woe is Necro posts started posts about having problem with cc from PvE mobs. #kermitmeme#nonofmybusiness lol

Youre comparing set up teams to non set up teams…..you do realize that right?

A necros without any support does not do well, a necros with support does very well

For instance in a match in Beta Coliseum I pulled almost 400k in damage to where in Legacy I only pulled 230k damage. Reason being…… in Beta I had the support of an engi and ele to assist me in staying alive long enough to put that kind of damage out

In Legacy I had practically 0 support and it was a complete struggle to even get that much damage out.

Necros is a class that can deal damage, but it cannot live long enough to do so.

Pro Necros=Supported Necros

The only person I consider to be a “pro” necros is Holts since he doesn’t need anyone to hold his hand

Those good players on Necro don’t complain and in yolo Queue make it pretty far into the top 100 just saying.