Guild Wars 2

Sup !

Was wondering if I come back to GW2 when I saw something like " we gonna buff necro’s sustain on the 9 sept patch".

So my question is : are the following changes the only changes for the necro with the next patch ?

Traits
Last Gasp in the Soul Reaping Line – now categorized as a spectral skill and affected by spectral traits. Additionally, recharge reduced from 60s to 50s.
Unholy Sanctuary in the Death Magic Line – In addition to healing, this trait will now activate Death Shroud if you have enough Life Force when you take a lethal blow (i..e an attack that would kill you). This trait has 30s internal CD and even if your Death Shroud is on cooldown it will circumvent that cooldown.
Skills
Death Shroud – can now interact with things while in Death Shroud form. You can now rez allies or finish downed enemies.
Corrupt Boon – Cast time increased 0.25s, bringing the skill to 0.5s cast time. This change also reduces the aftercast of Corrupted Boon by 0.25s.
Signet of Vampirism – The active time of this ability has been increased from 5s to 6s.
Spectral Armor – Recharged reduced from 60s to 50s
Rending Claws – Aftercast of this ability has been reduced by 0.25s
Ghastly Claws – Damage increased by 10%
Necrotic Slash – Stab and Bite have all of their targets increased from 1 to 2. This means you will have a slight cleaving effect on your dagger abilities. The positive effect of these abilities can only occur once per swing.
Locus Swarm – Duration of swiftness increased from 10s to 15s
Lich Form – Transformation reduced from 30s to 20s. Reduced its power scale to the player’s normal power scale. To compensate for this, we have increased the damage multipliers of the Lich abilities to be about what it was before. This change ensures your Lich Form damage remains as high as before but Signal of Fire/Air and other outside activations don’t deal exponential damage.

Coz it is absolutly not going to change anything about necro’s sustain, Unholy Sanctuary is the trait you have to focus on, by buffing the amount of heal, so we can play rabbid amulet and have a good healing, actually it’s almost fine on settler but the damages are not good enough so …
The actual coming change for this trait gonna be smth like sadly useless.

Yup. The meta will still be cheesy carrion nightmare PoC Reaper’s Protection..

I think I miss-understood it then, they are putting a 0.5 cast time on corrupt boon, actually instant cast , in what it is a buff ?

Suprah.5076:

I think I miss-understood it then, they are putting a 0.5 cast time on corrupt boon, actually instant cast , in what it is a buff ?

No, as it is now CB is casted instantly but with a 0.5 sec aftercast (so it’s not properly an instacast).

After the patch, CB will have a 0.25 casting time and 0.25 after cast.

Lopez.7369:

The Spectral Armor buff is great, the Corrupt Boon change is a wonderful quality-of-life adjustment, and being able to interact with objects and players while in Death Shroud is an enormous buff. It all adds up to a decent boost overall, and necromancer didn’t need big changes in the first place.

Also, rabid is already better than carrion. Most people just don’t seem to understand how effective healing works or that toughness works in Death Shroud.

So wait, you mean to tell me that I should listen to you and pick rabid over carrion, when top pvp necromancers such as Noscoc and Zombify run carrion for their build?

Rabid has higher condition pressure, but our sustain in terms of healing is too poor to make it work without eles and warriors and guards blasting water fields for us. Also, something I’ve noticed since playing ranger, rabid is less useful than carrion on necromancer because their attacks are for the most part very slow, while rangers get the kittening shortbow autoattack and Axe 2 and SB 2 that are kittens at once letting them proc more bleeds. People still prefer to use carrion on condi rangers too, but thats only because carrion’s higher health gives more insurance against burst damage and conditions.

Lopez.7369:

I’m not saying you should listen to me. I’m saying you should listen to the math.

With that said, I’m better than Zombify and Noscoc. I don’t run in and die just to corrupt might and protection.

You have to keep in mind that this game is so uncompetitive that the tournament scene isn’t actually reflective of the best players. Many of the best players — and I’m not necessarily including myself in this category — don’t take the game seriously enough to create a team. Pretty much the only serious team, at this point, is TCG in Europe. There are no serious teams in North America.

I wasn’t expecting as thorough or as convincing of an argument out of you as you gave me. I’ll have to wait and see if someone disproves you though. Are you able to do actual damage calculations with a typical condition necro rotation and see how they differ? (using geomancy for carrion, and earth sigil for rabid). That calculation would be interesting to see.

And I do understand what you’re saying. Not every top tier player has the energy to stream or make teams. I’m kind of interested in dueling or playing a match with you to see how you play though, if that would be okay.

Also what would you wager for rabid vs. carrion for ranger condition builds (spirits or traps or weird survival based mixes)? I feel like carrion could work due to the hybridized nature of their weapons and more of a weakness to condition damage compared to necromancer (troll unugent ftw!) but rabid also seems viable due to more/faster attacks and a few attacks that have 5 projectiles (axe and SB 2 at point blank). Its also puzzling me if the new axe would be worth using over shortbow in the future for condition builds.

Anyway, as offtopic as that was, I’m impressed with what you have to say.

Lopez.7369:

Geomancy applies slightly more bleeds than Earth — Geomancy keeps 3 bleeds over 10 seconds, while Earth applies about 2.5 bleeds over the same time period — except when you account for cleansing. The Geomancy bleeds are almost never going to last the full duration. The Earth bleeds are scattered. In that sense, you can consider Geomancy a little more “burst” — if 330 damage can really be considered burst — but Earth is much more sustain and condition coverage.

Earth also doesn’t have melee positioning and weapon swapping requirements, which are a huge deal for necromancer. One, going into melee range as a necromancer is suicide in group fights because the class’s survivability is based entirely around positioning. (This is what I was making fun of with my previous post; Noscoc and Zombify do this constantly in tournaments to use Path of Corruption or Geomancy.) Two, swapping to staff is a huge DPS loss compared to scepter if Reaper’s Mark isn’t up, so switching to staff for Geomancy is generally a bad idea.

So Geomancy versus Earth is a little more nuanced and less mathematical than rabid versus carrion, but I’m not really sure why Geomancy gets so much love in comparison. It’s at least closer than people let on. In reality, Earth seems much more effective due to the positional and weapon requirements of necromancer.

As for ranger, I’m not familiar enough with the class to comment. My understanding is that shortbow and other ranger weapons scale decently enough with power that carrion is worth it. In comparison, necromancer’s scepter has one of the worst power coefficients in the game.

Thanks for the advice. These things make sense. What necro build do you use if you don’t seem too keen on PoC? Plz don’t tell me dumbfire.

Lopez.7369:

I
With that said, I’m better than Zombify and Noscoc. I don’t run in and die just to corrupt might and protection.

Oh kitten lopez, busting out the PJSalt.

I too never understood why carrion started being a “thing” on necros though ether. It’s almost always better to prioritize toughness over vitality in terms of maximizing your defensive structure. Considering a necromancer is a very slow class, a lot of its defense should be coming from toughness as it synergies so well with healing. If you don’t have toughness, you’re going to rely on heavy dodging/mobility to avoid damage entirely while healing does its work – beyond kiting with spectral walk and using your cripples, not really an option for the necro.

Lopez.7369:

You have to keep in mind that this game is so uncompetitive that the tournament scene isn’t actually reflective of the best players. Many of the best players — and I’m not necessarily including myself in this category — don’t take the game seriously enough to create a team. Pretty much the only serious team, at this point, is TCG in Europe. There are no serious teams in North America.

Exactly. Its similar to what we had in warcraft during the first few seasons if you played on backalley battlegroups. Top tier players like me could play with randoms from the guild and still make it to gladiator level.

The entire structure doesnt cater or feed the competetive scene.

- MMR being account wide instead of class specific like it should be. This being the case just shows Anet doesnt take its own game seriously. In a deep and competetive game it would be really hard to be top tier/just as good with all classes in the game.
- MMR matching top 10 players with ppl who started doing rated games that same day.
- Lack of seasons and proper ladders.
- Lack of a real non fluffy (here you go more vendor trash) reward structure. A bit like during the old wow days. The higher you get the better your rewards/your looks should be. We need a structure that motivates ppl to push for higher rankings.

There is no incentive to push yourself or your team to the top.

Galandil.9641:

Suprah.5076:

I think I miss-understood it then, they are putting a 0.5 cast time on corrupt boon, actually instant cast , in what it is a buff ?

No, as it is now CB is casted instantly but with a 0.5 sec aftercast (so it’s not properly an instacast).

After the patch, CB will have a 0.25 casting time and 0.25 after cast.

Corrupt Boons is not instant, it has got a 0,25sec cast time already even tho it doesn´t show in the tooltip. I got interrupted on this ability many times, so it is definitely not instant.

Cast wont change anything when the skill has barely any animation.

Power necro will be even more broken than it is now… and all the wannabe necros will be bragging about skill when all they do is press lich… SO SKILLFUL SUCH ESPORTS

Im sorry but this is more than clearn indication Anet has no idea what is needed to balance a class.

lich is being nerfed in both duration (not sure if that was necessary) and in its unfair interaction with sigils, wells and chill of death (did i get the trait name right?), and even then it wasn’t such a good skill in pvp to begin with.

i don’t see what the lich hate is for honestly nor do i see how power necroes are broken.

I am pretty disappointed after watching necro skill bar. Most classes is getting some nice changes/buffs that might open for them some new builds , some of then will get a bit nerfed witch was needed . What about necro?? Spectral armor change is small buff , axe and dagger buffs are very very minor , so tell me where are the buffs to our sustain?

Basicly after 6 months necro got nothing , completly nothing. Now i am sure that devs have no idea what to do with the class. Tell me how necro can be attriction class , when every single other class have more tools to sustain fight way longer then we. Tell me why should i play condi necro when condis are completly shutdown becouse of the masive condi cleanse and even then engi or war will do better condi presure with more sustain , tell me why should i play dps necro when war,ele,thief will do way more dmg having way more sustain.

There is only one hope , that necro will befenit somehow from nerfs to some profesions.

Easiest (read laziest) way to fix a class is by swapping the attention to a totally different build/traitset.

Instead of adjusting and the improving the current metabuilds / combat and depth. they adjust old/rarely used abbilities Yay.

^ Anets way of balancing.

Jinx.7258:

Cast wont change anything when the skill has barely any animation.

Power necro will be even more broken than it is now… and all the wannabe necros will be bragging about skill when all they do is press lich… SO SKILLFUL SUCH ESPORTS

Im sorry but this is more than clearn indication Anet has no idea what is needed to balance a class.

At least lich is now considerably worse. I think you might be underestimating this change. It is a very significant nerf.

As for power necros, yes its brainless and skill-less with the life blast spam. But at least they die so there is a ceiling on how strong they can be

Lopez.7369:

With that said, I’m better than Zombify and Noscoc. I don’t run in and die just to corrupt might and protection.

Warrior is edging out of the meta with this patch, and ele will already be feeling the power creep from other classes beginning to theaten its strengths.

Very intrested to see how this pans out. Im not very well versed with necro glitches, so can’t comment too much on the ability to stomp/res while in DS…

Phaeton.9582:

Warrior is edging out of the meta with this patch, and ele will already be feeling the power creep from other classes beginning to theaten its strengths.

Very intrested to see how this pans out. Im not very well versed with necro glitches, so can’t comment too much on the ability to stomp/res while in DS…

It is a huge and underestimated buff (whether it is a quality of life change or not).

It is a huge buff, but a necessary one IMO. Downed state is a huge aspect of PvP that Necros have had almost no effectiveness in since launch. Glitching the DS stomp/rez was only really useful when traiting for Stability which is far too limited for a mechanic that already locks you out of all but 5 skills. Definitely looking forward to this change.

Necro can have more sustain, but it needs to come at the expense of something. Would necros be willing to reduce some of their death shroud HP for more regen?

style.6173:

Necro can have more sustain, but it needs to come at the expense of something. Would necros be willing to reduce some of their death shroud HP for more regen?

Yes
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/My-suggestion-to-fix-the-necromancer/first#post4352231