Guild Wars 2

Blocking the strike is not the same at all as evading the strike I feel like. Shouldn’t blocking at attack coming from invisibility reveal the attacker?

it should , it really should they attack if it hits they get revealed.

its a problem a clear issue , ranger gs counter attack a stealthed person can melee hit this block and not get revealed.

anet don’t want too much revealing skills but blocks or counter attacks should be counters to melee attacks not letting stealthed melee hit you and get away scotch free.

Is this in response to all stealth based professions (only 2 really) or 1 in specific?

NinjaEd.3946:

Is this in response to all stealth based professions (only 2 really) or 1 in specific?

all even huntershot/ stealthed projectiles that are blocked or reflected.
any attack that hits somthing be it block or a reflect wall should reveal themselfs.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

it should , it really should they attack if it hits they get revealed.

its a problem a clear issue , ranger gs counter attack a stealthed person can melee hit this block and not get revealed.

anet don’t want too much revealing skills but blocks or counter attacks should be counters to melee attacks not letting stealthed melee hit you and get away scotch free.

Well, technically they dont get hit because the blocked it, right? :P
I dont know why it “should” be that way. In the first place it “should” be a matter of balance. Right now a class with a lot of stealth is the thief, a class with many blocks the guardian. Guardians are very good – hardcounter to thieves, so not needed?!
And you actually get “revealing” information. "Blocked"over you haed…melee or range?!? You can see ranged attacks easily and locate the enemy. Not ranged, so maybe melee? Beat the hell out of the enemy. Normally no thief would ever facetank a medi-guard or burn-guard. And a thief 1vs1 a bunker-guard? Please…
If the ranger gs 4 counter attack misses the enemy cause of good positioning its a player playing smart and not an issue imo.

That kind of theme got discussed sporadically the last month and people were mostly saying that its not needed at the moment and especially thieves would need some other suvivability then. But hey, lets discuss again ^^

Coronit.9432:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

it should , it really should they attack if it hits they get revealed.

its a problem a clear issue , ranger gs counter attack a stealthed person can melee hit this block and not get revealed.

anet don’t want too much revealing skills but blocks or counter attacks should be counters to melee attacks not letting stealthed melee hit you and get away scotch free.

Well, technically they dont get hit because the blocked it, right? :P
I dont know why it “should” be that way. In the first place it “should” be a matter of balance. Right now a class with a lot of stealth is the thief, a class with many blocks the guardian. Guardians are very good – hardcounter to thieves, so not needed?!
And you actually get “revealing” information. "Blocked"over you haed…melee or range?!? You can see ranged attacks easily and locate the enemy. Not ranged, so maybe melee? Beat the hell out of the enemy. Normally no thief would ever facetank a medi-guard or burn-guard. And a thief 1vs1 a bunker-guard? Please…
If the ranger gs 4 counter attack misses the enemy cause of good positioning its a player playing smart and not an issue imo.

That kind of theme got discussed sporadically the last month and people were mostly saying that its not needed at the moment and especially thieves would need some other suvivability then. But hey, lets discuss again ^^

its not just a thief issue , with the amount of duration people can stack with chronomancer comming ect classes will need more means of countering steath or atleast a stronger preventatives , " if a stealth attack fails to hit a target it should have a risk Linked to it" right now hitting a blocked target does not de-stealth you buying time for a player to extend the stealth to regen or clear condis , even loose target getting away without any damage.

if stealth is going to stay the same as it currently is more counter play is needed on a team basis , even if guard does have lot of blocks if he builds for it , a smart theif on a team will learn to re-orgainise his priorities , just like a match i had a few days ago , this thief keep trying to spike Burst down a Medi-guard with his heal blocks while i was doing a Co-ordinated spike which just mean the thief was feeding him HP by randomly doing stealth attacks which failed epicly, rather than going for the opposing teams Power ranger he kept on hounding the tanky targets spending 3/4 of the match going from stealth to stealth, not doing much because he didn’t change targets.

builds are one thing but general counters to Extended Stealth times or one example chronomancer Multi 2xmass invis + Veil. all those people with no way to counter the stealth apart from a Very few Select Reveal skills, its going to hell in WvW with this tactic of Perma stealthed Zergs.

blocks need to prevent Stealthed attacks, a Failed attack hitting block should reveal and there are not a lot of ways to block only some Select builds which are made with Blocks in mind.

most classes in Pvp don’t even run Blocks right now apart from bunker guard and shelter on medi-guard have the most because the Aegis access , other classes have one if lucky and that won’t effect the amount of time a player could spend in stealth , it gives a reward for blocking a stealthed player and a Disadvantage to those stealthed players Attacking a blocking player , which right now it doesn’t .

counter attack and warroir off hand sword have the same Block untill mechanics so you could hit once get Kb’s ect not loose stealth and carry on with a high damage attack where the opposing player has to dodge or use a second block or AoE Stun to stop you , it gives too much reward for attacking from stealth in team fights.

with all this new Access to stealth comming up for mostly Chronomancer for team settings this needs to happen to help Reduce the Stealth> AoE+cleave > bomb bomb set ups too mostly found in Courtyard right now , imagine fighting a Stealth stacking Chronomancer, + a 2nd shatter mesmer also running Mass invis and a refuge theif with two other Dps dealers, spending the whole match time Twitching at the slightest spark each time they appear they Vanish again , thats not fun at all.

Is this because of mesmer??

At any other phase of the meta I would agree with you. However as it is right now I actually feel that certain classes stealth are a bit shafted. Especially with a new class coming out with an AOE reveal. (the first of its kind I believe aside from the guardians trap which ahs to be placed preemptively).

On the other hand. I despise Prismatic Understanding.

Thief stealth however can already be interfered with. Through interupting the leaps or blasts. And this is from the perspective of a ranger.

Honestly I feel like the rev is gonna be input as a counter to mesmers and there large scale aoe stealth. Im really worried about how hard theyl hit thieves however. So im hesitant to push for a new counter when one is already on the way.

Shadelang.3012:

At any other phase of the meta I would agree with you. However as it is right now I actually feel that certain classes stealth are a bit shafted. Especially with a new class coming out with an AOE reveal. (the first of its kind I believe aside from the guardians trap which ahs to be placed preemptively).

On the other hand. I despise Prismatic Understanding.

Thief stealth however can already be interfered with. Through interupting the leaps or blasts. And this is from the perspective of a ranger.

Honestly I feel like the rev is gonna be input as a counter to mesmers and there large scale aoe stealth. Im really worried about how hard theyl hit thieves however. So im hesitant to push for a new counter when one is already on the way.

True but that means one class Rev will have to be used for any mass stealth prevention.
kinda a niche like Sic um on ranger having to slot skills out ect.

if everyone had the ability to use blocks to apply reveal to failed stealth attacks , it’ll give everyone a slightly better chance at pin pointing targetings in addition to Rev which will be limited to a Area/radius which could be seen by the foes and walked around.

generaly from a WvW point of view having Rev and Reaveled on failed steath attack vs blocking foes makes the block more Valued than simply the current , WvW stealth counter of Place Wells/Aoes Everywhere to try and stop them.

it’ll make gameplay slightly more defensive , making better use of traps , or DH traps , though this is a general QoL for all stealth and if it did effect theif in such a away , which it won’t just means those players that carelessly attack into blocking targets Suffer the consequences and get revealed.

then its a quesiton of how long should a Block reveal last for defo for sure not the standard reveal times but 1second untill they can restealth.

with Rev Aoe reveal in mind applying 4-6seconds of revealed , theifs could get a Trait that reduces the Revealed duration debuff improving Survival, could even be added onto traits that extend stealth by x seconds also apply -x seconds of revealed.

i just don’t think that Rev should be the only class with Aoe reveal when it is a Game wide issue over all classes.

This would make thieves so much more useless than they already are in PvP. Medi guards already eat thieves for breakfast. This would only make the classes than can already wreck thieves even stronger against them(ie, medi guard) and won’t do much to help classes that struggle against them(ranger)

Doomdesire.9365:

This would make thieves so much more useless than they already are in PvP. Medi guards already eat thieves for breakfast. This would only make the classes than can already wreck thieves even stronger against them(ie, medi guard) and won’t do much to help classes that struggle against them(ranger)

I’m pretty sure this thread is directed to mesmer.

Doomdesire.9365:

This would make thieves so much more useless than they already are in PvP. Medi guards already eat thieves for breakfast

thief needs more than just stealth to survive , its not a class mechanic to rely on everyone has access to stealth.

there are many more issues about theif then just using stealth to avoid attacks , the sustain of the skills,traits and not having the ability survive outside of stealth is a core problem with thief itself.

it should be able to survive outside of stealth and should be very Dangerous while in stealth rather than useless outside of stealth and mildly nasty while stealthed it should be rewarding those that hit well/time attacks while avoiding blocks.

though yes thiefs have been Neglected just like rangers Anet only seems to look at the damage and not much else for a long while but they are getting around to fixing the Balance of Survival vs damage and this should help Everyone not just Niche roles or unbalanced classes which were tweeked by Shoe-horning in a few revealed skills , it’ll show where the underlaying core Problems are more clearly, lifting the Veil.

it’ll solve many issues while showing what thief lacks or any stealth reliant classes lack.

i think any class should be able to Survive well without the need the stealth , right now its become such a Relied on method for survival , its lost its purpose as of right now people just stealth for the heck of it and spam Aoes to stop it as to why D/D ele, Guardains with the wardings/wells is common in Pvp, is stealth was not relied on so much we would see less Cleaves and Aoes slightly more focus on single target pin pointing / clearly showing more defined roles between AoE focus and single target focus too.

if your so fed up of Guardains using Aoe wards and getting hit by d/d eles rings then something needs to be done about the core survial of thief rather than a Relied on stealth .

things have Knock on effects and this would have a Huge positive one.

Sagat.3285:

Doomdesire.9365:

This would make thieves so much more useless than they already are in PvP. Medi guards already eat thieves for breakfast. This would only make the classes than can already wreck thieves even stronger against them(ie, medi guard) and won’t do much to help classes that struggle against them(ranger)

I’m pretty sure this thread is directed to mesmer.

I’m aware of that but it ends up hurting thieves more than mesmers, who can send an illusion to remove aegis. Thief doesn’t really have anything like such.

Doomdesire.9365:

Sagat.3285:

Doomdesire.9365:

This would make thieves so much more useless than they already are in PvP. Medi guards already eat thieves for breakfast. This would only make the classes than can already wreck thieves even stronger against them(ie, medi guard) and won’t do much to help classes that struggle against them(ranger)

I’m pretty sure this thread is directed to mesmer.

I’m aware of that but it ends up hurting thieves more than mesmers, who can send an illusion to remove aegis. Thief doesn’t really have anything like such.

Exactly we don’t need threads like this how can it be so hard to balance mesmer when Robert seem overly careful with balance and it’s just a couple traits. I fear some roulette balance will happen and something random will happen like last time AKA not nefing mesmer’s CS and take it out on mantras and Mirror Blade.

Not to mention thief feels left out their latest Feline Grace “buff” is laughable.