Guild Wars 2

This is such a shame. It’s the same small group of forum qq’ers once again and now we’re binning progress. Just throwing around a word they don’t understand “It’s not ‘competitive’!” Well it is, you kill the other team, capture points and eventually someone wins. So now you can fall to your death? Guess what, all the other players are equally capable of falling too. But what you say? Some classes are better at pushing than others? I’m sorry, but we’ve been bringing certain classes to tpvp to fill certain roles for the past year, nothing has changed.

Neare.9703:

This is such a shame. It’s the same small group of forum qq’ers once again and now we’re binning progress. Just throwing around a word they don’t understand “It’s not ‘competitive’!” Well it is, you kill the other team, capture points and eventually someone wins. So now you can fall to your death? Guess what, all the other players are equally capable of falling too. But what you say? Some classes are better at pushing than others? I’m sorry, but we’ve been bringing certain classes to tpvp to fill certain roles for the past year, nothing has changed.

Pretty much this. It was creating its own meta, and that just isn’t acceptable to the top 100 or the people that try to emulate them and fail, so they complained here and it was removed. It’s a fun map and was really only hated on for being different. They claim it didn’t take “skill” but neither does the current meta they so love. I mean, do you really think AoE spamming (pre patch) or AoE condition spam (post patch) take any more skill than positioning or deciding when the best time to use stability is?

Personally, I prefer the meta that was evolving from Skyhammer and think it takes more skill (and is more fun) than AoE condition spam. Whatever, just one more reason not to queue for tPvP I guess. You guys are shooting yourselves in the foot with your insistence on YOUR way or the highway gaming.

When they eventually (if ever) release a true Capture the Flag map will that be your next target? What about 2v2 and 3v3 arenas? Doesn’t fit your meta so whine on the forums to get rid of it?

The worst part of all of this is Anet keeps caving to forum whines and it only makes the whining 10x worse than it would be if they disregarded the majority of the whines and looked at it objectively, or just didn’t cater to the demands of a few elitists because they are afraid the game will never be “e-sport” if they don’t. All this is doing is further stagnating the PvP scene for the sake of a few elitists and as long as you keep listening to them, the PvP portion of GW2 will continue to be a dying failure.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

We’ve taken Skyhammer out of the tournament rotation while we evaluate all of the feedback we’ve received over the last few days. The map may return to the rotation after we’ve made one (or more) adjustments to it.

Please bring the map back, many people do like it, just make some adjustments, like less glass floors, dodgeable cannon…

Only adjustable mechanic should be dodgeable cannon and even that is a stretch. Having the cannon undodgeable makes it more important on this map than the secondary objectives on any other map.

jportell.2197:

Only adjustable mechanic should be dodgeable cannon and even that is a stretch. Having the cannon undodgeable makes it more important on this map than the secondary objectives on any other map.

I agree. If any changes are made it should only be making the cannon able to be dodged/blocked, but the cannon should probably have a shorter charge up time if that is the case.

uberkingkong.8041:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

We’ve taken Skyhammer out of the tournament rotation while we evaluate all of the feedback we’ve received over the last few days. The map may return to the rotation after we’ve made one (or more) adjustments to it.

i’ll be eagerly awaiting its return, i hope the changes aren’t too drastic

i don’t think anyone thinks the map is currently perfect. it does need tweaks and adjustments. the problem is that half the community is “yeah, just a detail here and there, a mechanical change to this, some number adjustments and voila”, and the other half is “GET IT OUT OF HERE IT SHAMES THE REPUTATION OF GUILD WARS 2 AS A GAME OH GOD WHY DOES IT EXIST”

Some people are perfectly happy the way it is.

You remind me of that poll. The choices were like “can be tpvp if changed a little bit” “can never be tpvp”, theres no options “perfectly happy the way it is”

well it isn’t perfectly fine. an example of a small tweak would be making the cannon dodgeable. no change to numbers, speed, size, anything. just allow people to protect themselves against the cannon, just like they do with, for example, trebs in kyhlo.

i’m not saying “remove the shattered glasses and block off the fall points”, i’m talking really small tweaks.

jportell.2197:

Only adjustable mechanic should be dodgeable cannon and even that is a stretch. Having the cannon undodgeable makes it more important on this map than the secondary objectives on any other map.

the cannon doesn’t lose importance by being dodgeable. sure you didn’t knock the guy down and shaved off 10k health from him, but you still made him burn a dodge that, hopefully, someone from your team can take advantage of.

it’s just that, to the guy down there fighting on the nodes, it’s beyond their control (read: no amount of skill can help them) to avoid the cannon fire without completely abandoning the objective.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

We’ve taken Skyhammer out of the tournament rotation while we evaluate all of the feedback we’ve received over the last few days. The map may return to the rotation after we’ve made one (or more) adjustments to it.

I’m glad you’ve done the right thing and removed it from competitive play until the imbalance in usefulness of the various classes on it is addressed (right now Guardians, Engis, and Necros are king on the map). I think the following changes would make the map much more balanced and reduce the influence of pulls and pushes while not completely eliminating their usefulness:

• Make the cannon dodgeable
• Reduce or eliminate the glass panels in the cannon room (maybe just remove the first 2)
• Make the door to the cannon room not visible from the cannon room (perhaps by some sort of ceiling above that area) so that the cannon operator has less of an advantage (right now he can setup a knockback effect to go off right as the attacker enters the room)
• Move back or reduce the number of glass panels near A and C (right now it is too easy for instant pushbacks like the Guardian Shield 5 or Engineer Shield 4 to kill someone in a team fight)

Not much needs to change tbh.

Laiboch.4380:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

We’ve taken Skyhammer out of the tournament rotation while we evaluate all of the feedback we’ve received over the last few days. The map may return to the rotation after we’ve made one (or more) adjustments to it.

I will say this.

Removing a map because a group of players are all running the single most powerful build their class has is sad. If anything adding maps where people cannot just run OP build 1 or 2 is a very good thing for PVP. It promotes players actually having to diversify a bit.

As soon as I target a player in any tournament I am in I can tell by the class Icon almost exactly what they are going to be bringing to the fight, and that is not how it should be. If I see a Guardian coming at me I know its going to be one of 2 basic builds and the weapons they have on usually give that away before they even attack. Same with almost any other class, and that is boring.

There are so many issues with Class balance I couldn’t even begin to get into it all, but giving in to a group of OP meta only players that demand people in their groups run cookiecutter class builds because they are “the best” is a very bad idea.

I know Why Necro’s are mad about Skyhammer. Their OP FOTM build can get aced by a smart player with a knock back so they can’t just run in and LOLspam conditions and win.

Players have to use utility skills with stability in them or they can get knocked off an edge to their doom, and that breaks up their Pavlovian attacks, but the worst part of it is Rangers that are not playing BM can actually win on this map. Not because of some new super secret build, but because of the difference in levels and more room to actually be able to use their weapons to a real advantage for a change.

If there is this much QQ about a single map because people might actually have to improvise and think their way through a fight. What will happen if Anet actually brings in real class balance where there is no FOTM ROFLstomp class/build?

I can honestly say that I had more fun running Skyhammer tournaments the other night than I have had in months on the other maps. My whole team was so busy laughing and having fun that we totally forgot about the score many times and were just playing to have fun. Heaven forbid people have fun playing instead of nerd raging over someone that has the wrong master trait in their tournament team.

^ This. We had such a blast on this map when it was in rotation. Sure, had to change up some of the builds we used (most of us aren’t using meta anyways), but it was challenging and fresh. Why take it out? Oh no, some people will have to adjust, start passing out the cheese.

Skyhammer took more skill, you had to pay attention, you had to use your utilities, the team couldn’t just zerg/condi spam/zerg/condispam all over the place and actually had to do some thinking. Really? The only thing you could change would be making the laser something you can dodge. Anything else, and really the map would just be boring like the rest of them are now.

Some of us understand you can’t make everyone happy no matter what you do..but giving into the whining just makes it worse. A lot of us hope the map returns to the tpvp rotation with minimal changes.

BrunoBRS.5178:

i play exclusively a thief on sPvP/tPvP, and i love skyhammer.

you don’t need the same amount of CC and counter CC. you just need different tactics.

thief, for example, can pull every 20 seconds (less if traited), has a wide array of immobilizes and CC traps, and most importantly, you can stealth, and you can use stealth for something other than running away and backstab (shocking i know). and that’s not even counting all the emergency GTFO buttons (aka shadowsteps) and easy access to infinite dodges.

In other words, it’s a thief’s wet dream map. Old news.

They should keep the map skyhammer in, it is a great concept idea=)

Really the problem with the map is there is no combat whatsoever. It is just who can pull the other guy off the cliff first. That is fine, but personally I prefer combat and pvp when I try to play pvp. Not some mini game.

Regardless of whether it will be removed, it was still extremely unprofessional to introduce a concept like that on a tournament level instead of allowing it to be seen via scrimmages by other teams and receive feedback.

Authority.6145:

Regardless of whether it will be removed, it was still extremely unprofessional to introduce a concept like that on a tournament level instead of allowing it to be seen via scrimmages by other teams and receive feedback.

There are no tournaments.

They should’ve kept the map in Rated Matches. It’s fun, different, requires bigger diversity of builds. But I guess “top” players complained because they couldn’t use their standard overpower builds and faceroll all the newbies.

Ion cannon wtf…reminds me something like starcraft2/red alert in first person…and…thanks but…no..

KarlaGrey.5903:

BrunoBRS.5178:

i play exclusively a thief on sPvP/tPvP, and i love skyhammer.

you don’t need the same amount of CC and counter CC. you just need different tactics.

thief, for example, can pull every 20 seconds (less if traited), has a wide array of immobilizes and CC traps, and most importantly, you can stealth, and you can use stealth for something other than running away and backstab (shocking i know). and that’s not even counting all the emergency GTFO buttons (aka shadowsteps) and easy access to infinite dodges.

In other words, it’s a thief’s wet dream map. Old news.

your first post you whine because you think thieves will suck on a map you have yet to play. i point out that no, thieves are very much viable and your reaction is do a 180 and say thieves are OP on the map and everyone knows it (despite every whiner claiming it’s necros, guards and engies the only ones that are viable on the map).

make up your mind, or better yet, play the freaking map.

You know, we (joO) scrimmed Absolute Legends on sky hammer. I have to say it when people aren’t running builds that abuse this map, it was incredibly fun. I’ve played it in random tourney queue’s and it’s just annoying facing 4 engi, 1 gaurd teams.

Skyhammer has to stay. It’s fun and most importantly it’s fun to watch as a spectator. To me seeing people fall to death is much more entertaining than players spamming hundreds of skilleffects on a node. Success is so close to failure by breaking through the glass, I like it.
A competitive game doesn’t have to be excessively complex and demanding, it has to be entertaining.

What? They took it out?

Tsk.

Come on. Thieves can mindlessly spam #2 and get anything done like that (seriously, that’s the only thing I’ve seen doing the last 50 thieves in the last 30 tournament matches I’ve seen. Nothing else, just spam #2, all the time, they should get some recharges in their skills when they hit. Let them keep the instant recharge when their skills do not hit, like when they blocked, or fail or miss, kind of GW1’s dagger chains, but put some short recharges in there to stop the mindless spam, by Balthazar’s fiery beard).

While those who rely much more on skills combinations on certain orders, timing, positioning , interruptions and other CCs had a place to shine and what happened?

Didn’t condition spam work there, uh? Mashing buttons of a ranged weapon at random while running around like a headless chicken has to work all the time on every map? Or just running together from point to point like in GW1’s AB most boring matches?

Let’s hope they bring it back sooner rather than later. It’s the map in which less cowards I’ve seen, and in which I had more fun even when losing. Even in that moment when you use a forward-moving push like Kick and miscalculate the distance and end up falling off a ledge with your enemy, and it feels so slow even though it’s so fast that you feel like Willy Coyote, frozen there for a second before falling — even then &mdakitten’s a lot of fun.

Maybe better warning on the disappearing tiles and a bit more time until they disappear, a few hand railings here and there you can take out using some switch, but I would not make too many drastic changes to it.

Oh so I’m not the only one who hates this map.

Skyhammer is very fun, but a map where CC is everything doesn’t belong in tournaments.

cymerdown.4103:

I’m glad you’ve done the right thing and removed it from competitive play until the imbalance in usefulness of the various classes on it is addressed (right now Guardians, Engis, and Necros are king on the map). I think the following changes would make the map much more balanced and reduce the influence of pulls and pushes while not completely eliminating their usefulness:

• Make the cannon dodgeable
• Reduce or eliminate the glass panels in the cannon room (maybe just remove the first 2)
• Make the door to the cannon room not visible from the cannon room (perhaps by some sort of ceiling above that area) so that the cannon operator has less of an advantage (right now he can setup a knockback effect to go off right as the attacker enters the room)
• Move back or reduce the number of glass panels near A and C (right now it is too easy for instant pushbacks like the Guardian Shield 5 or Engineer Shield 4 to kill someone in a team fight)

• Instead of dodge able I propose that it damages both teams equally, this would demand a smarter use of it, and tanks could contest a point be eating their own teams cannons while it chases of a lower HP person (or immob them to eat it as well).
• Make the portal be a “run into” type thing, removed the first two glass floors and allow people to be punted back through the portal. (Punish people but not overly so for knockbacks)
• Instead of a roof, move the camera angle back towards the door (this gives more visability behind allowing you to break off the cannon when someone enters easily), but at the same time would blind you to the center combat area.
• I would personally like the glass around A+C to actually drop you down a level instead of dropping you to your doom. I don’t mind being decap’d by a good knockback/pull, but being killed (ie out of comission for 30s ish) is too much punishment.

I like how the map is without any changes being suggested. That’s just me though liking tougher situation which gives me more awareness, knowing your surroundings than being relax and have nothing to fear. So I hope it returns to the Tpvp rotation soon.

Taym.8326:

• Instead of dodge able I propose that it damages both teams equally, this would demand a smarter use of it, and tanks could contest a point be eating their own teams cannons while it chases of a lower HP person (or immob them to eat it as well).

that will only discourage using it in any practical way (the point of siege is to apply pressure so someone down there can take a point for you, not to kill random strays), and encourage trolls to aim at their own team under the guise of “i didn’t know, really”.