Guild Wars 2

I would love if someone would explain to me why downed state is good for the game.

It makes it (nigh) impossible to 1vX anyone because while you’re dicking around trying to down someone, the other player(s) can just wail on you. I’ve seen players 1vX and get more than 1 person’s HP to 0, but get 0 kills because they can’t down anyone.

I myself have won a fight because I died first in a very close fight- then got an easy down state kill for a res and stomped the other player. I felt dirty. Taking a win which clearly shouldn’t have been mine.

It just seems like a delaying tactic to draw out fights in a game which already suffers from drawn out fights.

The only argument I’ve read for it is that it helps defend against burst. I don’t understand this. If a player bursts someone down, why does he not deserve the kill? If a thief bursts in a group of 3 players, he sacrificed himself for that kill. Why can’t he just have it?

Someone with more insight than me please tell me why this isn’t a dumb mechanic. I haven’t had the opportunity yet to play tournies, is this mechanic important somehow in comp play?

I feel like you don’t have any of the required experience to be asking this kind of question yet.

I’m sorry if this sounds rude, but what I read out of your post was:

“I don’t understand why people have a chance to defend themselves against insta-gib burst. I mean, I understand that noobs people like to suicide for a kill 1v3, but then shouldn’t they get the kill?”

The answer to that question is, yes, they should. That’s why they need to have the skill associated with instagibbing. Say a thief runs into a 1v3, they have plenty of stealth skills to be able to stealth-down someone. You might argue that the downed person has a down-defense skill to interrupt, but the thief also has a lot of stealth skills which negate the target-required ones.

Additionally, having a “finish him” allows players to actually res mid-battle and not just be useless once insta-gibbed. This accommodates more team-oriented play instead of just “oh, I died, okay, I’ll be back in 20 seconds guys!”

At first I loved the downed mechanic, because as an elementalist I could build for stomping and ressing, which can be pretty fun. Go X/focus with full cantrips and you’ll have enough invulnerability, projectile management, and stability to stomp any class – don’t forget teleport for thieves!

But, after playing tons of pick-up games i hardly even mist away after getting downed, except in rare occasions when the team fight is close or I know someone likes ressing. On average just dying gets me back into the action faster.

It’s obviously more interesting in voice com coordinated 5v5’s, but, even there, mass res skills are starting to seem gimmicky.

The thing is, when I see people down on both teams, I’ll go for the finish instead of the res. Why? Finishing is faster than full-ressing and it also revives.

Issue with downed states usually is the understandings. Several things making it rather hard to understand :
- skills to ’ revive ’ target from down state
- target dead = you get up : sometimes it’s obvious, but some other times you get up because someone 30 meters away died
- some abuses/bugs , especially with the 3rd skill from warriors when on down states. I know there’s a trait but i had several times that skill disappear when i killed a target, although i didn’t have the associated trait. On the other hand, sometimes you’re 1v2, you down the warrior , he goes invincible hits you once and goes away. If the 2nd player kills me, he will lose the invincible, which isn’t really fair…

Abazigal.3679:

Issue with downed states usually is the understandings. Several things making it rather hard to understand :
- skills to ’ revive ’ target from down state
- target dead = you get up : sometimes it’s obvious, but some other times you get up because someone 30 meters away died
- some abuses/bugs , especially with the 3rd skill from warriors when on down states. I know there’s a trait but i had several times that skill disappear when i killed a target, although i didn’t have the associated trait. On the other hand, sometimes you’re 1v2, you down the warrior , he goes invincible hits you once and goes away. If the 2nd player kills me, he will lose the invincible, which isn’t really fair…

its not a bug. you have 33% chance to get rid of vengeance debuff without a trait. trait gives you 100%.

Esplen.3940:

I’m sorry if this sounds rude, but what I read out of your post was:

“I don’t understand why people have a chance to defend themselves against insta-gib burst. I mean, I understand that noobs people like to suicide for a kill 1v3, but then shouldn’t they get the kill?”

The answer to that question is, yes, they should. That’s why they need to have the skill associated with instagibbing. Say a thief runs into a 1v3, they have plenty of stealth skills to be able to stealth-down someone. You might argue that the downed person has a down-defense skill to interrupt, but the thief also has a lot of stealth skills which negate the target-required ones.

Additionally, having a “finish him” allows players to actually res mid-battle and not just be useless once insta-gibbed. This accommodates more team-oriented play instead of just “oh, I died, okay, I’ll be back in 20 seconds guys!”

I would be fine if you could still hard res after down. That way the other player still gets credit for the kill.

I love downed state in WvW and PvE. It’s only sPvP that I dislike it in.

Abazigal.3679:

Issue with downed states usually is the understandings. Several things making it rather hard to understand :
- skills to ’ revive ’ target from down state
- target dead = you get up : sometimes it’s obvious, but some other times you get up because someone 30 meters away died
- some abuses/bugs , especially with the 3rd skill from warriors when on down states. I know there’s a trait but i had several times that skill disappear when i killed a target, although i didn’t have the associated trait. On the other hand, sometimes you’re 1v2, you down the warrior , he goes invincible hits you once and goes away. If the 2nd player kills me, he will lose the invincible, which isn’t really fair…

I understand these things. But I don’t see what they add to the game.

Also the ‘target dead = you get up’ seems to reward the person who died first (since they get 1/2 health at res).

Hokay dokay friend, I will explain why we NEED downed state in PVP

Anet do not know how to balance a game, and thus some classes murder others with little or no chance of avoiding it.

THUS, downed state is a crap fix for a problem that should have been sorted in beta.

Sorry, I said beta, I meant promotional demo in order to drag up attention and soften the blow when bugs and balance issues havent been resolved almost a year after public release. My bad……

What bothers me about downed states is how OP stealth finishing is.

Every class has a downed interrupt for a reason, I don’t understand why they made thieves immune to this interrupt. Didn’t they realize stealthed players can’t be targetted?

Turin.1024:

What bothers me about downed states is how OP stealth finishing is.

Every class has a downed interrupt for a reason, I don’t understand why they made thieves immune to this interrupt. Didn’t they realize stealthed players can’t be targetted?

In all fairness though, stability cannot be stopped either. Lots of classes have that. Few have stealth as well (engie elixer toolbelt has it, albeit a little random.)

i can 1v2 quite well

only on my mesmer

DaliIndica.9041:

Anet do not know how to balance a game, and thus some classes murder others with little or no chance of avoiding it.

THUS, downed state is a crap fix for a problem that should have been sorted in beta.

well if it’s 1v1 they’ll still get the kill.

If it’s 1vX, they deserved it, and I’m okay with letting the X still hard res after anyway.

If it’s XvX I don’t see what it possibly adds to the game other than making someone stop and blow a cd to stability stomp, or sacrifice 1/2 their HP to stomp while the rest of the team focuses the stomper down.

No down state + hard res means the player would still get credit for the kill they deserved. I would also be fine with keeping signet res.

Keep in mind that if someone bursts a player down 1v3, he should be killed as well = no gain on the scoreboard.

Turin.1024:

Every class has a downed interrupt for a reason

What is the reason?

DaliIndica.9041:

Turin.1024:

What bothers me about downed states is how OP stealth finishing is.

Every class has a downed interrupt for a reason, I don’t understand why they made thieves immune to this interrupt. Didn’t they realize stealthed players can’t be targetted?

In all fairness though, stability cannot be stopped either. Lots of classes have that. Few have stealth as well (engie elixer toolbelt has it, albeit a little random.)

stealth is still subjected to AoE knockbacks. Stability is a boon, which can be stripped… So it’s not unstoppable. Stability also takes up a utility slot, essentially gimping dmg/healing/defense, especially when it is saved for stomps.

Down system- a badly designed mechanic that was mainly designed for pve.

Hope that helps. Most of us have asked for this to be removed in Spvp since day one…not gonna happen, so we mostly just stopped asking.