Guild Wars 2

For teams using multiple of the same class, will there be two different models so you can tell them apart more easily? I’d hate to fight two mesmers that all look exactly alike by default. Or have two guardians that look the same, one bunker one OMG WTF Burst. If not, I think it would be a really good idea for the future of this, possibly in a later feature pack.

There is no way of telling that right now besides what weapons they are using… Isn’t that enough?

It would be great if we didn’t see the exact same models in case of class stacking on the same team. I’d reckon it would be confusing to both players and viewers otherwise. A simple face, hair variation and maybe just one different armor piece would suffice.

Branden Gee.2150:

At this time it is one model per profession, per gender, per team. I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build. Though I’m not sure what that would look like without adding clutter to the screen.

A simple-ish idea would be to tie the power/condi/… sort of indication to a colour scheme. If the standard weapons were like ascended-skins, it could server as a really cool indicator for example, but just a simple dye variation could do an ample job.

Eurantien.4632:

There is no way of telling that right now besides what weapons they are using… Isn’t that enough?

Yeah there aren’t many builds that run with similar weapons, so in (most) cases what they’re holding – which will be easily identifiable, with standard models – should give you a basic idea of their build.

The Mesmer problem still exists, though – two completely identical players spamming clones everywere? It’s bad enough that their icons can completely obscure the action on the map – it’d be really nice to have tinted hues for ally and foe icons, and foe armours, if there are duplicates on the team.

Or there could be 5 variations of each model, that only change the chest or leg armor, and leave the rest the same.

Maybe in colors. Keep the main color the team’s colors, then then other 1-3 colors-

This would increase the amount of models to take care of, though.

Branden Gee.2150:

I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build.

DO NOT do that, please! It would be gamebreaking! Think about it: the game has just begun, people head to mid, they see 2 enemy guards coming over, they know that one of them is PROBABLY dps and the other one is PROBABLY bunker, but they have to wait those 2-3 seconds to decide which will be the target.

Doing what you say would completely eliminate those “2-3 seconds”.

It’s ok to dinstinguish 2 guardians (for example) from the enemy team, it is NOT ok to dinstinguish them by build. The variation should just be used to distinguish one guardian from the other NOT to dinstinguish from one guardian’s build to the other.

Branden Gee.2150:

At this time it is one model per profession, per gender, per team. I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build. Though I’m not sure what that would look like without adding clutter to the screen.

So if I got this right, if one team has a male warrior and a female warrior, there will be two different models, but if there are two male warriors, there will be only one model that both utilize?

And does this mean that if there are two male warriors on separate teams, they will share the same model?

Overall, I love this change. There’s of course room to grow, but I still seriously can’t wait for September. Thanks for the response.

I think the optimal version of this feature would be this:

1. Each gender and profession has 5 distinct models.
2. When a class enters, it takes the first model out of the 5 available. Each subsequent copy of that class takes the next model. If there are 5 male warriors, there will be five distinct male warrior models.

This of course requires a TON of models (8 profs * 2 genders * 5 models), but if there is an elegant way to create variance or just use some existing models to fill in the gaps, it’d be great. The face really doesn’t matter too much. All that really matters is the armor shape and style. The same face could probably be used for every single class for all PvPers care. I never get a good look at a face until I do /sit with a team that’s already given up

I’d also like to echo the above, I don’t think you should be able to know what kind of amulet the enemy is running just by the armor they have on.

Eurantien.4632:

There is no way of telling that right now besides what weapons they are using… Isn’t that enough?

Except most players don’t coordinate their looks, so even if the first time you are slightly unsure, from that point on you can fairly easily visually tell which one is which build. Not that its a huge deal with weapons almost always being different, but it is something to consider.

Branden Gee.2150:

At this time it is one model per profession, per gender, per team. I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build. Though I’m not sure what that would look like without adding clutter to the screen.

Archtype Icon attached to Class icon that already exists on target frame.

Examples: Square for Bunker, ^ for Power DPS, > for Condi DPS, etc. Not very good examples, but it should give you the idea.

Same symbol could also exist next to name above head.

Frenk.5917:

Branden Gee.2150:

I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build.

DO NOT do that, please! It would be gamebreaking! Think about it: the game has just begun, people head to mid, they see 2 enemy guards coming over, they know that one of them is PROBABLY dps and the other one is PROBABLY bunker, but they have to wait those 2-3 seconds to decide which will be the target.

Doing what you say would completely eliminate those “2-3 seconds”.

It’s ok to dinstinguish 2 guardians (for example) from the enemy team, it is NOT ok to dinstinguish them by build. The variation should just be used to distinguish one guardian from the other NOT to dinstinguish from one guardian’s build to the other.

2-3 seconds of a 15 minute match is now gamebreaking?

I’m having a hard time understanding why Anet decided to make this TA and CA exclusive? A feature I was waiting for basically from release, yet now (again) Anet decides to do it in their own strange fashion where things don’t make sense.

Why not let every player decide if they want to use that or not, just like team colors, condition indicators, etc.?!

Hello,

Branden Gee.2150:

At this time it is one model per profession, per gender, per team. I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build. Though I’m not sure what that would look like without adding clutter to the screen.

I do no think that this is the right approach:

• Fighting a player comes first with analyzing his build. Disclosing his base stats right away removes some of this analysis part, and reduces the effect of surprise that some sneakily inject into their builds. I do not know if that guardian is a DPS one? Well, it’s my job to find out, and make sure to not die in the process.
• What if two players of the same team share the same build, yet play it with a different level of skill? You want to avoid Irving, who is an insanely strong Hambow, but are eager to face Washington, who simply auto-attacks with the bow.

What matters is the ability to recognize the opponent, and that could be done by having each of the 5 players have some kind of unique setup, for instance armor skin and/or color, hair style and/or color…

Regards.

Shockwave.1230:

2-3 seconds of a 15 minute match is now gamebreaking?

How about if you’re holding mid, and you get an unexpected burst in your face because you expected bunker? Let’s say someone’s running dps Guard with a Staff, so they look like their team’s bunker when between points but pull a surprise medi+GS burst out of their bum when they get close?
Boom! Lost control of important capture point, when you saw a foe you should’ve recognised from earlier encounter in the match. Now their actual bunker can come in and hold it.

There’ll always be player names I guess, but I still feel that for identical classes we need something unique on each character. Armour shade was my first thought, but different armour pieces could work too. Hm.

Definitely not tied to ‘build’ though (be this traits, amulet, weapons). Just…. no.

Shockwave.1230:

Frenk.5917:

Branden Gee.2150:

I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build.

DO NOT do that, please! It would be gamebreaking! Think about it: the game has just begun, people head to mid, they see 2 enemy guards coming over, they know that one of them is PROBABLY dps and the other one is PROBABLY bunker, but they have to wait those 2-3 seconds to decide which will be the target.

Doing what you say would completely eliminate those “2-3 seconds”.

It’s ok to dinstinguish 2 guardians (for example) from the enemy team, it is NOT ok to dinstinguish them by build. The variation should just be used to distinguish one guardian from the other NOT to dinstinguish from one guardian’s build to the other.

2-3 seconds of a 15 minute match is now gamebreaking?

I’d say even 1 second delay is gamebreaking. The average human reaction is 0.3 seconds, what do you think would happen if a DPS guardian and a bunker guardian who look completely the same come to mid?
Your team sure will target the DPS guardian but wait! Which one of them is the DPS? Which one the bunker? In the meanwhile, the DPS guardian could have done the standard teleport+whirling wrath combo, maybe even killing one guy on your side.

Now what if they look different? Let’s say there a set rule that identify the build (and it’s not randomic): enemy team bunker guardian is red, enemy team DPS guardian is yellow. Midgifht begins, there are 2 guardians coming towards you but hey! Let’s target the yellow one immediatly, he is surely DPS.

See what this could cause?

Yeah, somehow color-coding enemy players by build could remove a lot of the strategy surrounding uncertainty until combat is joined.

But that said, the OP did raise a valid potential issue where you have two (or more) Mesmers using the same weapons and you’re unable to tell the difference between them due to Standard Models. (You could of course just turn it off, but that kind of defeats the purpose of Standard Models.)

Zaxares.5419:

(You could of course just turn it off, but that kind of defeats the purpose of Standard Models.)

Aye, then you’re just fighting two identical tiny Asuran or hueg Norn Mesmers!

(this actually doesn’t happen that often… but I still occasionally run into premades consisting of lll l ll llll l l and their friend ll l l lll l iI llll)

Frenk.5917:

Shockwave.1230:

Frenk.5917:

Branden Gee.2150:

I do like the idea of doing some sort of ‘profession archetype’, or a way to visually see if they are a power/toughness/condi/ect spec build.

DO NOT do that, please! It would be gamebreaking! Think about it: the game has just begun, people head to mid, they see 2 enemy guards coming over, they know that one of them is PROBABLY dps and the other one is PROBABLY bunker, but they have to wait those 2-3 seconds to decide which will be the target.

Doing what you say would completely eliminate those “2-3 seconds”.

It’s ok to dinstinguish 2 guardians (for example) from the enemy team, it is NOT ok to dinstinguish them by build. The variation should just be used to distinguish one guardian from the other NOT to dinstinguish from one guardian’s build to the other.

2-3 seconds of a 15 minute match is now gamebreaking?

I’d say even 1 second delay is gamebreaking. The average human reaction is 0.3 seconds, what do you think would happen if a DPS guardian and a bunker guardian who look completely the same come to mid?
Your team sure will target the DPS guardian but wait! Which one of them is the DPS? Which one the bunker? In the meanwhile, the DPS guardian could have done the standard teleport+whirling wrath combo, maybe even killing one guy on your side.

Now what if they look different? Let’s say there a set rule that identify the build (and it’s not randomic): enemy team bunker guardian is red, enemy team DPS guardian is yellow. Midgifht begins, there are 2 guardians coming towards you but hey! Let’s target the yellow one immediatly, he is surely DPS.

See what this could cause?

Seems like two sides of the same coin and both sides think it’s game breaking.

“You can’t visually tell what build is a dps! Game broken! "

“You can visually tell I’m a dps! Game broken!”

It really doesn’t matter either way, it just changes the openings of the initial engagement and after that there’s no difference. Nothing is actually broken either way.

Shockwave.1230:

Seems like two sides of the same coin and both sides think it’s game breaking.

“You can’t visually tell what build is a dps! Game broken! "

“You can visually tell I’m a dps! Game broken!”

It really doesn’t matter either way, it just changes the openings of the initial engagement and after that there’s no difference. Nothing is actually broken either way.

I’m trying to not be harsh, now but, a part from “it just changes the initial engagement” (“just”? Really?), I have to think you didn’t read my first post at all.
I am against a set rule that dinstinguish in the same way, every time, DPS and Bunkers. Let’s say that EVERY time you play a match the DPS is the yellow and the bunker is the red, you learn immediatly which build is that player playing.

Instead, I wouldn’t mind if that system was random: one time the DPS is the yellow one and the bunker the red one, and another time it’s the other way around. So this would not distinguish between BUILDS but only between PLAYERS.

Something I thought of to fix the “which warrior is it this time?” question, is numbering each character 1-5 or so. At the beginning of the game, you might not know if #2 or #3 is the dps, but later in the match, you could remember it is indeed #3.

This way works similar to how it does now. You don’t know which char has which build until you see them in action, but throughout the rest of the game, you’ll be able to remember visually.

The (stylized) numbers could either replace guild symbols, or be placed somewhere else in addition to guild symbols, making things easy and relatively keeping aesthetic.