Guild Wars 2

In the MMORPG Rift they had one of the better short term battlegrounds I’ve played to date called ‘The Black Garden’.

For those not familiar with Rift, it is basically a one flag capture and hold but that flag has a DOT attached with it. The longer you hold the flag the harder the DOT hits. Thus requiring you to kite and heal the person as long as you can while the other team is trying to kill said person and pick up the flag.

Without a healing mechanism, it would make the most sense to have to “hot potato” the flag amongst your team while in the heat of battle (like the dungeon where you have to pass the orb back and forth to light the lantern). This could also add depth as the enemy team could intercept the flag (i.e. a cloaked thief could try to secretly nab it, or another class could step in front of a long ranged pass).

This would work in either a 5 v 5 or 8 v 8 setting without things becoming to chaotic.

Link to gameplay video (in Rift): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S77RjytB0XA

Thoughts?

Ugh, I really didn’t like this map in RIFT.
Turned into a zerg, tanks with gear ruled over everyone else.

Might work better in GW2 though.

It’s an interesting idea but I’d rather the game be about combat and not about how well we can pass the potato or how good we are at intercepting the potato. Having non-player elements like Trebuchet are an interesting addition to a game but the game is not centered around it. Making a game centered around something like that may cause issues.

Untouch.2541:

Ugh, I really didn’t like this map in RIFT.
Turned into a zerg, tanks with gear ruled over everyone else.

Might work better in GW2 though.

Also this is true. If it were a capture the flag thing and not a pass the potato thing, it wouldn’t work here. Zerg the flag carrier and make sure the flag carrier is a heal spec cleric. Or, rather, a Guardian.

I never understood the hate for Black Garden, it’s the warfront I liked the most. :P
It would be fun to see something like that in here. Anything to add more variety to the Control Points mechanic, really.

As someone who played a LOT of Rift PvP, I’d definitely say ‘no’ to Black Garden, or any map that’s based upon a single node / choke point / mcguffin.
Black Garden matches lasted about 8 minutes long. The match was decided in the first 20 seconds: whoever won the first zerg to hold the McGuffin.

Even the Rift developers realized this was a bad map design. This is why their subsequent PvP maps, Library of the Runemasters and Black Garden: Stockpile, created many different objectives to hold.

Library of the Runemasters could be interesting for GW2:
– points are accrued by holding an item by a character
– the more items held, the more points accrued
– holding the item damages players / makes them susceptible to more damage
– self-damage is amplified the closer item holders are to one another
– when a player is killed, the item respawns in set locations

It creates an interesting gameplay: there will be dynamic control points (the players hold the items) and static control points (the respawn locations for the items). This creates various roles (carriers, zone defenders and damage dealers/roamers).

Naturally Anet would have to make some substantial changes to accommodate the gameplay in GW2.

Thedenofsin.7340:

As someone who played a LOT of Rift PvP, I’d definitely say ‘no’ to Black Garden, or any map that’s based upon a single node / choke point / mcguffin.

Even the Rift developers realized this was a bad map design. This is why their subsequent PvP maps, Library of the Runemasters and Black Garden: Stockpile, created many different objectives to hold.

Library of the Runemasters could be interesting for GW2:
– points are accrued by holding an item by a character
– the more items held, the more points accrued
– holding the item damages players / makes them susceptible to more damage
– self-damage is amplified the closer item holders are to one another
– when a player is killed, the item respawns in set locations

It creates an interesting gameplay: there will be dynamic control points (the players hold the items) and static control points (the respawn locations for the items). This creates various roles (carriers, zone defenders and damage dealers/roamers).

Naturally Anet would have to make some substantial changes to accommodate the gameplay in GW2.

The idea in general is good but without a dedicated healing/tank class I don’t know that ongoing damage from holding the flag/item would really fit into GW2’s combat system. They’d have to do that another way.

Thedenofsin.7340:

As someone who played a LOT of Rift PvP, I’d definitely say ‘no’ to Black Garden, or any map that’s based upon a single node / choke point / mcguffin.
Black Garden matches lasted about 8 minutes long. The match was decided in the first 20 seconds: whoever won the first zerg to hold the McGuffin.

Even the Rift developers realized this was a bad map design. This is why their subsequent PvP maps, Library of the Runemasters and Black Garden: Stockpile, created many different objectives to hold.

Library of the Runemasters could be interesting for GW2:
– points are accrued by holding an item by a character
– the more items held, the more points accrued
– holding the item damages players / makes them susceptible to more damage
– self-damage is amplified the closer item holders are to one another
– when a player is killed, the item respawns in set locations

It creates an interesting gameplay: there will be dynamic control points (the players hold the items) and static control points (the respawn locations for the items). This creates various roles (carriers, zone defenders and damage dealers/roamers).

Naturally Anet would have to make some substantial changes to accommodate the gameplay in GW2.

Right because the damage that 2 thieves, 1 thief/1 war, or 2 wars, can just come up and faceroll you to death with already isn’t bad enough. Yes there are escape mechanisms, but there is not enough escape mechanisms for you to be able to break the cc that 2 of either one of those classes, or one of them both put out on you, unless your a guardian and just throw them on their face and let them kill themselves with retaliation.

Sjach Darasv.3729:

Right because the damage that 2 thieves, 1 thief/1 war, or 2 wars, can just come up and faceroll you to death with already isn’t bad enough. Yes there are escape mechanisms, but there is not enough escape mechanisms for you to be able to break the cc that 2 of either one of those classes, or one of them both put out on you, unless your a guardian and just throw them on their face and let them kill themselves with retaliation.

You should think a little more before you type. I stated Anet would need to make some substantial changes for this type of play to be viable. Did it occur to you that perhaps one of them would be to change the damage mechanics from holding the item?

Thedenofsin.7340:

You should think a little more before you type. I stated Anet would need to make some substantial changes for this type of play to be viable. Did it occur to you that perhaps one of them would be to change the damage mechanics from holding the item?

I did think before I typed. You should have thought before you put in there that holding an item does damage/ makes you take increased damage as it is. If you have played sPvP you know it is just a giant zergfest and unless you give the items to a thief, mesmer, or guardian, that player will just be bursted down within 2 seconds of having the item because of all the sPvPers and the ever popular cookie cutter build. Also theres the whole, I’m not getting enough glory farm this teams sucks later, with no penalty except to players on the winning team that get swapped to the losing team. Would be an enourmous slap to the face if you were the one holding the item for most of the game and get slapped with autobalance for a forced loss that you gave to yourself. I think the point system needs to be reworked to make people want to play for the win instead of, play for the glory farm before they start putting in other modes of gameplay.

I think they changed <<The Black Garden>> from a single flag/fragments to multifragments
U can equip up to 3 frag , but u get a slow movement debuff for each of them , delivering to ur base for points (it was a more wiser-smart decision from the Rift Devs) .

I want too , an other pvp version , but i have to think over it to avoid another nerdorgasmwhinning at the forums .

An stupid idea is : combine CTF mode + GW2 map/3 directions to escape + 3 flags .

Mesmers cant teleport the flag with their portal , nor Thiefs can stealth with it ( but their shortbow teleportation its will be a pain in the ash ) .

Ouside of the keep , if these 3 ppl still hold the flags , they hurt each other with a aoe debuff damage , in they are closer than 2000-2500 range
Each 1 of them will be forced a) to choose 1 of the 3 pathways , b) stay close to each other and die in the middle , or c) like a train , the first flagman with 2 extra escords will try to <<open a path>> , while they other 2 will be waiting till the path is cleared

With the 3 paths/3 flags , u will have smaller number of enemies to fights , but more fights for the observers

Edit: Drop some seconday bosses in this map