Guild Wars 2

Ok so appearantly, Cleric and celestial amulet were deemed to tanky. So I was thinking of having amulets that support a more bruiserish gameplay, but at the same time are tanky enough to not spend all of thier skills on self sustain.

So these are the following suggestions

Templar Amulet:

1050 Power
1050 Healing Power
560 toughness
560 Concentration

If the above is still to tanky

Monk’s Amulet:

1050 Power
1050 Concentration
560 toughness
560 precision

Priest’s Amulet

1050 power
1050 concentration
560 vitality
560 precision

Saint’s Amulet

1050 Precision
1050 Concentration
560 Vitality
560 Ferocity

Prophet’s Amulet

1050 Precision
1050 Concentration
560 toughness
560 Ferocity

Dwayna’s Amulet

1050 Power
1050 Concentration
560 Vitality
560 Healing Power

All amulets aside from the first and the last have none of the following combinations. Toughness and Vitality, Toughness and Healing Power. Vitality and Healing power. The last amulet is a glorified menders amulet with less healing power no precision. And it’s not like DH bunker incorperated much of protection or regenration anyways. However vitality and or toughness is still a stat I believe is needed if one needs to play support. And elementalist or support guard cannot make use of the current saints or diviners amulet without a bit of help due to thir low healthpool and mediocore armour in the guardians case. Not much use if a support class can’t even sustain it self properly against a single thief or revenant.

U can argue for mesmers to make use of said amulets due to thier high mobility, stealth, teleports and invulnerability. It also helps that u can double shatter witih continuum split and stack might. An herald could potentially make use of seekers and or diviners as well. But both classes have the active sustain to atleast not die in an 1 v 1 with a snap of one finger if u are atleast half decent and has the sustain to atleast surive a single focused group burst by either disengaging, blocks, evade etc.

However if u give said amulets even a bit of help through a single added sustain stat aka toughness, vitality or healing in combination with concentration. U will have more options for support builds. And they can still be spiked down by either power or condi bomb. Espically with Revs, Chronophantasma shatters and Macebow around. U won’t see many support classes tanking 1 v 3 indefinately this way.

Templar’s Amulet:
1050 Power
1050 Healing Power
560 toughness
560 Concentration
yeah i think they (anet) would deem this tanky because it has both toughness and healing power.

cleric 1200 healing 900 toughness
crusaders 1050 toughness 560 healing
both were removed because both have both healing and toughness
seems like having both healing and toughness is a big no no for them (anet)

having both healing and some (560) vitality seems fine though
menders 1050 healing 560 vitality
sages 560 healing 560 vitality

Monk’s Amulet:
1050 Power
1050 Concentration
560 toughness
560 precision
^ seems fine to me.

Priest’s Amulet
1050 power
1050 concentration
560 vitality
560 precision
^ a vitality variant, nice!

Saint’s Amulet
1050 Precision
1050 Concentration
560 Vitality
560 Ferocity
^ not sure what this amulet is trying to achieve. ferocity without power seems useless.

Prophet’s Amulet
1050 Precision
1050 Concentration
560 toughness
560 Ferocity
^ a toughness variant but why ?

Dwayna’s Amulet
1050 Power
1050 Concentration
560 Vitality
560 Healing Power
^ seems okay

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Templar’s Amulet:
1050 Power
1050 Healing Power
560 toughness
560 Concentration

yeah i think they (anet) would deem this tanky because it has both toughness and healing power.

cleric 1200 healing 900 toughness
crusaders 1050 toughness 560 healing
both were removed because both have both healing and toughness
seems like having both healing and toughness is a big no no for them (anet)
…

Crusader had too much toughness compare to Templar.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crusader_Amulet

+1050 Power
+1050 Toughness
+560 Ferocity
+560 Healing Power

So probably running the Templar version would be a more “balanced approach” to help certain classes to be able to do their support work.

In Gw1, Monk was squishie and support but… it was able to EVADE a lot more than Tempest or Necro.

Crusaders had cheeze build with engi (firearm), revenant (2x fury) and ranger (lot of free crits in markmanship???).

So with Ferocity, their damage was too much for the sustain they had.

Since Magi make your team losing versus 5 bruisers (and we have more than 5 bruisers on the META), without something more bruiser like “support”, it will be hard to comp with that.

I’d like to see Diviner’s changed to give toughness or vitality instead of ferocity.

+1050 Power
+560 Precision
+560 Toughness or Vitality
+1050 Concentration

Anet could at least make a 560 toughness and healing power amulet.

+1050 Power
+1050 Precision
+560 Toughness
+560 Healing Power

Maybe they could actually add a 3 stat amulet for once in their lives.

+900 Power
+900 Vitality
+1200 Healing Power

Basically that’s a power version of Magi’s.

Maybe they could be smart too and readd celestial with reduced stats. 560 of all stats was too much. How about 460? This would make the overall stats equal to a 4 stat amulet.

+450 Power
+450 Precision
+450 Toughness
+450 Vitality
+450 Condition Damage
+450 Healing Power
+450 Ferocity

And if that’s too much, there’s 425, just under a 3 stat amulet.

+425 Power
+425 Precision
+425 Toughness
+425 Vitality
+425 Condition Damage
+425 Healing Power
+425 Ferocity

Removing Celestial was not the right move. The stats should have been reduced because it was giving too good of overall stats. 4 stat amulets are doing the same thing compared to 3 stat ones. Celestial is 3920, 4 stats are 3220 (big difference!), and 3 stats are 3000. What’s the problem with adjusting 4 stats and celestial to be around 3k?

Let’s make 4 stats something like 900 and 600, or 850 and 650, and let’s make Celestial 425. The only reason Tempests didn’t run a 4 stat amulet last season was because there wasn’t one with healing and toughness together. Give back Celestial or add a 560 toughness and healing power amulet, even if it has to have precision without power.

+1050 Precision
+560 Toughness
+1050 Condition Damage
+560 Healing Power

Would 1050 healing power with 560 toughness be too OP? Probably, but I’m going to suggest it anyway. Also, what’s wrong with doing 560 power amulets? Sure it’s less power, but it beats NO power at all!

+560 Power
+1050 Precision
+560 Toughness
+1050 Healing Power

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Partly true, but even for guard (I have 5k games on it), the HP GM trait take the “shout GM trait” off the possibilities.

So a supportive Paladin like (say the Templar offering you did) amulet would help open up option for bunker shout guard too.

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Partly true, but even for guard (I have 5k games on it), the HP GM trait take the “shout GM trait” off the possibilities.

So a supportive Paladin like (say the Templar offering you did) amulet would help open up option for bunker shout guard too.

true but they have still no toughness. also the use of shouts takes place for the burst heals provided through mediations. So it’s not impossible to burst them down. I’d wouldn’t even classify them as bunkers heck both current wouldn’t be considerd bunkers imo. More durability on par with bruiserish.

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Partly true, but even for guard (I have 5k games on it), the HP GM trait take the “shout GM trait” off the possibilities.

So a supportive Paladin like (say the Templar offering you did) amulet would help open up option for bunker shout guard too.

true but they have still no toughness. also the use of shouts takes place for the burst heals provided through mediations. So it’s not impossible to burst them down. I’d wouldn’t even classify them as bunkers heck both current wouldn’t be considerd bunkers imo. More durability on par with bruiserish.

Bunker don’t need to do damage. When they do, it’s broken and they get over nerf. Removal of Cleric because Tempest was OP. Remember?

So, a bunker need to sustain damage in 1v1 without giving much in return. This sacrifies imply, he can sustain 1v2 for some time. This sacrifies means he need to support the team with proteciton, regens, cleanses, mights and rez/stomp.

Shout bunker did that great. They got obsolete by OP dd ele that could do the same and still do more damage. After dd ele, they got obsolete by bunker mesmer quickness stability stomp/rez, then by Tempest ele because of Aura’s > than guard support package.

After Tempest Nerf, Bunker Cleric Guard would had been something again. But they decide to remove all bunker support options. So now, Bruiser > Bunker. This is the same stupid 2014 bruiser META. Today it’s worse because condi cheeze build of the past, now work at high level for same skills in 1v1.

To get back bunker support on track, we need toughness + healing power. Whatever the combo is. But those numbers should be balanced around the other amulet, so it’s not OP.

This is the only way to have low damage class that can sustain 1v1 or 1v2 and bringing support to “compensate” the low damage.

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/New-to-PvP-Start-here/first#post3383589

Jourdelune.7456:

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

It is just a matter of feeling but I had the impression that they were trying to decouple bunker and healer in order to create fragile strong support-healer and resilient selfish bunker. Not saying it is a good or bad thing but this is the impression I got from the last changes.

I’m by no means a pro gamer or experienced balance developer, but I do have a couple thoughts I’d like to share.

1) I don’t think all stats are innately equal, yet we have amulets which seems to assume this relationship. For example, toughness and healing might be a bit more valuable to a player than raw vitality, yet when allocating stats to an amulet, there is a one-to-one relationship. If the relationship between toughness and healing power is too powerful compared to other stats, make those stats “cost” more in terms of allocation. I’m not sure how well I’m conveying my point, but I’m also not the coldest beer in the fridge.

2) This point, I’m sure has been made numerous times by people with brains far prettier than mine: We as a community seem to accept that amulet changes =/= game balance. I think the ele. is probably a gleaming example of a class that was pigeon-holed into a place not by amulet design, but by class design.

I’ve steered away from the topic of conversation though; toughness + healing power isn’t the problem. It’s how we allocate it. Again, I could be wrong.

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Partly true, but even for guard (I have 5k games on it), the HP GM trait take the “shout GM trait” off the possibilities.

So a supportive Paladin like (say the Templar offering you did) amulet would help open up option for bunker shout guard too.

true but they have still no toughness. also the use of shouts takes place for the burst heals provided through mediations. So it’s not impossible to burst them down. I’d wouldn’t even classify them as bunkers heck both current wouldn’t be considerd bunkers imo. More durability on par with bruiserish.

Bunker don’t need to do damage. When they do, it’s broken and they get over nerf. Removal of Cleric because Tempest was OP. Remember?

So, a bunker need to sustain damage in 1v1 without giving much in return. This sacrifies imply, he can sustain 1v2 for some time. This sacrifies means he need to support the team with proteciton, regens, cleanses, mights and rez/stomp.

Shout bunker did that great. They got obsolete by OP dd ele that could do the same and still do more damage. After dd ele, they got obsolete by bunker mesmer quickness stability stomp/rez, then by Tempest ele because of Aura’s > than guard support package.

After Tempest Nerf, Bunker Cleric Guard would had been something again. But they decide to remove all bunker support options. So now, Bruiser > Bunker. This is the same stupid 2014 bruiser META. Today it’s worse because condi cheeze build of the past, now work at high level for same skills in 1v1.

To get back bunker support on track, we need toughness + healing power. Whatever the combo is. But those numbers should be balanced around the other amulet, so it’s not OP.

This is the only way to have low damage class that can sustain 1v1 or 1v2 and bringing support to “compensate” the low damage.

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/New-to-PvP-Start-here/first#post3383589

I see. The problem is that the moment a bunker in gw2 offers support. The Support kinda makes it so that u can practically carry an team. The shout guardian did not. It definately benefitted the team. But it did not carry. To me a bunker can take on 3 guys. (Bunker DH) and offer support. But it should not carry a team. An bunker Chrono could carry, qucikness, ress. perfect stomps, and tons of boons, well of precognition etc.

Having 2 tempest and u could carry a team. A single one could be argued to be balanced. The thing with A-net is that it wants to pick up the pace of the game. Some support builds have the potential to carry a team and keep them a life. What needs to happen is either nerf support builds into oblivion. Or remove bunkers and make them bruisers.. Or u could nerf tempest dps even more but that would kill build diversity.

Maby if fire traitline was made more attractive and somehow removed the dependence on condi cleanse on shouts. or atleast make it show that each shout could give 2 stacks of might to the tempest only. in conjunction with increasing might uptime by maby 20 percent for fire traitline. U could keep menders amulet and have tempest deal damage and kinda justify it dying by focused down or a really good thief or a single revenant. Just an idea i guess.

Ennui.1597:

I’m by no means a pro gamer or experienced balance developer, but I do have a couple thoughts I’d like to share.

1) I don’t think all stats are innately equal, yet we have amulets which seems to assume this relationship. For example, toughness and healing might be a bit more valuable to a player than raw vitality, yet when allocating stats to an amulet, there is a one-to-one relationship. If the relationship between toughness and healing power is too powerful compared to other stats, make those stats “cost” more in terms of allocation. I’m not sure how well I’m conveying my point, but I’m also not the coldest beer in the fridge.

2) This point, I’m sure has been made numerous times by people with brains far prettier than mine: We as a community seem to accept that amulet changes =/= game balance. I think the ele. is probably a gleaming example of a class that was pigeon-holed into a place not by amulet design, but by class design.

I’ve steered away from the topic of conversation though; toughness + healing power isn’t the problem. It’s how we allocate it. Again, I could be wrong.

1) You either change the OP skills scaling with some attribute to balanced them properly. Like the balanced team did. (i.e. Wash the pain Away is way less OP for AOE heals, thank god!)

Or you removed the Cleric amulet and do another amulet that would be less OP.

They did both.

For Attributes allocation, like you said… well Guild Wars 2 don’t have this. All stats come from Items. So, when we level we don’t have point to allocated to the attributes system.

In an ideal world, the players should use the same itemization in all game mode (like they want to have the same balanced in all game mode), so it would be easier for all to get into it. But they need a save and load build with so many things to consider.

In destroying the bunker support archetype, Anet is destroying his player base even more. The Q3 reports show abysmal money gain. Doing like Wildstar the dead game, show something that is really bad.

But still, they continue to alienated their player base, all this because each different teams got diffrent feeling about PVP balance.

I don’t know who is the big boss but since this situation exist from released, I guess he is not aware of this bad “cognitive dissonance” into his own company.

Unfortunately, the Anet Brand for PVP is down the drain. PVP players don’t take Anet seriously anymore.

Ranael.6423:

Jourdelune.7456:

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

It is just a matter of feeling but I had the impression that they were trying to decouple bunker and healer in order to create fragile strong support-healer and resilient selfish bunker. Not saying it is a good or bad thing but this is the impression I got from the last changes.

That would be a good idea, but there is none-bunker amulet that do the work, actually.

Bunker build that work where with class that heal and have toughness. Removing those two stats, make it way harder to work.

Probably Cleric was too high stats, so in real world, you simply lower the scaling of the skills that are OP with Cleric.

But in a poor world, where they are so cheap that they don’t give an alternative to Cleric… it’s not working like they want.

So, all meta now is a bruiser build. Different amulet because each build got traits or skills with more or less surv. The meta with DPS amulet, have strong defensive skills and traits. The meta with Condi amulet, have less defensive skills and traits than that.

A bunker that don’t do damge and can’t heal himself or anyone, or cleanse himself or anyone… simply don’t exist. Nobody will make a build only to stay on a point all game.

Power : 1050
Healing power : 1050
Toughness : 560
Something: 560

This would had solved the issue. Only 1610 stats for defensive attribute, compare to the 2100 from cleric.

But anyway, the balanced team did nerf Ele heals, did nerf Ele damage (with CD). So, cleric amulet would had been balanced.

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Jourdelune.7456:

@Zintrothen

+1.

We have Vitality + Healing power to counter Conditions builds. But can’t have Toughness + Healing power to counter Power DPS build.

Why?

Cleric was strong with 900 tou and 1200 healing… then, toning it to 1050 healing and 560 toughness would work great I guess.

First stat: Power + Healing / Second stat: Toughness + whatever would be good for Support build in a power burst meta.

I think the problem becomes DH bunker. DH bunker doesn’t need the HP as it can take the honor traitline and get hp on pair with mid armour proffersion. And with 560 healing already u can heal yourself for nearl a 1 k with aegis.

even with 560 toughness guardians would have nearly 2.8 armour and 3 k with stalwart defender.

While i think DH bunker is completely fine as it deals no damage and has almost no other job then bunkering and offering a tiny bit of support. Going with A-net’s vision of fast paced combat it would not be to thier liking. then add in all the QQ and toughness and healing become a nono.

Partly true, but even for guard (I have 5k games on it), the HP GM trait take the “shout GM trait” off the possibilities.

So a supportive Paladin like (say the Templar offering you did) amulet would help open up option for bunker shout guard too.

true but they have still no toughness. also the use of shouts takes place for the burst heals provided through mediations. So it’s not impossible to burst them down. I’d wouldn’t even classify them as bunkers heck both current wouldn’t be considerd bunkers imo. More durability on par with bruiserish.

Bunker don’t need to do damage. When they do, it’s broken and they get over nerf. Removal of Cleric because Tempest was OP. Remember?

So, a bunker need to sustain damage in 1v1 without giving much in return. This sacrifies imply, he can sustain 1v2 for some time. This sacrifies means he need to support the team with proteciton, regens, cleanses, mights and rez/stomp.

Shout bunker did that great. They got obsolete by OP dd ele that could do the same and still do more damage. After dd ele, they got obsolete by bunker mesmer quickness stability stomp/rez, then by Tempest ele because of Aura’s > than guard support package.

After Tempest Nerf, Bunker Cleric Guard would had been something again. But they decide to remove all bunker support options. So now, Bruiser > Bunker. This is the same stupid 2014 bruiser META. Today it’s worse because condi cheeze build of the past, now work at high level for same skills in 1v1.

To get back bunker support on track, we need toughness + healing power. Whatever the combo is. But those numbers should be balanced around the other amulet, so it’s not OP.

This is the only way to have low damage class that can sustain 1v1 or 1v2 and bringing support to “compensate” the low damage.

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/New-to-PvP-Start-here/first#post3383589

I see. The problem is that the moment a bunker in gw2 offers support. The Support kinda makes it so that u can practically carry an team. The shout guardian did not. It definately benefitted the team. But it did not carry. To me a bunker can take on 3 guys. (Bunker DH) and offer support. But it should not carry a team. An bunker Chrono could carry, qucikness, ress. perfect stomps, and tons of boons, well of precognition etc.

Having 2 tempest and u could carry a team. A single one could be argued to be balanced. The thing with A-net is that it wants to pick up the pace of the game. Some support builds have the potential to carry a team and keep them a life. What needs to happen is either nerf support builds into oblivion. Or remove bunkers and make them bruisers.. Or u could nerf tempest dps even more but that would kill build diversity.

Maby if fire traitline was made more attractive and somehow removed the dependence on condi cleanse on shouts. or atleast make it show that each shout could give 2 stacks of might to the tempest only. in conjunction with increasing might uptime by maby 20 percent for fire traitline. U could keep menders amulet and have tempest deal damage and kinda justify it dying by focused down or a really good thief or a single revenant. Just an idea i guess.

Good Bunker shout guard carries game a lot in team fight.

The problems from that build have not enough HP (since they removed attributes from traits line) and the damage should had been upgrade somewhat.

DH bunker bring meditation selfish cleanses/heals. That bunker build is not supporting much except for some prot/regen/aegis. It’s like less than 30% of bunker shout support.

The thing is, Attributes allocations should not be “chained” into amulet format. Each classes got their + and -. This need to get some way to balanced those plus and minus with attributes allocations.

But since they didn’t balanced properly the skills/traits scaling for all attributes for all classes, they prefer to put that dumb amulet system for PVPer.

The tempest cleanses on shouts is another way to cleanses. Cleansing water with cantrip, work too.

Cleansing is not related to Attribute, so not related to having better support amulet.

Only druids and DH can heals on mender because they have great way to heals/block/blinds/evade/aegis power damage. While Tempest don’t have much options in that dept.

Jourdelune.7456:

Ranael.6423:

Jourdelune.7456:

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

It is just a matter of feeling but I had the impression that they were trying to decouple bunker and healer in order to create fragile strong support-healer and resilient selfish bunker. Not saying it is a good or bad thing but this is the impression I got from the last changes.

That would be a good idea, but there is none-bunker amulet that do the work, actually.

Bunker build that work where with class that heal and have toughness. Removing those two stats, make it way harder to work.

Probably Cleric was too high stats, so in real world, you simply lower the scaling of the skills that are OP with Cleric.

But in a poor world, where they are so cheap that they don’t give an alternative to Cleric… it’s not working like they want.

So, all meta now is a bruiser build. Different amulet because each build got traits or skills with more or less surv. The meta with DPS amulet, have strong defensive skills and traits. The meta with Condi amulet, have less defensive skills and traits than that.

A bunker that don’t do damge and can’t heal himself or anyone, or cleanse himself or anyone… simply don’t exist. Nobody will make a build only to stay on a point all game.

Power : 1050
Healing power : 1050
Toughness : 560
Something: 560

This would had solved the issue. Only 1610 stats for defensive attribute, compare to the 2100 from cleric.

But anyway, the balanced team did nerf Ele heals, did nerf Ele damage (with CD). So, cleric amulet would had been balanced.

Or maybe they want to remove bunker possibilities on some professions (because next elite spec ). But as said in your other topic there is few explanations on global intention from the devs (both balance and PvP devs) so we can only assume things because no one goes into deeper gameplay conversation with what appears to me (from my noobish point of view) as invested players.
Grouch said they want " to take support down a notch and increase the pace of combat" without more details.

Ranael.6423:

Jourdelune.7456:

Ranael.6423:

Jourdelune.7456:

Actually, we are losing an archetype define by Grouch there:

It is just a matter of feeling but I had the impression that they were trying to decouple bunker and healer in order to create fragile strong support-healer and resilient selfish bunker. Not saying it is a good or bad thing but this is the impression I got from the last changes.

That would be a good idea, but there is none-bunker amulet that do the work, actually.

Bunker build that work where with class that heal and have toughness. Removing those two stats, make it way harder to work.

Probably Cleric was too high stats, so in real world, you simply lower the scaling of the skills that are OP with Cleric.

But in a poor world, where they are so cheap that they don’t give an alternative to Cleric… it’s not working like they want.

So, all meta now is a bruiser build. Different amulet because each build got traits or skills with more or less surv. The meta with DPS amulet, have strong defensive skills and traits. The meta with Condi amulet, have less defensive skills and traits than that.

A bunker that don’t do damge and can’t heal himself or anyone, or cleanse himself or anyone… simply don’t exist. Nobody will make a build only to stay on a point all game.

Power : 1050
Healing power : 1050
Toughness : 560
Something: 560

This would had solved the issue. Only 1610 stats for defensive attribute, compare to the 2100 from cleric.

But anyway, the balanced team did nerf Ele heals, did nerf Ele damage (with CD). So, cleric amulet would had been balanced.

Or maybe they want to remove bunker possibilities on some professions (because next elite spec ). But as said in your other topic there is few explanations on global intention from the devs (both balance and PvP devs) so we can only assume things because no one goes into deeper gameplay conversation with what appears to me (from my noobish point of view) as invested players.
Grouch said they want " to take support down a notch and increase the pace of combat" without more details.

Sorry it ain’t happening most Marauder META build are more tanky than most Cleric Build except Tempest (that got nerfed anyway) because of HoT passives/active bunker skills.

To achieve this goal, they need to rollback HoT (including all changes, removals and nerf).