Guild Wars 2

How the kitten are you losing money on one of the best pvp mechanics out there?

Nurture that kitten! You have no idea. The only reason people still play spvp is because the mechanic is good but the implementation is horrible. Easy fix!

Tell your boss. Stand up to them. Look at LOL DOTA etc. They are dancing around spvp in gw2 because they know they have something and how to work it. Meanwhile you invested time and effort to make a kitten game and you are seriously kittenting the bed with what you have created.

I couldn’t agree with him more. +1 for you Tron!

Game mechanics are fine, they just need to actually make it more fun to compete. Better rewards, visible rankings, GW1 style observer mode that would show all top 100 matches, proper ladders and seasons.

It really doesn’t require too much effort.

Things like this have been said since the release, but so far not even a whisper has been mentioned about it. Really makes you wonder if they are even listening.

pretty sure anet CEO doesn’t even play games nor knows what pvp is

money people don’t care about such kind of stuff, we are nothing but “loot bags” for them basically

when you go farm gold in game, do you care about NPCs or players in wvw? nah, you just want loot/money…. same goes for them, they just want our money and will choose the most efficient method for it – least investment, most profit aka pve

pvp requires a lot of development but effect is not as visible, besides the truth is, only so many ppl enjoy pvp regardless how good it is… go to TC DR and ask roleplayers or players from pve guilds like DnT, why don’t they pvp

people don’t want to try, they just want to log in game, kill some NPCs, get some shiney armor and feel good about themself while sitting afk in LA…

in pvp you won’t always win since you are facing players and not NPCs that are designed to die, so pvp is bound to cause frustration and you actually have to invest some time into getting better etc. before you can win and tbh in many cases you will still lose because there is always someone better than you… most people don’t want it

bottom line you can invest 300k into pve and make 70% of population interested in playing or you can invest same money to improve pvp and it will be still only 10% of population who will appreciate it and probably only 1/3 of them will buy stuff from gem store

I dont like this “pvp doesnt make money arguement”. If this were true, then the top free pvp games wouldn’t get so much development and updates. Look at LoL and Dota, these games aren’t making money off pvp? They dish out tons of money for tournaments. Do they just print their own money then?

Anet just dropped the ball on this. Tons of people would pay for pvp if it were actually worked on like living story was. They need to removed the Hotjoin servers so people will actually use the Custom Arenas and then maybe more people would be in Solo or TeamQ. Which would maybe make thier MMR system worth something by having more then 3000 people play pvp.

Truely Custom Arenas- like ban traits or classes
More skins
More finishers
Rank Boosters
New Races
Custom Guild Cloaks
Map Editor?
Game modes?

I dunno its kinda early here, but I’m sure people can come up with 100 ways to make money off pvp.

Also telling the CEO isn’t really going to help your case since the amount of hardcore PvP is an insignificant number. I think PvP only exist at this stage as a checkbox item or for legal reasons aka bait and switch.

Morderger.6298:

I dont like this “pvp doesnt make money arguement”. If this were true, then the top free pvp games wouldn’t get so much development and updates. Look at LoL and Dota, these games aren’t making money off pvp? They dish out tons of money for tournaments. Do they just print their own money then?

Anet just dropped the ball on this. Tons of people would pay for pvp if it were actually worked on like living story was. They need to removed the Hotjoin servers so people will actually use the Custom Arenas and then maybe more people would be in Solo or TeamQ. Which would maybe make thier MMR system worth something by having more then 3000 people play pvp.

Truely Custom Arenas- like ban traits or classes
More skins
More finishers
Rank Boosters
New Races
Custom Guild Cloaks
Map Editor?
Game modes?

I dunno its kinda early here, but I’m sure people can come up with 100 ways to make money off pvp.

PvP doesn’t make money for the amount of work they have to put into.and all of them require a lot of work all your examples are of MOBA not MMORPG, the expectations for things they have to sell are a little different. I don’t play MOBAs, but it seems they make money from selling champions and other random stuff.

The other problem is that because the population is so low, they don’t want to put in the resources but at the same time the population doesn’t want to play PvP because it is lacking resources aka the Wii U. Guild wars 1 the game that apparently had it all, could not generate as much income as the PvE side, what makes you think this game can?

your list shows exactly why they can’t make money. All those things you listed require a lot more work than you seem to think. New races requires voice work, armor design etc the easiest things on your list are not significant enough to generate. Also selling game modes? Nobody would be that stupid and it will be a terrible decision. Map editor? Apparently you seem to think it is easy to make especially with the engine Anet seems to have.

All you manage to do is how why Anet wont be able to make money off this mode.

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

milo.6942:

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

I always thought it was to prevent something like what happen in guild wars 1, but I guess that seems to logical a reason for some.

Thedenofsin.7340:

This game is riddled with cancer.

Hambow / HS Warriors
decap engies
PW thief builds
mm necros
spirit rangers

All the balance team does is shove another tumor in.

This ^^

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

I always thought it was to prevent something like what happen in guild wars 1, but I guess that seems to logical a reason for some.

and what was it that happened to gw1 that they are trying to prevent?

Rezz.8019:

Game mechanics are fine, they just need to actually make it more fun to compete. Better rewards, visible rankings, GW1 style observer mode that would show all top 100 matches, proper ladders and seasons.

It really doesn’t require too much effort.

I agree with everything you said. I also think part of the problem is the conquest game mode. It is boring to watch and boring to play. That’s why you don’t see many viewers at tournaments and why the PvP population is so low.

milo.6942:

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

I always thought it was to prevent something like what happen in guild wars 1, but I guess that seems to logical a reason for some.

and what was it that happened to gw1 that they are trying to prevent?

Certain skills became entirely different from their PvE counterparts. Functionally different, to the point it could have just been easily named a different skill.

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

I always thought it was to prevent something like what happen in guild wars 1, but I guess that seems to logical a reason for some.

and what was it that happened to gw1 that they are trying to prevent?

Certain skills became entirely different from their PvE counterparts.

Yes… and pvp & pve did great… I just finished saying in my last post that it’s a poor reason unless there is something else behind it

SPvP needs to make money to survive and flourish. If there is no money to be made there will be little investment into fixing anything, which is what we are going through right now. I want ANET to make tons of money from spvp, they will be happy and the community will have a better product.

Check it out.
• League of Legends revenues for 2013 total $624 million
• Dota 2 made around $80 million in microtransaction revenues in 2013
• Anet’s annual revenue for 2013 was $150m – GW2 makes up about 20% of that.

http://global.ncsoft.com/global/ir/earnings.aspx (If you are interested in taking a look at the financials)

GW2 tried to make money through paid arenas. Which is a great idea. Except for arenas have horrible options and are hard to customize with that options we do have. If the process was easier, and more modes and simple options were added that would make a huge impact, and a good start to a bit more revenue.

I believe if ANET wants to make big time money. They need to pump some resources into SPvP and market it to the millions of people that play LOL and DOTA etc. Many people just aren’t MMO fans and they see the GW2 as MMO with pvp attached. I see it as an awesome pvp game and do very little pve. There are many people in this boat, and I don’t believe the top brass at ANET understand this. I feel for the Devs at anet. They are taking all of our forum kitten talk and from what I gather they are doing the best they can with the resources they have. If the top executives don’t realize how much potential there is to profit from spvp, they need to take a vacation and let some forward thinkers take the reigns for a bit.

Here are the top guys. Hope they are listening.

Mike O’Brien Co-Founder —
Jeff Strain Co-Founder —
Patrick Wyatt Co-Founder —
Christopher Lye Director of Marketing —

tronjeremy.5820:

Mike O’Brien Co-Founder —
Jeff Strain Co-Founder —
Patrick Wyatt Co-Founder —
Christopher Lye Director of Marketing —

Jeff Strain, and Patrick Wyatt both left the company back in the GW1 days, they both work at Undead Labs. Mike O’Brien is the current head honcho at Anet.

That isn’t the problem. The problem is the people that play the game and get on the forums and instead of explaining the issues they see in a concise, polite way they say rude things and then the devs don’t worry about it because they think to themselves, “Dang, if people get this mad over the game and continue to play it we must be doing something right.”

If I was a dev, not only would I not respond to the OP, I would flat out ignore them.

It’s about time people start conveying their desires for the game in a polite manner instead of these rage filled diatribes. Forum trolling is so passe.

Also tell the CEO he owes me a Lamborghini Egoista for taking care of that one little problem.. nudge nudge

forget about it….

Iason Evan.3806:

That isn’t the problem. The problem is the people that play the game and get on the forums and instead of explaining the issues they see in a concise, polite way they say rude things and then the devs don’t worry about it because they think to themselves, “Dang, if people get this mad over the game and continue to play it we must be doing something right.”

If I was a dev, not only would I not respond to the OP, I would flat out ignore them.

It’s about time people start conveying their desires for the game in a polite manner instead of these rage filled diatribes. Forum trolling is so passe.

I has nothing to do with manners…it has to do with resource allocation. So, you are saying if we were all polite then all of a sudden the CEO would send down an order to have more staff work on pvp?

milo.6942:

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

silvermember.8941:

milo.6942:

Guys the answer is right in front of you, it’s not complicated at all. To balance pvp means to affect the builds of pve players. Pve players currently fund the game. Ergo, don’t kitten with the revenue stream. Of course then the most obvious question is why don’t they split pve and pvp balance? I don’t know. I don’t buy the responses given that it’s to help not alienate pve players when they visit pvp… just guessing but I’d lean towards there not being enough programmers and qa staff to support what amounts to a near doubling of skills. Notice also how 2 years into the game there are only a handful of new skills.

I always thought it was to prevent something like what happen in guild wars 1, but I guess that seems to logical a reason for some.

and what was it that happened to gw1 that they are trying to prevent?

Certain skills became entirely different from their PvE counterparts.

Yes… and pvp & pve did great… I just finished saying in my last post that it’s a poor reason unless there is something else behind it

I would hope by know you realize that what is good for you, might not be good for them. So whether you agree or not isn’t really that relevant. Also PvP and PvE doing great is not relevant since the game had bigger issues that the separation of skills.

Carbine.4706:

Jeff Strain, and Patrick Wyatt both left the company back in the GW1 days, they both work at Undead Labs. Mike O’Brien is the current head honcho at Anet.

Thanks for the clarification. I didn’t know.

tronjeremy.5820:

Tell your boss. Stand up to them.

Your work desk now belongs to a guy named Eric.

style.6173:

Thedenofsin.7340:

This game is riddled with cancer.

Hambow / HS Warriors
decap engies
PW thief builds
mm necros
spirit rangers

All the balance team does is shove another tumor in.

This ^^

Agreed 100%.

This game has all the right base mechanics to be excellent. It just needs balancing.

GOOD BALANCING.

An honest to God, if ANet doesn’t have the resources to balance the game, then do this one thing:

Restructure the code so that all spell coefficients, durations, etc can be loaded/adjusted by the user via custom arenas.

There are (barely) enough top-tier people playing this game that could be corralled to crowd-source an agreed-upon set of changes to balance this game.

We could have our own, community-driven, set of recommended balance parameters we could play by.

Then the players could be happy.

From what I understood, they have limited resources in terms of developers, so they can’t even split the skills from pve and pvp, and make the necessary adjustments and balance.
Because pve players would cry so hard that they have to kill the boss in an extra 30 seconds, saying the game is now unplayable for X class.

And since the pve/wvw population is way, way higher than the spvp one (and makes way more reveneu through the store) you get shafted.

Thats why they are so unassertive with balance patches, and you get this terrible crap Spvp meta, and the nervous girlly giggles when announcing the changes, because they do know it’s crap…

Some of it may be a catch-22 but I believe before any further howls for balancing etc, SPvP needs to bring in revenue.

Revenue = Increased Attention/Fixes/Updates