Guild Wars 2

Take boon removal..

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

I think if you are going to attack and kill a bunker, you should be looking at removing boons, watching for retaliation, and generally being more patient.

Be more patient? Against a class that is designed to delay? How do you not see the problem with this? Being patient doesn’t counter the guardian. You play right into his hand.

Remove boons? As a warrior? With what abilities? Besides, what’s 1 boon removal on a cooldown going to do vs spammable retal? Heaven forbid it doesn’t get retal. Not like all classes have null field or corrupt boon.

Which then requires you to have a teammate around. So now you’re saying that you need a team to take out one class. Which means that class isn’t balanced.

Which is why bunker classes are determining team comps right now. Because they’re too strong to pass up.

Please, keep showing how you’re “not ignorant”.

But I say that in jest. Being ignorant btw isn’t a bad thing. It just means you don’t know.

Now you know. And knowing is half the battle.

You say his job is to delay you, and in your mind it takes 2 people to kill him.
If you hadn’t hit him 47 times while retal was up, he would have never killed you. Thus, he needs 2 people to do any killing as well.

Listen buddy, it’s obvious you and I are never going to see eye to eye on this. You refuse to learn anything about the class and instead fall back on:

“it’s OP!! Why can’t I just quickly solo down any player who has committed his ENTIRE BUILD AND STYLE to defense?! If he delays me, then he wins. I need to be able to kill him QUICKLY, and if I can’t it’s obviously because his build is broken.”

And I can’t argue with that mentality.

Enjoy your thread. I’m sure the developers are breathing in every word of your expert opinion.

What is so strange he hit him 47 times?

The only BAD people here are the ones who say he hit him 47 times…

What of it? Guardian can have retal nearly 100% time. There are MANY multihitting skills in the game. Engineer’s Flame Jet is best example, hits TEN (10) times in period of 2,25s.

Burn Bomb…. Initial explosion + 3 hits in aoe so 4 hits itself lets assume 3 people hit have retal that is 12 retal hits in 3 seconds.

Drop the “you hit him 47 times” because you look like noobs. Retal is just dumb. At worst they should give retal charges, like 3 hits reflected and that’s it.

PS

I play myself Engie and Guardian.

Sky.9347:

You say his job is to delay you, and in your mind it takes 2 people to kill him.

It will take two people to kill him. Either one with boon removal or another DPS to split the retal damage.

Sky.9347:

If you hadn’t hit him… he would have never killed you. Thus, he needs 2 people to do any killing as well..

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Once again, you fail to understand that not attacking a bunker class (that was brought to the game to hold a point long enough for backup to arrive) is not a viable option because you’re allowing him to fulfill his role. Let alone the fact that a bunker class can kill anyone is an insult to balance in the first place.

Yet you think it’s perfectly viable.

Killyox.3950:

What is so strange he hit him 47 times?

The only BAD people here are the ones who say he hit him 47 times…

What of it? Guardian can have retal nearly 100% time. There are MANY multihitting skills in the game. Engineer’s Flame Jet is best example, hits TEN (10) times in period of 2,25s.

Burn Bomb…. Initial explosion + 3 hits in aoe so 4 hits itself lets assume 3 people hit have retal that is 12 retal hits in 3 seconds.

Drop the “you hit him 47 times” because you look like noobs. Retal is just dumb. At worst they should give retal charges, like 3 hits reflected and that’s it.

PS

I play myself Engie and Guardian.

Because THIS guardian didn’t have 100% uptime, and Retal was the primary source of damage (by far), and there is no skill in this game I know of that hits 47 times.

You can, at any time, stop hitting someone who has retaliation on them. This is not a 100% uptime situation.

Your bolded statement doesn’t apply. This was a 1 on 1 duel in which the only real damage was done 230 hp at a time, 47 times, without the attacker stopping to recover or wait for retal to drop or anything.

If a sword/scepter guardian has super high retal uptime, he has burned utilities to make that happen. He isn’t unkillable.

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

You say his job is to delay you, and in your mind it takes 2 people to kill him.

It will take two people to kill him. Either one with boon removal or another DPS to split the retal damage.

Sky.9347:

If you hadn’t hit him… he would have never killed you. Thus, he needs 2 people to do any killing as well..

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Once again, you fail to understand that not attacking a bunker class (that was brought to the game to hold a point long enough for backup to arrive) is not a viable option because you’re allowing him to fulfill his role.

Yet you think it’s perfectly viable.

And you are saying that he shouldn’t be allowed to delay you at all.

Listen, if you are playing a profession & build that doesn’t have any boon removal… and you are a player who is ignorant of the bunkers limitations… then yea, you’re gonna be delayed.

Keep in mind his entire build and playstyle centers around delaying you. You killing yourself with retal was just an added benefit.

I’m not even saying bunkers in general shouldn’t be tweaked. I am saying you failed in this fight, and you aren’t seeing it even after all this forum QQ.

Sky.9347:

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

You say his job is to delay you, and in your mind it takes 2 people to kill him.

It will take two people to kill him. Either one with boon removal or another DPS to split the retal damage.

Sky.9347:

If you hadn’t hit him… he would have never killed you. Thus, he needs 2 people to do any killing as well..

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Once again, you fail to understand that not attacking a bunker class (that was brought to the game to hold a point long enough for backup to arrive) is not a viable option because you’re allowing him to fulfill his role.

Yet you think it’s perfectly viable.

And you are saying that he shouldn’t be allowed to delay you at all.

Listen, if you are playing a profession & build that doesn’t have any boon removal… and you are a player who is ignorant of the bunkers limitations… then yea, you’re gonna be delayed.

Keep in mind his entire build and playstyle centers around delaying you. You killing yourself with retal was just an added benefit.

I’m not even saying bunkers in general shouldn’t be tweaked. I am saying you failed in this fight, and you aren’t seeing it even after all this forum QQ.

Except he still delayed me. This fight went on for ~30 seconds. His heal was off cooldown.

It ended early because I died to his passive damage reflect. It would have gone longer had that not been the case. Probably about another 20-30 seconds before my CD’s came back up and he had nothing.

Once again, no bunker spec should be able to kill. Only delay incoming attacks and support their team. If they are able to kill, it’s insulting to balance.

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

You say his job is to delay you, and in your mind it takes 2 people to kill him.

It will take two people to kill him. Either one with boon removal or another DPS to split the retal damage.

Sky.9347:

If you hadn’t hit him… he would have never killed you. Thus, he needs 2 people to do any killing as well..

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Once again, you fail to understand that not attacking a bunker class (that was brought to the game to hold a point long enough for backup to arrive) is not a viable option because you’re allowing him to fulfill his role.

Yet you think it’s perfectly viable.

And you are saying that he shouldn’t be allowed to delay you at all.

Listen, if you are playing a profession & build that doesn’t have any boon removal… and you are a player who is ignorant of the bunkers limitations… then yea, you’re gonna be delayed.

Keep in mind his entire build and playstyle centers around delaying you. You killing yourself with retal was just an added benefit.

I’m not even saying bunkers in general shouldn’t be tweaked. I am saying you failed in this fight, and you aren’t seeing it even after all this forum QQ.

Except he still delayed me. This fight went on for ~30 seconds. His heal was off cooldown.

It ended early because I died to his passive damage reflect. It would have gone longer had that not been the case. Probably about another 20-30 seconds before my CD’s came back up and he had nothing.

Once again, no bunker spec should be able to kill. Only delay incoming attacks and support their team. If they are able to kill, it’s insulting to balance.

Okay, maybe. But by that logic one could say “no one should ever be able to kill a bunker without help”. If you take away any ability they have to do damage, you’d have to buff up their defense even more.

I don’t know if that’s a good solution. You might feel like he was unkillable, but he wasn’t. He may have delayed you 30 seconds, but that doesn’t seem like such a problem.. and certainly isn’t related to retaliation. He may have delayed you longer had you played smart instead of balls to the wall aggressive, because although he may have been able to string together 30 seconds of retaliation (I’d have to check but I think even that isn’t possible without a big bit of luck in his build), he would have been naked after that.

This isn’t 100% uptime. Your entire complaint is worthless, because this isn’t 100% uptime. Now you are talking about delays and such… which could be it’s own thread, because it still isn’t 100% uptime on retaliation.

Another way Guardians can get Retaliation up:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rune_of_Sanctuary

Plus

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rune_of_the_Monk

Plus, having some trait points in Virtue which increases Boon Duration, too.

These are some traits I use as a Guardian that give Retal, there are obviously more:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wrathful_Spirit
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Virtue_of_Retribution
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vengeful

Sky.9347:

This isn’t 100% uptime. Your entire complaint is worthless, because this isn’t 100% uptime. Now you are talking about delays and such… which could be it’s own thread, because it still isn’t 100% uptime on retaliation.

Yea you’re totally right. It’s not up 100% of the time. He’s not walking around with it on.

It’s only up 100% of the time when fighting people.

This is clearly not an issue because when he’s off playing with flowers, he doesn’t have retal.

You got me.

You should probably read what you post before posting. Just another GI Joe tip.

Daays.4317:

Sky.9347:

This isn’t 100% uptime. Your entire complaint is worthless, because this isn’t 100% uptime. Now you are talking about delays and such… which could be it’s own thread, because it still isn’t 100% uptime on retaliation.

Yea you’re totally right. It’s not up 100% of the time. He’s not walking around with it on.

It’s only up 100% of the time when fighting people.

This is clearly not an issue because when he’s off playing with flowers, he doesn’t have retal.

You got me.

It isn’t 100% in combat, either.

In a short fight it might be 100%, but only because you died before the duration wore off. During that initial duration… yes, you will likely be delayed. But if you don’t attack him a ton, he’s got an entire build built around something you just made useless outside of the couple dozen seconds he delayed you from killing him.

EDIT: And if his entire build and purpose in pvp is to delay you for 30 seconds every once in a while… well then I see no problem with that.

2nd EDIT: I don’t know why you hate me so much that you have to continuously amend your posts with little jabs to try to… what? insult me? I’m not even sure.

Sky.9347:

It isn’t 100% in combat, either.

In a short fight it might be 100%, but only because you died before the duration wore off. During that initial duration… yes, you will likely be delayed. But if you don’t attack him a ton, he’s got an entire build built around something you just made useless outside of the couple dozen seconds he delayed you from killing him.

I’m beginning to wonder if you even think through what you say before you post.

Don’t attack during retal.

In which his heal will come off CD. His shouts will come off CD. His virtues will come back up. His aegis will recharge. Which all give retal, except the heal of course.

Thanks for the idea.

Daays.4317:

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Let alone the fact that a bunker class can kill anyone is an insult to balance in the first place.

How do you know hes not trying to kill you where is that part i don’t see it?
And how do you know hes running a bunker build could be some balanced build.

and no you don’t NEED boon removal to kill guardian with retaliation up usually most of the damage come from auto attack and not retaliation. at least you almost killed him.
Sorry sir but this is a l2p issue.

short fight……. this game shouldn’t be having several minute long fights. its one thing to be able to stay alive forever while someone is trying to kill you. its quite another to stay alive forever AND kill the person trying to kill you. being able to do both at once requires some kind of trick to it. Oh wait, if you make killing the person attacking you a passive action… suddenly you can concentrate 100% on staying alive forever and let this passive take care of killing your attacker off.

look, i play (main) guardian and even i can recognize that this boon is being severely abused. guardian vs guardian it becomes glaringly obvious.

Have you tried using the Sigil that removes buffs?

As a Guardian, Necros really are a pain the in the kitten for me since they turn my boons into conditions. Anything in general that removes my boons is a pain. Would having a Necro on your team help?

Every class/spec isn’t going to be good against every other class/spec in every situation. Whatever build you’re running is going to have weaknesses as well as strengths.

Sorry, I’m coming into this thread late.

tom.7468:

Daays.4317:

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Let alone the fact that a bunker class can kill anyone is an insult to balance in the first place.

How do you know hes not trying to kill you where is that part i don’t see it?
And how do you know hes running a bunker build could be some balanced build.

and no you don’t NEED boon removal to kill guardian with retaliation up usually most of the damage come from auto attack and not retaliation. at least you almost killed him.
Sorry sir but this is a l2p issue.

…
What are you talking about. He has damaging attacks on me from his scepter/sword. Did you even look at the Screenshot?

What is your spec/trait set up, Daays? Could you post a link?

Hello,

As this thread is going inflammatory, it is now closed. Please help keep these forums a productive and friendly place by posting in a respectful tone.

Thank you.

Daays.4317:

tom.7468:

Daays.4317:

His job is to delay. Not kill. Not attacking him is allowing him to delay.

Let alone the fact that a bunker class can kill anyone is an insult to balance in the first place.

How do you know hes not trying to kill you where is that part i don’t see it?
And how do you know hes running a bunker build could be some balanced build.

and no you don’t NEED boon removal to kill guardian with retaliation up usually most of the damage come from auto attack and not retaliation. at least you almost killed him.
Sorry sir but this is a l2p issue.

…
What are you talking about. He has damaging attacks on me from his scepter/shield. Did you even look at the Screenshot?

Exactly why would he attack you if he was not trying to kill you does it make sense?