Guild Wars 2

Am I the only one who thinks that Hammer warrior when ran with Berserker’s amulet isn’t that over the top? The build is very counterable with it’s lack of disengage and susceptibility to burst damage, making it rewarding to play. Also it serves as a counter to all of the condition spam engis/necros and brings balance to the meta game.

Honestly I think the problem with hammer warriors being OP was that they can run soldiers amulet and still do big hammer burst. This allows them to waddle around the midfight and spam ground targeted AoE while laughing because nobody can can damage the warrior nearly as much as he is damaging them. This is bad gameplay and should not exist.

Can we just nerf Unsuspecting Foe and call it a day Instead of ruining hammer as a damage weapon completely?

Move UF to GM tier and it’s solved…

How can you do big burst if you use soldiers amulet? Never seen this happen.

Junkpile.7439:

How can you do big burst if you use soldiers amulet? Never seen this happen.

Very easy with unsuspecting foe and merciless hammer. Let’s say you’re using SoR, so you have fury. Suddenly you’re up around 80% crit chance depending on runes. So 80% crit chance, ~35% bonus crit damage depending on build, +25% flat damage increase…you get the idea.

I don’t think hammer will die out, but benefits a mid bunker warrior more than a DPS warrior.

People might use axe if it didn’t suck so hard.

JonathanSharp.7094:

If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

The problem is that both greatsword and axe are pretty bad at everything else. When running greatsword it’s mandatory to bring bulls charge and and frenzy just to make use of skill 2. Eviscerate on the axe does decent on demand damage if you manage to land it but all the other skills are terrible.

If the patch goes through as planned warriors won’t really be viable outside of the sword condition build and the occasional mid bunker (which already pales in comparison to guardian bunker).

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

Mid bunker warrior will die out though. Unless they run condi which won’t be nerfed.

I agree with the damage reduction however. Grandmaster suggestion is made exclusively by idiots, however the master trait will nerf ham/bow – while make full cc warrior unviable sadly. It’s a shame as the build was fun, but stopped playing it a fair while back now anyway. Would of been nice to keep it going in a weaker state though.

Have a few ideas for making it work still but it won’t be serious tourney tier.

As for the greatsword… I’d like to see a skilful ability worked into how you plan to change the F1.. Warrior needs more timed skills (the comparison in quantity of these abilities is laughable when compared to, say, a kit engi etc).

A blind would be good, or some finicky movement skill that requires a target.

the receiving side didn’t think that hammer zerk wars was that fun to fight, more like one sided

Josh Davis.6015:

It’s worth noting that Tyler Chapman and I have tested a few variations of Hambow internally and it still does good damage. Like…really good. I think the main implication of the changes in PvP is that you won’t be able to run defensive runesets like Lyssa and do the same amount of damage as you did before – you’ll need to run offensive sets.

Infact it will change nothing.

Cleansing Ire and zerker stance are everything wars need. I’ve tried wars in full damage set ( runes too) with the standard build and it was effective about the same ( more damage, less stability).

Those nerfs are not enough to really shake war meta.

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

I agree with the 1st part but not the 2nd.

Greatsword is still terrible as a DPS weapon because 100b is 3.5 seconds in channeling..in one direction..while standing still..while exposed to reciprocal damage or damage from other targets..while being susceptible to interrution. Why are we the only class that has to be punished for trying to actually play and do dps?

Engineers have a PULL on their weapon set -toolkit or whatever you want to name it- with zero cool down on weapon (toolkit) switching..yet warriors being the main melee class that actually has to close in on the target has zero pulls. I’d take a pull over GS5 interruptable slow charge any day.

Quickness has been nerfed to the ground and slotting it in order to get a 100b off every 60 second is not practical.

In this game’s pvp, standing still is death and that is what 100b is about. GS 3 is good and as for 4+5..why do we have to have our abilities wasted on gap closing instead of being ranged like the rest of the classes?

You talked about changing GS abilities but so far: nothing. Rarely does anyone use it anymore because LB is superior since it sadly join the: Fire and forget train of thought as well as being ranged so no need to struggle with actually reaching your target.

Axe is melee in a range/condi game. Also, Axe requires 3 consecutive hits to achieve its max after being nerfed for what I assume is a silly attempt to reign in pve farming. Axe off hand dps is weak and Axe 5 suffers from the same problem that 100b does.

Oh well. I guess I can accept the war nerfs and shelf my beloved hammer. I started practicing other professions more diligently after I saw the patch preview and let me tell ya.

I think it’s about to get REALLY ENGINEER UP IN THIS META!

The overreaction level is like 9000 right now.

Oh boo hoo. It’s still incredibly strong. I’ve been running a hambow based build that operates with everything that will happen post-patch. I’m pretty sure just a straight hambow build will work fine too, you don’t need unsuspecting foe THAT much.

Ya there doesn’t need to be a vigil for the Hambow build, it’s still going to be effective in the next patch

But this damage nerf really hurt my PvE hammer warrior. Can’t really use any other weapons because only hammer is ascended.

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

then, clearly, you should:

• improve axe to not suffer so much at range (eg: better gap closing or better ranged attack or better at pinning target, eg: halve the dmg on evis but double the leap range and add a daze).
• stop 100b from self-rooting and tune down the damage to compensate. 100b instagibs (or any other kind of instagib ability for that matter) are a bad idea in a competitive game anyway.

I am not a warrior, so let me be the first to apologize if what I am about to say is inaccurate.

From my perspective, the only issue with the current version of the warrior is the effectiveness of healing signet without any need to reach for healing power. It has been suggested before, but why not nerf the base heal of healing signet slightly but make it scale better with healing power? If this isn’t a viable solution, could we get an explanation of why not?

I think specifically targeting just the hambow build is way to narrow minded and does not address the true issues with the warrior class.

lol GS on Warrior is very, very powerful if you’re good at it.

Josh Davis.6015:

It’s worth noting that Tyler Chapman and I have tested a few variations of Hambow internally and it still does good damage. Like…really good. I think the main implication of the changes in PvP is that you won’t be able to run defensive runesets like Lyssa and do the same amount of damage as you did before – you’ll need to run offensive sets.

I’m glad to see the developers taking the communities reactions into account and taking the time to update the playerbase concerning potentially tremendous changes to a class.

candlecan.9827:

I am not a warrior, so let me be the first to apologize if what I am about to say is inaccurate.

From my perspective, the only issue with the current version of the warrior is the effectiveness of healing signet without any need to reach for healing power. It has been suggested before, but why not nerf the base heal of healing signet slightly but make it scale better with healing power? If this isn’t a viable solution, could we get an explanation of why not?

I think specifically targeting just the hambow build is way to narrow minded and does not address the true issues with the warrior class.

Because that would be too much of an easy fix.

candlecan.9827:

I am not a warrior, so let me be the first to apologize if what I am about to say is inaccurate.

From my perspective, the only issue with the current version of the warrior is the effectiveness of healing signet without any need to reach for healing power. It has been suggested before, but why not nerf the base heal of healing signet slightly but make it scale better with healing power? If this isn’t a viable solution, could we get an explanation of why not?

I think specifically targeting just the hambow build is way to narrow minded and does not address the true issues with the warrior class.

So much misinform in this forums, people QQ about how healing signet is OP without healing power and toughness and with PPC, that’s not true…i can easily backstab you to death with a ptv thief..it’s at its effective level where it should be..it will still heal up some of your hp slowly even you dont have any healing power..

so you think that targeting just hambow build does not address the true issues being that warrior can finally be tanky when specced tankiness with healing signet? or healing signet can finally be on pair with other heals? ok

i just don’t get the logic behind all these comments, people complaining about hambow build being op, so we will nerf the skill that is not op when used on other builds, which no one complained about!

Lighter.5631:

candlecan.9827:

I am not a warrior, so let me be the first to apologize if what I am about to say is inaccurate.

From my perspective, the only issue with the current version of the warrior is the effectiveness of healing signet without any need to reach for healing power. It has been suggested before, but why not nerf the base heal of healing signet slightly but make it scale better with healing power? If this isn’t a viable solution, could we get an explanation of why not?

I think specifically targeting just the hambow build is way to narrow minded and does not address the true issues with the warrior class.

So much misinform in this forums, people QQ about how healing signet is OP without healing power and toughness and with PPC, that’s not true…i can easily backstab you to death with a ptv thief..it’s at its effective level where it should be..it will still heal up some of your hp slowly even you dont have any healing power..

so you think that targeting just hambow build does not address the true issues being that warrior can finally be tanky when specced tankiness with healing signet? or healing signet can finally be on pair with other heals? ok

i just don’t get the logic behind all these comments, people complaining about hambow build being op, so we will nerf the skill that is not op when used on other builds, which no one complained about!

you misunderstand. I am not complaining about hambow. In fact, I am advocating that they leave that build alone because they are currently discussing nerfing that build directly. My view on healing signet comes from witnessing multiple different warrior builds that posses HIGHLY potent offensive capabilities, yet enjoy the sustain that no other class with such offense offers. All I am saying is that if a warrior wants that “tankyness” than offer it to them, but at the cost of having to at least devote healing power to achieve it.

candlecan.9827:

Lighter.5631:

candlecan.9827:

I am not a warrior, so let me be the first to apologize if what I am about to say is inaccurate.

From my perspective, the only issue with the current version of the warrior is the effectiveness of healing signet without any need to reach for healing power. It has been suggested before, but why not nerf the base heal of healing signet slightly but make it scale better with healing power? If this isn’t a viable solution, could we get an explanation of why not?

I think specifically targeting just the hambow build is way to narrow minded and does not address the true issues with the warrior class.

So much misinform in this forums, people QQ about how healing signet is OP without healing power and toughness and with PPC, that’s not true…i can easily backstab you to death with a ptv thief..it’s at its effective level where it should be..it will still heal up some of your hp slowly even you dont have any healing power..

so you think that targeting just hambow build does not address the true issues being that warrior can finally be tanky when specced tankiness with healing signet? or healing signet can finally be on pair with other heals? ok

i just don’t get the logic behind all these comments, people complaining about hambow build being op, so we will nerf the skill that is not op when used on other builds, which no one complained about!

you misunderstand. I am not complaining about hambow. In fact, I am advocating that they leave that build alone because they are currently discussing nerfing that build directly. My view on healing signet comes from witnessing multiple different warrior builds that posses HIGHLY potent offensive capabilities, yet enjoy the sustain that no other class with such offense offers. All I am saying is that if a warrior wants that “tankyness” than offer it to them, but at the cost of having to at least devote healing power to achieve it.

actually…you misunderstand, i know you are not complaing about hambow, but you are complaing about healing signet, which is wrong.. i’d like to see you run a ppc gs/lb or any classic burst warrior with healing signet and enjoy the so called super awesome sustain and start talking after that..

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

since the ham bow is solely a spvp problem why not just make the change for pvp only?

XII.9401:

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

I agree with the 1st part but not the 2nd.

Greatsword is still terrible as a DPS weapon because 100b is 3.5 seconds in channeling..in one direction..while standing still..while exposed to reciprocal damage or damage from other targets..while being susceptible to interrution. Why are we the only class that has to be punished for trying to actually play and do dps?

Engineers have a PULL on their weapon set -toolkit or whatever you want to name it- with zero cool down on weapon (toolkit) switching..yet warriors being the main melee class that actually has to close in on the target has zero pulls. I’d take a pull over GS5 interruptable slow charge any day.

Quickness has been nerfed to the ground and slotting it in order to get a 100b off every 60 second is not practical.

In this game’s pvp, standing still is death and that is what 100b is about. GS 3 is good and as for 4+5..why do we have to have our abilities wasted on gap closing instead of being ranged like the rest of the classes?

You talked about changing GS abilities but so far: nothing. Rarely does anyone use it anymore because LB is superior since it sadly join the: Fire and forget train of thought as well as being ranged so no need to struggle with actually reaching your target.

Axe is melee in a range/condi game. Also, Axe requires 3 consecutive hits to achieve its max after being nerfed for what I assume is a silly attempt to reign in pve farming. Axe off hand dps is weak and Axe 5 suffers from the same problem that 100b does.

I’m with this guy. In PvE GS rules because of defiant/unstoppable.

In PvP hammer rules because there is no self rooting, rush over shooting, no whirling wrath terra-mapping issues on inclines. As for axe..it just straight out sucks for many players. Too many skills that don’t deal damage and a spin to win cheese about it.

No karma, no gold, no real rewards apart from the game play itself in pvp, and you’re plowing on right a head with what is going to be a deeply disliked patch to warrior because of your profession philosophy. Why did we see so many warriors?..because you gave them a build with near prefect synergy. Until you resolve stuff like guardian precision being tied to condition dmg and other fundamentals like this where other professions can also have near prefect synergy builds, all your ever gonna have is what you currently got..buff with one hand, then nerf it again with the other 2 months later. Focus on builds that last rather than create flavour of the month spec’s to only remove them again next patch.

Greatsword + Longbow + Throw Bolas

You’re welcome

Switch to Hammer+Axe/Mace, voila you’re still OP as hell.

Warrior is the only class that can run knights and still do more damage than most zerker specs that are not mesmer or thief.

A number reduction to hammer is insignificant when you can switch to axe set in between stuns and auto people to death because axe chain is comparable to 100b as sustained damage.

All you need is to pop your IWIN stances with extra duration and become unpeelable.

Zenith.7301:

Switch to Hammer+Axe/Mace, voila you’re still OP as hell.

Warrior is the only class that can run knights and still do more damage than most zerker specs that are not mesmer or thief.

A number reduction to hammer is insignificant when you can switch to axe set in between stuns and auto people to death because axe chain is comparable to 100b as sustained damage.

All you need is to pop your IWIN stances with extra duration and become unpeelable.

I don’t even know where to start with this. I suspect a troll?

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

Then you might want to take a look at GS again. Just sayin’. Its only use is Rush to run away (because it never lands), Whirlwind Attack for an extra dodge, and Hundred Blades on bosses in PvE that don’t immediately turn around and faceroll you.

I think its about time that wars be given the ability to move while casting HB.

Hell mesmers get to evade while using Blurred Frenzy. That DPS is even greater since its 8 hits of a 2.4 coefficient over 2 seconds. That also cleaves….

jmatb.6307:

Greatsword + Longbow + Throw Bolas

You’re welcome

I don’t think you PvP much. Otherwise you’d realize that, besides being easily dodged, Throw Bolas is “Obstructed” or “Out of Range” about 50% of the time its used. That skill is a POS.

Rarnark.5623:

Oh well. I guess I can accept the war nerfs and shelf my beloved hammer. I started practicing other professions more diligently after I saw the patch preview and let me tell ya.

I think it’s about to get REALLY ENGINEER UP IN THIS META!

Nah engis got hit too. Only class that hasn’t been significantly effected with its OP is Mesmer. Go roll mes, you won’t regret it.

JonathanSharp.7094:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

I hope you have some plans in future about them as in current state they are terrible.

Axe:
-AA was nerfed into ground – and for what reason if we can know?
-Cyclone Axe is useless
-Throw axe is a 4sec cripple olny
-Evi is good but short range making it hard to land for the casttime it has.
-Axe Offhand? Is a joke.

Greatsword:
-AA is weak. Period.
-Hundren Blades not all that much great in terms of dps as people claim to be. 3,5sec selfrooting move is asking for this skill to be dead if running without cc weps/utilities. Im actually using gs+rifle and hb doesnt exits for me. Btw pretty bad combo as rifle is also weak.
-Bladetrail is pointless, running in circles is often enough to not get hit once by that. Its also doesnt return many times back for obvious reason. Also the animation is silly.
-Rush still missing targets, even the immobilized ones
-Arcing slide..while i like the animation, skill itself is terrible, not even used in pve
-Lack of synergy and poory designed skills in general.
-Also greatsword damage needs a buff..Not much but its does need some.

I can go on with other weapons such as sword burst with 0 damage for power builds, mace being too slow, broken rifle with all the damage placed in 2 skills olny but i think you getting the point.

Hammer is pretty good bc it has synergy between skills, the same goes for longbow making it a ideal combo. Its not like everyone want to run hammer bc it became “op” for some reasons, its just that everything outside of bunker condi war sux. Its ok, you want to nerf it as it is too powerful in mind of many people, but theres no compensate in buffs to other areas i have mentioned.

Also whats about condition builds? Its ok for them to have a great control, defense and damage so easy? The olny thing they have to stack in reality is condition damage leaving them 2 defensive stats. Power builds cannot affort that. Power builds requires 3 offensive stats while condition builds just 1. Wheres the balance?

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

So why not fix greatword then and why you nerfed axe ? I am speechless yopu do know these 2 weapons for pvp are in the “useless” department right ?Another reason i must believe you guys are pvecentric with these changes.GS and axe are not viable weapons as they are now in pvp period.Do you guys even play pvp ?You need to completely rework axe and greatsword skills if you want warriors to start using them in pvp without being a free kill or run in a zerg ftw department.

jmatb.6307:

Greatsword + Longbow + Throw Bolas

You’re welcome

Broken + Getting nerfed + Useless(and broken)

You’re Welcome.

Josh Davis.6015:

It’s worth noting that Tyler Chapman and I have tested a few variations of Hambow internally and it still does good damage. Like…really good. I think the main implication of the changes in PvP is that you won’t be able to run defensive runesets like Lyssa and do the same amount of damage as you did before – you’ll need to run offensive sets.

Did you guys tested the other classes damage internally while running defensive specs ?My money is on * NO* because you would have realized how badly these nerfs are going to affect warriors while other classes can still outdamage a warrior by going full bunker because of sustained and better application of their damage than warriors get.

You guys just don’t know how to spec for dps warrior. It’s OP. All I’m suggesting is to add something to the GS f1 because there isn’t anything, and that’s bad design (respectfully).

There are also better non cc alternatives for dps to GS.

As for this deal with hammer longbow.. Do many good players even play that build? I can see why Anas T ran it (a longbow warrior’s reaction to cc meta) but don’t people realise the best valks/soldiers build is being removed by this change? While hammer longbow is shaved and mace GS is unchanged trait wise (the animation fix will address this 1v1 though).

Either way I’m not fussed, just surprised at people’s reactions.

Phaeton.9582:

You guys just don’t know how to spec for dps warrior. It’s OP. All I’m suggesting is to add something to the GS f1 because there isn’t anything, and that’s bad design (respectfully).

I don’t know if it’s OP, but greatsword works incredibly well in pvp when you know when to engage (AKA: while fighting on a point).

And works with both berserker and tankier versions.XD

JonathanSharp.7094:

The idea we’re operating under:

If you want AOE CC, bring a hammer. If you want burst or DPS, bring an axe or a greatsword.

Considering that Hammer has the highest damage skills (and autoattack too), this will NOT happen.
Increase other weapons damage and then you will see less Hammers around.

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

Hammer warriors are so op.. anyone who doesn’t realize how good they are right now is drinking their own kool aid.

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

If you don’t think any other good player has at least blink/teleport/invulnerability/block than you are not as good as you think you are.

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

Where do i can get these long immo in my gs skills? Or rifle at least? Utility slot? Sorry, reserved for triple stance.

Scoobaniec.9561:

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

Where do i can get these long immo in my gs skills? Or rifle at least? Utility slot? Sorry, reserved for triple stance.

Longbow

redslion.9675:

Scoobaniec.9561:

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

Where do i can get these long immo in my gs skills? Or rifle at least? Utility slot? Sorry, reserved for triple stance.

Longbow

I dun like longbow, i like rifle : )

mini.6018:

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

If you don’t think any other good player has at least blink/teleport/invulnerability/block than you are not as good as you think you are.

GS/LB is a great weapon set and can be built in a variety of ways. Good Warriors will know that. The mobility, AoE, Immob potential with Leg Specialist, 100B for cleave and to take advantage of immobs…

It seems you don’t know much about Warrior.

jmatb.6307:

mini.6018:

jmatb.6307:

@ Redscope and Mini

If you guys don’t think two sources of long immob cooldown can’t set up hundred blades, then you’re not as good as you think you are.

If you don’t think any other good player has at least blink/teleport/invulnerability/block than you are not as good as you think you are.

GS/LB is a great weapon set and can be built in a variety of ways. Good Warriors will know that. The mobility, AoE, Immob potential with Leg Specialist, 100B for cleave and to take advantage of immobs…

It seems you don’t know much about Warrior.

Aaaaaaand another pro that can kill a mesmer/thief with 100 blades.Didn’t realize this game is full of pros especially when i log into the mists.

lol talking to someone who thinks Axe and GS is weak is priceless. Please, by all means, continue with your words of wisdom and enlighten me