Guild Wars 2

..Seriously these two classes see very little play at the top end because THEY SUCK.

How hard is it to show these classes some love?

The warrior needs improved condition removal (you gave us basically none) to deal with the necro spam that is currently dominant in tPvP. It also needs one of its key traits, fast hands, fixed. This bug cripples warriors so often its a disgrace. You always get 10 seconds switch (which kills you all the time) for the first weapon swap. Then if you die using your secondary set and when you respawn you switch OUT OF COMBAT to your primary weapon then your next change will be 10 seconds again when in combat. Seriously how is this not a top priority to fix along with the double death bug? Is 10 months not long enough to fix this or what?

The ranger also needs some buffs. They arent that bad. But they are still well under the 6 “super” classes which pretty much dominate EVERY battle.

Show the ranger and the warrior some love. Its boring having all good teams formed of the other 6 classes.

Tl;DR: Give warrior some better condition removal and fix fast hands.

Yup. Its an easy fix too, just add a condition removal trait (other classes have this already).

For example, make new grandmaster traits in the discipline tree (both the existing ones are complete garbage, i’ve never seen a build use them before. Change one to “burst skills heal you for 5/10/15% of your max life (based on how many adren bars) + remove 1 condition” (at the moment, its better generally speaking for a warrior to NOT use their burst skills – there needs to be a powerful incentive to use them.)

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

My honest opinion with Warriors (and i know this always brings down hate), is that they need to nerf 100b. Then buff overall warrior damage to compensate, then buff their survivability. Then improve their condition removal. Warriors are 1trick ponies atm.

I dont do any high end Tpvp, so i dont know much about that. In spvp though, if a warrior hits you from behind with a bullrush 100b, your pretty close to dead. Other than that, they are so easy to counter, easy to kite and not a real threat.

I have never played Ranger, nor do i really remember seeing any in pvp that cause any problem to me. Definately the weakest class in pvp by a long way.

Warrior is so not the weakest profession in SPvP.

Warriors have a ton of different playstyles that they can use in SPvP. You can got 100B Glass Cannon, Hammer, Duel Axe, Rifle, Sword Sword condi and you can also go support (that is the weakest of all the builds.).

I think that the support role for warrior needs a buff, nothing else though.

Archonis.7249:

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

What removing 1 condition every 20 seconds or having some remove all condition thing which then goes on cooldown and then does nothing else? That isnt good condition removal sorry.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Archonis.7249:

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

What removing 1 condition every 20 seconds or having some remove all condition thing which then goes on cooldown and then does nothing else? That isnt good condition removal sorry.

You are aware that you are playing in a team environment? So you should have some support that helps you with removing conditions. So those two things that I mentioned are plenty to keep you from dying from conditions. Also, there are runes and sigils that help with removing conditions and also lower condition duration.

Archonis.7249:

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

Other classes can get passive condition removal from traits pretty easily, meaning they don’t have to use a utility specifically designed for condition removal.

For example, if a thief takes shadow’s embrace, he gets 1 condition removed every 3 seconds of stealth. Most thieves have at least 3 ways to stealth, and one of them (shadow’s refuge" is gonna let them remove multiple conditions). Mesmer can for example remove condition anytime they shatter, Ele can remove from attuning to water, or from getting regen. The list goes on and on.

Warrior can currently get shrug it off from traits, which only triggers with more than 1 condition on you (removes 1) and has a 30 sec internal CD (much larger than say, a thief’s ability to stealth, a mesmer’s ability to shatter, a ele’s ability to attune or get regen…..

This is why warriors are considered weak to conditions, because we have extremely poor condition removal passive. Keep in mind, there is currently no viable warrior bunker build either (ironic since we are one of 2 heavy armor classes). Its either dps, or cc-support.

1v1 I will agree with you. The warrior will lose to conditions, but the OP is talking about TPvP which should be team based.

I don’t have a problem with conditions on my Warrior in Tournaments or in Hot Join. I run around in the group, because hopefully one of them has group condi removal.

Also don’t forget about combo fields as well. There are a few that remove conditions.

This game is balanced around the idea that every class is self sufficient. There are no dedicated healers for example like in basically every other MMO.

Yea if we had dedicated healers in this game like monks or whatever, i’d say sure, ok warriors can have this glaring weakness to condition damage, because there will be another class that cover this weakness for them and create a sort of give-take synergistic relationship. Unfortunately this is gw2. There are no dedicated healers. This is not as “team oriented” a game as other mmo’s because there is significantly less direct support you can offer your allies. Every class needs to be somewhat balanced around 1v1 because of this. They don’t need to be EXACTLY even; each class can have niches to a small extent, but you can’t leave a class with almost no options vs 1 type of build.

Whats bad is that the whole pvp is a game type where you cant avoid conditions

Hey don’t underestimate the ranger. We’re the new Aquaman. God I still can’t get over the last joke of a update for rangers.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Archonis.7249:

1v1 I will agree with you. The warrior will lose to conditions, but the OP is talking about TPvP which should be team based.

I don’t have a problem with conditions on my Warrior in Tournaments or in Hot Join. I run around in the group, because hopefully one of them has group condi removal.

Your main is a thief. I looked at your post history. Go troll somewhere else please.

Yea, my main is a thief. So what does that have to do with anything?

I also have a Warrior that I SPvP and Tourney with and I am very successful with him.

I got a plan for ya pal. Stop being a kitten glass cannon warrior and L2P or something.

There are plenty of ways to keep yourself from succumbing to conditions, you just don’t want to up your knowledge to deal with it. Instead you come in here and whine and cry and ignore good advice.

Well warrior needs condition removal. Thats obvious to anyone who plays above the VERY basic level.

I suggest – Shrug it off trait cool down reduced to 10 seconds.
– Mending – Cures 3 conditions not 2

Lordrosicky.5813:

Well warrior needs condition removal. Thats obvious to anyone who plays above the VERY basic level.

It has conditional removal, through two abilities and through the use of runes, sigils and combo fields. More than enough, given that there are other abilities that allow you to block, dodge and other survivability traits and abilities.

Lol at a heal 15% of your life trait, dont you think it is a bit too much? Most of the ‘heal something on use something’ skills barely heal 1-2k. They should be the same.

Imo warriors and rangers are fine, some people managed to do some really strong and useful builds, which are pretty good. The main issue is that the other classes are overpowered, and making these two overpowered as well wont fix the problem. They just have to nerf down the rest of the classes.

I think that Rangers and Warriors are very strong. I have gone against some really good Rangers and Warriors in TPvP against my Thief (PD/DD Condi build) and they Survived a looooong time against me. Long enough to get back up and get me off of the point.

A lot of people just don’t want to take the time to understand their profession and how the work together and against various professions.

Agreed that warriors need more condition removal, more development in support builds, and more versatility in damage builds (even if it requires a tone-down on great sword in order for other weapons to be buffed up).

However, certain ranger builds need a serious tone down before buffs are even considered. Right now, the tanky ranger with 24/7 protection boon is unbelievably effective. Why more people do not run this build is beyond me. Maybe it’s just lack of education. Maybe people aren’t aware of it.

Anet has stated that Warriors are UP because of lack of cond removals. Not sure why are you still arguing.

Archonis.7249:

Stop being a kitten glass cannon warrior and L2P or something.

Glass cannon is the only viable role for a warrior. If you’re playing any other war, then you’re a burden.

i love warrior pvp, rolling a glass cannon axe build is HILARIOUS, i’ve had a team of 3 run up to capture a shrine befor and i’ve jumped on them, popped quickness and let the overwhelming flurry of crits fly!
churns through anything like a panzer tank through a cardboard box factory

ranger however…yeah….

Archonis.7249:

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

The ranger thing is because it’s pretty much impossible to make a specialized ranger.

We have two burst combos. One relies on the enemy standing still for 5 seconds doing nothing, and the other relies on the pet actually working properly (which it almost never does). We don’t have any straight up high damage weapons either. The shortbow outdoes every single other weapon in pure damage with just its autoattack.

We are decent at condition damage though, which is kinda nice.

1) Shake it Off!
2) Trait for Shake it Off!
3) Mending
4) Endurance Signet’s Active
5) Traiting Warhorn to convert conditions into boons

Warriors have plenty of condition removal. It’s just so many warriors are playing the class like the easymode thing it is without putting any thought into their build. You know those rune things? Guess what happens if you put 6 of the ones called ‘Superior Rune of the Soldier’ on? It makes “For Great Justice!” suddenly even better, and likewise with “Shake it Off!”

Not every class should get every thing. Warriors already have it good enough. I’d look at ranger before I even glance at warrior sideways.

zone.1073:

Agre

However, certain ranger builds need a serious tone down before buffs are even considered. Right now, the tanky ranger with 24/7 protection boon is unbelievably effective. Why more people do not run this build is beyond me. Maybe it’s just lack of education. Maybe people aren’t aware of it.

Please educate me on this mythical Ranger build that has protection up 100% of the time.

Kamahl.3621:

1) Shake it Off!
2) Trait for Shake it Off!
3) Mending
4) Endurance Signet’s Active
5) Traiting Warhorn to convert conditions into boons

Warriors have plenty of condition removal. It’s just so many warriors are playing the class like the easymode thing it is without putting any thought into their build. You know those rune things? Guess what happens if you put 6 of the ones called ‘Superior Rune of the Soldier’ on? It makes “For Great Justice!” suddenly even better, and likewise with “Shake it Off!”

Not every class should get every thing. Warriors already have it good enough. I’d look at ranger before I even glance at warrior sideways.

Spoken like someone who has never played sPvP before. Thanks for reading the guildwar2 wiki. Go roll a warrior alt and try what you just recommended. Get back to me when you do anything useful with that build.

Some people seem confused. Warriors do have active condition removal. We have extremely poor passive condition removal. I can’t explain it any easier than i did earlier. By passive condition removal i mean condition removal via traits. Pretty much every class has a superior passive condition removal via traits compared to shrug it off which removes 1 condition every 30 seconds if you have more than 1 condition applied to you.

Read my previous post which explains how much more superior other classes versions of these traits are. Most of them can be triggered ~10 seconds or less, and some of them can be triggered back-to-back-to-back and remove multiple conditions in a very short time frame.

This isn’t even a discussion as anet already admitted warriors are hard-countered by conditions and that they have weak condition removal passive.

Healing Signet and Signet of Renewal. Bam. 200 hp regen and remove all conditions with the click of a button. Done.

Warrior

• “shake it off” – 1 condition, stun break, 1 condition for nearby allies as well
• Auto “shake it off” – as above
• Quickening Breath – convert 1 condition to its opposite boon every time you use a warhorn skill + 20% less cd on warhorn skills
• Signet of stamina. – all conditions
• Mending – heal skill and remove 2 conditions

Ranger

• Healing Spring: aoe regen to allies, aoe heal to you and your pet, water field, remove conditions on pulse
• Signet of renewal – remove condition ever 10 sec (lame), active: pet takes conditions from you and allies (haven’t used this personally so don’t know how many conditions are removed).]
• Brown Bear F2: Shake it off, remove 1 condition
• Empathic Bond: pets periodically take conditions from you

Don’t for get, Sigil of Purity – 60% chance to remove a condition on crit – 10sec internal cd

So you expect a warrior to use a warhorn in high end spvp for anything other then swiftness in between running to points? And then you also expect them to trait for it as well? LOL

Auto shake it off is terrible, it removes 1 condition every 30seconds, just absolutely horrible in game where some classes can easily stack 5 conditions on you instantly. And why would you take that trait over something else that is way more beneficial? Signet of Stamina has a pretty damn long cooldown.

Even the lead pvp developer has confirmed warriors have a problem in this department in the State of the Game video.

Archonis.7249:

Warrior is so not the weakest profession in SPvP.

Warriors have a ton of different playstyles that they can use in SPvP. You can got 100B Glass Cannon, Hammer, Duel Axe, Rifle, Sword Sword condi and you can also go support (that is the weakest of all the builds.).

I think that the support role for warrior needs a buff, nothing else though.

The OP mentioned the top end, meaning tournies and such. I would laugh especially hard if I saw a rifle warrior or a sword/sword in tpvp. Warriors do not have viable condition builds so the fact that you would even mention makes me question your whole post. In my experience, it’s pretty much either glass cannon or a CC shout heal build if you are lucky enough to get a spot over another better class in a organized tourney team.

Archonis.7249:

Warrior has condi removal with Signet of Stamina and Shrug it Off.

Ranger is a pretty solid professions, the problem I see with a lot of Rangers in SPvP is that they try to make a balanced build and forget to pick a role. Some that will have some burst or some condition or some survivability, instead of Being full burst, condition or survivability.

Another thing is that this is a team sport, so you don’t always have to rely on yourself for condition removal. I run with a friend that is a guardian and he is always cleansing and healing me.

shake it off removes 1 condition, the signet does remove all conditions, but other than that its useless. It doesn’t heal, it has a long CD, it takes up a utility slot thats needed for more important things. There is a heal called mending that removes 2 conditions its a terrible heal that heals for maybe 1/5 of a warriors HP pool. There is a trait to shake it off automatically but it is a major trait deep in the defense trait line that offers very little value to waste so many points on plus it has a long CD. Thats it folks its very bad for warriors. You then force them into shout builds and force them into specific runes to be viable which nerfs their potential.

x6 superior rune of the soldier = remove a condition on shout

for great justice! 25s cd
shake it off! 25s cd
on my mark! 30s cd

that is 1 + 2 + 1 conditions removed every 25 – 30s
plus healing 1.3k – 1.9k per shout with vigorous shouts trait

warhorn trait -20% cd convert condition into boon

charge 16s cd remove conditions chilled crippled immobilzed and convert a condition into a boon
call to farms 16s cd convert a condition into a boon

that is a total of 9 conditions removed.

mesmer? shatter? need grandmaster trait.
only 4 shatter skills
15s 30s 45s 60s cool down time

ele? no play much. sorry.

guardian? 1 condition per 20s?

Who would trait for a warhorn in spvp? only bad warriors. The rest of your post confirms to even have a chance against condition builds warriors must spec into a cookie cutter 3shouts/soldier runes build.

Recently.1043:

Spoken like someone who has never played sPvP before. Thanks for reading the guildwar2 wiki. Go roll a warrior alt and try what you just recommended. Get back to me when you do anything useful with that build.

It’s like I’m really talking to a pro. I have an 80 warrior and an 80 engineer, and several level 20/40 alts for other classes. Engineers don’t even have passive condition removal, unless you want to count that lol-tastic 3% conversion minor trait. Just learn to play the class and incorporate a few skills to help deal with a condition or two here and there. Even if it means changing your heal skill around, mending is actually incredibly good.

Warriors suck for a different reason in sPvP. Lack of condition removal certainly isn’t it.

Warriors are not bad, they need their tweaks and fixes here and there. Its just others do the job better, whether that means a nerf to those classes or a general buffs to Warriors remains to be seen.

While warriors seem decent but not great, I just pity rangers lol. All of them just pose little to no threat at all at least to my class/spec.

For warriors to survive even a respectable amount of time, they need to go shout build. That got a bit boring. They really need other builds that can give decent survivability.

pot.6805:

So you expect a warrior to use a warhorn in high end spvp for anything other then swiftness in between running to points? And then you also expect them to trait for it as well? LOL

Auto shake it off is terrible, it removes 1 condition every 30seconds, just absolutely horrible in game where some classes can easily stack 5 conditions on you instantly. And why would you take that trait over something else that is way more beneficial? Signet of Stamina has a pretty damn long cooldown.

Even the lead pvp developer has confirmed warriors have a problem in this department in the State of the Game video.

What Warriors? 100Blade warriors? Yeah, sorry. But, that kitten deserves to get CC locked. My cond damage and cond removal warrior has no problems with conditions…at all. If you don’t build for removal why the kitten should you deserve to have it?

Mending: Remove two condition
Shake it Off: Remove a condition
Signet of Stamina: Remove all condition

Warriors complain about condition removal because all of you use always the same build and the same utility. You have to find a new play style, tha bull’s rush kitten can’t fit top players at all.

Panther Chameleon.8465:

pot.6805:

So you expect a warrior to use a warhorn in high end spvp for anything other then swiftness in between running to points? And then you also expect them to trait for it as well? LOL

Auto shake it off is terrible, it removes 1 condition every 30seconds, just absolutely horrible in game where some classes can easily stack 5 conditions on you instantly. And why would you take that trait over something else that is way more beneficial? Signet of Stamina has a pretty damn long cooldown.

Even the lead pvp developer has confirmed warriors have a problem in this department in the State of the Game video.

What Warriors? 100Blade warriors? Yeah, sorry. But, that kitten deserves to get CC locked. My cond damage and cond removal warrior has no problems with conditions…at all. If you don’t build for removal why the kitten should you deserve to have it?

LoL you play a “condition” warrior? That says all I need to know bro. I don’t use 100b. I am hammer/mace+shield shout build. You must play in hotjoins where most ppl are glass cannons and not condition specs.

Zero reading comprehension here… People still listing condition removal skills via actives abilities. Yes warriors (like all classes) have actives/utilities to remove conditions. Almost every other class has passive condition removal via traits that are vastly superior.

For example, my thief can remove a condition every 3 seconds in stealth. I do not need to use a skill designed SOLELY FOR CONDITION REMOVAL TO REMOVE CONDITIONS. So when you respond by listing a skill like “shake it off” which is a skill designed solely to remove conditions, i question your ability to read and/or critically think.

Again, for example i can remove a condition on my elementalist by attuning to water. Do you understand now? Other classes can remove conditions via traits by using skills that are not designed for the primary purpose of condition removal. They can trait to have other skills they use remove conditions instead.

Warriors trait for condition removal is shrug it off. It is probably the worst passive condition removal since it 1.) has a 30 second cd which is significantly higher that other classes (check how often a thief can enter stealth, or a mesmer can shatter, or a ele attune to water, etc…..) and it only removes 1 condition and triggers only if you have more than 1 condition.

I don’t get whats difficult to comprehend. Clearly this trait is sub-par and should be improved and/or replaced with something similar to what other classes have. (my idea was a trait that lets you remove a condition via a burst skill use, but anything that would bring passive condition removal to ~10-12 seconds would be good)

pot.6805:

Panther Chameleon.8465:

pot.6805:

So you expect a warrior to use a warhorn in high end spvp for anything other then swiftness in between running to points? And then you also expect them to trait for it as well? LOL

Auto shake it off is terrible, it removes 1 condition every 30seconds, just absolutely horrible in game where some classes can easily stack 5 conditions on you instantly. And why would you take that trait over something else that is way more beneficial? Signet of Stamina has a pretty damn long cooldown.

Even the lead pvp developer has confirmed warriors have a problem in this department in the State of the Game video.

What Warriors? 100Blade warriors? Yeah, sorry. But, that kitten deserves to get CC locked. My cond damage and cond removal warrior has no problems with conditions…at all. If you don’t build for removal why the kitten should you deserve to have it?

LoL you play a “condition” warrior? That says all I need to know bro. I don’t use 100b. I am hammer/mace+shield shout build. You must play in hotjoins where most ppl are glass cannons and not condition specs.

LOL Hammer warrior having issues? You have an aoe 3 second stun every 8 seconds? LOLOL you’re whining about conditions! Wow that’s all i needed to know! Complaining about getting shutdown by necros who have zero direct stability. If you can’t time a good earthshatter on a necro who already lacks mobility my hat’s off to you, bud. Try and use a ranged weapon and fight the necro on equal ground instead of running whatever FOTM hammer mace build you got going on if it’s ranged conditions that scare you. You’re not going to be blocking any conditions with that worthless shield either.

Both professions have sufficient condition removal. Although I do agree the Ranger needs a fix and a buff. Warrior needs a nerf.