Guild Wars 2

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

trolling is part of it so do it.

Only for those who haven’t grown up yet and still feel the need to act kitteny towards others in order to make themselves feel superior/better in some fashion.

hes right stop the infractions this is actually a good post and I’m sure it does not impose on any of the forum rules.

Braxxus.2904:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

trolling is part of it so do it.

Only for those who haven’t grown up yet and still feel the need to act kitteny towards others in order to make themselves feel superior/better in some fashion.

we must have diff definitions of trolling

I wonder if the new map mechanic could be used to get WvW people involved. After all, orb running is one of the funnest parts in WvW. Thing is we’d have to do the outreaching.

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Is Anet going to do an outreach program?

to who?

nobody wants to play this kind of pvp, if anet was going to do an outreach program there needs to be someone to outreach

there’s a dam good reason why tournament ques never pop and there are only 10 active ten servers up out of a list of hundreds, domination is arguably the worst game mode for mmo pvp because it emphasizes role based gameplay, something arenanet said would not happen, they use this as a tool to disregard responsibility towards real balance issues so everyone stays the way they want them too, even if that isn’t balanced

Seriously?

@SAtaarcoeny.8476
my view on ele = they have crazy burst, crazy cc, crazy heals, crazy condi clear, crazy condis, crazy survivability, they can get out of a battle reset health and do it all over again so even if they are getting beat first attack attempt they will come back and do it again. ( it dont matter how skilled u are a great ele will win) and then to top it all off there elites are the most op eletes in the game. if they need heals for the team or in solo fight the water one (gl beating them 1v1 with that out) or if they need that extra bit of burst for a little more tanky one then they have a dps 1) so overal WTF is all i can say to this.

my view on ranger= they can drop a top tier bunker in 30 seconds. (enough said u would think) they have crazy aoe damage crazy single target damage. they remove every condi every 10 sec, they have entangle elete super crazy op damage and its great for 1v1 and team fights. they are super survivable. u can be a bunker and your pet will kill them fast while they add condis so either one u try and kill ur SOL, they have super speed over 50 times a game on pet swaps so they are so crazy in team fights for reses and stomps. (cc them u say when someone goes down? well i do a smart guard wont let that happen they stability, plus gotta go over there to them cause ele mist forms behind the line so ur dead for over extending) they are super survivable also.

You’re helping people doing what?Sharing your biased opinions?
Where there are unknown mesmers who post videos on youtube of their flawless victory against your typical 0/10/0/30/30 dagger/dagger ele ( so we’re talking about the build as the weapon set itself is not OP at all),
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjUtDw8e8kI&list=PLBF2912D72F052EC7&index=37
we’ve then got people like you considering themself top-players…with that kind of comment quoted above…

I believe the guy on youtube is helping people much more than you ever did in 6 months time, with your little drama queen threads…you little attention seeker, you should stop insulting people’s intelligence.. pls

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

Please, let us know what the top tier games are then.

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

Please, let us know what the top tier games are then.

What genre specifically?

Not to go against the ‘community’ grain here but I find WoW pvp to be a lot more robust and interesting to watch.

I wouldn’t even put it past Path of Exile or D3 in having more indepth and interesting gameplay mechanics just from the sheer size of available builds and concepts thrown around. Not to mention LoL, Dota2, Blood Line Champions, probably even Smite (which seems to already have a larger PvP following).

When compared to other less specific ‘player vs. player’ games, the mechanics of this to even some things like ShootMania, Gunz Online (of all things), TF2 etc. out shine this game on the sheer availability of mechanics, gamestyle and interesting concepts.

What we have here is a standard MMO PvP where targeting isn’t needed. A ‘dodge’ button that really just moves your character X feet and makes you immune to incomming attacks, coupled with 3 point King of the Hill mechanics.

You bundle all of that into lack of build variety, standards across different continents (NA vs EU), a hand full of maps and a lack of any real skill indicator…

Well, you get the point. GW2 is a good show and tell of once interesting mechanics executed in a flawed manner and never followed up on.

Now this is all my opinion, and that’s fine. But ArenaNet shot itself in the foot a long time ago so it’s hard to rally behind them once again just to anticipate let down.

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

I like where things are going then!

Oni.5429:

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjuLeZ5898g

I like where things are going then!

Hey man, I did say CFalcon was top tier! And FYI I mained Fox / Seconded Falcon so I know what he’s capable of. Problem is in the world of tournaments he aint at the top of the food chain. Hence the comparison.

(for example):
http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Tier_list

Eurantien.4632:

I wonder if the new map mechanic could be used to get WvW people involved. After all, orb running is one of the funnest parts in WvW. Thing is we’d have to do the outreaching.

i hope it does bring WVW ppl in.

madatom.5218:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Is Anet going to do an outreach program?

to who?

nobody wants to play this kind of pvp, if anet was going to do an outreach program there needs to be someone to outreach

there’s a dam good reason why tournament ques never pop and there are only 10 active ten servers up out of a list of hundreds, domination is arguably the worst game mode for mmo pvp because it emphasizes role based gameplay, something arenanet said would not happen, they use this as a tool to disregard responsibility towards real balance issues so everyone stays the way they want them too, even if that isn’t balanced

they had a perfectly good reason in SOTG of why this is the only game mode. a death match in this game wouldnt be good because teams would wait until full elites.

what other game type would you want.? i agree with keeping this game mode then adding new objectives in it. like they are adding the orb into it that basically makes a new game mode.

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

i think the pvp is crazy fun in this game we just need more ppl.

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

If a game loses momentum early on it becomes increasingly difficult for them to get their playerbase back.

GW2 sPvP lost its momentum roughly 3-4 months ago. A lot of people have quit or barely play. I myself have moved on to greener pastures and log an equivalent 10 minutes of GW2 time a day, maybe less.

ArenaNet should take notes from Nadeo and their ShootMania series for how they developed the game with competitiveness in mind and decided to not release the game until every piece of the puzzle had been completed.

TLDR:
Low population (lets just say 2,500 and be generous, across all countries).
Little amount of playable modes.
No legitimate ranking system besides time invested.
Lack of variety in class mechanics.

= game on its last legs. I just want people to admit it so we can get past the rose tinted glasses.

I think alot would agree; however the pvp is still some of the best out there. The shame of it all will be that this game will never realize its potential.

Personally, I consider the PvP to the bottom rank among the top tier.

GW2 is to Captain Falcon of SSBM.

Please, let us know what the top tier games are then.

What genre specifically?

Not to go against the ‘community’ grain here but I find WoW pvp to be a lot more robust and interesting to watch.

I wouldn’t even put it past Path of Exile or D3 in having more indepth and interesting gameplay mechanics just from the sheer size of available builds and concepts thrown around. Not to mention LoL, Dota2, Blood Line Champions, probably even Smite (which seems to already have a larger PvP following).

When compared to other less specific ‘player vs. player’ games, the mechanics of this to even some things like ShootMania, Gunz Online (of all things), TF2 etc. out shine this game on the sheer availability of mechanics, gamestyle and interesting concepts.

What we have here is a standard MMO PvP where targeting isn’t needed. A ‘dodge’ button that really just moves your character X feet and makes you immune to incomming attacks, coupled with 3 point King of the Hill mechanics.

You bundle all of that into lack of build variety, standards across different continents (NA vs EU), a hand full of maps and a lack of any real skill indicator…

Well, you get the point. GW2 is a good show and tell of once interesting mechanics executed in a flawed manner and never followed up on.

Now this is all my opinion, and that’s fine. But ArenaNet shot itself in the foot a long time ago so it’s hard to rally behind them once again just to anticipate let down.

if you ever get to see top tier games full great teams vs full great teams this game is really interesting. problem is you dont get to see those games to often.

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

madatom.5218:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Is Anet going to do an outreach program?

to who?

nobody wants to play this kind of pvp, if anet was going to do an outreach program there needs to be someone to outreach

there’s a dam good reason why tournament ques never pop and there are only 10 active ten servers up out of a list of hundreds, domination is arguably the worst game mode for mmo pvp because it emphasizes role based gameplay, something arenanet said would not happen, they use this as a tool to disregard responsibility towards real balance issues so everyone stays the way they want them too, even if that isn’t balanced

they had a perfectly good reason in SOTG of why this is the only game mode. a death match in this game wouldnt be good because teams would wait until full elites.

what other game type would you want.? i agree with keeping this game mode then adding new objectives in it. like they are adding the orb into it that basically makes a new game mode.

I’ve been playing ShootMania and they have a gametype called ‘Battle’.

In battle each team has 2-3 points. (4-6 points total per map think of them like GW2 nodes).

When the round starts, a player must reach a center circle first, when they do, their team gets to go on the ‘Attack’ and the other team is on the ‘Defense’.

If the attacking team is held off an enemy point for 15 seconds, the defending team gets to attack. But if the attacking team gets on a point, the 15 second timer is reset to 15 seconds.

This flips back and forth until either the match timer runs out or until one team captures all 2-3 enemy points.

I think that kind of gamemode would lend itself really well to sPvP and its been an intense gamemode when playing it in ShootMania.

Defektive.7283:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

madatom.5218:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Is Anet going to do an outreach program?

to who?

nobody wants to play this kind of pvp, if anet was going to do an outreach program there needs to be someone to outreach

there’s a dam good reason why tournament ques never pop and there are only 10 active ten servers up out of a list of hundreds, domination is arguably the worst game mode for mmo pvp because it emphasizes role based gameplay, something arenanet said would not happen, they use this as a tool to disregard responsibility towards real balance issues so everyone stays the way they want them too, even if that isn’t balanced

they had a perfectly good reason in SOTG of why this is the only game mode. a death match in this game wouldnt be good because teams would wait until full elites.

what other game type would you want.? i agree with keeping this game mode then adding new objectives in it. like they are adding the orb into it that basically makes a new game mode.

I’ve been playing ShootMania and they have a gametype called ‘Battle’.

In battle each team has 2-3 points. (4-6 points total per map think of them like GW2 nodes).

When the round starts, a player must reach a center circle first, when they do, their team gets to go on the ‘Attack’ and the other team is on the ‘Defense’.

If the attacking team is held off an enemy point for 15 seconds, the defending team gets to attack. But if the attacking team gets on a point, the 15 second timer is reset to 15 seconds.

This flips back and forth until either the match timer runs out or until one team captures all 2-3 enemy points.

I think that kind of gamemode would lend itself really well to sPvP and its been an intense gamemode when playing it in ShootMania.

That sounds fun and easily supported in gw2’s current form. Make it happen!

no matter how you promote this game it’s still bad and not worth playing

Pyrial.2917:

Defektive.7283:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

madatom.5218:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Is Anet going to do an outreach program?

to who?

nobody wants to play this kind of pvp, if anet was going to do an outreach program there needs to be someone to outreach

there’s a dam good reason why tournament ques never pop and there are only 10 active ten servers up out of a list of hundreds, domination is arguably the worst game mode for mmo pvp because it emphasizes role based gameplay, something arenanet said would not happen, they use this as a tool to disregard responsibility towards real balance issues so everyone stays the way they want them too, even if that isn’t balanced

they had a perfectly good reason in SOTG of why this is the only game mode. a death match in this game wouldnt be good because teams would wait until full elites.

what other game type would you want.? i agree with keeping this game mode then adding new objectives in it. like they are adding the orb into it that basically makes a new game mode.

I’ve been playing ShootMania and they have a gametype called ‘Battle’.

In battle each team has 2-3 points. (4-6 points total per map think of them like GW2 nodes).

When the round starts, a player must reach a center circle first, when they do, their team gets to go on the ‘Attack’ and the other team is on the ‘Defense’.

If the attacking team is held off an enemy point for 15 seconds, the defending team gets to attack. But if the attacking team gets on a point, the 15 second timer is reset to 15 seconds.

This flips back and forth until either the match timer runs out or until one team captures all 2-3 enemy points.

I think that kind of gamemode would lend itself really well to sPvP and its been an intense gamemode when playing it in ShootMania.

That sounds fun and easily supported in gw2’s current form. Make it happen!

At the speed this game gets developed, we’ll be lucky to see this type of game mode in the next 12-18 months.

All hope is lost. We need to stop tiptoeing around it.

great reply folly. everything u said was dead on.

its frustrating for me cause all my friends that left are telling me we have a team for gears of war 4 and sponcers and we are signed up for game battles. im a die hard guild wars fan boy but they need to fix there kitten.

they need to give us free transfers to EU whenever we want and let EU transfer to NA whenever they want. and they need to let us in on whats happening like u said those private meetings being held by ppl that dont play the game is really frustrating. (when i say dont play the game i mean are not on enough to know whats really going on)

idk we will see what happens. but i know if they have game breaking bugs or nerf me to uselessness again and try and leave the game like that for 1-2 months again then i gotta cut the tie. they wont care 1 out of 3 million dont matter but it should.

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

they had a perfectly good reason in SOTG of why this is the only game mode. a death match in this game wouldnt be good <strong>because teams would wait until full elites</strong>

thats not a good reason at all, if this is the case balance the skills to either promote or discourage this type of gameplay

again this is simply arenanet trying to shift responsibility away
role based metas that are built into the character/class mechanics is the worst thing for esports/gaming unless the teams are substantially sized (like in tribes) or its not an mmo

we have this thing called balancing for skill and balancing for counters and esports need to include both

balancing for skill is a very simple concept, the higher the difficulty of the execution is the more power you should get, balancing a class around long CDs and dealing large amounts of damage with very few button presses is not acceptable, nor is creating a class thats so over complex that when played at its best level is vastly more powerful then anything else in the game (as it throws out the majority and dominates)

balancing for counter is a harder concept to understand but probably more important, its essentially the idea that if X player uses X skill then Y player should have a number of skills or tools at his disposal to deal with it, when you dont give players these tools they will find that they are helpless and just end up quiting, when you give players too many tools the attacking player will find that there attacks are useless and just end up quitting again

these issues become more glaring issues when only some classes have access to the utility needed to deal with certain situations, things like mesmer portal or quickness are terribly designed mechanics because the mesmer portal OVERVALUES the mesmer and quickness DOES NOT SCALE EQUALLY across all classes (rangers are DEPENDENT on it, elementalists get almost no gain aside from casting churning earth faster)

if you balanced for deathmatch you can seamlessly integrate all other gamemodes and thats because most video games with it as the priority gamemode often demand the player to be offensive, defensive and aware and these concepts transfer well into other gamemodes

balancing around dom forces players to be ONLY defensive or ONLY offensive, classes that overperform in these roles will be prioritized over others, this causes bad balance

now on an unrelated note damage in this game in general is WAY too high and some classes dont seem to be well designed for players with higher latency (such as australians) a good example of this would be burning speed which likes to randomly overshoot or undershoot targets and it appears this happens because im 250 ms behind because i tend to rubberband after casting the spell, should probebly act like a leap finisher without being an actual leap finisher (so no auras into oblivion)
another example is with the infamous oneshot thief, the thief uses the combo while i might use lightning flash as a stunbreak, to teleport away but latency dictates that im downed and teleporting (so it basically looks like i just used lightning flash while in a downed state to the other player)

wow i said alot

One of the fastest ways to improve reputation would be to openly declare war on ANY one-shot combo in the game.

Nobody should be flatly laid out by cheese combos such as mug→c&d→backstab or haste + 2 2 2 2 2 or what have you before the packets reach you from the server.

well hopefully adding the capture the orb thing helps out. i understand why ppl say it seems like they are just making excuses. but they seemed really sure that this was the best game mode for the game.

Extremely well written and enlightening posts, Follidus. I completely agree with every letter of it.

Let us pray to the nine divines that arenanet actually reads it, chances are though that even if they do they will not let us know that they’ve read it.

There’s too much sense in this thread. TOO MUCH.

OMG IGNORE IGNORE.

Jokes aside, Follidus is completely right.

There’s no point in promoting an unfinished product.

The real risk is that if you don’t promote, players won’t come, and in MMO market it’s really important to have a consilidated playerbase EVEN BEFORE you start promoting.

As things are right now, this consolidated playerbase is not there, and the environmnent is very, VERY frustrating for new players.

There’s not even an incentive for playing PvP over the PvE/WvW side of the game.

Imo, along with the structure to sustain PvP, they need to make the PvP side of this game more rewarding for the casual/PvE player, and both things need to be developed altoghether.

There’s a chance that a bunch of PvE players trying PvP because the rewards are good, will like it.
There’s a chance that among those players, there will be a smaller bunch of skilled ones forming a team that is going to challenge PZ, or Chieftain Ninjas, or Team Curse, or Cute for the leadership.

Without the playerbase playing it, there’s no point in having even the greatest PvP structure of the world.

It’s amazing how people can fool themselves, the game is great! we just don’t have enough players. Sure, sure.
It reminds me of that dude who tries to sell the house for 200.000 but can’t, so instead of accepting reality itself, he tries to reason why he cant do it, it must be the economy, you know, the bubble, the employment, etc etc. Sure, sure, just wait 1 year and everything will be fine.
But hey, i’m not ur mother, so if u want to keep playing and believing in the second coming of guild wars 2 pvp, our saviour, it’s ok. I mean, it could be way worse, you could be in a park getting high with LSD.

Baldric.6781:

It’s amazing how people can fool themselves, the game is great! we just don’t have enough players. Sure, sure.
It reminds me of that dude who tries to sell the house for 200.000 but can’t, so instead of accepting reality itself, he tries to reason why he cant do it, it must be the economy, you know, the bubble, the employment, etc etc. Sure, sure, just wait 1 year and everything will be fine.
But hey, i’m not ur mother, so if u want to keep playing and believing in the second coming of guild wars 2 pvp, our saviour, it’s ok. I mean, it could be way worse, you could be in a park getting high with LSD.

Sounds like a night on the town to me.

Baldric.6781:

It’s amazing how people can fool themselves, the game is great! we just don’t have enough players. Sure, sure.
It reminds me of that dude who tries to sell the house for 200.000 but can’t, so instead of accepting reality itself, he tries to reason why he cant do it, it must be the economy, you know, the bubble, the employment, etc etc. Sure, sure, just wait 1 year and everything will be fine.
But hey, i’m not ur mother, so if u want to keep playing and believing in the second coming of guild wars 2 pvp, our saviour, it’s ok. I mean, it could be way worse, you could be in a park getting high with LSD.

This is so sad but true. Everyone knows that no one is playing pvp, that the big problem is that everyone left pvp to do other things. That the percentage of pvp’ers out of the total GW2 population is much lower than that of any other game. This is clear, and yet GW2 pvp is the best of the best? How can GW2 pvp be any good if no one wants to play it? Before you say “oh well the combat is good its just all the other things”, if that was true people would be playing it. Look at wow, its balance is crap, it does not have ranking, it does not have a MM system, it does not have spectator mode (talking about battle grounds, and the years before arena). But its pvp is fun. At the end of the day the PVP has to be fun for all players, and this is were GW2 pvp fails.

PvP died. They released the game WAY to early. When a game comes out and is missing its KEY features that its previous one had, there’s something wrong. This is what happens people when you bite off more than you can chew, the WvW thing and PvP thing was cool, but lets face it they had to dedicate A LOT of time to WvW. WvW is the big money maker. When have you heard of a game picking back up after it died? And yes it has died, I’m comparing it to beta. So all I can say is GL to Anet in their next life.

Let’s be serious here people, SPVP in guilds war 2 is just a stinker, it might stink less if they ever add proper mmr/leaderboards, soloq, spectators, custom servers etc, but it will still stink plenty. The reason for it is that there is so much things wrong with spvp besides the things mentioned above that short of a complete rework or a major update of some of games core features like combat, nothing really can’t be done.

You can put your pink glasses and go "spvp will be better then jesus once they add the kitten that was supposed to be there on release’’ but let’s get real, it won’t.

The problem with spvp for many of us pvers and wvwvwers is that it feels detached from the game… those exotic skins you worked hard for? Gone. That careful stat planning? Gone. Your racial abilities? Gone. It sacrifices a lot of things for the sake of “balance” and frankly I dont think it works given how unpopular hotm is.

Yes the new map may look fun, but still I dont feel like I am playing my hero character.. I get this lame outfit and I cant customize my stats the way they are in wvwvw.

They may chose to continue to create new maps, but the core problem will still exist. I would probably be more willing to try spvp if I could at least import my exotic skins and stats from wvwvw.

Mrbig.8019:

There’s too much sense in this thread. TOO MUCH.

OMG IGNORE IGNORE.

Jokes aside, Follidus is completely right.

There’s no point in promoting an unfinished product.

The real risk is that if you don’t promote, players won’t come, and in MMO market it’s really important to have a consilidated playerbase EVEN BEFORE you start promoting.

As things are right now, this consolidated playerbase is not there, and the environmnent is very, VERY frustrating for new players.

There’s not even an incentive for playing PvP over the PvE/WvW side of the game.

Imo, along with the structure to sustain PvP, they need to make the PvP side of this game more rewarding for the casual/PvE player, and both things need to be developed altoghether.

There’s a chance that a bunch of PvE players trying PvP because the rewards are good, will like it.
There’s a chance that among those players, there will be a smaller bunch of skilled ones forming a team that is going to challenge PZ, or Chieftain Ninjas, or Team Curse, or Cute for the leadership.

Without the playerbase playing it, there’s no point in having even the greatest PvP structure of the world.

in SWTOR u get xp for pvp. u think that would help? maybe do dailies and weeklies that give gems and gold?

aaron.7850:

The problem with spvp for many of us pvers and wvwvwers is that it feels detached from the game… those exotic skins you worked hard for? Gone. That careful stat planning? Gone. Your racial abilities? Gone. It sacrifices a lot of things for the sake of “balance” and frankly I dont think it works given how unpopular hotm is.

Yes the new map may look fun, but still I dont feel like I am playing my hero character.. I get this lame outfit and I cant customize my stats the way they are in wvwvw.

They may chose to continue to create new maps, but the core problem will still exist. I would probably be more willing to try spvp if I could at least import my exotic skins and stats from wvwvw.

I don’t see a problem with allowing skins, but why do you need “your” stats?

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Mrbig.8019:

There’s too much sense in this thread. TOO MUCH.

OMG IGNORE IGNORE.

Jokes aside, Follidus is completely right.

There’s no point in promoting an unfinished product.

The real risk is that if you don’t promote, players won’t come, and in MMO market it’s really important to have a consilidated playerbase EVEN BEFORE you start promoting.

As things are right now, this consolidated playerbase is not there, and the environmnent is very, VERY frustrating for new players.

There’s not even an incentive for playing PvP over the PvE/WvW side of the game.

Imo, along with the structure to sustain PvP, they need to make the PvP side of this game more rewarding for the casual/PvE player, and both things need to be developed altoghether.

There’s a chance that a bunch of PvE players trying PvP because the rewards are good, will like it.
There’s a chance that among those players, there will be a smaller bunch of skilled ones forming a team that is going to challenge PZ, or Chieftain Ninjas, or Team Curse, or Cute for the leadership.

Without the playerbase playing it, there’s no point in having even the greatest PvP structure of the world.

in SWTOR u get xp for pvp. u think that would help? maybe do dailies and weeklies that give gems and gold?

Exp while PvPing is already a good reward. WoW started doing it in the recent WOTLK and it was indeed a sucess.

Gold/gems on dailies, altough controlled, could mine PvE gold sinks stability, since they would create a “null creation” of gold/gems from nowhere, and since gems can be turned into gold, the economy would “crash”.

That is the main reason why they removed gems form paids rewards as soon as they reduced the entry barrier ( aka: ticket cost) : gems would become too easily accessible for PvP players, mining the PvE economy ( there’s no control over them, and there’s no way to tell if the PvP player with tons of gems is going to spend them for tickets or simply turning them into gold that will flow into the PvE economy, breaking it).

I’m not very confident about how PvE stuff is generated, but i surely know exotics are obtained via dungeons token, and legendaries/ascension stuff is obtained via tokens+ certain crafting stuff.

Knowing this, personally i would change the system like this

- remove hotjoins and make mathces “ranked” and “not ranked”

- remove the tournament system and make all matches 1team vs 1team with normal maps rotation

- unranked will be 5vs5 ( remove 8vs8) with 1 minute to plan your strategy

- ranked will be like current paid system is

as long as the rewards are concerned:

- increase and differentiate the number of dailies available ( like capture Y points, then capture Y x 2 points to get another daily after completing Y daily, kinda like the “avenger”, “ransacker” titles and stuff like that).

- improve daily rewards
how

Let’s say we have 3 dailies based on capturing 10, 30, 60 ( random numbers) points.

After completing the first daily ( 10) you get a certain amount of glory, after the second (20) you get double amount of glory + karma, with the third you get glory, + karma + a random PvE dungeon token

Let’s say we have 6 kinds of dailies ( point capture, point defense, trebuchet master, guild lord slayer, master of the hunt and orb capture) with 3 stages for every daily.

If you complete 50 % of all these dailies, you are rewarded with a glory booster + a tournament ticket.

If you complete 100 % of these dailies, you’re rewarded with 5 random PvE dungeon tokens + 3 tickets + glory+ karma

paid rewards

- paid chest will always contain 3-5 random PvE dungeon tokens + glory + karma+ random booster+ random stuff to craft ascension gear and legendaries ( not sure about this, i have no idea how to craft them).

Since you need stuff like 200-300 tokens for a single PvE dungeon exotic piece of armor, and since there are kinda like 8 different dungeons with 8 different kinds of tokens, gaining a full set via PvP will be very tough, but you’ll be able to gain exotics via PvP.

Overall, without doing any paid, you would be able to obtain a total of 11 random PvE tokens per day.

This will make PvE players RAGE JOIN PvP, and PvE won’t be felt as separeted from the rest of the game.

Of course numbers are totally made up, but you got the general idea.

Development time and updates for PvP in this game move at a snails pace. In sPvP every class is still limited to a select few full attack or bunker builds. Balanced builds just get destroyed. There is no incentive to play. You cannot get quick matches with friends against quality opponents. If you queue with friends you end up waiting around. Solo queuing is boring and monotonous.

If you include WvW updates then there still is no ascended gear acquisition through WvW. The dailies/monthly are PvE updates. And ascended gear is actually a turnoff to a lot of PvP players.

While I am looking forward to the March PvP updates I do not believe it will be enough. They will have good changes, needed changes/updates, but they need to do a lot more. People will not come back in droves like I think Arenanet is expecting to happen.

They need to make it easier to play with friends, get matches quicker, give more incentives, and make balance changes that allow for more variety in builds. Tournaments need an overhaul. Expecting people to buy tickets to do daily competitive PvP is silly. You do not have to spend a dime to do the most difficult PvE in the game. Why should PvP players? Monthly and yearly tournaments is a different matter.

They need to focus on making PvP fun for more people. By focusing on money, buying tickets and going for e-sports, they have created a system that is simply not fun to bunch of PvP players I know.

I started this game with 20+ guildies that I have played with long before this game. all of them focus on PvP. All of them have quit simply because they were not having fun. Their reasons vary but it all comes down to having fun with friends. I am now alone, bored out of my mind, and only log in to do the PvE daily. I am dangerously close to quitting before the March update.

Probably the most sensible post I’ve read. The Feb and March patches better be kitten good or else it could be the end.

PenguinEchoed.2480:

Probably the most sensible post I’ve read. The Feb and March patches better be kitten good or else it could be the end.

I’m actually fairly pleased with the recent trend (particularly the SotG and the discussions that ensue with developers fairly active on the forums, and the general activity of the devs when stuff is announced). The new map and pseudo-mode make me decently happy and I look forward to them (I haven’t heard/paid attention but is the new map going to be the new map for 1v1s in paids?), and I hope we get a sizeable and worthwhile balance patch as that’s a month overdue now.

@ mrbig. sounds all really good. i just wish ANET would brain storm with us ask the community what they want to see and tell us what anet wants to do.

@ frellin i am close to leaving also just because there is no ppl. im willing to stay through all the bs while we wait for new content. but if there is no ppl there is no point. i hope they do like a 2-4 week free mist trial.

@penguin. its how alot of us fell and noone i know wants to say it might be the end because we dont want anet to get discouraged but they can let us know how to help.

When bugged traits and skills which are a global issue for the entire game aren’t dealt with. I wonder if this format will get the attention it needs.

I think you talk enough tbh. Maybe too much because though I’m sure your jobs are hardI ddon’t see a lot of anything going on brah. Weren’t things put on hold to get custom arenas but they ain’t here?

Follidus.8027:

I really get tired of making these long posts because no one ever reads them, and for some reason I always get called bad, or an elitist. But here are some of my thoughts because sata asked me to:

1) this game shouldn’t get mass promoted until these things are implemented:
- private servers

- weekly/monthly/yearly tournaments

- dueling without having to join an empty server, or a private server.

- rating system (when it’s done being tested + has a place where people can view the ladder that is updated consistently. You can’t do what you did with QPs and have a forum post with a list that’s updated for a few days straight, and then a week later. Needs to be consistent. Having it instantly update would be even better.)

- Tutorials that show people the difference between running a stun break + not running a stun break. Something that takes you into your own private instance, similar to the storyline for pve. This instance has an instructor that teaches you some of the fundamentals about the game. You’ll have different instances for different things. One thing is showing the importance of a stun break, and it’s shown by having a glass cannon warrior use bull’s charge > frenzy > hundred blades on you. The instructor will say “use mist form when the warrior charges you to break the stun.” or whatever stun break it is that is provided for you. This will help solve the issue of new players getting destroyed by these types of builds. For this game to succeed you either have to implement these type of tutorials, or nerf these builds so that new players/hotjoin players don’t get destroyed and quit. If you want this game to be a skillful game, then you need to teach people. End of story.

The goal here is to get new people as well as older people back to the game, but you need them to stay. Nothing is going to change if you don’t have these things in place. The game itself is amazing, but these things need to be introduced.

---

You should be learning from your mistakes
You should be learning from your mistakes
You should be learning from your mistakes
x1000000!
—-

- When you released the game (which I realize was rushed due to forces out of your control, where you had to release it before WoW hit, but learn from this.) there was so much hype about the pvp, yet there were so many things lacking. You can’t do this again, which is why you need to have things in place before you try to promote this game’s pvp, whether it’s new players, players that quit, or even the PvE/WvW players.

- YOU NEED TO BE ABSOLUTELY kittenING TRANSPARENT ABOUT WHAT YOU ARE DOING. I can’t say this enough, it’s simply infuriating that you don’t do this. Making people guess in-game and on the forum if there’s a rating system in place? Don’t take this the wrong way, but what the kitten are you thinking? This is simply unacceptable and a big reason why people are quitting + unsure about when to come back. You need to say what you’re doing, why something isn’t coming when it’s planned, and what happened. You need to be specific. “Our coders couldn’t solve this issue as fast as we planned.” It doesn’t matter what it is, you need to say what the problem is. If you think it’s that bad and don’t say anything, then people, as a whole, are going to think of the worst thing they can think of. For example, look at all the people that say/think things like “X is never coming out, they have no progress on it, this game will be dead before it comes out.”

Lets say you have a meeting at 12:00. You’ll probably want to get there at 11:45 or something to give you enough time in case something goes wrong, right? Lets say something does go wrong, you’ll probably want to give the person a call when this happens, and tell them you’ll be late, right? If you know it’ll be 10 minutes, but maybe more, until you get there, you don’t say you will only be 5 minutes, right? You don’t say you will only be 10 minutes, right? You’ll say it will be 10-15 minutes. This is the kinda kitten you need to do with this game.

In marketing there’s a concept where if you mess up, admit to it + try to correct the mistake, then people will like you more than if you never made that mistake at all. Similarly, if you say “x has been done so far, Y is what we were working on, however we made some mistakes so it’s taking longer than the when we told you; The October Patch. In the mean time, this is our plan: ’whatever your plan is” then that’s a lot better than saying nothing at all, or saying “it’s coming soon,” or “it will be done when it’s done.”

Even on the current ranking system, tell people what you’re testing and why. You can’t just say “it benefits us if we keep the same map for the whole week.” You need to explain why.

Quoted for more emphasis.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Nice post Folly. I agree with your points overall, though I’m going to speak primarily to your points about communication, community involvement and transparency.

The trick with our communication, is to find a good balance, on multiple levels.

First, we have to be conscious of the balance between how much time we have to be posting on the forums and writing blog posts, with how much time we have to be working on actual development: bug fixes, profession balance, designing new features, implementing new content, etc.

Next it’s important for us to be conscious of the balance between saying too little, leaving people pessimistic about when things are coming out and guessing about how those things will work, and saying too much, harming our ability to later change, postpone or abandon something that we’ve already publicly committed to.

Finally we need to consider the balance between relying on community feedback too heavily, where it’s super time consuming for us to process and leaves us feeling unable to make a change without first asking for a community vote, and relying on community feedback too little, where we might miss some key information that could impact the success of our future releases.

Hopefully we are getting this balance pretty close most of the time, and if not, it’s always something we are working towards improving.

Anyway, keep up the good, constructive posts!

I’m sorry, but no, you are not getting the balance anywhere near close. How can you think that you are communicating effectively when the dev tracker would be almost dead if not for all the support/moderation posts? How can you say it’s fine when there’s a company like Riot where devs post constantly every day and regularly have huge discussions with the player base? How can you say you’re doing well when no one has any idea what you are doing except for the extremely minimal press releases?

Sorry to jump down your throat when you are at least here and trying, but you shouldn’t be looking at the amount of communication the company does and thinking ’Ya, we do a pretty good job." You should be looking at your communication and saying, “Holy crap, this is one of the biggest problems we have and we need to make major improvements.”

dreztina.4820:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Nice post Folly. I agree with your points overall, though I’m going to speak primarily to your points about communication, community involvement and transparency.

The trick with our communication, is to find a good balance, on multiple levels.

First, we have to be conscious of the balance between how much time we have to be posting on the forums and writing blog posts, with how much time we have to be working on actual development: bug fixes, profession balance, designing new features, implementing new content, etc.

Next it’s important for us to be conscious of the balance between saying too little, leaving people pessimistic about when things are coming out and guessing about how those things will work, and saying too much, harming our ability to later change, postpone or abandon something that we’ve already publicly committed to.

Finally we need to consider the balance between relying on community feedback too heavily, where it’s super time consuming for us to process and leaves us feeling unable to make a change without first asking for a community vote, and relying on community feedback too little, where we might miss some key information that could impact the success of our future releases.

Hopefully we are getting this balance pretty close most of the time, and if not, it’s always something we are working towards improving.

Anyway, keep up the good, constructive posts!

I’m sorry, but no, you are not getting the balance anywhere near close. How can you think that you are communicating effectively when the dev tracker would be almost dead if not for all the support/moderation posts? How can you say it’s fine when there’s a company like Riot where devs post constantly every day and regularly have huge discussions with the player base? How can you say you’re doing well when no one has any idea what you are doing except for the extremely minimal press releases?

Sorry to jump down your throat when you are at least here and trying, but you shouldn’t be looking at the amount of communication the company does and thinking ’Ya, we do a pretty good job." You should be looking at your communication and saying, “Holy crap, this is one of the biggest problems we have and we need to make major improvements.”

Quoted for even more emphasis. I’d make a long post of my own, but it’s 5am.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Nice post Folly. I agree with your points overall, though I’m going to speak primarily to your points about communication, community involvement and transparency.

The trick with our communication, is to find a good balance, on multiple levels.

First, we have to be conscious of the balance between how much time we have to be posting on the forums and writing blog posts, with how much time we have to be working on actual development: bug fixes, profession balance, designing new features, implementing new content, etc.

Next it’s important for us to be conscious of the balance between saying too little, leaving people pessimistic about when things are coming out and guessing about how those things will work, and saying too much, harming our ability to later change, postpone or abandon something that we’ve already publicly committed to.

Finally we need to consider the balance between relying on community feedback too heavily, where it’s super time consuming for us to process and leaves us feeling unable to make a change without first asking for a community vote, and relying on community feedback too little, where we might miss some key information that could impact the success of our future releases.

Hopefully we are getting this balance pretty close most of the time, and if not, it’s always something we are working towards improving.

Anyway, keep up the good, constructive posts!

I’m sorry , but you’re nowhere near to finding that balance.
it’s not about HOW MUCH you talk, it’s about HOW TRANSPARENT you are.
As players, we have literally no idea about what you’re doing, what are your plans for the future anf how are you going to realize them.

we have literally no idea

have you ever heard of social dilemmas ?
altough this is not properly the case, the psychological implications are pretty much the same.
the only difference is that while in social dilemmas, without informations about the common resource, ,people get mad and don’t care about the better way to use it, in this game, without informations, people just get mad and leave.
LEAVE.

your “customer care” marketing strategy is one of the most awful things I have ever seen.
at least it gives me hopes I’ll be good at my job (that is marketing, guess what).

if you really think you’re being trasparent enough, than I hope the small playerbase you’re going to hold with your terribad communication, will be at least profitable.

personally, I don’t know how long I’m going to last with this game.

Mrbig.8019:

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Nice post Folly. I agree with your points overall, though I’m going to speak primarily to your points about communication, community involvement and transparency.

The trick with our communication, is to find a good balance, on multiple levels.

First, we have to be conscious of the balance between how much time we have to be posting on the forums and writing blog posts, with how much time we have to be working on actual development: bug fixes, profession balance, designing new features, implementing new content, etc.

Next it’s important for us to be conscious of the balance between saying too little, leaving people pessimistic about when things are coming out and guessing about how those things will work, and saying too much, harming our ability to later change, postpone or abandon something that we’ve already publicly committed to.

Finally we need to consider the balance between relying on community feedback too heavily, where it’s super time consuming for us to process and leaves us feeling unable to make a change without first asking for a community vote, and relying on community feedback too little, where we might miss some key information that could impact the success of our future releases.

Hopefully we are getting this balance pretty close most of the time, and if not, it’s always something we are working towards improving.

Anyway, keep up the good, constructive posts!

I’m sorry , but you’re nowhere near to finding that balance.
it’s not about HOW MUCH you talk, it’s about HOW TRANSPARENT you are.
As players, we have literally no idea about what you’re doing, what are your plans for the future anf how are you going to realize them.

we have literally no idea

have you ever heard of social dilemmas ?
altough this is not properly the case, the psychological implications are pretty much the same.
the only difference is that while in social dilemmas, without informations about the common resource, ,people get mad and don’t care about the better way to use it, in this game, without informations, people just get mad and leave.
LEAVE.

your “customer care” marketing strategy is one of the most awful things I have ever seen.
at least it gives me hopes I’ll be good at my job (that is marketing, guess what).

if you really think you’re being trasparent enough, than I hope the small playerbase you’re going to hold with your terribad communication, will be at least profitable.

personally, I don’t know how long I’m going to last with this game.

This is true. People are more likely to jump to conclusions the less they know about something. When things turn sour, and things currently are, silence feeds concerns.