Guild Wars 2

so when are you going to fix all of the necro bugs? You didn’t even hit on any of the important ones last patch.

JonathanSharp.7094:

A while ago Jon Peters said something that has been taken out of context. He said that only two people were working on the things he was working on (which was true – but he meant it differently than how it was received) and people have taken that to mean that we only have 2 people working on balance, or PvP, or both (at this point it’s morphed into different things in different threads). …SNIP…

I just wanted to clear this up to let you guys know a little bit more of what happens here inside the studio so you understand more of what Peters was trying to say. He’s just as busy as we all are, and with a lot of us gone for Thanksgiving (he’s not here right now), I just took it upon myself to try to clear this up a little.

Cheers

I’m glad you clarified this, but it still raises some serious questions about staffing. When other MMOs have a designer devoted to each class/profession, with people above them and below them bringing everything together, the lack of developers dedicated to each profession in GW2 seems to be serious deficiency, especially since it has been acknowledged that there is a lot more on in the pipeline for each profession than the limited staff can handle in a timely fashion.

I see GW2 as balancing on the edge of a very sharp blade right now, with the difference between snowballing success and dwindling interest hanging in the balance. I don’t think you guys have six months to fix balance and content issues that should have been fixed yesterday. Profession balance is an ongoing thing, most of us get that, but the current profession issues are fairly massive and are having an impact on the success/failure trajectory of the game.

I don’t see how you can do what needs to be done in a timely manner with out addressing the issue of insufficient personnel assigned to key tasks necessary for the ongoing health of the game. Whether it’s new hires or re-assignment of existing personnel, something needs to be done.

I love the game (over 500 hours logged so far), love Arenanet, but I can’t shake the feeling that the massive potential associated with this game is slipping away as many key issues go unresolved due to issues with development resources.

Balance issues aside, there are still dozens of DEs that remain broken since launch and every time a player runs across them and finds them still broken, it sucks a little more life from the game.

I want to game to be a huge, ongoing success, but I have to admit I’m worried.

@ArenaNet
Maybe this has been asked before and I missed it… but how exactly do you find out about “necessary” changes? For me almost every patch destroyed a bit of the fun I had with my chosen profession(s) – I’d say I like 20% of the changes and hate 80% so far. So it’s kinda safe to say YOUR ideas are not what I think about those classes, balance, mechanics and stuff.

However – there might be good reasons behind the changes, but to me in the first place it looks like “someone said this and that skill is way too powerful (in damage, duration, utility, whatever) – please change that!” (or in short “xxx is OP —> Nerf!!!”). And you do it.

So… do you
(1) heavily analyze the log files and draw your conclusion from statistics on what classes are played when and for what, what skills they use, how often they die or kill other players etc? What are the key numbers you watch?
(2) browse forums (if so – which ones) and if just enough player ask for something you consider including it in a patch?
(3) actually play the game or have a couple of people playing the game (kind of a reference team to eliminate or “level” the “human” factor) and analyze those games and get recommendations from these people
(4) every of the game designer team just tries to come up with some “cool” ideas and if the team likes it… you include those in the patch (joking)
(5) do something else?

Please shed some light on this. When I can understand how and why you change classes in a certain way and what probably might be a “final” role/position in PvE, sPvP, WvW etc. it would be way easier for me to decide and stick on a certain class/build and learn to play that class in the way it was meant to be played.

This might be a personal thingie… so no offense meant. I am sure all the people, that are comfortable with playing flavour of the month classes/builds/playstyles depending on current patch status won’t have a problem at all… but that’s not me and not what I want from that game.

Kind regards,

AllieMurdock.1785:

We absolutely have PvE in mind when balance changes are made. Our designers, while having certain projects they work on (PvP, WvW, dungeons, etc.), are invested in the overall feel of combat in the game. It is a delicate balance, no doubt, but one we take very seriously.

Thank you for your constructive feedback, and feel free to make suggestions where you think changes could be made.

Thank you so much Allie. Such a relief. I know a lot of people see end-game in GW2 = PvP or WvW but I’m really hoping it wouldn’t be. I’m a bit of a carebear when I play MMO’s (I don’t like the idea of killing other PC’s) and I really enjoy the PvE aspect of GW2 a lot.

Once again, such great response from your team on this thread. TY vm.

Thanks for the update and insight. I do appreciate it and am for the most part happy with the game. I’m having a blast playing WvWvW on my Ranger, but I know there are issues with both of those things that need to be addressed.

My comment is a general one; I would much rather see more focus on fixing issues with the product that’s already out there before coming up with new content and events. For example, I’d much much rather someone be working near full-time on fixing the problems with Ranger pets, as opposed to doing stuff like animating candy-corn figures for Halloween. I know the game will always undergo changes, but I think the adage “in order to finish first, first you must finish” applies.

pyronix.4081:

AllieMurdock.1785:

We absolutely have PvE in mind when balance changes are made. Our designers, while having certain projects they work on (PvP, WvW, dungeons, etc.), are invested in the overall feel of combat in the game. It is a delicate balance, no doubt, but one we take very seriously.

Thank you for your constructive feedback, and feel free to make suggestions where you think changes could be made.

Thank you so much Allie. Such a relief. I know a lot of people see end-game in GW2 = PvP or WvW but I’m really hoping it wouldn’t be. I’m a bit of a carebear when I play MMO’s (I don’t like the idea of killing other PC’s) and I really enjoy the PvE aspect of GW2 a lot.

Once again, such great response from your team on this thread. TY vm.

Good thing you came in here and cleared it up. Apparently the huge amount of PvE content released in comparison to PvP stuff wasn’t a big enough hint of where their focus was. Do you even read the patch notes? The vast majority of things are for PvE players.

Seether.7285:

pyronix.4081:

AllieMurdock.1785:

We absolutely have PvE in mind when balance changes are made. Our designers, while having certain projects they work on (PvP, WvW, dungeons, etc.), are invested in the overall feel of combat in the game. It is a delicate balance, no doubt, but one we take very seriously.

Thank you for your constructive feedback, and feel free to make suggestions where you think changes could be made.

Thank you so much Allie. Such a relief. I know a lot of people see end-game in GW2 = PvP or WvW but I’m really hoping it wouldn’t be. I’m a bit of a carebear when I play MMO’s (I don’t like the idea of killing other PC’s) and I really enjoy the PvE aspect of GW2 a lot.

Once again, such great response from your team on this thread. TY vm.

Good thing you came in here and cleared it up. Apparently the huge amount of PvE content released in comparison to PvP stuff wasn’t a big enough hint of where their focus was. Do you even read the patch notes? The vast majority of things are for PvE players.

The discussion was about balance, and I was talking in the context of balance based on Jonathan’s reply.

Also, you can do without the condescending tone.

AllieMurdock.1785:

Thank you for your constructive feedback, and feel free to make suggestions where you think changes could be made.

Try taking a look at the class forums, we’re doing this all the time to no avail. No responses, no outcome. You won’t believe it, but there are actually good suggestions on how to improve the balancing for all classes in all forums, not the type of statement you’d expect (like “increase our dps by 200% and make us invincible, then we’re fine”). People are actually thinking on ways to improve the game for everybody, unlike your strange attempts at balancing (like increasing the mesmer portal cooldown from 60s to 90s, which fixes none of the underlying problems and changes basically nothing).

Iruwen.3164:

strange attempts at balancing (like increasing the mesmer portal cooldown from 60s to 90s, which fixes none of the underlying problems and changes basically nothing).

That’s very true. I’m also perplexed at the raw 50% dmg nerf to Dancing Dagger. The skill is now also 50% less fun to use…
These nerfs seem like placeholders to me anyhow. I just hope the future will bring the drastic changes across the board that PvP needs, because right now whenever I PvP I’m experiencing 25% fun, 25% indifference and 50% WTF!?

rootnode.9546:

Eclipses.7152:

If you want to start, how about you start by making a post in each profession’s thread about where you see that profession (as it stands) and where you want to take it, what needs to be improved/what need scaling back and why. That’d give you great feedback.

That’s a great idea! Love it.

Anyway, Jonathan: thank you for the post. I for one, and I think many others, would welcome more posts like this. More openness and more communication.
With a post like this (detailed information and some insight), you folks could’ve prevented a lot of the kittenstorm you got over the weekend, the event and the patch.

I hope that we’ll see more of these posts from now on.

Admittedly, that would be nice.

Here is what I see some the problems may be at:

As it is now, Structured 8v8 PvP was designed to be (or intenteded to be) inviting to the new player, but it’s causing the exact opposite. You have your Bacskstab Thief instagibing unexperienced (and experienced too) players here and there (or the untouchable bleeder with the absurd caltrops) with over the top escapability, your Elementalists specced in arcana and 30 water that just refuse to die or you get it down but suddenly full Hp again out of nowhere, shatter Mesmers instagibing you with unavoidable burst which also happen to be extremely frustrating and confusing (pun not intended) to play against, Warriors with hundred blades and frenzy (and some others I’m leaving)… everything is very uninviting to newcomers and that is a serious problem.
Many people will come here and spout out the same crap over and over again: “use your stun breaker n00b!” “but that spec is squishy as kitten” “that’s all that spec does, CDs used and it’s done for” etc, etc. That’s actually NOT helping, it’s only making things worse. You know what they say about covering the trash instead of cleaning it out.
8v8 balance (and now 5v5 which wont change much), is extremely important, you heard me right Eight vs Eight (in this case) or entry PvP balance is extremely important. If this game wants to become an E-sport so badly, players need to feel related to what they see, and they obviously do that by playing, but they have to like it first. I know you had to learn about player psichology devs, put that in practice. A new or common/casual player just doesn’t like getting killed in 2 seconds out of nowhere, or getting frustrated trying to get a kill that’s not going to happen, or trying to guess which is the real one.
You can come now and say “top players don’t have a problem with that other build which is easily countered or is not viable on tounament play”, well… TOP players are NOT the casual players that fill up the streams, play the game to enjoy more than to compete and make for the majority of the game, are more likely to use the cash shop, etc.
The PvP balance of this game is clearly aimed at and only the competitive scene (or so it seems to me), with the examples above still in place (that seem to only happen in the so called ‘pugs’). You can rebalance what’s cousing troubles without affecting or dumbing down the competitive scene, they are obvsiously not aiming for that. For example intagib thieves would have been changed a long time ago and in WvW too, the “only SPvP” changes to some of the nerfs only prove my point even further: they only aim exclusively towards competitive players and everyone else is relegated as in the words of an ANET dev: “pug baddies”.
Also, there’s a serious problem in their priorities and on how slow they are acting to solve these problems. A new game mode needs to come out as people is clearly showing signs of being tired of a single mode, but it has not to be aimed for competitive folk which are the minority.
In the end it’s the player base that dictates what becomes a competition and what doesn’t, you just have to give them the tools that are actually usable for that porpouse, and by that I mean aim the balance for BOTH sides.

@Khenzy

being able to counter all the examples you gave at the beginning of your post is not easy at first. A newcomer can’t just hop into spvp with a new class and expect to do well. It takes time and experience to learn the counters for each class, and thats how it should be IMO.

If anything the replies here show only Jonathan Sharp and Allie Murdock are working on balance.
So that’s only 2, as Jon Peters said all along!

Believe it or not but I actually tutored a bit for Logic courses. You’re not fooling me!

Whatever the system is being used, it simply isn’t working productively enough.

Waiting three months for major bugs (like non-scaling Turrets or sigils not working with weapon kits) or blatantly obvious broken skills (Hundred Blades, Backstab, etc.) to be fixed and not even have them done then is nothing short of poor form.

I wish I could be more constructive but “not good enough” is the best I can come up with. WvW/SPvP were some of the brightest gems in GW2’s crown and they are simply going to waste with PvP balance being treated like an afterthought.

This is what we ask for A-net is communication. We don’t ask you to promise us anything just tell us what’s going on.

Rhoto.8791:

@Khenzy

being able to counter all the examples you gave at the beginning of your post is not easy at first. A newcomer can’t just hop into spvp with a new class and expect to do well. It takes time and experience to learn the counters for each class, and thats how it should be IMO.

Of course everyone has to learn sooner or later or else they will get their kitten kicked big time; but certain builds that offer a low risk-high reward and don’t let their foes a chance to retaliate or create unnecessary frustration is basically flawed and needs to end. For example, they created Mesmers following a principle, yet I’m pretty sure they didn’t think about te recieving end of it. The GW1 Mesmer (completely different game, I know) was so much more deeply and better designed than the overpowered overly chaotic illusionist bomber we have right now.

Speaking as someone who is generally disgruntled with the current state of the game, I just wanted to tell you I appreciate this level of communication and I hope you engage in it more often in the future.

So then why did Jon Peters lie to all the ranger players saying that there will be some big changes in the upcoming patch? When there was clearly no big changes?

Eleazyair.5716:

So then why did Jon Peters lie to all the ranger players saying that there will be some big changes in the upcoming patch? When there was clearly no big changes?

Because underwater skills are better then land skills silly goose…

This whole “team” does not listen to us…they make the changes “they” want….not what most people give feedback on.

They wont even give us new game types.

They will do what they want with the sPVP…

I don’t even know why there is an sPVP forum in the first place.

Where’s the Game Testers in that list~

Anywho:
Interesting how fixing a controversial post gets the bait instantly, as if Moderators are around the clock like a Gary Glitter stake-out, yet are so quiet to everyone’s Questions.

I really appreciate this post, thanks.