Can someone explain to me where it all comes from? Just tell me if I’m missing anything from this list:
- Self-heal.
- In-stealth healing.
- Initiative healing.
- Mug.
- In-stealth condition cleansing. (I count this as a necromancer.)
On the broader topic of balance, does anyone feel like this is too much? I’m OK with thieves having high burst, lots of stealth, and the best mobility. That’s the class description. But right now it feels like a thief isn’t really punished for directly engaging because he can just leave and come back at close-to-full or full health while his target is still stuck in combat and weakened from the last attack.
And yet their healing isn’t nearly as good as other classes’, even when specced for it. In any case, the spammable heals require the thief to be in combat.
And yet their healing isn’t nearly as good as other classes’, even when specced for it. In any case, the spammable heals require the thief to be in combat.
Well, that would be ridiculous. The worry isn’t whether the raw healing is better than other classes’ raw healing; it’s whether the healing-to-damage-to-survivability ratios are off.
Those 2 specs have the heal from the skill (obviously) condition cleanse + usually in-stealth healing (not always depending on how they play). Thieves with mug healing + in-stealth healing pay for that with a lower initiative pool (not enough traits).
On the other hand the in-stealth condition cleansing isnt that OP as most people make it to be. If he goes in stealth without using his heal skill he removes 1 condi the moment he stealthes and 1 more 3 seconds after that if he remains in stealth for that duration. So he removed 2 of the bleed/weakness/cripple/poison/chill/blind/fear you put on him. Not nearly enough for a necro to have problems stacking conditions on a thief. If he uses his initiative on S/D weapon set to remove conditions he will be reduced to auto-attacks after the first 5 seconds of the fight.
On the trait that gives heal from initiative last time i checked it was like 80 health / initiative used so it averages out on 80 health / 6 seconds which is standard initiative regen (and that is presicely the reason no thief ever uses that trait)
I have to agree healing while stealthier is completely broken and needs nerf a GOOD thief in a 1v1 with this trait is unbeatable maybe they can’t beat you but you sure as hell can’t beat them
OK. It’s not that I don’t believe the thieves here, but I’m trying to understand why I consistently see thieves come out of stealth at full health while I’m still stuck in combat. It doesn’t even seem to have much of a cooldown attached to it. Maybe it’s because one of their self-heals has a 15-second cooldown and thieves have a low health pool. Is that why it seems like they can heal up so quickly?
I just don’t know how to counter this in a one-on-one situation. It seems pretty close to impossible for me to win. I, ironically, get attritioned down.
OK. It’s not that I don’t believe the thieves here, but I’m trying to understand why I consistently see thieves come out of stealth at full health while I’m still stuck in combat. It doesn’t even seem to have much of a cooldown attached to it. Maybe it’s because one of their self-heals has a 15-second cooldown and thieves have a low health pool. Is that why it seems like they can heal up so quickly?
I just don’t know how to counter this in a one-on-one situation. It seems pretty close to impossible for me to win. I, ironically, get attritioned down.
Here let me explain .. So thieves have trait that regens HP while in stealth. Thieves have plenty of different ways to go into stealth thus giving them more sustain then any other class if played right put that with high burst and its unbeatable. Perfect example thief is at half HP and so are you thief uses heal you use heal both at half again due to combat damage then thief uses blinding powder thief has regen some HP then thief can use shadow refuge which gives a long stealth then also heals as a skill alone.. Also DP thieves can just hop around a circle regen more health by this time thief has 30 second cd heal up again bam rinse and repeat broken kitten .. Who ever thought out stealth and heal together was insane
Vs my ele I got back stabbed 8 times! And not one landed my back but yet I still couldn’t out heal the DPS .. Ugh so broken
A regen thief should really be of no threat if you know how to deal with one…if he is regenerating, he is not doing damage because if he hits you, he won’t be regnerating anymore. If he decides to hit you, that is 4 secs in which he is revealed. 4s is a good amount of time to seriously put a hurt on a thief…especially if you are condi based.
Keep in mind too that you can still AOE them in stealth to negate their healing. If they try to stealth around you and heal, your damage will deny their healing…forcing them to have to get out of AOE range just to heal, which means they will not be able to hit you.
I think you may be overestimating the power of the thief heals in stealth…it’s really not as much as you think as long as you keep the pressure up. Guessing + knowing where they are and keeping pressure is the most effective way to kill them. If they are built for regen, chances are they are not doing that much damage to you.
I believe that regen heal on stealth is just broken..Sure its not factor in spvp due to game mode but if i was big into wvw or there was a game mode centered around kills i would certainly be whining.
Prove me wrong but if you add very high uptime of stealth that cant be removed,thiefs incredible mobility in most builds and that trait..i cant see how you can kill such a thing.Even the heaviest bunker can get beaten to death but if you dont confine the fighting area to a small place that thief..is just immortal
2. Stealth healing requires 30 SA, which is dreadful in sPvP. The heal isn’t even that good anyways.
3. Init healing is only achievable via AReward, which often means giving up a lot of other good stuff. Also, the trade off that comes by nature from this trait is… Particularly dangerous.
4. Mug heals for very little with a long recharge.
5. Condi cleansing again requires the much-hated SA trait line, which is near useless. It is true that it is a good counter to condis in specific builds, however.
Well I guess this was inevitable. We’ve had thieves move too fast, hit too hard, spam too much, dodge too much, hate boons too much… and now to make the circle complete… heal too much. I’ve now heard everything.
