Guild Wars 2

Rating is not proof that the player as an individual is good
More so it is an indication of how good the people are that he plays with

Example: The guy who is subpar at tpvp but joins a guild with a lot of friends
who are actually good at the game and then he plays 10 matches on one night
and is carried to a 9 win and 1 loss record
He’ll never be a good player on his own
But while with his crew, he’ll never drop lower than 500

Example: The old veteran who knows every single class/build and meta in the game
He is perfectly capable of performing in a top 200 team
but he often plays with his IRL buddies who are not as good at the game
He plays with his girlfriend, her friend and even his girlfriend’s mom
He never walks away from a new player
He always takes the time to teach them and lose matches with them, while doing it
Due to this, he’ll never be ranked above 80% – 90%

So you see, the only thing that rating really proves
Is how picky you are, with who you are playing with

Current LB rating isn’t, but I’ve found peak LB rating to be quite accurate.

I really don’t think most top players boast about their rating, most of those posts are just from the same trolls, trying to stir things up and get attention.

If anything most of the top players know the leaderboards are pretty inaccurate and don’t really matter.

Some people carry their moms, others have to do their dishes mid-tourney.

I see hurt people at several locations, forums is one of them. Y’all PvE’s think rank doesn’t matter, and yes you are right, to some extend! But what’s all with the crying?

- to be fair top 10 players or even top 50, who cares, will whup your kitten . The reason there is a good team is that they have a good idea and some good players to execute it with. If that guy playing with your mommas nephews daughter in law is SO good as you’re indicating, maybe he would have gotten an offer to play for a team due to his excellence in that class. Your dad may know your son in law has skill on his engi, but can he 2 v 2 perfectly with your dad’s sister? Team PvP is team PvP. Team fights and mindgames are everything. If you think you learn that buy playing with your multiple cousins, you are wrong. And if this individual you are reffering to is SO good (and forgive me god, only plays 90%) he must be pretty open minded to be wasting his time losing to noob no. 1, 2, and 3 (and the never forgotten noob no. 4). My point is, that because you (did I just refer to you or a plural audience?) can’t get to the top on the leaderboard, doesn’t mean that they’re just mediocre players, and that their rank is irrelevant. Leaderboard doesn’t work properly I agree, but it works in 90% of the cases. CIAO.

chukree, i think OPs target were people on ladderboard ranks 800-999, who boast that they are ranked, even though they just won 20 games. no need to be so condescending.

edit: plus, he’s from NA and a non elitist and helpful mentality like this seems to be rare over there lately. so be nice

OlrunTheBlade.1486:

Current LB rating isn’t, but I’ve found peak LB rating to be quite accurate.

I always wondered how you look up stats like that. I mean..I can look up current leaderboard ranks of course. But Peak rating and such. How would I check that for myself and others?

Epidemix Revenge.4862:

OlrunTheBlade.1486:

Current LB rating isn’t, but I’ve found peak LB rating to be quite accurate.

I always wondered how you look up stats like that. I mean..I can look up current leaderboard ranks of course. But Peak rating and such. How would I check that for myself and others?

http://www.gw2score.com/PvP/player/cheese4739

^ gw2score is a good resource, that’s my page - swap out the username#### for your own or anyone else’s, or click the top-right "PvP leaderboards" link to get a searchable version of LB.
As you can see, I’ve done reasonably well in the past, not played all that many ranked games recently, and temporary LB decay is a joke.
GW2score: wooo, many useful! ^__^

Temporary LB decay can work, but I don’t personally think it should be 100% temporary. I think most of it should be temporary, but there should be SOME permanent aspect. Then good players who come back aren’t rated as trash, but there is also some penalty for inactivity.

Chukree.1756:

I see hurt people at several locations, forums is one of them. Y’all PvE’s think rank doesn’t matter, and yes you are right, to some extend! But what’s all with the crying?

- to be fair top 10 players or even top 50, who cares, will whup your kitten . The reason there is a good team is that they have a good idea and some good players to execute it with. If that guy playing with your mommas nephews daughter in law is SO good as you’re indicating, maybe he would have gotten an offer to play for a team due to his excellence in that class. Your dad may know your son in law has skill on his engi, but can he 2 v 2 perfectly with your dad’s sister? Team PvP is team PvP. Team fights and mindgames are everything. If you think you learn that buy playing with your multiple cousins, you are wrong. And if this individual you are reffering to is SO good (and forgive me god, only plays 90%) he must be pretty open minded to be wasting his time losing to noob no. 1, 2, and 3 (and the never forgotten noob no. 4). My point is, that because you (did I just refer to you or a plural audience?) can’t get to the top on the leaderboard, doesn’t mean that they’re just mediocre players, and that their rank is irrelevant. Leaderboard doesn’t work properly I agree, but it works in 90% of the cases. CIAO.

Your assumption has caused you to miss the point entirely

My comment is directed at the public in general who are discriminant against any player who isn’t in the top 1000. Although the rating system may be an accurate way to gauge a player’s total record of successful matches, it is not an accurate way to gauge how skillful a player is and their overall ability to compete if they were actually rolling with an elite team.

My comment is directed to support those good players who find it more important to play and lose with their girlfriends or good buddies, than to tell them “sorry, I don’t want to lose rating tonight”.

Ultimately, I feel it pressuring and unfair to the community that “if you care about rating” you cannot afford to play matches with less experienced players . All it does is promote segregation within the tpvp community and keeps otherwise good players, rated as bad players if they spend a week doing matches with less experienced players.
Is the rating system not based on individual identity?
Why is it so reliant on who you play with to gain those individual statistics?

~ Simple Fix: We need a non-rated tpvp arena
That way you only join rated matches with your best core team
And join non-rated with your gf and her mother

If non-rated tpvp arena existed, there would be much more community interaction between the elite, the new and the bad. Good players could take the time to play and teach other players again, without getting frustrated over losing rating, while doing it.

You’re right OP, rating means nothing. Being able to play low skilled builds can give you high rating but it does not make you a good player for example.

I agree with you OP, but isn’t this why we have hotjoins? Not as flawless as a non-rated arena with the rated arena set-up, but I simply think having too many (low-reward generally) options will only cause certain arena’s to be empty.

And if you’re the nice, non-elitist person, do you really care about what others think? You obviously don’t care about your rating, so why do their opinions matter so much? If you have proper arguments based on facts, which you seem very capable of doing, people will take you more seriously than someone along the lines “Hay Frands! Eew Eev here! #1 everything (insert opinions and irrelevant information) Bai Frands!”

OlrunTheBlade.1486:

Current LB rating isn’t, but I’ve found peak LB rating to be quite accurate.

Whats this??

Peak LB rating is the highest rating you’ve achieved.

Team queue leaderboard means nothing. Solo queue leaderboard means even less.

Team queue = get high by just playing a specific comp which you fill a narrow and easy role in.

Solo queue = get high by afking and playing 1/2 games every few weeks to maintain a pro rating.

What shows individual skill in this game? There is no hard evidence for this. It is all subjective as its a team game. Is Marcelo a good left back? He won the champions league for real madrid. But he can’t defend. As proven in the world cup. How do you judge an individual in a team game like football? Answer = its all about opinions.

GW2 is the same. Impossible to judge. That is why a significant portion of the gw2 pvp community are sad acts who hate all other people who play their class (they are a threat to them being considered the greatest of that class – lol great life). Watch almost any “pro” streamer and they will be quick to belittle anyone else playing their class because they are pathetic and want to be considered da best eu/na!!

With a system which enabled the judging of individual skill we wouldn’t have these epic car crash streams or in-game chat ego trips. And things would be so much more dull.

O and then how would 95% of the gw2 pvp community never admit to making a mistake? Most people I have ever played with (and I have pugged/solo queued with a very high number of people) are total kittenbags and never admit its their fault. They are all playing perfect and when we lose its nothing to do with them. They won against this same roster with their 4 lame mates so it proves they are incredible right?

Yeh this games community is awful. Leaderboards contribute to it too. I wish they would get rid of them. They serve no purpose.

Esmee.1067:

I agree with you OP, but isn’t this why we have hotjoins? Not as flawless as a non-rated arena with the rated arena set-up, but I simply think having too many (low-reward generally) options will only cause certain arena’s to be empty.

And if you’re the nice, non-elitist person, do you really care about what others think? You obviously don’t care about your rating, so why do their opinions matter so much? If you have proper arguments based on facts, which you seem very capable of doing, people will take you more seriously than someone along the lines “Hay Frands! Eew Eev here! #1 everything (insert opinions and irrelevant information) Bai Frands!”

disclaimer...

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I simply wanted to give a recognizable example. Vee Wee is very active in the Engineer forums trying to help other Engineers, and thus I consider him a valuable member of the community.

Hotjoins do not allow us to pre-make a team with people that we want to play with
This is why we need a specific non-rated team arena

I do care about rating as it is a big part of what keeps any game competitive
But I don’t care enough to segregate myself from friends who aren’t “great players”
Just to maintain that rating

Thus, the current system puts us in to a dilemma of extreme stances:
(A) I want to play for rating so I must not play matches with less experienced players
Because if I do, we will lose and I will lose rating
~ or
(B) Screw the rating system, I often play with my gf, friends and inexperienced players
While teaching them in matches, we will come against good teams and we will lose
And I will lose rating so why bother playing for the rating?

There are a lot of older gamers like myself who would like to remain competitive within the community but we have wives, nephews, maybe even children, ect.. ect.. who like to play the game with us and when the only arena we can do this with them in is tpvp, we cannot play for rating. Thus we will never gain recognition within the community to ever mingle with the other more competitive players “all due to the judgements based on rating”

Again, this wouldn’t be a problem if there were a non-rated team arena
Where loses gained from playing with your girlfriend, her friend and her mom
Didn’t count against you

~ Take it seriously as there are many older gamers like myself

Lordrosicky.5813:

With a system which enabled the judging of individual skill we wouldn’t have these epic car crash streams or in-game chat ego trips. And things would be so much more dull.

O and then how would 95% of the gw2 pvp community never admit to making a mistake? Most people I have ever played with (and I have pugged/solo queued with a very high number of people) are total kittenbags and never admit its their fault. They are all playing perfect and when we lose its nothing to do with them. They won against this same roster with their 4 lame mates so it proves they are incredible right?

Yeh this games community is awful. Leaderboards contribute to it too. I wish they would get rid of them. They serve no purpose.

Snipped the last part out, because I keep on hearing this…

Despite me not having had the oppertunity to rise in ranks due to unfortunate circumstances, I have spoken with a lot of people ranging from the top 10 to top 100, and usually what I hear is that most people cope with huge ego issues…

It is fairly possible that your team makes mistakes, not everyone is flawless, but there are little who blame themselves… Sure, you might not be responsible for your whole team flocking to one point, whilst leaving the other’s untouched even though you were first to fight on said point, but these kinds of situations are dime a dozen when compared to the many mistakes you make yourself…

I am guilty of sometimes sticking too long in a fight even though I mostly play side-node classes, resulting in my team, whenever we play, having to deal with our squishiest classes defending a point, which in the end is completely my fault since I could’ve repositioned myself to get more sustain to a point… Do I know this whenever I am in the match itself? Not likely, it is usually after the harm’s been done that I realize my flaws, but sometimes I do have to cope with my pride and do not dare to admit that losing the game was my fault, while I played a huge part in it…
I have got to be honest as well, I sometimes dislike teaming up with people who do not want to be on TS, or pugging teammates in TeamQ since I do not want them “to be a liability”, while I haven’t even given them a chance to prove themselves… Sure, TS helps a ton, but you’d be surprised how many peform well, or even better, without…

Luckily, there is a minority that is somewhat more relaxed, and usually these bundle up in groups and do well for large periods of time – though in the competitive scene, these are too little and thanks to this you don’t see enough, imho, high-ranked teams playing and staying together

Is this because of the Leaderboards? Or is it because of the lack of competition? Wanting to be the very best? Maybe they all contribute for the numerous amount of well talented people who sadly suffer from having too big of an ego

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Rating is not proof that the player as an individual is good
More so it is an indication of how good the people are that he plays with

Example: The guy who is subpar at tpvp but joins a guild with a lot of friends
who are actually good at the game and then he plays 10 matches on one night
and is carried to a 9 win and 1 loss record
He’ll never be a good player on his own
But while with his crew, he’ll never drop lower than 500

Example: The old veteran who knows every single class/build and meta in the game
He is perfectly capable of performing in a top 200 team
but he often plays with his IRL buddies who are not as good at the game
He plays with his girlfriend, her friend and even his girlfriend’s mom
He never walks away from a new player
He always takes the time to teach them and lose matches with them, while doing it
Due to this, he’ll never be ranked above 80% – 90%

So you see, the only thing that rating really proves
Is how picky you are, with who you are playing with

if you wanna play with friends who don’t pvp on high level and you care bout ladder (LOL) just get a second account already or you’re gonna end up from 100 to 800 in no time (Personal experience, but thanks god no kitten was given to ladder anyway)

Absolutely no way I would buy a second account after putting so much money in to the one I have now.

Arena-Net just needs to take some time and redo the leaderboard system entirely
In to something that accurately gauges the individual skill level of a player

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Absolutely no way I would buy a second account after putting so much money in to the one I have now.

Arena-Net just needs to take some time and redo the leaderboard system entirely
In to something that accurately gauges the individual skill level of a player

you bought gems uh? Anyway if you’re waiting for anet to make a decent ladder with decent ranking system you’ve better to leave this pvp already…we’re waiting for it since closed beta..

Rating is meaningless when any old player, who has never played engineer before can roll the class, run turrets and climb relatively high on solo queue within the same day. Leaderboards are a serious problem that are really just an amalgamation of class imbalance, poor matchmaking, the inability to look at an individuals performance at opposed to the team as a whole and a system that favours those who purposefully play to win, as opposed to those who play to play. You know, cos they enjoy the game.

I mean, look at hotjoin. People are so desperate to win on an UNRANKED and MEANINGLESS gametype, they will stack teams, stack cheese builds and go into spec or quit the game as soon as they think they are gonna lose.

These players who can’t take a loss are a kitten in any gaming community. GW2 is my first (and probably last) MMO. I don’t know if this is an MMO problem in particular but it seems to be worse in GW2 than in any other game I have played online in the past. FPS games I have played at a highly competitive level in the past such as Q3A and RTCW/RTCW:ET never really had this “who is better” type of situation. Certain people were amazingly good and if they were better than you it was just down to the fact they had better skill. It was just accepted if someone was owning you over and over that they were just a better player. You couldn’t blame it on class disparity or anything of the sort.
I guess because the game is so imbalanced and there are so many factors that decide the outcome of a fight that any player can basically mask his/her own failures with “well it wasn’t my fault….it was cos build x/y/z is OP and teammates are bad etc etc”

All this leads to a bad pvp community. And I mean bad, because the pvp community in this game is completely at odds with the PvE community that is otherwise much more friendly, open to suggestions and criticism with regards to builds. There is of course the exception of dungeon elitisits, but those guys are just….well I don’t want to get into it too much but you often find these guys don’t PvP. If you don’t PvP, you sure as hell don’t get the right to go around with an elitist “i’m better than you” attitude. It’s laughable imo.

There are some other pretty serious issues when it comes to ladders of course.
First and foremost, the TPVP ladder makes no sense whatsoever, in concept and in practical application. It’s a TEAM queue. Why are TEAMS not ranked? Why is there no option to sign GUILDS up to the ladder? Why is it just a list of individuals? Why is this so at odds with ANets design philosophy (i.e. that team fights are the focus of PVP, not 1v1s)

I’m just sitting here, typing this up and the more I think about it the more stuff I have to type, so I better just stop myself cos I could go on and on.

You’re right though about leaderboards in tpvp
They need to be guild or specific team name based, not individual
I mean the way the ratings work pretty much rely on “who you’re playing with”

All of these people want Guild Vs. Guild
But they already have it in tpvp, it’s just displayed wrong as individual rating

i still LOL when players boast there LB or rank :P

I think most PvP player’s ego can be summed up in the following comic:

http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20120328

Thanks.

How can anyone take LB seriously, when after 4-5 months of not playing you can get to top100 teamq from % after loosing 1 match?