Guild Wars 2

I know this game isn’t balanced around 1v1s, but when you see 2 professions just completely destroy everyone else, you know they need to toned down a little. I’m talking about Fear Spam Condition Necros and Mesmers in general (I’m sure not all builds). I’ve been playing almost entirely on 1v1 servers recently and these 2 professions in the hands of some really skilled players just demolish all other players.

As a comparison take a look at Eles and Engineers. These 2 professions are also very strong and do very well but vs them you DO have a chance at winning. Vs Necros you might win if they’re using a power build and vs Mesmers if they’re bad. Even bad Necros and Mesmers which you can spot since they’re terrible at dodging pose a serious threat.

Again, I know the game can’t be balanced around 1v1 but I would like to see these 2 professions brought down to the level of Engineers and Eles, professions that in the hands of skilled players are fantastic but not impossible to beat.

I play a Warrior as my main but also an Ele, Thief and Engineer. My perspective is not just from my own personal experience but also from seeing other people duel on these servers.

You know, there’s a thread in the necro forum asking how conditionmancers should deal with classes that have heavy condition cleanses. The response is basically “layer up conditions during fear, or die”.

The fact is that the game isn’t balanced around 1 vs 1. There will always be a class who is best at 1 vs 1. Whether it is the Thief who pops in and out of stealth and resets fights indefinitely when they don’t burst you down. The mesmer, who is nigh impossible to damage while interrupting and bursting you down. The necromancer, who has statistical bulk and high damaging stuns + conditions to wear you down. The engineer, who can kite you endlessly while laying down high direct + condition damage with grenades. The guardian, who’s cleansing and protection uptime make them impossible to kill. The ranger, who solos you with the pet while dodging and evading everything you throw at them.

I’ve heard it all, trust me. The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist. Even though warriors suck now, there was a time when they were top tier due to bulls rush + frenzy + 100 blades killing people instantly.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

You know, there’s a thread in the necro forum asking how conditionmancers should deal with classes that have heavy condition cleanses. The response is basically “layer up conditions during fear, or die”.

The fact is that the game isn’t balanced around 1 vs 1. There will always be a class who is best at 1 vs 1. Whether it is the Thief who pops in and out of stealth and resets fights indefinitely when they don’t burst you down. The mesmer, who is nigh impossible to damage while interrupting and bursting you down. The necromancer, who has statistical bulk and high damaging stuns + conditions to wear you down. The engineer, who can kite you endlessly while laying down high direct + condition damage with grenades. The guardian, who’s cleansing and protection uptime make them impossible to kill. The ranger, who solos you with the pet while dodging and evading everything you throw at them.

I’ve heard it all, trust me. The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist. Even though warriors suck now, there was a time when they were top tier due to bulls rush + frenzy + 100 blades killing people instantly.

I’ll fix that for you, since I’m of the opinion that ele has been the strongest tourney class in the game for about 8 months now. Just by a little, for a variety of reasons.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

You know, there’s a thread in the necro forum asking how conditionmancers should deal with classes that have heavy condition cleanses. The response is basically “layer up conditions during fear, or die”.

The fact is that the game isn’t balanced around 1 vs 1. There will always be a class who is best at 1 vs 1. Whether it is the Thief who pops in and out of stealth and resets fights indefinitely when they don’t burst you down. The mesmer, who is nigh impossible to damage while interrupting and bursting you down. The necromancer, who has statistical bulk and high damaging stuns + conditions to wear you down. The engineer, who can kite you endlessly while laying down high direct + condition damage with grenades. The guardian, who’s cleansing and protection uptime make them impossible to kill. The ranger, who solos you with the pet while dodging and evading everything you throw at them.

I’ve heard it all, trust me. The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist. Even though warriors suck now, there was a time when they were top tier due to bulls rush + frenzy + 100 blades killing people instantly.

You must be somewhat new then. A few months back the indestructible ele was generating tears for days.

Fear spam necros? That’s a new one. Just don’t walk into the Necrowall. Other than that Necros have Stakitten which is on a long CD and fear in death shroud, which will have an both the internal CD and the death shroud CD. No way to spam fear really.

BTW, wasn’t Necro supposed to be the best 1v1 class, according to the class philosophies?
Something about, engaging a Necro being the same as asking to die and that’s why we don’t have mobility, so we can’t chase or disengage if WE don’t have the upper hand?

PS- Terrormancers have 0 access to swiftness/stability and no gap-closer besides DS2.

If you don’t know the mesmer builds, then yeah, you’re going to die to mesmers 1v1. We’re a strong dueling class, hence the dueling trait line

Also, don’t nerf mesmers too hard, since we’re pretty good at handling those fear spamming necros you dislike so much

Jackums.3496:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist.

I agree with the general premise of your post, but I laughed at the above.

There was a time when the else was considered under powered (considered worse the pre patch necros or current warriors). But it is true that recently, everyone flocking to the forums and copying the same build (as we see now with neckros), the ele has had its spotlight.

stefanplc.5234:

I know this game isn’t balanced around 1v1s, but when you see 2 professions just completely destroy everyone else, you know they need to toned down a little. I’m talking about Fear Spam Condition Necros and Mesmers in general (I’m sure not all builds). I’ve been playing almost entirely on 1v1 servers recently and these 2 professions in the hands of some really skilled players just demolish all other players.

As a comparison take a look at Eles and Engineers. These 2 professions are also very strong and do very well but vs them you DO have a chance at winning. Vs Necros you might win if they’re using a power build and vs Mesmers if they’re bad. Even bad Necros and Mesmers which you can spot since they’re terrible at dodging pose a serious threat.

Again, I know the game can’t be balanced around 1v1 but I would like to see these 2 professions brought down to the level of Engineers and Eles, professions that in the hands of skilled players are fantastic but not impossible to beat.

I play a Warrior as my main but also an Ele, Thief and Engineer. My perspective is not just from my own personal experience but also from seeing other people duel on these servers.

Mesmers have received several nerfs but playing a warrior or ele against a mesmer is hard. I suggest you make a mesmer and check out their shatter burst build playstyle. The only way to deal with mesmers (with warriors/eles) is to know the class and completely aggressive as the more you drag the fight, the harder it is going to get.(using tons of conditions help a lot).

Mesmers are currently just borderline OP in spvp but they are average in tpvp. They are used mainly for MOA/Portal/Illusion of life.
In hotjoin, GC mesmers sniping and shattering for massive damage from a distance is really a l2p thing. Players need to prioritize Mesmers (like Necros) and you will not see him doing much other than dying.

Necros are OP only with their terror builds (especially in numbers or with engis). If fear is toned down (and AOE conditioning as well) then Necros are fine. They are supposed to be strong as a trade off for poor mobility.

I see the 2 main problems here;
1) “When in the hands of someone skilled….”
2 “My main is warrior.”

Nuf said.

Jackums.3496:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist.

I agree with the general premise of your post, but I laughed at the above.

The thing is with the elementalist is that their bunker build came at around the same time that guardian bunkers were proficient. The QQ I always noticed was about Guardians + Elementalists, and the “bunker” game in general, and nothing directed too specifically at elementalists.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Jackums.3496:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist.

I agree with the general premise of your post, but I laughed at the above.

The thing is with the elementalist is that their bunker build came at around the same time that guardian bunkers were proficient. The QQ I always noticed was about Guardians + Elementalists, and the “bunker” game in general, and nothing directed too specifically at elementalists.

Go back in the forum-pages. There are tons of QQ about it. Bunker-guardians on the other side were considered strong but not op.

Warriors actually have the option to become the new Necro meta’s natural enemy. Running Zerkers stance and something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNApeRjcOtwpQyQMxBEkCsoKOKUilQ9AP2w4A-TsAg0CvICSFkLITQygsBNsYZxEBA

…means the Necro can’t do anything for the duration while you lock him down. I actually feel like I have a role when I join TPvP as opposed to a third wheel.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Warriors actually have the option to become the new Necro meta’s natural enemy. Running Zerkers stance and something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNApeRjcOtwpQyQMxBEkCsoKOKUilQ9AP2w4A-TsAg0CvICSFkLITQygsBNsYZxEBA

…means the Necro can’t do anything for the duration while you lock him down. I actually feel like I have a role when I join TPvP as opposed to a third wheel.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNApeSjcOFvBPyOMxBA0DsqirTBlUPsbu4A-TsAg0CnIMSZkzIjRSjsGNsYhwEBA

With this I don’t even have to dodge anything: by the time necros get out of my stun chain, they are dead.

Mesmer GS are taking 3100+ all time with Spatial Surge, and sword are granting 2,5s evasion with low CD.
This no talking about teleport, invis, and a lot of other tricks.

Auto response on an Engineer with Elixir R will beat a condi Necro every time. Thieves will kill zerker Mesmer almost instantly.

JETWING.2759:

Mesmer GS are taking 3100+ all time with Spatial Surge, and sword are granting 2,5s evasion with low CD.
This no talking about teleport, invis, and a lot of other tricks.

You mean doing 3k auto attacks? That will only be true if they are at max range and you have 0 toughness in which case you should be taking heavy damage. Sword evasion is needed because a light armor class needs defenses to get into melee without getting blown up (even warriors know the problem of melee at the moment). Teleport and invis are on long cds and usually cant be repeated more than once in a fight. I agree a mesmer has a lot of defenses but run a condition build on necro/engi (even warrior) and watch them melt to your conditions :-P

Power builds have to be aggressive and they will succeed in taking a mesmer down.

StSwfx.3754:

Auto response on an Engineer with Elixir R will beat a condi Necro every time. Thieves will kill zerker Mesmer almost instantly.

Do not know about Engi but a GC thief vs GC mesmer actually boils down to skill. Only difference is the thief can disengage if losing (gotta love the tons of stealth) and a mesmer can only do so if they have their portal/teleport since their mobility sucks kitten.

Demon.5082:

JETWING.2759:

Mesmer GS are taking 3100+ all time with Spatial Surge, and sword are granting 2,5s evasion with low CD.
This no talking about teleport, invis, and a lot of other tricks.

You mean doing 3k auto attacks? That will only be true if they are at max range and you have 0 toughness in which case you should be taking heavy damage. Sword evasion is needed because a light armor class needs defenses to get into melee without getting blown up (even warriors know the problem of melee at the moment). Teleport and invis are on long cds and usually cant be repeated more than once in a fight. I agree a mesmer has a lot of defenses but run a condition build on necro/engi (even warrior) and watch them melt to your conditions :-P

Except for the fact that mesmers fight at range, thanks to phantasms.

So yeah, they can kite while dealing damage, using LoS and when they are caught they become invulnerable.

At least Aegis from chaos armor was removed…

The best way to kill a mesmer, as a warrior (and as some engi specs), is to lure them into narrow spaces, where their escapes are less effective.

WHAT? Teleports on long cooldown?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat

redslion.9675:

Demon.5082:

JETWING.2759:

Mesmer GS are taking 3100+ all time with Spatial Surge, and sword are granting 2,5s evasion with low CD.
This no talking about teleport, invis, and a lot of other tricks.

You mean doing 3k auto attacks? That will only be true if they are at max range and you have 0 toughness in which case you should be taking heavy damage. Sword evasion is needed because a light armor class needs defenses to get into melee without getting blown up (even warriors know the problem of melee at the moment). Teleport and invis are on long cds and usually cant be repeated more than once in a fight. I agree a mesmer has a lot of defenses but run a condition build on necro/engi (even warrior) and watch them melt to your conditions :-P

Except for the fact that mesmers fight at range, thanks to phantasms.

So yeah, they can kite while dealing damage, using LoS and when they are caught they become invulnerable.

At least Aegis from chaos armor was removed…

The best way to kill a mesmer, as a warrior (and as some engi specs), is to lure them into narrow spaces, where their escapes are less effective.

WHAT? Teleports on long cooldown?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat

This is why I say Mesmers are a hotjoin class more than a tpvp one lol. Same as thieves. The whole phantasm build is OP in games where people do not focus the mesmer but they are horrid in tpvp games where the phantasm mesmer does not do much by running and hiding as he is not providing AOE damage or helping defend/cap the point.

Also, FYI
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Savage_Leap is twice the range of http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat (tooltip is bugged, it just has 300 range) and has a lower cd.

But I do agree that Phase Retreat should not break stuns since its on that low a cd.

The best way to kill a Mesmer is to immobilize him and nuke/condition spam him (even if he stealths he will be in the same spot).

Leg Specialist and Pin Down are the best anti Mesmer tools for a warrior. (Bola is also good but can be dodged due to the stupid cast).

With some cunning and patiente, I can down mesmers with hammer, but the problem is that phase retreat is instant, so it works under stuns. And its movement is not predictable.

I just think it’s a messy skill, working in hotjoin but sub-par in tourneys.

Phase retreat does not break stuns it works like larcenous strike..
Mesmers are not op :/ Necros however are.

I know they don’t break stuns, but creating a gap at random + loss of target means by the time you get to him again the stun will be gone.

Demon.5082:

redslion.9675:

Demon.5082:

JETWING.2759:

Mesmer GS are taking 3100+ all time with Spatial Surge, and sword are granting 2,5s evasion with low CD.
This no talking about teleport, invis, and a lot of other tricks.

You mean doing 3k auto attacks? That will only be true if they are at max range and you have 0 toughness in which case you should be taking heavy damage. Sword evasion is needed because a light armor class needs defenses to get into melee without getting blown up (even warriors know the problem of melee at the moment). Teleport and invis are on long cds and usually cant be repeated more than once in a fight. I agree a mesmer has a lot of defenses but run a condition build on necro/engi (even warrior) and watch them melt to your conditions :-P

Except for the fact that mesmers fight at range, thanks to phantasms.

So yeah, they can kite while dealing damage, using LoS and when they are caught they become invulnerable.

At least Aegis from chaos armor was removed…

The best way to kill a mesmer, as a warrior (and as some engi specs), is to lure them into narrow spaces, where their escapes are less effective.

WHAT? Teleports on long cooldown?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat

Also, FYI
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Savage_Leap is twice the range of http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phase_Retreat (tooltip is bugged, it just has 300 range) and has a lower cd.

tooltip is not bugged. 10 is the base cd of phase retreat

everyone runs illusionary celebritity which reduce illusion cd by 20 percent

the only problem with necro terror build is that it works well in group setting which means it is not a pure 1vs1 build unlike perma stealth thief or phastasm mesmer

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

I see the 2 main problems here;
1) “When in the hands of someone skilled….”
2 “My main is warrior.”

Nuf said.

Indeed.

By the way, mesmers are somewhat balanced, necros are beign op right now because the way the conditions works right now with nothing to mitigate thier damage they are out of control and the easy way they can be spamed, returning to mesmers, they recieved a lot of nerfs since last patches a lot of them werent necessary but still they did it.

The problem is your warrior, the classes that you are talking about are always going to being seen as OP to you because of that fact, warriors are a very bad designed class, while mesmers and necros are better designed and suited for this game, look at what i posted in anohter topic, this will explain a lot of things to you, it was a rply for a person that is asking about warriors ways to “soak up damage”:

Nothing, warrior is a class that does not belong to this game, in this game armor is nerfed so its not important if you have a lot of armor/toughness, so be a heavy armor user compared to a thief that has medium armor or a elementalist that has light armor does not matter.

And guess, light armor classes and medium armor classes have acces to be bunkering(tanks), while warrior that is a class known in every game for its tank capabilities in this game its not because the only thing that has is heavy armor to do that, but like i explained, armor in this game dosent matter.

This game right now is a mess, its centered a lot on having boons and who keeps them most of the time, and direct damage its bad in this game because a bunker will mitigate it, so people are now doing condition builds because its the only damage source that has no way to be mitigated, ill explain: if you have 2 sources of damage but one of those sources can be reduced by armor/toughness,boons,evades,rolls,blocks,invulnerability, and the other form of damage only reduced by the ability of remove it with condition removes, guess what damage its going to be prefered to people?.

So on topic, dont use a warrior right now specially in pvp you are better using any other class, any other class is viable, warrior is not, dosent belong to this game.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Warriors actually have the option to become the new Necro meta’s natural enemy. Running Zerkers stance and something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNApeRjcOtwpQyQMxBEkCsoKOKUilQ9AP2w4A-TsAg0CvICSFkLITQygsBNsYZxEBA

…means the Necro can’t do anything for the duration while you lock him down. I actually feel like I have a role when I join TPvP as opposed to a third wheel.

It’s not nearly enough to kill a Necro.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

You know, there’s a thread in the necro forum asking how conditionmancers should deal with classes that have heavy condition cleanses. The response is basically “layer up conditions during fear, or die”.

The fact is that the game isn’t balanced around 1 vs 1. There will always be a class who is best at 1 vs 1. Whether it is the Thief who pops in and out of stealth and resets fights indefinitely when they don’t burst you down. The mesmer, who is nigh impossible to damage while interrupting and bursting you down. The necromancer, who has statistical bulk and high damaging stuns + conditions to wear you down. The engineer, who can kite you endlessly while laying down high direct + condition damage with grenades. The guardian, who’s cleansing and protection uptime make them impossible to kill. The ranger, who solos you with the pet while dodging and evading everything you throw at them.

I’ve heard it all, trust me. The only class I’ve never heard as being “overpowered” is the elementalist. Even though warriors suck now, there was a time when they were top tier due to bulls rush + frenzy + 100 blades killing people instantly.

You do realize that by someone going full condition removal spec, they almost literally do 0 damage? The main issue with condition builds is that it is too easy to get tanky while stacking conditions. It’s uncommon to see condition mancers/anything to have below 1800 ish toughness.

I agree that this game shouldn’t be built around 1v1’s, but if there’s a class that is dominating in all areas, it’d be mesmer and necro.

Mesmers are nowhere near dominating in all areas. The meta Mesmer brings ZERO count it ZERO condition removal to a fight. They bring portal which is situational at best and illusion of life which is bested by signet of undeath (All necros I play with agree this is better) and toss elixir R which is a great instant self rez and great with teammates…. So that leaves us to Mesmer is good for portal…. Other classes bunker better and other classes DPS better some do both at the same time. Just because clones confuse you does not mean Mesmer is anywhere near overpowered mkay?

Necros have poor access to boons and that’s why they have great condition abilities.
While other classes have great access to boons and others are more balanced, the strength of necros rely on only on their conditions.
Really, this qqing must stop.

vicious.5683:

Necros have poor access to boons and that’s why they have great condition abilities.
While other classes have great access to boons and others are more balanced, the strength of necros rely on only on their conditions.
Really, this qqing must stop.

A good night time laugh. Thanks.

Demon.5082:

Mesmers have received several nerfs but playing a warrior or ele against a mesmer is hard. I suggest you make a mesmer and check out their shatter burst build playstyle.

Mesmers dont ALL play Shatter builds. In my opinion they are just about right, they need tweaks here and there but no heavy nerfs or heavy buffs. Mesmer seems to have a decent diversity of builds

Necros if you are doing it wrong if not condition
Thief you are doing it wrong if not Stealth Backstabbers
Ele you are doing it wrong if not D/D
ext
(Based on peoples opinions)

What the guild needs is MORE viable builds, not just 1 per a class.

The problem with some Mesmer specs like the Phantasm build to much damage is done by the Phantasms and not enough is done by the Mesmer, if that damage was reduced slightly and had the Mesmer damage was increased a bit i think it would make up for it a bit

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Necros if you are doing it wrong if not condition
Thief you are doing it wrong if not Stealth Backstabbers
Ele you are doing it wrong if not D/D
ext

Scepter/dagger ele is seen a lot more than d/d is currently, and s/d thief has been a popular choice in addition to the standard d/p. Both ele and thief have more variety in tournaments than mesmers do. Nearly every mesmer is running the same 20/20/0/0/30 shatter build. I don’t disagree that more viable builds would be a good thing, but I think your examples are off.

Mallechos.9876:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Necros if you are doing it wrong if not condition
Thief you are doing it wrong if not Stealth Backstabbers
Ele you are doing it wrong if not D/D
ext

Scepter/dagger ele is seen a lot more than d/d is currently, and s/d thief has been a popular choice in addition to the standard d/p. Both ele and thief have more variety in tournaments than mesmers do. Nearly every mesmer is running the same 20/20/0/0/30 shatter build. I don’t disagree that more viable builds would be a good thing, but I think your examples are off.

They were examples that i have been told, not ones i agree with. I guess i am the odd one, i hate shatter Mesmer and run a condition build on my Mesmer and love it, i do run D/D on my ele but i focus one thing – Air i spend 95% of my time in Air and my build is around that.

The problem with the game is that to many classes have to few “viable” builds that gives problems to those that arent running them as soon as people complain the WHOLE class gets slapped (unless Thief!) which punishes those that dont run the build that people are moaning about.

Lord forbid some people start putting a condition cleanse on their bar and use it judiciously (Hint: Do not use it on the first poison or stack of 4 bleeds you get).

Most of what people are talking about existed before the patch when Necors were underpowered and did relatively poorly in PvP. If you want to complain show the difference, the before and after.

I think really what is going on is that more necros are showing up to PvP so people have to figure out how to counter them.

Tenebrous.2451:

Lord forbid some people start putting a condition cleanse on their bar and use it judiciously (Hint: Do not use it on the first poison or stack of 4 bleeds you get).

Most of what people are talking about existed before the patch when Necors were underpowered and did relatively poorly in PvP. If you want to complain show the difference, the before and after.

I think really what is going on is that more necros are showing up to PvP so people have to figure out how to counter them.

Why not give EVERY class a new heal, one that heals ALL conditions and makes the user immune from ALL conditions being applied for X number of seconds(increased based on number of conditions removed)? Of course this would be done in different ways for each character (except Necro, they just get the X seconds of immunity added to Consume conditions, cool down increased)

For example, Mesmers heal could be that it heals and sends all the conditions to a clone, or maybe the heal creates a clone that takes all of the conditions an what conditions it has on it will be given to anyone in its AoE when its killed/replaced?

Of course this would take work to make the heal “fit” all of the classes but this would help with the Condition builds. Could even make it so that the immunity (would be a boon and ONLY applicable from the heal and cant be spread to allies) increases the more Conditions that you have?

This way it wont be so limited on who actually gets condition removal. Thus it will be like a battle of wits between the condition user and the target, does the Condition user burst all conditions fast or slowly build them and risk it not being enough

How long does the target wait before they use the condition removal heal? to soon and it will be wasted, to late and it could still mean dying.

That would change the game alot i think, it would give Necros(and all condition specs) a real dilemma rather then having next to nothing to fear. Something similar could be done for Boons, where each class is given a skill that strips boons from a target and gives them a “condition” (again this ONE skill has it and the condition cant be spread) that makes them not able to get boons for X number of seconds (increased per a boon removed)

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Tenebrous.2451:

Lord forbid some people start putting a condition cleanse on their bar and use it judiciously (Hint: Do not use it on the first poison or stack of 4 bleeds you get).

Most of what people are talking about existed before the patch when Necors were underpowered and did relatively poorly in PvP. If you want to complain show the difference, the before and after.

I think really what is going on is that more necros are showing up to PvP so people have to figure out how to counter them.

Why not give EVERY class a new heal, one that heals ALL conditions and makes the user immune from ALL conditions being applied for X number of seconds(increased based on number of conditions removed)? Of course this would be done in different ways for each character (except Necro, they just get the X seconds of immunity added to Consume conditions, cool down increased)

For example, Mesmers heal could be that it heals and sends all the conditions to a clone, or maybe the heal creates a clone that takes all of the conditions an what conditions it has on it will be given to anyone in its AoE when its killed/replaced?

Of course this would take work to make the heal “fit” all of the classes but this would help with the Condition builds. Could even make it so that the immunity (would be a boon and ONLY applicable from the heal and cant be spread to allies) increases the more Conditions that you have?

This way it wont be so limited on who actually gets condition removal. Thus it will be like a battle of wits between the condition user and the target, does the Condition user burst all conditions fast or slowly build them and risk it not being enough

How long does the target wait before they use the condition removal heal? to soon and it will be wasted, to late and it could still mean dying.

That would change the game alot i think, it would give Necros(and all condition specs) a real dilemma rather then having next to nothing to fear. Something similar could be done for Boons, where each class is given a skill that strips boons from a target and gives them a “condition” (again this ONE skill has it and the condition cant be spread) that makes them not able to get boons for X number of seconds (increased per a boon removed)

So every class gets a full condition cleanse – even the ones with overwhelming removal as it is? And every class gets corrupt boon too, except far stronger? Seems reasonable.

Roe.3679:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Tenebrous.2451:

Lord forbid some people start putting a condition cleanse on their bar and use it judiciously (Hint: Do not use it on the first poison or stack of 4 bleeds you get).

Most of what people are talking about existed before the patch when Necors were underpowered and did relatively poorly in PvP. If you want to complain show the difference, the before and after.

I think really what is going on is that more necros are showing up to PvP so people have to figure out how to counter them.

Why not give EVERY class a new heal, one that heals ALL conditions and makes the user immune from ALL conditions being applied for X number of seconds(increased based on number of conditions removed)? Of course this would be done in different ways for each character (except Necro, they just get the X seconds of immunity added to Consume conditions, cool down increased)

For example, Mesmers heal could be that it heals and sends all the conditions to a clone, or maybe the heal creates a clone that takes all of the conditions an what conditions it has on it will be given to anyone in its AoE when its killed/replaced?

Of course this would take work to make the heal “fit” all of the classes but this would help with the Condition builds. Could even make it so that the immunity (would be a boon and ONLY applicable from the heal and cant be spread to allies) increases the more Conditions that you have?

This way it wont be so limited on who actually gets condition removal. Thus it will be like a battle of wits between the condition user and the target, does the Condition user burst all conditions fast or slowly build them and risk it not being enough

How long does the target wait before they use the condition removal heal? to soon and it will be wasted, to late and it could still mean dying.

That would change the game alot i think, it would give Necros(and all condition specs) a real dilemma rather then having next to nothing to fear. Something similar could be done for Boons, where each class is given a skill that strips boons from a target and gives them a “condition” (again this ONE skill has it and the condition cant be spread) that makes them not able to get boons for X number of seconds (increased per a boon removed)

So every class gets a full condition cleanse – even the ones with overwhelming removal as it is? And every class gets corrupt boon too, except far stronger? Seems reasonable.

Does it seem reasonable for those that get next to none? Of course these would be heal and a Utility so taking them would mean losing out elsewhere. The fact how unbalanced Conditions and boons are something needs to be done.

some Condition removal is pointless, especially when you come up against Necro and some classes that can just spam boons become to strong simply because of them boons, so why not add abilities that would work against this

As it would require timing for both parties as to when to either burst your conditions or when to use the heal.

Hell, The boons are nearly as bad as the conditions in this game, some classes get them with ease others (Mesmer example) get them (if they are lucky) by chance. Something needs to be down as its just as out balanced as damage is in the game.

If you want to tpvp with a mesmer, shatter is your most effective bet.
Some niche builds might work (retal or PU boon build) but they just won’t compare to an engi or guardian bunker.
With regards to tpvp, a mesmer is no where near overpowered. They have powerful 1v1 builds but since they rely on stealth for target dropping, they just can’t hold points effectively. So please do not tell me condition mesmers are viable or mesmers are overpowered when the real pvp ie tpvp (this is what ANet should balance classes around) shows otherwise. If ANet introduces a death match or duel style gameplay then we can start talking about nerfing Mesmers.

Necros with terror builds are too powerful 1v1 to be equally powerful in a group fight which is why players say they are OP. Jumping into a hotjoin game with a necro and getting chain cc-ed by 2 players and dying does not mean you are not OP.

TLDR : Mesmers need viable condition and phantasm builds (lower phantasm damage and give them small aoe attacks) and Necro terror builds have to be toned down.

PS: To all the smart kitten Necros saying nothing changed in this patch to make Necros OP, why are you worried if some of the patch buffs ( terror and fear) are reverted?? It should not make a difference right?? Nothing changed.
:)

Demon.5082:

PS: To all the smart kitten Necros saying nothing changed in this patch to make Necros OP, why are you worried if some of the patch buffs ( terror and fear) are reverted?? It should not make a difference right?? Nothing changed.

:D

Because Terror wasn’t changed and has been the same for many months now. Only thing fear wise that changed was Doom to have a 1.5s fear when within 600 and Spectral Wall. The other changes were Spectrals not being cancelled, CD reduction for utilities across the board, a Nerf to corrupt boon and of course Torment and burning. The main thing that most Necromancers dont really care to lose is burning because thats the added part (along with torment) that started this whole necromancer OP thing.

Demon.5082:

TLDR : Mesmers need viable condition and phantasm builds (lower phantasm damage and give them small aoe attacks) and Necro terror builds have to be toned down.

THIS. Sure we have possible Condition builds, but they are NO where near strong enough compared to Condition builds by other classes, to much RNG and to much reliance on 2 traits: Cripple on death and random condition (yay more RNG -.-) on death

It doesnt help our tree system is a TOTAL mess with traits all over the place, we have condition traits in every tree…except the condition tree and the “Condition” tree is to obsessed with clones and phantoms

It just seems like we are pigeonholed into builds that some (including me) dont want to play because we have nothing else that is viable. -

Want to Bunker? Sorry No better options
Want to Condition? Sorry No better options
Want to Roam? Sorry No better options

Mesmer needs more viability and NO this does not mean we want to be the best at everything, it just means some of us dont want to be forced into the same build because everything else can be done better and more easily on other classes.