Guild Wars 2

Celestial getting removed. Pls don’t, ruining the only viable amulet for me on my main(necro). I’ve tried plenty of different amulets in pvp but I always come back to celestial since it has little bit of the defensive and offensive stats i want: vitality, toughness, power, precision and condition damage. If you’re going to remove celestial please make 5stat-amulets, 4 stats aren’t enough or atleast there isn’t enough combinations of stats for those.

There should be a counter for every build, a way to out do what becomes the meta based on skill.

Agreed. I have the power Shiro build (sword in place of shield usually and the trait that does more damage to those below a certain health threshold) and it doesn’t really have a set counter from a particular class, though more waves of respawners can be a situational counter due to its poor healing and need for energy build up.

In 1v1 however seems to have no counter and elementalist could live forever against it but a counter implies is at an advantage and is more likely to defeat you than you are to beat them not stalemate.

Warlord.9074:

lol no… Cele exists because it was a PVE thing, that came out with a living world patch. Not until a long time after was it added to PVP. It was a mistake to add it to PVP in the 1st place it was never intended to be there.

You’ve got it backwards. Cele was put into PvE because it was in PvP since beta.

Seriously, where did this complete falsehood come from? People keep saying this and it’s just wrong.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Warlord.9074:

lol no… Cele exists because it was a PVE thing, that came out with a living world patch. Not until a long time after was it added to PVP. It was a mistake to add it to PVP in the 1st place it was never intended to be there.

You’ve got it backwards. Cele was put into PvE because it was in PvP since beta.

Seriously, where did this complete falsehood come from? People keep saying this and it’s just wrong.

People probably forget it existed because it was useless, and in fact, had to be buffed 10% to even be considered viable. The only reason it became viable though was not that specific buff, it was the accompanying power creep like when they made Warrior shout heals like 3x as potent (or whatever it was) and the D/D Ele buffs all that time ago, THATS when Cele became a problem.

In short, when power creep and boon craze got out of hand the stats became an issue. And they are an issue, don’t get me wrong, but Celestial Ammy was a symptom not a cause.

A-net, could you try thinking about this stat combo amulet:

1050 power
1050 condition damage
560 precision
560 vitality

-healing and toughness is useless for me in pvp. I prefer use some skills and timed dodge to avoid damage. Vitality needed for some mistakes in combat and for some condi durability.

I don’t want focus pure condi or power dmg. I want “new celestial”.Not best at anything. What do ypu think guys

Spicy.2481:

Celestial getting removed. Pls don’t, ruining the only viable amulet for me on my main(necro). I’ve tried plenty of different amulets in pvp but I always come back to celestial since it has little bit of the defensive and offensive stats i want: vitality, toughness, power, precision and condition damage. If you’re going to remove celestial please make 5stat-amulets, 4 stats aren’t enough or atleast there isn’t enough combinations of stats for those.

what does necro need with vitality? you already get 20k health with 0 vitality

Hello Grouch,

Removing Rune of Durability and Rune of Mercy, I agree.

Sigil of energy, I disagree, this was much needed for many specs but never considered “over powered” in any respect.

Mercenary’s Amulet, really only useful for necromancer, not bad though, I would like this addition for diversity.

Sage’s Amulet, possibly druid/necro/elementalist? IMO, not a very good amulet, I would consider expertise over power or precision over condition damage, too similar to Mercenary’s Amulet, Will likely be a very seldom used amulet, I recommend revising it.

Paladin’s Amulet AIDS, basically the new soldiers amulet, will likely make Revenents/chronomancers/scrappers/druids unkillable with too much damage output.

Mender’s Amulet Stupid as kitten, do you ever see anyone run Magi builds? NOPE, because people NEED toughness. Add toughness, concentration, something to make it worthy of being called “Mender’s”.

Kicker.8203:

• Removing bunker amulets is a dream come true! Great job.

so much for play the way you want

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long time. So you allowed a league season directly after an expansion, without ever running a balance patch over it. Which in turn caused several random defensive builds to be put into play to negate your unbalanced damage coming from a select few classes. The majority of the active players jumped into your first season, only to find the game horribly broken (100% your fault). And now to fix that, your taking the nerf bat to everything defensive in order cover up your management’s gross incompetence with pushing content out too soon.

You (Anet) caused the way everyone played in the first season. And now your doing a cover up, to cater to all the bad players who blamed “EZ” class types, and realized how horribly unbalanced things were. You’re removing every viable defensive amulet in the game. You’re already nerfing the abilities, why are you nerfing the stats now too? “something we’ll tweak until we get PvP’s gameplay closer to our vision for it”
What is your “vision”? Everyone running around as a Trickster in zerker gear, instant-killing everyone and instant-dying? Your restricting gameplay like GW1 Costume brawl. (But at least GW1 had a Rock-Paper-Scissors style of strength and weaknesses)“Every class gets one set of skills to use that we deemed worthy”. That’s fine for the snowball arena, but for PvP as a whole you are grossly corrupting what you want rather than what the player decides. PvP should be skill based, therefore the closer you make things to neutral, the more the skill is shown. Forcing everyone to be offensive is NOT making things neutral, it’s you being lazy as crap.

Why can’t you make it more Rock-Paper-Scissors. If condition builds become the new “Meta”, how about giving ALL classes access to Resistance. Therefore you have a way to counter condition damage, but open yourself up to physical? There should be a counter for every build, a way to out do what becomes the meta based on skill. You’re approach however is along the lines of “Killing the patient to cure the disease”. The reason why people pick defensive builds in the first place is what needs to be addressed, not “We’re just gonna take stuff away until such a simple skeleton remains that we think is balance-ish”

100%

HipposWild.7185:

Kazel.9857:

snip

100%

Disagree

Saiyan.1704:

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long ti…..

Snip

Your “idk what’s going on” rant is so off base, it’s unreal.

They have to do an extensive test run before implementing a balance patch… that’s how balance patches gets implemented…. Throwing a PvP Season means Anet will see competitive players running optimal builds on the highest, competitive, TPvP level. What this means is, Anet have been seeing what’s optimal and what isn’t because… well.. it makes for a more efficient balance patch for Anet to implement.

Removing Cele amulet and replacing it with three entirely different amulets basically gave what people were already needing from Cele to begin with; only, it’s not as unbalanced because there’s finally a Give and Take relationship. GW2 has always been about Give and Take… it’s why we’ve had (used to have) each individual player on a given team run a unique amulet or build. That, in a nut shell, is Anet’s goal.

The first statement is wildly inaccurate. When the expansion was beta testing the dh was under powered… so instead of tweaking and readjusting they completely blew it up. This combined with the insane cc it gives and the introduction of the Rev who also deals decent damage meant eventually people got tankier and tankier just to survive the instant trap /double trap barrage. All they had to do was respond at that point and fine tune and this meta never would have gone sooooooo full tank.

The devs need to make a real decision about how they want the game played i.e. fight lengths and build roles and stop making classes that are balanced 1v1 but then the one randomly also adds boons etc to party members… youll never balance that way

Khenzy.9348:

Anyone else concerned about Reapers (specially with future buffs) running Mercenary’s Amulet? I can’t be the only one.

Most people see the Reaper dominating with that. Even Anet must see it…

Sorry if someone has mentioned this, but why are all the changes are for Spvp and then you keep trying to balance things around the Spvp, then you forget that there is wvw and there is pve =/

Please add all the stats and then try to balance things and not based on Spvp only, things like you need to stand on capping point and Mesmer gs1 for example (not to mention the obstructer you get mostly with it if you try to go in distant)

Or being on the capping point when you know that there are aoes going around on the capping point or god forbid traps.

Please try to balance the game itself and not only around Spvp and forget about other parts of the game.

Heartpains.7312:

Sorry if someone has mentioned this, but why are all the changes are for Spvp and then you keep trying to balance things around the Spvp, then you forget that there is wvw and there is pve =/

Please add all the stats and then try to balance things and not based on Spvp only, things like you need to stand on capping point and Mesmer gs1 for example (not to mention the obstructer you get mostly with it if you try to go in distant)

Or being on the capping point when you know that there are aoes going around on the capping point or god forbid traps.

Please try to balance the game itself and not only around Spvp and forget about other parts of the game.

100%

Kinda curious why they got rid of settlers. Condi damage, toughness, and healing power was never OP in any meta. There doesn’t seem to be a good replacement either.

Dont forget to delete marauder. Lets go squishy all the way. Also not sure if it was mentioned..but do you guys realize there is a special, awesom hipeo uber wow magic stat called ferocity?

Rip elementalists. Change is nice, but this is a bit over the top. Kinda killed my engineer build removing soldiers amulet but im kind of alright with these changes.

/cheers to the new meta.

Evasiion.3859:

Rip elementalists. Change is nice, but this is a bit over the top. Kinda killed my engineer build removing soldiers amulet but im kind of alright with these changes.

/cheers to the new meta.

Couldn’t imagine a Soldier’s build (especially from Engineer) that wouldn’t be pretty good with Paladin’s Amulet.

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long time.

Absolutely, 100% agree.

When you have to remove features to achieve to some semblance of balance, it demonstrates some fundamental problems with gameplay mechanics.

This game has always had too much “active” defense: constant dodging, blocking, blinding, going invulnerable, etc. With HoT it just went totally overboard, combining immortal bunker specs with bunker stat combinations.

So now they take the lazy man’s way out. Tweak some numbers and remove some stat combos.

why dont you just remove mesmer all together from the game?? we had wellmesmer for 2months now and you remove celestial amulet now?, you buff other bunkers aka guard which makes shatter mesmer even more worse? is that a joke or are you telling us to only play 3 classes at all?
and no endurance gain now?? how am i supposed to dodge in a 3n1? or against rangers spammy attacks… just great : )

HipposWild.7185:

Saiyan.1704:

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long ti…..

Snip

Your “idk what’s going on” rant is so off base, it’s unreal.

They have to do an extensive test run before implementing a balance patch… that’s how balance patches gets implemented…. Throwing a PvP Season means Anet will see competitive players running optimal builds on the highest, competitive, TPvP level. What this means is, Anet have been seeing what’s optimal and what isn’t because… well.. it makes for a more efficient balance patch for Anet to implement.

Removing Cele amulet and replacing it with three entirely different amulets basically gave what people were already needing from Cele to begin with; only, it’s not as unbalanced because there’s finally a Give and Take relationship. GW2 has always been about Give and Take… it’s why we’ve had (used to have) each individual player on a given team run a unique amulet or build. That, in a nut shell, is Anet’s goal.

The first statement is wildly inaccurate. When the expansion was beta testing the dh was under powered… so instead of tweaking and readjusting they completely blew it up. This combined with the insane cc it gives and the introduction of the Rev who also deals decent damage meant eventually people got tankier and tankier just to survive the instant trap /double trap barrage. All they had to do was respond at that point and fine tune and this meta never would have gone sooooooo full tank.

The devs need to make a real decision about how they want the game played i.e. fight lengths and build roles and stop making classes that are balanced 1v1 but then the one randomly also adds boons etc to party members… youll never balance that way

DH and Revs didn’t start the bunker meta… the meta would have came regardless because they are optimal builds.

What you just said doesn’t object to my points. They even said that DH trap prowess was going to be fixed in the balance patch… they waited to do so for reasons that i’ve already listed above.

The soon-to-be patch doesn’t cater to 1v1 duels so no clue where you got that from. Everyone knows that the game is 3x more balanced Team vs Team rather than Build Wars 2 duelings.

Honestly, I think removing celestial is deleting eles, even with these alternative amulets.

1. Eles do not have any hard mitigation (high evasion, stealth, blocks, lots of invulns) to play a burst or pure-bunker role, and are forced to tank up and play a bruiser/support role. This is an inherent flaw in the class design because 90% of survivability comes from traits.
2. Ele “defense” comes from high prot uptime, lots of cleanses, and lots of heals. This means that they need toughness (b/c prot ontop of base ele is just not enough) and healing power.
3. While in the distant past you could run the old valk’s amulet (now crusaders), power creep has burst and condition application over-the-top such that at least some vitality is also needed. Try crusaders now, even on tempest with a +vitality rune, and you will just melt.
4. Every time you nerf tanky eles ability to survive, they just disappear from the meta due to problem #1. The problem for eles has always been and will always be defense, and increasing the damage is useless unless you over-buff it so they can instantly 1-shot people again.

None of the provided amulets provide a combination of toughness, vitality, and healing power needed to make a working bruiser, which is the only role eles have ever effectively filled.

I would propose one of the following instead:
1. Reduce the stats on celestial so that it isn’t so overwhelmingly advantageous numerically.
OR
2. Introduce two versions of “cele” amulets for eles, one that is power based and one conditioned base (assuming you ever make ele condi viable), allowing them to provide vit, healing power, and toughness in reasonable amounts along with (power version) power, prec, and ferocity or (condi version) condition damage, condi duration, and precision.
OR
3. Increase the base HP of low-HP classes so they aren’t restricted only to amulets with +vit.
OR
4. This one is a long shot and not going to happen, but….Nerf everything down to a power level similar to pre-dhuumfire, where it was possible to survive without +vit.

Saiyan.1704:

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long ti…..

Snip

Your “idk what’s going on” rant is so off base, it’s unreal.

They have to do an extensive test run before implementing a balance patch… that’s how balance patches gets implemented…. Throwing a PvP Season means Anet will see competitive players running optimal builds on the highest, competitive, TPvP level. What this means is, Anet have been seeing what’s optimal and what isn’t because… well.. it makes for a more efficient balance patch for Anet to implement.

snip

Highly inaccurate. ArenaNet did not do an extensive test run before implementing a balance patch before PvP season 1. They did not do a balance patch at all! After HoT came out the game was highly unbalanced. Instead of doing a balance patch after a month or so they started a PvP season almost immediately. Probably because they hoped to get audience for their e-sports directly after the expansion when everyone was looking at GW2. That came at the cost of not so fun game play for most players and very boring game play to watch.

I don’t know what the results of the proposed changes of Jan 26 will be. But I lost faith in ArenaNet when it comes to balance patches. They have to earn that trust back by focusing on the players instead of dreaming of a big e-sports future.

this engi will miss cele

excited about menders on shout warrior though. hopefully it can be buffed enough to be worth maining for pvp again.

Blanket changes like these are not the answer. Honestly, if y’all are going to resort to this type of stuff, then just go baseline and remove all stat enhancers and runes/sigils…

I’m sorry, but this is another sign of the “low resources” that are being devoted to the most important aspect of the game, and that happens to be professions…

foste.3098:

HellShadow.6813:

+1050 power
+1050 precision
+560 toughness
+560 ferocity
pls pls pls

I second this plzzzzz Josh make it happen

If we are going to have yet another round shifting things around that dont work, might as well get this.

Why would it not work? It is like saying marauder is not working, it will work for ranger, mesmer, warrior, necromancer, revenant, and engineer. It is a variation of marauder.

Because real problem is balancing around amulets, not the stats on them.

I really don’t get these complaints. Anet has the choice when trying to break the bunker meta to either balance all the defensive abilities which are active skill based ways of defense or you remove the lazy flat passive defense through stats.
I like it more when my survival depends on my skill / traits rather then the sats I choose.

So because you are not able to fix the bugs / balance sigil of demon summoning you just remove it WP. Next you gona remove Pets from necro because you cant balance it too right ? Why you no just remake sigil of demon summoning so its a viable choice for minion masters and add a rune for minions too.

Axialbloom.8109:

- Removed Celestial
- Removed Sigil of Energy
- Removed Elementalist?

Energy wasn’t removed, reread the post.

Blackmoon.6837:

https://youtu.be/lsfhADiaP5E

I forgot about this song lol

I am also concerned about the removal of the Soldiers amulet. I play non-meta characters and builds as a casual player. Soldiers has been necessary for survivability.

With all the other changes that are happening with the upcoming patch, the removal of amulets seems to be a bit hasty. Keeping them and seeing how the meta changes due to the buffs and nerfs that are incoming would be a more prudent course and if things don’t change, then remove them before the next league.

Surprising indeed that they didn’t remove Clerics…(maybe they just left it out in the post)
Magi’s is unused anyway because precision in itself doesn’t deal much damage and you have no sustain without toughness(which is good). It is now:
Healing power(main)
Vitality
Precision

to make it useful it should be:
Condition damage(main)
vitality
healing power

I quite like the new stat sets. However, none of those have boon or condi duration.

Josh Davis.6015:

PS, gold for purchases runes/amulets will be refunded, and the newly added amulets will be free.

Oh, please be consistent.
All the pvp players had already the convenience of using them for ages
Think of the 24h rule…

GM Awesomeness.8619:

As for refunds: if you’ve had these account-bound items for ages, we won’t be doing refunds because you’ve already derived substantial benefit. If, however, you bought them more recently, we’re doing refunds on a case-by-case basis.

reapex.8546:

Axialbloom.8109:

- Removed Celestial
- Removed Sigil of Energy
- Removed Elementalist?

Energy wasn’t removed, reread the post.

Honestly it might as well have been. Who in their right mind would consider using this sigil now? Going from 50% endurance instantly to 12.5% endurance (1/4 of one dodge) over 5 seconds?! Are you f—-in’ mad?! That’s literally a 75% nerf, and that’s only for the builds that don’t have access to vigor already. That’s also ignoring the possibility for boon removal/corruption.

Let’s not forget that vigor doesn’t stack with any other endurance regeneration abilities… making it even more useless for any class that has a trait that gives them extra endurance regeneration.

A lot of people really liked this sigil, and I honestly haven’t seen a single complaint on the forums about it. But it was popular and a lot of ppl used it (like cele ammy), so…

RIP.

hotcarl.8621:

reapex.8546:

Axialbloom.8109:

- Removed Celestial
- Removed Sigil of Energy
- Removed Elementalist?

Energy wasn’t removed, reread the post.

Honestly it might as well have been. Who in their right mind would consider using this sigil now? Going from 50% endurance instantly to 12.5% endurance (1/4 of one dodge) over 5 seconds?! Are you f—-in’ mad?! That’s literally a 75% nerf, and that’s only for the builds that don’t have access to vigor already. That’s also ignoring the possibility for boon removal/corruption.

Let’s not forget that vigor doesn’t stack with any other endurance regeneration abilities… making it even more useless for any class that has a trait that gives them extra endurance regeneration.

A lot of people really liked this sigil, and I honestly haven’t seen a single complaint on the forums about it. But it was popular and a lot of ppl used it (like cele ammy), so…

RIP.

Same as I said. They should make vigor stack in intensity twice and make it 10s on this sigil or just nerf it to a plain 30 endurance.

Mercenary amulet, lol.

Thank you, exactly what I need.

The energy sigil nerf takes away 50% of the necro’s only team-wide damage immunity. Focusing the necro is still a thing due to the class’s lack of disengage. I think the buffs to the class are justified, if not warranted, in this case.

It’s not a good dodge roll unless I see 4 times ‘evaded’ popping up.

Where is the toughness + healing?

The sigil of Energy nerf is extreme, to say the least: Sigil of Energy currently grants 50 endurance which is 50% of the total endurance.

Vigor is a 50% buff to endurance regeneration, which happens to be at 5% per second. This means that having vigor is equal to a 2.5% extra endurance gain, since 5% * 1.5 = 7.5%, and 7.5% – 5% = 2.5%.
The new Sigil of Energy grants 7s of Vigor, which means that the new energy gain is 2.5% * 7 = 17.5%, which is 17.5 endurance.

Current sigil of Energy awards 50 endurance instantly
Post-nerf sigil of Energy awards 17.5 endurance in 7 seconds.

Please, just nerf the endurance amount from 50 to 25 and call it a day. The new Sigil of Energy is extremely underperfoming with respect to the current Sigil of Energy.

Juba.8406:

Please delete Warrior.

ahahahhahahahahahahahaha made my day :’DDDDD

Mender’s Amulet
1050 Power
1050 Healing Power
560 Precision
560 Vitality

>

This need to be,

Mender’s Amulet
1050 Power
1050 Healing Power
560 Precision
560 Felocity

Or
1200 power, 900 prec, 900 heal (zealot)

No vitality plz

hotcarl.8621:

reapex.8546:

Axialbloom.8109:

- Removed Celestial
- Removed Sigil of Energy
- Removed Elementalist?

Energy wasn’t removed, reread the post.

Honestly it might as well have been. Who in their right mind would consider using this sigil now? Going from 50% endurance instantly to 12.5% endurance (1/4 of one dodge) over 5 seconds?! Are you f—-in’ mad?! That’s literally a 75% nerf, and that’s only for the builds that don’t have access to vigor already. That’s also ignoring the possibility for boon removal/corruption.

Let’s not forget that vigor doesn’t stack with any other endurance regeneration abilities… making it even more useless for any class that has a trait that gives them extra endurance regeneration.

A lot of people really liked this sigil, and I honestly haven’t seen a single complaint on the forums about it. But it was popular and a lot of ppl used it (like cele ammy), so…

RIP.

Not sure if you’re asking me a question or asking Anet a question or just being rhetorical lol.

foste.3098:

PLZ for the low of god add this amulet combination:

+1050 power
+1050 precision
+560 toughness
+560 ferocity

This will be highly desirable for rangers, mesmers, warriors, and necromancers who wish to play a power build. Currently thees classes can pick berzerker (an go full glass) or marauder to get some defence. The stat combination i proposed would be a competitor to the marauder amulet since the above mention classes have medium and high hp pools and getting more hp is somewhat redundant (not on all builds but still), but they all would greatly benefit from some added armor.

Back on topic i love all the item changes. The removal of celestial and introduction of these new stat combinations will force ppl to make more of a choice when making a build.

Always

I really dislike the huge nerf to energy sigil. It is a nerf to active defense, while cc spam and unavoidable procs remain and dmg is even buffed. Which makes passive sustain/defense even more important …

It should have been the other way arround.

Trepidation Lost.3469:

foste.3098:

PLZ for the low of god add this amulet combination:

+1050 power
+1050 precision
+560 toughness
+560 ferocity

This will be highly desirable for rangers, mesmers, warriors, and necromancers who wish to play a power build. Currently thees classes can pick berzerker (an go full glass) or marauder to get some defence. The stat combination i proposed would be a competitor to the marauder amulet since the above mention classes have medium and high hp pools and getting more hp is somewhat redundant (not on all builds but still), but they all would greatly benefit from some added armor.

Always

Need:

1050 Power
1050 Condition
560 Toughness
560 Healing Power

Chaos.2108:

Mercenary Amulet, are you seriously thinking it’s a good idea?

What are you crying about!? The community got what it wanted now, mesmers got nerfed so hard that condi build is everything we got left!!!

As I see it, not adding this one, will ruin the only build we have left!!!
People here think more about themself then acual balance… As an example of this many clapping their hands, cheering for the nerf to cele amulet, and dont even for a sec think about what it would do to ele…

Stop beeing selfish and ignorant!

Druid, scrapper, necro are still op as hell, and now theives will join in aswell! You should be focusing on that..

If some amulets may make some classes op, then iam all for locking that said amulet from those classes, so they cant access it! But for some other classes they going to be essential after this patch!

But I guess you, and some other people here, didnt think of that…

Saiyan.1704:

Kazel.9857:

This is one of the cheapest, most horribly thought out -lazy- fixes I’ve seen in a long ti…..

Snip

They have to do an extensive test run before implementing a balance patch…

Axialbloom.8109:

Khenzy.9348:

Anyone else concerned about Reapers (specially with future buffs) running Mercenary’s Amulet? I can’t be the only one.

Most people see the Reaper dominating with that. Even Anet must see it…

The amulet is needed for mesmers aswell! Not introducing it because reaper will get an advantage, isnt fair! This game cannot alone be balanced around necros…

Nerco reapers need a nerf, Anet not doing this in this patch, is a HUGE mistake! Same goes for scrapper and druid aswell!

wtf is the problem with soldier amulet?
thats kittened