Guild Wars 2

This is what you call a mirror match-up.

fun to watch even though its just a brief moment xD

i think i replayed this about 10 times..that is insane

Keyboard rolling at all levels of this game.

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Keyboard rolling at all levels of this game.

i tried that once. turns out popping all defenses and offenses at the same tame makes it very easy to be blocked and then proceed to burst you down. “keyboard rolling”yeah right

sophiewhite.3149:

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Keyboard rolling at all levels of this game.

i tried that once. turns out popping all defenses and offenses at the same tame makes it very easy to be blocked and then proceed to burst you down. “keyboard rolling”yeah right

The did the exact moves in the exact order. If that is not rolling the keyboard in a rotation, then I do not know what is then.

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

sophiewhite.3149:

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Keyboard rolling at all levels of this game.

i tried that once. turns out popping all defenses and offenses at the same tame makes it very easy to be blocked and then proceed to burst you down. “keyboard rolling”yeah right

The did the exact moves in the exact order. If that is not rolling the keyboard in a rotation, then I do not know what is then.

lol

Rev- Overpowered, face roll, brain dead class since day 1

:D

Good first step to rebalancing the HoT powercreep blowout- delete rev from game.

THIS IS AMAZING

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

Sword 2, 3 and staff 5 need to be reworked -_-

Actually…. all rev use same rotations -_-
rush in→ def and off in same time→ mobile → block →healing →rush in….

Actually… all OP class have same things -_- REV,ENG,DURID,DH….

mobile , great healing , inv , block , short CD , def & off in same time, CC
short CD mobile is the main problem of them. Let them easy to leave the danger and CD other sustain skill -_- again again and again…

ELE and NEC doesn’t have this system. So they become the first target and easy get kill.

Really funny seeing that but also kind of saddening too. The game has become mostly a rotation game where you run in, do your rotation and then bug out if you’re not winning. I guess a lot of that is muscle memory at that level but still it’s disheartening to see that the game is so faced paced there’s no careful playing and countering.

apharma.3741:

Really funny seeing that but also kind of saddening too. The game has become mostly a rotation game where you run in, do your rotation and then bug out if you’re not winning. I guess a lot of that is muscle memory at that level but still it’s disheartening to see that the game is so faced paced there’s no careful playing and countering.

so i take it you never die then? because if you do then it does take countering and careful playing.

Man this was fun as hell man. It was like watching a friggin DBZ fight.

apharma.3741:

. The game has become mostly a rotation game where you run in, do your rotation and then bug out if you’re not winning.

Oh so it’s like every mmo in existence.

Every build that has ever existed has a optimal way to go about attacking another player.

In theory most high level 1v1s should actually look like that, however in real 1v1s one of the players usually alphas ahead of the other player resulting in the late player having to break rotation to defend themselves.

Crinn.7864:

apharma.3741:

. The game has become mostly a rotation game where you run in, do your rotation and then bug out if you’re not winning.

Oh so it’s like every mmo in existence.

Every build that has ever existed has a optimal way to go about attacking another player.

In theory most high level 1v1s should actually look like that, however in real 1v1s one of the players usually alphas ahead of the other player resulting in the late player having to break rotation to defend themselves.

Not sure about other mmos, but if we talk about any type of pvp game that has some skill level of skill play, a rotation its the definition of low skill use (not necesary low skill level if its so OP that cant be countered – not here yet).

Thats for two main factors:

- You can predict a rotation, meaning you can easily survive the burst and get a time or create a time to burst.

- Theres not one optimal way to deal with all the players. The strategy (not rotation) will depend of class, build and skill level. A good player will be able to change its style/strategy at the midle of the fight and you will need to change yours also.

As a reminder: The easier way to connect against an enemy that knows how your class works and the combos its to do out of the boxes atacks or have as many as posible so you are not predictable (in other words if you expect the same burst atack all the guys that start with a meta build learn, you will get killed against anyone that knows their class).

Its the same principle as starting the same way every time, you will be countered. Also if we talk about rotations with lazzy low level play, you can create a counter rotation and kitten the other guy lol.

Repeating the same combos and start its part of a rotation (not the only one, since its the use of them as a set timing (not adjusted one) in a predeterminated sequence: Like casting 3 illusions and do shatter inmediatly to only get blocked by a war shield instead of waiting for it to end and then shatter.

Lucius.2140:

Thats for two main factors:

- You can predict a rotation, meaning you can easily survive the burst and get a time or create a time to burst.

- Theres not one optimal way to deal with all the players. The strategy (not rotation) will depend of class, build and skill level. A good player will be able to change its style/strategy at the midle of the fight and you will need to change yours also.

As a reminder: The easier way to connect against an enemy that knows how your class works and the combos its to do out of the boxes atacks or have as many as posible so you are not predictable (in other words if you expect the same burst atack all the guys that start with a meta build learn, you will get killed against anyone that knows their class).

Its the same principle as starting the same way every time, you will be countered. Also if we talk about rotations with lazzy low level play, you can create a counter rotation and kitten the other guy lol.

Repeating the same combos and start its part of a rotation (not the only one, since its the use of them as a set timing (not adjusted one) in a predeterminated sequence: Like casting 3 illusions and do shatter inmediatly to only get blocked by a war shield instead of waiting for it to end and then shatter.

Your points are only valid in a asymmetrical 1v1 (a 1v1 between different builds)

In a 1v1 between identical builds (like the OP’s video where both where power revs) you execute the optimal rotation because if your opponent does anything less than the optimal then they lose by default.

The only time breaking the optimal is the proper play in a symmetric 1v1 is if you are behind and need to pull a wild card to win. Of course in the majority of 1v1s, one player attacks ahead of the other, rather than both at the same instant.

Crinn.7864:

Lucius.2140:

Thats for two main factors:

- You can predict a rotation, meaning you can easily survive the burst and get a time or create a time to burst.

- Theres not one optimal way to deal with all the players. The strategy (not rotation) will depend of class, build and skill level. A good player will be able to change its style/strategy at the midle of the fight and you will need to change yours also.

As a reminder: The easier way to connect against an enemy that knows how your class works and the combos its to do out of the boxes atacks or have as many as posible so you are not predictable (in other words if you expect the same burst atack all the guys that start with a meta build learn, you will get killed against anyone that knows their class).

Its the same principle as starting the same way every time, you will be countered. Also if we talk about rotations with lazzy low level play, you can create a counter rotation and kitten the other guy lol.

Repeating the same combos and start its part of a rotation (not the only one, since its the use of them as a set timing (not adjusted one) in a predeterminated sequence: Like casting 3 illusions and do shatter inmediatly to only get blocked by a war shield instead of waiting for it to end and then shatter.

Your points are only valid in a asymmetrical 1v1 (a 1v1 between different builds)

In a 1v1 between identical builds (like the OP’s video where both where power revs) you execute the optimal rotation because if your opponent does anything less than the optimal then they lose by default.

The only time breaking the optimal is the proper play in a symmetric 1v1 is if you are behind and need to pull a wild card to win. Of course in the majority of 1v1s, one player attacks ahead of the other, rather than both at the same instant.

I dont think thats true, let me give you two examples considering two wars:

• If they start at same time and its time to burst in the rotation: i will block the burst that way i will take the lead, breaking a tie.

• If one start first and its time to burst but the enemy its trying to “break” by blocking, then i will not burst , will wait and then burst or change to an unbloackable atack xd.

That video its too small to consider it a full rotation and as i said before: rotation itself its not a combo but a complete set of them that go in circles, never change and never change of pace. If you are winning with a rotation but in a specific part you gain more to not do it and outsmart the rotation of your mirror enemy, then do it!. Same goes if you are losing as you said or if you are at a tie.

If i can kill an enemy faster by waiting or doing something other way i will do. Rotations are predictables and you can circle them, its not good to use them for that.
Also the game itself has enough deep to let you do different strategies with the same build and not consider one optimal in all cases, the game its not linear in its gameplay, that itself its an asymmetrical condition.

Lucius.2140:

• If they start at same time and its time to burst in the rotation: i will block the burst that way i will take the lead, breaking a tie.

No, because if you took the time to block his burst, you just interrupted your own burst. He can then block your burst and now you’re back to square one.

In a symmetrical 1v1 you can’t actually get ahead if the other person is executing optimally, you either fall behind or match them.
Of course thanks to the great randomness of PvP a truly symmetrical 1v1 between top level players almost never happens.

• If one start first and its time to burst but the enemy its trying to “break” by blocking, then i will not burst , will wait and then burst or change to an unbloackable atack xd.

Then that person isn’t playing optimally. Optimal playing assumes the opponent is going to use his unblockable siggy at a appropriate time.

If i can kill an enemy faster by waiting or doing something other way i will do.

You misunderstand what I mean by “optimal.” Optimal rotation is the rotation that kills the target the fastest.

You are talking about outplaying the opponent. If we are to assume in this hypothetical duel that the pair are both playing properly, then outplaying isn’t on the table.

EDIT: when I say rotation I’m not talking about static PvE style rotations where you do the same button combo for any and every enemy. I’m referring to a theoretical dynamic rotation that accounts for the target’s class and DcDs.

My arguments are theoretical assuming perfect play.

Crinn.7864:

EDIT: when I say rotation I’m not talking about static PvE style rotations where you do the same button combo for any and every enemy. I’m referring to a theoretical dynamic rotation that accounts for the target’s class and DcDs.

My arguments are theoretical assuming perfect play.

Yeah i was talking about a statical ones were players never reaction different if something change, except if they are losing. Its not that rare to get one guy that confess his doing that with a class that have too much sustain (like old cele ele).

Also you can consider on that conditions two points: flexible systems allow to more viable answers that will not end in for example: died in or before move 15, so you can get more than one solution, gw2 its flexible in its gameplay .

Plus its imposible for a player to take in account movements on infinitum (as you said, perfect play its imposible for this).

Would have liked to see what could have happened after they both staff 5’ed, too bad other people showed up and ruined it the 1v1.

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

This was my initial reaction.

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

What about Dragon Hunters? If they used F3, most traps, symbols, meditations, and weapon bursts wouldn’t do anything for the duration.

Simonoly.4352:

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

This was my initial reaction.

THIS! So much this!

mrauls.6519:

Simonoly.4352:

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

This was my initial reaction.

THIS! So much this!

Literally every class except necro can unload major burst damage against an opponent while in some sort of damage immunity.

Mesmer: Blurred frenzy/distortion, plus shatters.
Ele: obsidian flesh.
Engi: Rocket charge, shock shield
Thief: many high damage attacks that also evade
Ranger: Signet of stone
Guardian: shield of courage
Warrior: whirlwind attack and endure pain/berserkers stance

ArthurDent.9538:

mrauls.6519:

Simonoly.4352:

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

This was my initial reaction.

THIS! So much this!

Literally every class except necro can unload major burst damage against an opponent while in some sort of damage immunity.

Mesmer: Blurred frenzy/distortion, plus shatters.
Ele: obsidian flesh.
Engi: Rocket charge, shock shield
Thief: many high damage attacks that also evade
Ranger: Signet of stone
Guardian: shield of courage
Warrior: whirlwind attack and endure pain/berserkers stance

It’s cute how you try to put the above on par with the unbalanced mess that is revenant.

ArthurDent.9538:

mrauls.6519:

Simonoly.4352:

Sins.4782:

Just think, if this was on anything other than rev, both players blowing their highest damaging skills in a row on each other would have resulted in both taking huge damage.

This was my initial reaction.

THIS! So much this!

Literally every class except necro can unload major burst damage against an opponent while in some sort of damage immunity.

Mesmer: Blurred frenzy/distortion, plus shatters.
Ele: obsidian flesh.
Engi: Rocket charge, shock shield
Thief: many high damage attacks that also evade
Ranger: Signet of stone
Guardian: shield of courage
Warrior: whirlwind attack and endure pain/berserkers stance

yea because a ton of warriors damage doesnt come from f1 if a condi or 2 if a power. totally.
and how almost all of the classes require 2 skills to match the revs 1 skill

Ah the brain dead levels of rev.

Explore the new “server”-class in the next expansion, a personal bot that plays guildwars for you. #allveryexcitedtobringyou

How is this not a gif yet?

It is.

Sins.4782:

It is.

#DeleteRev

XD

Anyone wanna guess what’s their next move? My money is on elemental blast if on cap point, warding rift and then chaotic release lol

If we want to talk something serious though…..it’s true that they’re blowing all high damage CDs, but any other class have to blow their even higher CD defenses as well or suffer 50-70% hp damage. Just imagine what the necro will be like after the end of that rotation.

There’s simply no way to interrupt most of their chains due to innate evades. Yes I know a few 1/4s window frame just before they start but that fact that those frames are “pre-skill animations” mean it’ll require something like thief steal or mesmer power lock to reliably stop them. Kiting won’t work either due to distance 240+ coverage in all their skills.

Only way to avoid damage is dodge or blow your defensive CDs like stealth, evade or blocks. This is one of the main reason why revenant stands at the pinnacle of power roaming specs: the distance coverage and defensive aspects allows them to execute rotations safely. It’s not a sin that rev bears alone though, many HoT specs are like that, promoting players hitting same rotations without much considerations of it missing or interrupted.

If we want to break down the skills you mentioned

• Blurred frenzy root mesmer on the ground, easiest thing to kite in game.
• Obsidian flesh is on 40s CD.
• Rocket charge can be interrupted midway just before each strike landing. Shock shield damage got 50% base damage gutted (and power coefficient took another 50%) so it tickles anyone that isn’t thief.
• Many thief attacks evade while dealing high damage? Are you talking about the dead S/D build or hideous staff build that basically mean suicide dive in teamfights? Vault can also be interrupted just before landing.
• Signet of stone is on 64 or 80s CD.
• Shield of courage is on 65s CD and even with renewed focus its still considerably high
• Whirlwind attack can be kited to reduce significant damage. Endure/defy pain are on 60s CD as well.
  You might notice I also mentioned interrupt frames on some evading skills, the fact that they’re open to interrupt “midway” or “before landing” means you can time it much easier than rev’s pre-skill animations.

Now compare all those skills to the rev rotations we seen in OP’s funny video, all their rotations will be back in 20s.

Sins.4782:

It is.

Say what what? My unwittingly keen eyes spawned a gif? You don’t say!!!