Guild Wars 2

Hi,

NERF INC ASAP!

So I’m a pretty good Guardian I must admit, I can 1v1 without any class dying for a good duration. Though when it comes to me facing a POWER spec Necro its a different story, I get POPPED very quickly, which obviously means there is something wrong or in other words OVERPOWERED.

See my picture attached and tell me what you THINK!

There was a necro who used his elite, he pressed 1 a lot and you seem to have taken every hit.
Then there’s a second necro who uses a dagger but does really low damage with it (maybe a hybrid build).

So… how is this Lich Form damage unusual? And what have thieves got to do with it?

flow.6043:

There was a necro who used his elite, he pressed 1 a lot and you seem to have taken every hit.
Then there’s a second necro who uses a dagger but does really low damage with it (maybe a hybrid build).

So… how is this Lich Form damage unusual? And what have thieves got to do with it?

Name me another class, who’s elite can basically one shot players? If you didn’t understand my whole question, I am using the term Thieves to exaggerate my point in a way it makes sense to what I’m talking about.

Necros are pretty balanced. The heavy damage comes from Lich, DS 1 or wells, all of which are highly telegraphed, like all hard hitting hits should be. Reflect their projectiles, corrupt/steal their stability then CC, get off point when wells are on them etc. Maybe Chill of Death needs to be looked at, but otherwise their damage is justified.

Well, at least the bird took some damage before you died.

Run an s/d thief on your team. He can strip the stab and cc him while you both clean up. It’s easy to do on thief.

There you go!

Dude, do you call taking ELEVEN hits in the face getting 1-shot? :-D those attacks have absolutely no homing to them: dodge, get out of the way, hide behind a pillar or on any ledge and he can’t hit you.

You are a pretty good guardian yet you didnt know what that green lich was going to do ?
Sorry man, but its a L2P issue. When a necro turns in that BIG fluo green kitten you should istantly know that you need to block/dodge those shadowy hands.

There are many teams that melt when a lich pops up, but actually its easy to deal with them, depending on your class/build

• remove their stability, then CC hard
• if u cant, use some shield, even better if reflects
• moa
• stealth and flee
• blind him and dps hard (that thing has extremely reduced mobility)
• if you cant do anything of the above, just roll and take some distance, cause those #1 death attacks are the slowest projectiles in game, if u are at say 900+ range you can dodge them without even dodging.

had to laugh when i read this. necros must be really op when they can 10 shot op-but-nobody-admits-it bunker guardians.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions on how to play, the thing is I know what to do, even if I go off point to hide etc, me myself as a guardian can’t do crap if I’m a bunker, I’m not even standing in the wells. @manveruppd, I was actually soaking all those hits up and healing at the same time, now imagine me being a Thief or a Mesmer for example.

you can pretty much avoid all the damage if you trait for sanctuary 9 seconds, your block heal, aegis, 2-3 dodges, blinds, focus if you bring it, shield 5 if you bring it and strifing. not that hard.

Wall of Reflection
thats a third of the lich duration handled already, who knows them might kill themselves too! also use dodges, blocks, sanctuary, shield of absorption etc as a guardian you have plenty of ways to stop projectiles,

also deathly claws moves EXTREMELY slow, with even a short amount of distance you can simply run sideways to avoid the damage completely.

Chilli.2976:

I was actually soaking all those hits up and healing at the same time, now imagine me being a Thief or a Mesmer for example.

Obviously a thief or mesmer wouldn’t face-tank a Lich. Also, as others have said already, they’d both just strip stability, blind, CC and dps the necro down. As a guardian you could’ve used reflects and the necro would have killed himself with just 3-4 hits.
Lich is super weak without support from allies, it needs babysitters because they basically give up all of their defense for a temporary power boost. So in your case either your team mates sucked or weren’t present in that fight at all, in which case it’s probably a win for you because you made the necro waste his elite for no reason.

Anyway Anet stated way back before the game came out Elites were meant to be game changing skills that can change the way a fight plays. Lich, Crate, Spirit, Banner are all good elites in that regard.

the question is, are those elites good? should they be that powerful? are they better than the gw1 elites?

I love it when there is power lich necro on the team I’m playing against PoC to the lich and fear chain the kitten out of him. Thanks for playing!

Why do you want nerf the necro?

It’s a gigantic green character, easily telegraphed and dealt with by a proper team.

Although it is fun to use against tanky guardians who choose to do nothing meaningful about it.

I would nerf the damage on DS#1 to be honest (being serious). No build should be based around 1 spam, it is lame and boring. Lich form is lame too but its a 3 minute cooldown and its counter able to never mind.

Chilli.2976:

Hi,

NERF INC ASAP!

So I’m a pretty good Guardian I must admit, I can 1v1 without any class dying for a good duration. Though when it comes to me facing a POWER spec Necro its a different story, I get POPPED very quickly, which obviously means there is something wrong or in other words OVERPOWERED.

See my picture attached and tell me what you THINK!

So do you survive vs any class but 1 Power Necro and suddenly you ask for a nerf? That make sense!!!
I’d say Guardian is OP and you just got outskilled by another player.
Also don’t put Thieves in a situation that doesn’t involve a thief please, there are still too many people crying for thieves when they die

Lordrosicky.5813:

I would nerf the damage on DS#1 to be honest (being serious). No build should be based around 1 spam, it is lame and boring. Lich form is lame too but its a 3 minute cooldown and its counter able to never mind.

I have a theory that power necro has so much 1 spam because you have to focus so much on positioning and life force to actually survive. Not like most other builds that have like, real active defenses.

Roe.3679:

Lordrosicky.5813:

I would nerf the damage on DS#1 to be honest (being serious). No build should be based around 1 spam, it is lame and boring. Lich form is lame too but its a 3 minute cooldown and its counter able to never mind.

I have a theory that power necro has so much 1 spam because you have to focus so much on positioning and life force to actually survive. Not like most other builds that have like, real active defenses.

Well yeh at least the 1 spam is gated behind life force. It is still lame though. And power necro dies really fast.

It is balanced. But I would rather see buffs to areas like regen working in death shroud and nerfs slightly to the life blast damage

Nerf the slow moving green ball. Sure. But speed up its cast time and projectile.

Lets do a second test. Have a thief stand behind you and backstab you 11 times in a row like you apparently let this Necromancer do to you, and we’ll see which one kills you faster.

Bhawb.7408:

Lets do a second test. Have a thief stand behind you and backstab you 11 times in a row like you apparently let this Necromancer do to you, and we’ll see which one kills you faster.

mmm 11 backstab let’s see…
considering 3 seconds of revealed, it will take 33 seconds for the thief, I guess the power necro kills faster

How many teams run at least 1 guardian? How many teams run at least 1 necro?
???
Necro OP confirmed, plz nerf.

PSILO.4068:

Well, at least the bird took some damage before you died.

lmfao i died at your post. 11/10

Kolly.9872:

Bhawb.7408:

Lets do a second test. Have a thief stand behind you and backstab you 11 times in a row like you apparently let this Necromancer do to you, and we’ll see which one kills you faster.

mmm 11 backstab let’s see…
considering 3 seconds of revealed, it will take 33 seconds for the thief, I guess the power necro kills faster

To speed up the process you can always do Backstab → HSHSHSHSHSHSHS

XD

Autoattack #1 scale tooo much with power in lichform and in deathshroud

everyone know this and everyone know this is op – alot people play powernecro just to burst peoples down in lichform and dont know anything bout this class

its same it was with hammerclowns – people playing it said it is fine and they still do
same with turretengis – this people even think this is balanced^^

anyway – autoattack scale too much with power and needc to be fixed

but we all know – arenanet dont care so why care?^^

Lich form has always been there, but ppl wasnt complaining about it before, why ?
Cause they necro used to be first targets and were easily shut down before they could become a threat.

Chilli.2976:

flow.6043:

There was a necro who used his elite, he pressed 1 a lot and you seem to have taken every hit.
Then there’s a second necro who uses a dagger but does really low damage with it (maybe a hybrid build).

So… how is this Lich Form damage unusual? And what have thieves got to do with it?

Name me another class, who’s elite can basically one shot players? If you didn’t understand my whole question, I am using the term Thieves to exaggerate my point in a way it makes sense to what I’m talking about.

Moa form + immobilize?

Well afterwards you simply kill the poor fool. But it’s pretty much an easier way of getting it done if you think about it.

People are waking up to the fact that necros are a bad condition class.

…a good gimic way to play them, is full zerk, as people tend to worry about the conditions, and ignore the direct damage.

…but after the first time a person dies to a zerker, they look at their logs, figure out what happened, and then go wreck that necro over and over, so it’s not really viable.

…it’s not like he has stealth, just go kill him.

So necros are a bad condition class and we are a one trick pony for power? Is that what your saying or am I missing something.

Necro is definitely not a one trick pony, whatever build you run (well…. MM necro is a zero trick pony, there are just too many ponies..), running a power necro in a team pvp means that you are going to have close to no escapes, so you got to rely totally on your team for your survivability.
Zerk necros, compared to other zerkers, trade mobility for lot more health. I sometimes play a vampiric necro and its really good against many other zerk spec cause it has 23k hp + 18k from LF pool, and if you build and play it around quick LF generation that extra life can refill more than once in a duel, gaining more effective health than a bunker.

Sigh….. I know they are not a one trick pony. Maybe in a duel vamp is ok but only if the person your playing has very little CC. Vamp in general sucks. If your looking for something with enough sustain and enough damage to work as a bunker necro try this

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fRAQNBIhZakjmeartx4G2bTcMUQFlRHAHw2S9TMFxKA-TZhHwAEOFAMLDA4BAE4IAke/BA

Lets not forget that nerfing power necro autoattacks would wreck the viability of the necromancer in other game modes, especially PvE where its already the weakest class and depends on the high damage autos to do anything at all.

And I think its fine for PvP. It is powerful sure, but necromancers are easy enough to incapacitate and burst down so its not much of an issue for smart players. As to the OP, unless you play meditation against a glass necro, necromancers in general do really well against guardians.

Let’s analyze what a guardian can do against lich form auto-attacks, I’m just gonna run down the list of each auto-attack a lich form necro does and what a guardian can do.

LF Auto 1: Passive aegis blocks, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 2: Sword #2 blind, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 3: Focus #5 block (blocks 3 attacks), take 0 dmg
LF Auto 4: Focus #5 block, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 5: Focus #5 block, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 6: Focus #4 blind, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 7: Focus #4 blind (second bounce), take 0 dmg
LF Auto 8: F1 active traited blind, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 9: GS #3 blind, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 10: F3 active aegis block, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 11: Shelter block heal (lasts 2s, LF auto is about 1 per second), take 0 dmg
LF Auto 12: Shelter block heal, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 13: Renewed Focus invulnerability (lasts 2s), take 0 dmg
LF Auto 14: Renewed Focus invulnerability, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 15: F3 active aegis block (recharged from elite), take 0 dmg
LF Auto 16: Dodge, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 17: Dodge, take 0 dmg
LF Auto 18: Dodge (energy sigil weapon swap), take 0 dmg

Were you standing completely still when you got that combat log?

The damage is quite normal…
Plus you are a guardian, if you’re anywhere half decent you should have popped your projectile destroyer already.

I have so many ways to deal with them.
Spam blind, turn him into moa to cancel his elite entirely, strip his stability and he becomes a big fat target that will be CCed around like a ping pong ball, time the dodge because it’s so predictable, pop the projectile reflection so he kills himself,.

Believe it or not, lich form necro usually die faster than the regular form of necro, so when they pop lich form too quickly, it’s the time they die first, or forced to cancel early due to lack of hp.

Last thing, I find it hard to believe you’re as good as you claimed as a guardian.
Getting hit 11 times as a guardian in 30 second is no joke. If you’re squishy classes you’d have downed in 3 hits already.

GG WP, learn2powernecro.

Proudly represent!

cuge.5398:

You are a pretty good guardian yet you didnt know what that green lich was going to do ?
Sorry man, but its a L2P issue. When a necro turns in that BIG fluo green kitten you should istantly know that you need to block/dodge those shadowy hands.

There are many teams that melt when a lich pops up, but actually its easy to deal with them, depending on your class/build

• remove their stability, then CC hard
• if u cant, use some shield, even better if reflects
• moa
• stealth and flee
• blind him and dps hard (that thing has extremely reduced mobility)
• if you cant do anything of the above, just roll and take some distance, cause those #1 death attacks are the slowest projectiles in game, if u are at say 900+ range you can dodge them without even dodging.

^ I agree with all of this as a Necromancer. Lich Form is a very, very powerful elite but it also has a lot of weaknesses. Necro’s are the easiest profession to CC hands down. Removing the stability just turns that giant Lich in to a play thing so, if you can do that I highly suggest you do.
As for damage though, yes. Massive damage IF you allow yourself to take it. As Cuge said, the #1 is the slowest projectile in game and going Lich Form slows you down quite a bit. Dodge, block, reflect, etc. and you’re golden. Otherwise you’re going to be in a world of hurt.

Chilli.2976:

@manveruppd, I was actually soaking all those hits up and healing at the same time, now imagine me being a Thief or a Mesmer for example.

My zerk, sh-@t-ter mesmer avoids big, green men. It’s super obvious. You call out, “LICH!” to your team and do many things mentioned above to avoid getting killed.

Also, I don’t always run Moa, I run Mass Invis, but Moa-ing him works. Y’know the only other build/class I’ll moa? Bunker gerdian.

Edit: LOL, fixed the silly filter explanation of my class. Watch this: glkittenter mesmer

Have you been following the candidates for gamescom? Not a single necro. Guardians probably have the best defense against Lich form. Most necros prefer golem over Lich due to the weaknesses outlined here. Learn to play and stop resorting to why a certain class needs a nerf due to your incompetency.

Zhombify is a necro. Most necros that are competitive also play condi so golem or plague makes more sense.

Furious.2867:

Have you been following the candidates for gamescom? Not a single necro.

Zombify is a Necro, one who has been around for ages (#Zombify4Gamescon) and is on the list for NA, EU has never really had many Necros in the high tier scene consistently so its not a big surprise they didn’t have a Necro rep.

Yes I was referring to the EU candidates since my main account is based there. https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/allstarsvote

I think you mentioned Zombify a few months ago when I asked who the top/favorite NA necros were. Mad props to him for representing the best class ever despite its imperfections

Bhawb.7408:

Furious.2867:

Have you been following the candidates for gamescom? Not a single necro.

Zombify is a Necro, one who has been around for ages (#Zombify4Gamescon) and is on the list for NA, EU has never really had many Necros in the high tier scene consistently so its not a big surprise they didn’t have a Necro rep.

Yep, everytime Lich form is proced I gotta pillar hump or back out until the duration goes off, getting hit spam for 6k on my guardian is not something I can survive 2-3 hits from

Chilli.2976:

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions on how to play, the thing is I know what to do, even if I go off point to hide etc, me myself as a guardian can’t do crap if I’m a bunker, I’m not even standing in the wells. @manveruppd, I was actually soaking all those hits up and healing at the same time, now imagine me being a Thief or a Mesmer for example.

Yeah I get it, I wasn’t implying that you didn’t see the attacks coming or anything, just pointing out that sometimes you’ve got to do what all your instincts as a bunker guardian tell you not to do and give up the point! Not right away – by all means, heal through them as much as you can, dodge till your endurance is used up, but then run off, wait behind a pillar for a couple seconds to get some endurance back, then jump on the point again before he can decap it completely, rinse, repeat. If by that point your teammates haven’t come to help you (you’d be amazed how quickly a Lich goes down once their stability is gone!), then it’s they who killed you, not the necro.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Roe.3679:

Lordrosicky.5813:

I would nerf the damage on DS#1 to be honest (being serious). No build should be based around 1 spam, it is lame and boring. Lich form is lame too but its a 3 minute cooldown and its counter able to never mind.

I have a theory that power necro has so much 1 spam because you have to focus so much on positioning and life force to actually survive. Not like most other builds that have like, real active defenses.

Well yeh at least the 1 spam is gated behind life force. It is still lame though. And power necro dies really fast.

It is balanced. But I would rather see buffs to areas like regen working in death shroud and nerfs slightly to the life blast damage

You’re both right: it’s not unbalanced, but it’s still boring and should be changed. The whole thing power necros do is spam dagger 1 to build life force so they can spam DS1. Sure you have to watch your positioning and kite proactively (because it’s too late once you get trained, with no vigor, blocks, or invlunerabilities), but it’s still pretty boring gameplay. That’s what happens when you gate both defence and offence behind life force generation – power necros spend most of each match with access to only 5 skills!

manveruppd.7601:

That’s what happens when you gate both defence and offence behind life force generation – power necros spend most of each match with access to only 5 skills!

arguably, those 5 skills is pretty much all they need….

If you stood there and either tried to facetank his damage or didn’t dodge, defend or even just move from side to side then you deserve to get killed. Repeatedly.

So many people complain about Lich form and they don’t even try to defend against it or avoid it. When a necro pops leach when I’m on one of my other toon, I just move from side to side with the odd dodge thrown in. Most necr’s won’t even hit me ONCE. Learn to play before whining on the on the forums.

op confirms he is a moron , nothing to see here