Guild Wars 2

I’m asking a little frustrated after the heart pounding loss in paid tournaments as the starting setup was promising for our advantage as the other team switched characters before the match started to give the advantage on their side. It’s “squishy” to be able to do that in tournaments at all. What are Arenanet- and the community’s feedback on this?

They would have to take character balancing in all forms in order to fix this issue.

It’s not only me affected about this. I think team setups shouldn’t be exploited this way. It’s just not fair. And with the patch, they should have this exploit removed.

If you want to be good in tours and face team with curtain setups you should check how they play with the upcoming patch which will enable you to do so. Not switch characters in mid game because you can.

So basically it is nor fair because you aren’t being handed the victory on a silver platter made of broken traits, shoddy class balance, and broken synergy?

It takes time to change characters mid game. In Tournaments “Time” spent on waypoints determines the victory. So if people are able to beat you and they have enough time to swap characters while doing so… Pretty sure you aren’t going to win anyway so you are just asking for handouts.

If I were you I would spend more time practicing with my team and less time worrying about people who are trolling with class swaps mid match. In Tournaments Time is everything. Time spent holding points, time spent getting to points, time spent practicing with your team.

It is all time. And those with the most time win. If you are losing to a team that throws away time to swap characters mid match, you are losing to yourself.

I agree with OP.

Change professions between maps, thats great. It allows a team to create a strategy for each map. As soon as you hit “Go” and are able to see the enemy team composition, you should be locked into whatever profession you entered with. Hard countering another team’s composition is just low.

If someone accidentally joins with the wrong profession, oh well. Should have paid more attention to what you are doing.

If I were you I would spend more time practicing with my team and less time worrying about people who are trolling with class swaps mid match.

OP is talking about the 2 minutes before the match starts, when teams can see each others composition and swap to counter accordingly.

Hammerheart.1426:

I agree with OP.

Change professions between maps, thats great. It allows a team to create a strategy for each map. As soon as you hit “Go” and are able to see the enemy team composition, you should be locked into whatever profession you entered with. Hard countering another team’s composition is just low.

If someone accidentally joins with the wrong profession, oh well. Should have paid more attention to what you are doing.

If I were you I would spend more time practicing with my team and less time worrying about people who are trolling with class swaps mid match.

OP is talking about the 2 minutes before the match starts, when teams can see each others composition and swap to counter accordingly.

There are no hard “class” counters and you also have the option to swap characters so your point (and OPs) is moot.

There are no hard “class” counters and you also have the option to swap characters so your point (and OPs) is moot.

No hard counters? What game are you playing?

Just because I have the option doesn’t mean I exploit it.
Be the change you want to see in the world

I prefer to win with strategy and skill. I could watch someone’s stream during a match, and counter what they’re doing because I can hear them. But I don’t, and my team doesn’t, because we have standards. It’s not war, it’s a game.

By all means, continue to support the problems with the game, just don’t complain when it fails to become anything more than it is so you can cheese your way to a hollow victory.

Some of you don’t know that I am talking about Paid Tournaments. I’ve recently fought against OnibawaN and a few other higher strategic players. Luckily I’m not accusing them for this “exploit” since it was another team new to Paids which were doing the class-swap in the beginning of the game to counter our team setup.

I’m not saying I’m after a fast win because I’m not (even if I love fast won games) but it’s really upsetting coming up with a nice setup to be able to counter most of other setups to have no advantage when the opposite team switch characters before game start to eat your setup up with a huge advantage.

Think of my argument as this; American football. As a trainer you usually look on how the opposite team plays over recorded footage of their matches. That’s how you know how to deal with them. Not getting a glimpse of the future of how they will play during (your match) and how you will counter it.

I’m pretty sure Anet never intended for people to do this. It’s obviously an exploit.

I don’t get why you get an advantage through class swaping during a match. If you watch top teams they never do. Becaus the meta is that strong, you can’t counter it.

Clearly each class only has one role in tournaments… This is why no one in NA plays tournies. Fake meta is more popular than actual player skill. New players either get trolled by exploiters or rolled by the real meta after trying to chase this fake forum meta garbage.

This will never improve with people constantly trolling the forums with stuff they drain from the rear hatch after eating bad seafood.

Well, you can’t compare NA to EU. It’s a different level. But you always need actual player skill. Sure when you play a build that is not viable you can be that good you will probably loose to worse players.

I honestly doubt that switching characters during tournaments was intended.

Rambodacious.7495:

Xil, so what is this “one true meta” you speak of that can destroy all other metas? Enlighten us.

There is no meta. It is imaginary. That is the point. You chase the dragon. Like a heroin addict chasing the perfect high. That high is imaginary. Just like the meta.

You create the meta by chasing it.

You know why the top teams are the top teams? Because they spend countless hours practicing together. Their builds mean nothing. Their strats mean nothing. All that matters is that those players are collectively chasing the meta and in doing so creating it.

The forum meta is 3rd party, wiki inspired, theorycrafted, nonsense when it is not entirely fabricated just to troll, that is. The only way to get good is to chase the meta, the only way to chase the meta is to play the game as often as you possibly can. There is no secret. No uber builds, no stacked classes, just well motivated players playing together often and with synergy.

That is the real meta. Everything else is the imagination of basement dwellers.

So you want to tell me the bunker ele is not meta? Try to win a paid tournament without ele. Record it and send it to me if you win.

Best Regards
“The Meta”

I can win any tournament with 5 naked minion master necros. And they don’t even have to be good they just have to listen to what I tell them to do.

The forum meta is fabricated by people who want to feel important, and/or troll you. The real meta consists of playing well with a team and practice, practice, practice, practice, practice.

Also bunker ele aren’t a singular build. But I have never had an issue, with any of my characters, pushing bunker ele off point or killing them outright. If they have a support with them of course they are much more powerful, and that is how it should be. Synergy > all.

But 1v1 bunker ele are not a problem once you practice to the point where you can notice the animations and counter with timing and precision.

Learning2play requires actually playing.

I’m playing with the same 4 ppl since 4 months. I know this progression. Still you can’t kill a bunker ele alone. It’s even hard with 2 ppl. So you want to tell me that’s not a tactical advantage? I mean gl with your minion master to survive against 2 ppl. Gl to defend a point without stability when a guard comes and knocks you off.
Or am I false again?

I kill them all the time alone. Bunker ele are very predictable. Just like guardians. Even with the block exploit I could still smash full bunker guardians 1v1 just by watching for the skills I know they are using and tricking them into using cooldowns.

In 4 months you should have learned how team synergy works. If you have trouble 2v1 on anything you are not doing it right.

In order to get better you have to accept that you are not the best and you don’t have everything figured out. If you already had everything figured out you would not be on the forums.

Also 5 MM Necro’s is a monster troll team. And quite hilarious. Like 5 shatter mesmer, or 5 bunker ele. Fun times.

tldr;

Learn to play Elementalists so you can learn how to counter them.

I made a bright red Char ele named Burning Giner. Ole burny taught me a lot about Elementalist that didn’t make sense from a viewing perspective. Maybe you try this? Helps to know what you are fighting before you attack it. I read that somewhere.

I played ele on my own… i’m not that good but i know all mechanics that are important. I’m interested when you are saying you can win 1v1 against an ele. If you are on EU servers you can try to kill our core ele. I think will be a endless match.
If you wanna 1v1 against me, as i play guard, you can pm me… i think you trolling around saying you win 1v1 against them. Or mabye you just face bad ppl.

Xil is obviously trolling since I got 800+ pvp hours and I still have problem with bunker eles even as burst thief (main: condition). I take take down guardians with my conditions, but elementalists are just not worth it. As empathietic said; would be an endless battle with bunker elementalists due to their 500 knockdowns and heals.

Well if a guard dies to your conditions, he is definitely false specced. Or only specced against burst. I play 3 shouts, with soldier runes and trait that remove a condition. So I pretty much hold every 1v1.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Well if a guard dies to your conditions, he is definitely false specced. Or only specced against burst. I play 3 shouts, with soldier runes and trait that remove a condition. So I pretty much hold every 1v1.

Bunkers aren’t often that good in paid tournaments since they’re not playing that much and learns how the battlefield works. Usually Bunker Guardians are secondary choices to support team and they got 1 thing to do; hold people off point and survive against heavy burst. But once I’ve managed to decide if the guardian is good or not, I usually take them down with conditions when carefully put out. It’s hard but it’s definitely doable!

Elementalists on the other hand, sure if you don’t know what you’re doing you will die from anything but if you’re good, you have a 98% coming out as a victor.

Absolutely true. In free it’s just too easy to get a guard. But in paids it’s in 95% of all cases impossible.
Lucky I stayed on guard till today and made 90% of all matches with this nice class.

Back to the topic I would say they won’t “fix” it. In my opinion there’s not really something like buildwars when you play a balanced build. So nothing to fix really.
If you watch top teams like team cursed or team paradigm you see always the same setup since ages, and never any rerolling action. In paids it’s that competitive that you have to focus on one team-build to work out and then stay on it. It’s hard to changes the setup as you need other tactics for it.

Paids aren’t the issue. Nor because I’m bad (because I don’t like to think so at my rank). The issue is that Elementalists has too much healing power. If they reduced the healing power and riding on lightning speed we might be able to 1 on 1 them the same way as I can 1 on 1 a bunker guard.

Aeranima.2853:

I’m asking a little frustrated after the heart pounding loss in paid tournaments as the starting setup was promising for our advantage as the other team switched characters before the match started to give the advantage on their side. It’s “squishy” to be able to do that in tournaments at all. What are Arenanet- and the community’s feedback on this?

You’re absolutely right. I just responded to your topic.

XiL.4318:

I can win any tournament with 5 naked minion master necros. And they don’t even have to be good they just have to listen to what I tell them to do.

Video proof of this fact. Until then you remain a narcissistic blowhard with regionalistic bigotry spewing meaningless drivel throughout the forums.

Is it confirmed by ANet that this will be removed by the next patch?

Tyler Bearce.3427:

It is not intended to be able to switch characters mid-match, in tournaments. This is on our list of things to fix.

And so on January 22nd 2013, the lord spoke.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

It is not intended to be able to switch characters mid-match, in tournaments. This is on our list of things to fix.

Thanks Tyler for clearing that out. My tourney team will be thrilled to hear this.

Things are moving fast around here

Aeranima.2853:

Paids aren’t the issue. Nor because I’m bad (because I don’t like to think so at my rank). The issue is that Elementalists has too much healing power. If they reduced the healing power and riding on lightning speed we might be able to 1 on 1 them the same way as I can 1 on 1 a bunker guard.

The healing power factor of our minor trait has already been reduced by 50%, not every ele go around with a cleric amulet, most of us go around with a valkyrie/soldier amulet…..still people ask for even more nerfs, because they can’t stand the fact they get outplayed

There are no inbuild defensive mechanism on the ele outside the water ehal, remove those and you get a free kill, we’ve got no stealth, no clones, no block, no DS and ride the lightning is on the dagger OH…..what a light armor profession in mele range should do? stay there and trade blows with a warrior.

I’d like to have the same auto-face/auto-target skills of other professions with the .5s activation time, I’d like to see you trying to hit anything with 3s activation skills outside the commonly used d/d

Tyler Bearce.3427:

It is not intended to be able to switch characters mid-match, in tournaments. This is on our list of things to fix.

Can we get a yay or nay on whether or not it is intended for them to swap characters once you are able to see the other team’s composition? The way I read this, It is not intended once the two and a half minute timer ends and the match starts. How about prior to that?

list of things to fix is getting long so put that on in the que for 2-3 months from now then ?

edit: i take that back i forgot there are stil lbugs from beta

XiL.4318:

Rambodacious.7495:

Xil, so what is this “one true meta” you speak of that can destroy all other metas? Enlighten us.

There is no meta. It is imaginary. That is the point. You chase the dragon. Like a heroin addict chasing the perfect high. That high is imaginary. Just like the meta.

You create the meta by chasing it.

You know why the top teams are the top teams? Because they spend countless hours practicing together. Their builds mean nothing. Their strats mean nothing. All that matters is that those players are collectively chasing the meta and in doing so creating it.

The forum meta is 3rd party, wiki inspired, theorycrafted, nonsense when it is not entirely fabricated just to troll, that is. The only way to get good is to chase the meta, the only way to chase the meta is to play the game as often as you possibly can. There is no secret. No uber builds, no stacked classes, just well motivated players playing together often and with synergy.

That is the real meta. Everything else is the imagination of basement dwellers.

Boom!

I am soooooooo tired of hearing the word meta in random 16 player sPvP games. People talk about their “leety mcleetsauce” experience more than they actually play the game.

It’s the same thing in the shooting world. You have your avid shooters who do it because we enjoy marksmanship. Then you have your “operators” who show up at a shooting range inside the safety of the continental United States with their gun all beefed up looking like something out of a Call of Duty game.

The long and the short is. They are both the same type of people. Chasing the prestige not actually doing it because it is a hobby they enjoy.

It’s not only the fact you can swap out characters halfway into a match (how laughable is that?), but also that you can easily view the opposing team setup prior to engaging a match.
While that may matter little in hotjoins and free tournaments, I believe it should rightfully be removed in paids. As a matter of fact, why is that even possible to start with?
No reason to give competitors a GW-style observer-mode type of overview over the opposing team setup. There is no plausible reasoning behind letting a team see your setup beforehand.
One of ther cruicial things about GW (mATs) was/is to prevent your opponent from seeing your setup beforehand, because it’d always result in significant tactic adjustments and accompanied by build speccing.

So many things wrong about this game, honestly.

At players claiming that playing vs eles, thieves and guardians is a l2p issue – do make videos or fraps of matches vs good eles where they get wrecked by subpar builds.
I believe it would be a recording most curious and entertaining to watch, and definitely great for educational purposes.

Isnt there concern about observers being on vent with one of the teams and feeding them info. This isnt much relevant in pure deathmatch, but sure is in conquest.

@daydream: as in gw1 observing should always be time-delayed. After the match is done you can observ it.

Right, that makes sense, even a one minute time delay would render all information useless.

Arheundel.6451:

Aeranima.2853:

Paids aren’t the issue. Nor because I’m bad (because I don’t like to think so at my rank). The issue is that Elementalists has too much healing power. If they reduced the healing power and riding on lightning speed we might be able to 1 on 1 them the same way as I can 1 on 1 a bunker guard.

The healing power factor of our minor trait has already been reduced by 50%, not every ele go around with a cleric amulet, most of us go around with a valkyrie/soldier amulet…..still people ask for even more nerfs, because they can’t stand the fact they get outplayed

There are no inbuild defensive mechanism on the ele outside the water ehal, remove those and you get a free kill, we’ve got no stealth, no clones, no block, no DS and ride the lightning is on the dagger OH…..what a light armor profession in mele range should do? stay there and trade blows with a warrior.

I’d like to have the same auto-face/auto-target skills of other professions with the .5s activation time, I’d like to see you trying to hit anything with 3s activation skills outside the commonly used d/d

This is probably the funniest post I’ve read on this forum.

You run with the FOTM builds, owning complete noob/casual players thinking you ’’outplayed’’ them.
I guess some people have to boost their self esteem somehow.

People, this thread is about good pvp players. Not hotjoin newbies. Please understand that. 5v5. Not 8v8. No newbie elementalists but pro elementalists. Keep that in mind when continuing to debate about this topic.