Guild Wars 2

pushing everyone in objects and they just leave you in and not kill you and you had to close the game and rejoin

gotta love it when you and a teamate are stuck in objects one after another

Well now, thanks for this tip. Previously I only saw DH’s using their F1 pull to get people stuck in walls, but now I know my Rev can do it too!

/stuck and w8 30 seconds(inactivity) and you ll respawn to starting point

Any high velocity movement can do it. I even had a friend surge of the mists himself into a wall.

ArthurDent.9538:

Any high velocity movement can do it. I even had a friend surge of the mists himself into a wall.

You can also Ride the Lightning straight into a wall as well…

I’ve had similar problems with the physics engine, scripting in Second Life. The solution there was to thicken the mesh involved.

From occasional camera glitches, GW2 mesh appears to be one sided, a single plane. That makes it hard for the engine to catch collisions.

Ithilwen.1529:

I’ve had similar problems with the physics engine, scripting in Second Life. The solution there was to thicken the mesh involved.

From occasional camera glitches, GW2 mesh appears to be one sided, a single plane. That makes it hard for the engine to catch collisions.

All 3d meshes are made up of single planes. There is no such thing as volume in 3d.

Crinn.7864:

Ithilwen.1529:

I’ve had similar problems with the physics engine, scripting in Second Life. The solution there was to thicken the mesh involved.

From occasional camera glitches, GW2 mesh appears to be one sided, a single plane. That makes it hard for the engine to catch collisions.

All 3d meshes are made up of single planes. There is no such thing as volume in 3d.

Incorrect. I personally make meshes in Blender which are two sided and have a space within. (In fact you can do this automatically in Blender ) It’s about giving the physics engine enough time to react.

That’s why speed is a factor.

As an example, a wall can be built with an inside face. It will be more resistant to collision glitches.

In Second Life we have a sub category of mesh called prims which are treated as solid by the physics engine. Such a thing might be available to GW2, I don’t know.

Ithilwen.1529:

Incorrect. I personally make meshes in Blender which are two sided and have a space within. (In fact you can do this automatically in Blender ) It’s about giving the physics engine enough time to react.

That’s why speed is a factor.

In Second Life we have a sub category of mesh called prims which are treated as solid by the physics engine. Such a thing might be available to GW2, I don’t know.

And you don’t know what you’re talking about.

All 3d models are comprised of vertex connected into planes which make up the object. The “two-sided” blender mesh you make only appears to have volume.

One oddity that gw2’s collision system does have is that the collision is double sided rather than just being on the normal side. This is presumably due to gw2 making extensive use of double-sided planes for all manner of objects from armor to fencing, thus simply doing double sided collision for all planes simplifies their collision system.

I model regularly in mesh. At the moment I’m building the fuselage of a Bachem BA 349 “Natter” which I will fully script for use in another game world. (My personal scripting, not canned packages )

One annoying glitch in GW2 is that the cam sometimes gets in the wrong place and I can see the single sided mesh in some models. This is why you can see “out” through a wall when stuck behind it. ( An alternative explanation would be a very thick double sided mesh. ) In either case, a well proportioned double sided mesh might well help.

In addition to that.. I have been scripting for something like a decade and have dealt with this type of issue several times.

It’s best to use caution when claiming someone “doesn’t know what they are talking about.”

Ben Phongluangtham.1065:

We are actively looking into a lot of these issues. As ArthurDent noted, it has to do with the speed at which you’re moving.

It’s not something that’s likely ever going to be 100% resolved, but I’m hoping we can reduce the frequency by a lot.

So a reduction on the speed you are being pulled or knocked back would help reducing/fixing the issue? And would there be a trade off to it?

I don’t entirely know what your architecture’s like, but from my (hacky) Unity perspective, I have to ask – are raycasts not an option?

I obviously understand engines can be waaay different, but that’s how I’d handle it in Unity… Since both skills are a single moment of activation, I’d raycast from the target in the direction they’re about to travel and make any point of contact the upper limit of their travel.

My friend has been playing pvp with her ranger lately, and she just told me that her longbow 4 skill is making opponents getting stuck in walls. Apparently, people started to report her and she’s afraid she’s going to get banned.

Just to have some assurance, longbow’s 4 skill is part of the issue people are talking in this thread, and it’s not ban-worthy, right?

Deliberately exploiting a bug like that is “less-than-ethical.” I think that people who do it should be banned.. though that almost certainly won’t happen.

I just came from a game against elements of an old ESL team farming unranked with a premade.. I don’t think that’s ethical either, but it’s been going on from season 1.

Kadj.6725:

I don’t entirely know what your architecture’s like, but from my (hacky) Unity perspective, I have to ask – are raycasts not an option?

I obviously understand engines can be waaay different, but that’s how I’d handle it in Unity… Since both skills are a single moment of activation, I’d raycast from the target in the direction they’re about to travel and make any point of contact the upper limit of their travel.

That would take a fair amount of rotation math ( slow.) It would also result in very short pushes and pulls in many cases. Personally, I’m foul sick of the pull-through-the-traps trick… but that would be a pretty severe nerf.

Ithilwen.1529:

Deliberately exploiting a bug like that is “less-than-ethical.” I think that people who do it should be banned.. though that almost certainly won’t happen.

I just came from a game against elements of an old ESL team farming unranked with a premade.. I don’t think that’s ethical either, but it’s been going on from season 1.

My friend’s not deliberately exploiting it, though. She just wants to play with her normal ranger build and get done with the pvp dailies, as she usually does every day.

This is sounding more like a clash between walls and knockbacks that didn’t exist before (yes, I know I’m captain obvious) than just an issue with knockbacks being too fast. I never once encountered this issue even just a few months ago. You could probably create a temporary, but not ideal, fix like slowing down knockbacks as was mentioned, until you pinpoint the real issue and can fix that.

DiogoSilva.7089:

My friend has been playing pvp with her ranger lately, and she just told me that her longbow 4 skill is making opponents getting stuck in walls. Apparently, people started to report her and she’s afraid she’s going to get banned.

Just to have some assurance, longbow’s 4 skill is part of the issue people are talking in this thread, and it’s not ban-worthy, right?

Yes, PBS can easily knock people into walls, not her fault.

Ithilwen.1529:

That would take a fair amount of rotation math ( slow.)

I don’t pretend to be a super expert – especially not where servers come into play – but I feel like one mathematical function every (cooldown) seconds would matter unless it’s an case of an extremely large number of players abusing it.

As it is, half the job seems to be already done; the game is innately aware of whether you’re facing another player or not, and auto-faces when relevant. It also checks Line of Sight and Range, two reasonably mathematically challenging things. DH pull may ignore facing, but it probably can still use the code. All a raycast would need is either to continue on the same trajectory(rev push) or a ‘fake’ counter-face (pull) to know which way to go. While I’m coming up short on ideas where the ‘counter-face’ code might exist in gameplay already, I feel like it easily already exists.

And if that code doesn’t exist, I question why the skill doesn’t check line of sight at execution at worst. (Assuming it isn’t supposed to respect line of sight. I never really paid attention to that and the wiki doesn’t say whether skills need LoS or not.)

Ben Phongluangtham.1065:

zealex.9410:

So a reduction on the speed you are being pulled or knocked back would help reducing/fixing the issue? And would there be a trade off to it?

That’s what we’re planning to try internally soon. Hopefully, we can find a speed that largely feels the same. Potential trade offs would likely be just changing the way knockbacks/pulls feel. Slowing them down could make things feel a bit sluggish. And of course, slowing things down too much might actually feel like you’re getting CC’d longer.

Once we have the code change in, we’ll be going over it with the skills & balance team to evaluate whether it’s the right change to make.

Specifically with pulls, since anecdotally I’ve seen it happen much more often with them and I’ve even observed people who I would claim are intentionally attempting to pull people into the environment;

Why not make LoS stop pulls? It makes sense from a balance standpoint to begin with, but would also “fix” issues with the environment.

There’s ways of dealing with knockbacks like that too. For instance, a simple solution could be the trend of games to have CC that states something like “CC into a wall causes stun,” but in reality what you would do is “convert” the knockback to a different CC if the knockback would cause an environment collision.

Personally, I’d rather these options be considered than for a solution that will only “reduce” the occurence rate. Your ultimate goal should be to improve and preserve the user end experience, and being knocked into the environment should be treated with a zero tolerance attitude because it ruins entire game experiences for groups of people; not just individuals.

Ithilwen.1529:

That would take a fair amount of rotation math ( slow.)

Not really, raycasting is extremely cheap compared to most of the other things the server is handling. The effect on performance would be negligible to the point of being irrelevant.

We lost a game today when an elementalist in our team got stuck in this area near mid point.

If that happens, a temporary fix is to type “/stuck” and it’ll port you somewhere after 30 seconds of not moving. It’s not ideal but it’s better than 4v5 the whole match or dishonor from a relog.

Ithilwen.1529:

Incorrect. I personally make meshes in Blender which are two sided and have a space within. (In fact you can do this automatically in Blender ) It’s about giving the physics engine enough time to react.

That’s why speed is a factor.

As an example, a wall can be built with an inside face. It will be more resistant to collision glitches.

In Second Life we have a sub category of mesh called prims which are treated as solid by the physics engine. Such a thing might be available to GW2, I don’t know.

I think you might be confusing collision mesh with texture mesh

More often than not, the object you see with lots of details and nice textures, is not the actual physical object that you collide with. Instead the collision mesh is a simplified version of that

Doing anything else would make most game simply too unoptimized to run

When you bug your camera behind a solid object and see straight through it, it is because the game is optimized so that the graphics card does not need to bother with deciding if that texture should be rendered or not, as you shouldn’t ever see it and is not related to physics

In case this post didn’t help, you can check out stuff like https://www.katsbits.com/tutorials/blender/collision-models.php which illustrate quite nicely how a texture mesh does not correspond to a collision mesh

Ben Phongluangtham.1065:

We are actively looking into a lot of these issues. As ArthurDent noted, it has to do with the speed at which you’re moving.

It’s not something that’s likely ever going to be 100% resolved, but I’m hoping we can reduce the frequency by a lot.

Maybe you lazy developers should have built a new engine for your 2012 game instead of recycling DX 9 Garbage?

MoZing.1594:

Maybe you lazy developers should have built a new engine for your 2012 game instead of recycling DX 9 Garbage?

The DX version has absolutely nothing to do with collision handling.

Crinn.7864:

MoZing.1594:

Maybe you lazy developers should have built a new engine for your 2012 game instead of recycling DX 9 Garbage?

The DX version has absolutely nothing to do with collision handling.

Actually it does, and you failed to realize my point as well. My point is that it’s lazy and cheap to use the guild wars 1 engine for a 2012 game.

MoZing.1594:

Crinn.7864:

MoZing.1594:

Maybe you lazy developers should have built a new engine for your 2012 game instead of recycling DX 9 Garbage?

The DX version has absolutely nothing to do with collision handling.

Actually it does, and you failed to realize my point as well. My point is that it’s lazy and cheap to use the guild wars 1 engine for a 2012 game.

DirectX still doesnt have anything to do with collision. Its just math.