Guild Wars 2

1) PU condition mesmer
2) Evade condition thief
3) Minion necro
4) Apo condition warrior

Ele, GD, Ranger and Engi don’t exist.

Go.

The heck is an evade condition thief?

Arganthium.5638:

The heck is an evade condition thief?

deadly blossom spam i guess

ahuba.6430:

Arganthium.5638:

The heck is an evade condition thief?

deadly blossom spam i guess

Ah yes the old OP LDBlossom build. o.O

Condi warrior, enough said.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIAQNAscTjkOpwxQCQMxBAkCsq6oIppSPCzs1A-TsAAzCpIMSZkzIjRSjsGN6Y1x8DA

PU Mesmer (any kind)
MM Necro

Way below:
Spirit Ranger
Nade Engi

Of course I won’t mention warrior, because warrior.

No bomb nade node spamming engi? But they just leave their explosive poo everywhere

Mightymealworm.8409:

No bomb nade node spamming engi? But they just leave their explosive poo everywhere

Because explosive poo.

deathblossom thief unkillable by petting zoo def. dumbest

really i would vote for pistol/nade/bomb engi, seems like they do nothing special(skill rotation? wat?) and still melt people -_-

ens.9854:

deathblossom thief unkillable by petting zoo def. dumbest

really i would vote for pistol/nade/bomb engi, seems like they do nothing special(skill rotation? wat?) and still melt people -_-

Run around in circles and leave poo.

Because explosive poo.

PU Mesmer
hate so much

thieves are fine. they at least get revealed when they attack
but mesmers can even cast phantasms while in stealth

I mainly just hate tank warriors, they give the good warriors (greatsword/longbow) a bad name. Actually I hate all tank builds, and all condi builds, and all classes that can go invis. ya, all of that.

Spamming Engis…

Spirit Ranger /15 chars

Pu/Phantasm Mesmer, Spirit Ranger, MM Necro
Healsignet Warriors(so all), s/d Thiefs

Hs wars as a build.Iq lvl over 9000 Super Sayan

From a micromanage standpoint (buttons pressed) probably spirit ranger. You pretty much just have to auto attack to get anything done. Your pet is for burst and your main source of damage is from burning via sun spirit. Throw in a few dodges (don’t need to get carried away though since you have stone spirit) for the protection and your elite spirit for 400+ hp per second you have a successful home defender.

Every class in GW2 is easy to play.

Some are just easier than others.

The challenge in GW2, the element of skill if you so like, is entirely derived from your ability to make it succeed in a team-fight.

Playing a class well isn’t much of a challenge.

So it really doesn’t matter what you play as long as you work well in a team-scenario.

my elementalist
http://youtu.be/3Az_trFal_w

Minion Necro is very, very easy…

You can fall asleep playing the minion Necro its that easy…

i play my MM in hotjoins naked. i still get to beat people there 1v1.

Dee Jay.2460:

Every class in GW2 is easy to play.

Some are just easier than others.

The challenge in GW2, the element of skill if you so like, is entirely derived from your ability to make it succeed in a team-fight.

Playing a class well isn’t much of a challenge.

So it really doesn’t matter what you play as long as you work well in a team-scenario.

They only seem simple when you just look at the main attacks and simple defense.

I think when you play more classes and learn some more sophisticated attacks and defenses with them, as well as combo field use, you will see some are challenging to play at their highest level.

MM, its literally summon minions then spam buttons with a staff equipt. that it.
PU mesmers atleast need to try and stay hidden, MM can just spec for vampiric minion and improved syphoning and become a tank with high damage and several CCs.

Meglobob.8620:

Minion Necro is very, very easy…

You can fall asleep playing the minion Necro its that easy…

Not true. If you stand there and do nothing, you will die from any normally competent attacker.

I think some of you have been beaten by a MM and are just justifying your loss.

Try playing a MM against a competent attacker whose build is not naturally countered by the MM. A stealth class confuses the minions easily. They do not re-acquire their targets easily and are slow moving.

Silentshoes.1805:

Dee Jay.2460:

Every class in GW2 is easy to play.

Some are just easier than others.

The challenge in GW2, the element of skill if you so like, is entirely derived from your ability to make it succeed in a team-fight.

Playing a class well isn’t much of a challenge.

So it really doesn’t matter what you play as long as you work well in a team-scenario.

They only seem simple when you just look at the main attacks and simple defense.

I think when you play more classes and learn some more sophisticated attacks and defenses with them, as well as combo field use, you will see some are challenging to play at their highest level.

Stop kidding yourself. Nothing in GW2 takes any skill. Dee Jay is exactly right, that the only thing requiring half a braincell, is knowing what battles to take, where to attack/defend, and positioning during fights. Everything else is just: close eyes, smash keyboard.
There’s no such thing as sophisticated attacks – and combo fields? If you consider those hard to use, I have some sad news for you.

Adrian and DeeJay,

Those who have taken things to a higher level know better and are probably smiling as they read your posts about how easy it all is.

Silentshoes.1805:

Adrian and DeeJay,

Those who have taken things to a higher level know better and are probably smiling as they read your posts about how easy it all is.

Higher level? Really? I’ve been ranked since the introduction of the leaderboards, with about rank 100 being the highest. I’ve had a consistent 60% winrate, and played with players from Paradigm, CC, AKGL etc. My current group consists of one player who’s currently rank 16, and one who’s rank 120. I’ve played almost sorely PvP and WvW since the betas, without ever playing Hotjoin or Zerging.

If you can boast better results than that, then I’m all ears. Until then, I suggest you go watch any of the ’pro’ streams (like Teldo, Helseth or Ostrich), or simply take a look at the countless threads from former pros (Xeph comes to mind), who left the game because it was too easy, and too braindead.

Adian.8756:

Higher level? Really? I’ve been ranked since the introduction of the leaderboards, with about rank 100 being the highest. I’ve had a consistent 60% winrate, and played with players from Paradigm, CC, AKGL etc. My current group consists of one player who’s currently rank 16, and one who’s rank 120. I’ve played almost sorely PvP and WvW since the betas, without ever playing Hotjoin or Zerging.

If you can boast better results than that, then I’m all ears. Until then, I suggest you go watch any of the ‘pro’ streams (like Teldo, Helseth or Ostrich), or simply take a look at the countless threads from former pros (Xeph comes to mind), who left the game because it was too easy, and too braindead.

Ranks dont mean sh…in this game :x. Deimos showed it:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/and-so-i-gave-solo-arena-a-try/first

99% of the pros in this game arent really that pro to be honest. They are where they are due to the lack of competition. Its a bit like the early TBC arena days where we would get to 2100-2200 with 0 losses since we where some of the few that where try harding it.

The only classes that take some degree of skill/coordination if compared to other MMOs are engi, ele and mesmer.Something can be said about thief aswell but its too simple mechanically to be considered difficult.

MM and Condi Necros don’t require a brain to play
Condition warrior and Hambow
Condition Mesmers
Bomb/Nade spam engi

Locuz.2651:

Adian.8756:

Higher level? Really? I’ve been ranked since the introduction of the leaderboards, with about rank 100 being the highest. I’ve had a consistent 60% winrate, and played with players from Paradigm, CC, AKGL etc. My current group consists of one player who’s currently rank 16, and one who’s rank 120. I’ve played almost sorely PvP and WvW since the betas, without ever playing Hotjoin or Zerging.

If you can boast better results than that, then I’m all ears. Until then, I suggest you go watch any of the ‘pro’ streams (like Teldo, Helseth or Ostrich), or simply take a look at the countless threads from former pros (Xeph comes to mind), who left the game because it was too easy, and too braindead.

Ranks dont mean sh…in this game :x. Deimos showed it:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/and-so-i-gave-solo-arena-a-try/first

99% of the pros in this game arent really that pro to be honest. They are where they are due to the lack of competition. Its a bit like the early TBC arena days where we would get to 2100-2200 with 0 losses since we where some of the few that where try harding it.

The only classes that take some degree of skill/coordination if compared to other MMOs are engi, ele and mesmer.Something can be said about thief aswell but its too quite simple mechanically to be considered difficult.

But still an important part of the gameplay is about rotation, downed state management (should I ress or stomp? Will I be able to do that fast enough?) and target calling in a teamfight.

IMHO classes might need different time to get used to, but you need more than class knowledge to succeed.

Dunning Krueger Effect. Things feel simple when you don’t understand them in depth. You don’t know what you don’t know.

I see this with my kid quite often.

Silentshoes.1805:

Dunning Krueger Effect. Things feel simple when you don’t understand them in depth. You don’t know what you don’t know.

Talking about personal experience with engi: even without playing much, kit management went natural after a while. It was all a matter of getting used to it.

The first time I roll any class in spvp I lose to NPC sparring partners. Even when copying good builds. Once I get the hang of it, things go smooth.

Not saying all build/classes are equally effective, but the difficult part is not understanding how a class works and having half an idea of what you need.

Then sure, you can execute them more or less smoothly, but you still know “I need to land A and B” and when you face a class you know, you have an idea of what they can do.

Adian.8756:

Stop kidding yourself. Nothing in GW2 takes any skill. Dee Jay is exactly right, that the only thing requiring half a braincell, is knowing what battles to take, where to attack/defend, and positioning during fights. Everything else is just: close eyes, smash keyboard.
There’s no such thing as sophisticated attacks – and combo fields? If you consider those hard to use, I have some sad news for you.

It’s simple and it’s tough at the same time. There’s nothing inherently hard about understanding how to manage downed state, and yet even at the top level a lot of the big plays happen when one team mis-manages a stomp or rez.

I haven’t seen a player under r30 able to hold his own even in solo queues for a while, which is evidence that it at least takes some time. r30 is what, maybe 100-150 hours? That’s nothing to sneeze at.

Also, the population is pretty small, so we’re not seeing the game played at its skill cap, even by top teams.

But yes, the mechanics are pretty simple and unfortunately some recent FOTM builds have been the simplest possible combinations of an already fairly-simple system.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Adian.8756:

Stop kidding yourself. Nothing in GW2 takes any skill. Dee Jay is exactly right, that the only thing requiring half a braincell, is knowing what battles to take, where to attack/defend, and positioning during fights. Everything else is just: close eyes, smash keyboard.
There’s no such thing as sophisticated attacks – and combo fields? If you consider those hard to use, I have some sad news for you.

It’s simple and it’s tough at the same time. There’s nothing inherently hard about understanding how to manage downed state, and yet even at the top level a lot of the big plays happen when one team mis-manages a stomp or rez.

I haven’t seen a player under r30 able to hold his own even in solo queues for a while, which is evidence that it at least takes some time. r30 is what, maybe 100-150 hours? That’s nothing to sneeze at.

Also, the population is pretty small, so we’re not seeing the game played at its skill cap, even by top teams.

But yes, the mechanics are pretty simple and unfortunately some recent FOTM builds have been the simplest possible combinations of an already fairly-simple system.

The res/stomp issue comes because it’s a metter of fraction of seconds.

Example: your teammate just got downed, the enemy is starting his stomp animation with stability popped. Assuming you are near your ally, that nobody will interrupt you and that there won’t be poison in the way you’ll manage to pull out a ress a split second before the stomping animation ends. Understanding when you can pull off a ress and when you’d just end up getting killed is very important.

This goes with some weapons, too. Example: Warrior’s 100b can be used as a downed state cleaver. But you have to position yourself in a way that will damage both the resser and the ressed. Your DPS will be enough to negate the attempt, but either a teammate stomps or you have to aim at downing the resser.

Locuz.2651:

Adian.8756:

Higher level? Really? I’ve been ranked since the introduction of the leaderboards, with about rank 100 being the highest. I’ve had a consistent 60% winrate, and played with players from Paradigm, CC, AKGL etc. My current group consists of one player who’s currently rank 16, and one who’s rank 120. I’ve played almost sorely PvP and WvW since the betas, without ever playing Hotjoin or Zerging.

If you can boast better results than that, then I’m all ears. Until then, I suggest you go watch any of the ’pro’ streams (like Teldo, Helseth or Ostrich), or simply take a look at the countless threads from former pros (Xeph comes to mind), who left the game because it was too easy, and too braindead.

Ranks dont mean sh...in this game :x

99% of the pros in this game arent really that pro to be honest. They are where they are due to the lack of competition. Its a bit like the early TBC arena days where we would get to 2100-2200 with 0 losses since we where some of the few that where try harding it.

I completely agree. A true professional in any game, is one which can run you over with little to no effort, and who has a huge impact on any game he plays. Those doesn’t exist in GW2, the same way they exist in CS, Dota or Starcraft. I’m pretty decent in both CS (DMG for those who know) and HoN (1900 MMR), but I’d still get completely wrecked if I ever played the pros.

In GW2, I’ve won 1v1s on multiple occasions against the acclaimed "pros", and even beat their premade teams with nothing but random PUGs. Can you imagine 5 randoms playing against NiP in CS, or EG in Dota2? The pros would win 100 of 100 games.

Silentshoes.1805:

Dunning Krueger Effect. Things feel simple when you don’t understand them in depth. You don’t know what you don’t know.

I see this with my kid quite often.

Great input - that truly made way for discussion. So let me get this straight, you understand the combat in depth? And I don’t, because I’m not playing a high enough tier, contrary to you? I must say, I find it kind of ironic how you mention the Dunning Kruger effect, without realizing you’re a victim of it yourself. You’re being a condescending know-it-all, without actually providing any proof of your statements, acting like you’re better than most, while having no history to back it up - the exact cognitive traits The Kruger Effect explains.

I’d like to hear who exactly you find worthy of judging the current combat mechanics, and how players like Xeph or Helseth does not fit your criteria.

The skill comes in winning consistently, skill isnt about playing your class, it is about out playing other people and decision making.

Example: Team mate is down, do I have the damage to cleave the stomper in under 3 seconds (greatsword/lb warrior)

I’m decapping far and an engy and s/p thief come to stop me, how long can I stay and get away without dying?

I’m 1v1ing a necro, does he waste all of his weakness and chill so that I can kill him or is he actually good? (because condi necro is the hard counter to gs/lb war)

There are so many factors pertaining to game knowledge during team fights and many others required in making important rotational decisions like:

I can go decap far but will my team lose the mid fight?

Can I 1v1 that x?

Is there somewhere more important to be? (treb npc channels etc)

Mainly doing well in pvp is knowing what skills to avoid, recognizing the telegraphs in the mess of animations, and target calling the best possible person at the start of a solo q match.

Ofc playing the classes well is easy, if you know exactly how to beat a class then you will know how to play that class, making up excuses about something being overpowered is just a copout for when people dont understand what they are up against.

Then it might be true that some classes have more uses than others, that they require more or less practice, more or less coordination, so balancing is still a big deal.

But that is just the tip of the iceberg.

And other than that, whatever happens you still need to know what you can and you can’t do. You can play an OP build and still get wrecked because you overestimate your power or your resistance and thus become useless for the team/worse than others.

Arganthium.5638:

ahuba.6430:

Arganthium.5638:

The heck is an evade condition thief?

deadly blossom spam i guess

Ah yes the old OP LDBlossom build. o.O

Is this actually played in PVP? I can’t recall the last time I saw one…

It’s a shame though, the animation on Death Blossom is awesome. When I started playing thief a while back I used to use it simply as it looked cool…

AI builds
condi tank/aoe spam builds

here, i said it

1) Banner Regen warrior (you literally just have to summon a banner, and nothing can kill you 1v1)

2)MM Necro

3)1-5 Engis, rotation means nothing and every skill is effective in almost any situation.

4)Zerker staff ele, some may argue this, but from a Tpvp standpoint all you do is spam aoe until you get killed, re-spawn and repeat.

5)Power necro, place wells, lich form, spam 1.

And IMO spirit ranger is not as faceroll as people have stated, I just recently started playing it and I have yet to kill any somewhat decent player just by spamming 1 on SB.

Adian,

Redlion’s post got into what I am talking about. It’s not just about 1v1 dueling. It’s about class knowledge, situational knowledge, map knowledge, and above all making the right decision in an instant.

I have watched people who can do this a whole lot better than me, and a whole lot better than many others. It’s an eye opener. It’s the beginning of clearing away the Dunnng Kreuger Effect that comes from entering GW2 tournaments from WOW or some other game that is less sophisticated in team strategy mechanics required to earn a win.

I will throw it back at you: you say you are so superior at GW2 sPvP that it is child’s-play-simple for you to be great with any of the classes. What evidence do we have that you are this terrific at sPvP? You are just some poster on a forum.

I don’t claim to be amazing at this game. I just say there is depth that newer players do not understand.

redslion.9675:

The res/stomp issue comes because it’s a metter of fraction of seconds.

Example: your teammate just got downed, the enemy is starting his stomp animation with stability popped. Assuming you are near your ally, that nobody will interrupt you and that there won’t be poison in the way you’ll manage to pull out a ress a split second before the stomping animation ends. Understanding when you can pull off a ress and when you’d just end up getting killed is very important.

This goes with some weapons, too. Example: Warrior’s 100b can be used as a downed state cleaver. But you have to position yourself in a way that will damage both the resser and the ressed. Your DPS will be enough to negate the attempt, but either a teammate stomps or you have to aim at downing the resser.

Right. The point is, it’s not brain surgery. Neither is it so easy that children or players with less than about 100 hours of experience can expect to succeed consistently.

How hard should it be? Should I need at least 300 hours of experience to truly understand the depths of strategy and class mechanics? 500?

When someone describes healing signet as: “A regen that regens harder than wolverine from Xmen on cocain and centrum b vitamins.” Theres something wrong, lol.

If I recall this quote came from a post called “The perfect warrior build,” in the warrior forum. Too bad that post was removed due to trolling, I found it pretty kitten funny.

im not a pro but i did play MM, dps spirit ranger, condi bunker spirit ranger, trap ranger, BM, zerker ranger, mantra mesmer, PU, phantasm, hambow, and ele. amongst them, i find MM the easiest to play in PVP. im not gonna say its braindead but its still easy.

2) Evade condition thief
Trust me, it’s easier even than MM Necro, which you at least need to press keyboard 6-10 for ONCE. With Evade condition you only need to :

22223333322222 -swap- 333332222 -repeat-

Nomin.5901:

5)Power necro, place wells, lich form, spam 1.

nooo dont hate on power necro… :(
i would be suprised if any competent player died to the rotation you described.

Troll.4237:

When someone describes healing signet as: “A regen that regens harder than wolverine from Xmen on cocain and centrum b vitamins.” Theres something wrong, lol.

If I recall this quote came from a post called “The perfect warrior build,” in the warrior forum. Too bad that post was removed due to trolling, I found it pretty kitten funny.

The class went from hard to easy when Anet made possible for some war builds to be effective on any position and in any scenario (not talking about rock-paper-scissor, but about all the situations that happen in a match, like teamfights, roaming, bunker busting and so on).

Not good-at-all builds still exist, though, even if they still use some cheese to face other warriors.

Stand The Wall.6987:

Nomin.5901:

5)Power necro, place wells, lich form, spam 1.

nooo dont hate on power necro…
i would be suprised if any competent player died to the rotation you described.

S/he doesn’t really play power necro, I think XD
We Power Necros are very~~different, from our condi spamming comrades, you see.
We need familiarity with Axe/Focus or Dagger/Warhorn combos to play. We also need to bear in mind each of our Well’s complex function and their positioning, for they are not condition damage, so knowing when to conjure a Well/when to spam 1~, I mean, when to draw our daggers and cut our foes to pieces is pretty tricky to master.

The biggest difference, however, is that we require skills to play.