Guild Wars 2

I’m going to kick this post off by admitting that I am fully away that I was never in any way important in the GW2 PvP scene. Also, I tend to ramble on. What I was however – was someone that was fairly active on these forums. This was because despite all of the flaws the basic mechanics of the game were super fun and unlike anything else I had played. There are plenty of character action games, but none with this level of variety and customization in a 3rd person perspective.

After putting up with parts of the game that bugged me, mostly balance, I eventually just stopped playing PvP altogether. These day, I only sign on to do solo PvE content. THe main reason I ended up leaving was simple, there was so much power creep and bloat that the gameplay became a huge mess.

Go look at PvP from the launch of the game and compare it to now. The pacing is almost absurdly fast now. This is mostly due to the design of the Elite Specializations. Rather than being simply a new playstyle, many were just flat out upgrades. Berserker feels like Warrior+, Chronomancer adds a new ability, Dragon Hunter gets WAAAAY better virtues, etc. The only Elite Spec that felt truly like a different playstyle to me was Reaper. Instead of carefully using your skills, you’re almost constantly throwing skills around now. You see many players just using rotations regardless of what the enemy is doing.

Now, the Elite Specs weren’t the only reason for power creep, there was the merging of many different traits in the original Specialization update. It’s a system I like conceptually, but it may have been better if certain traits had just just disappeared or receive more significant nerfs before being merged together. Almost every class got a huge boost in overall power and then HoT came and added even more must-use traits.

I’m sure some players prefer this faster pace, but I for one can’t even be bothered to watch GW2 PvP anymore because the screen is just a mess of skills and particle effects – which is funny since that was a complaint you saw a lot at launch. Even with me knowing what is going on it can still be hard to make any sense out of it.

My other major issue that has also been present since launch is the overall class balance. We all know balancing a game like is is impossible, but GW2 has been one hell of a rollercoaster ride. Warriors started off at the ultimate noob killers, then were useless, then were dominating as Hambow, then they did nothing well, then Shoutbow became a thing, then it became weak again, and now they seem to be OK but are lacking much of the variety the class used to have. Ele also had a fairly similar experience of up-and-down balance.

My timeframe may be a little off but I believe that the time of the Hambow Warrior was one of best in terms of balance we have ever seen, with the exception of the Hambow build itself. Warrior could do pretty much any role you wanted. It may not have been the best at it, but it was at the very least viable. You could do CC on Hammer, stack a crazy number of bleeds on Sword/Sword, provide support with Shouts, and straight up DPS with Axe and GS. That kind of variety is what I think all classes should aspire to. They can all fill a Support, Physical Damage, Condition Damage, or Control role, but in different ways. For example, Warrior being really good at stacking one condition but Necromancer applies a moderate amount of many different condis.

The framework for this seems to be present in most classes, and is probably what the Devs originally wanted. They were killing the holy trinity by making every class able to fulfill every role. The problem is that now most “meta” classes are able to do a bunch of different roles in one build instead of having to focus on one primary role and maybe one or two lesser roles. Again, I think this is because many traits have too many different effects. Simplifying the trait system would hopefully allow for more defined roles with less bloat.

For those of you who want a less long winded synopsis of what I think would make PvP better:

1: Simplified traits with one primary effect. Any secondary effect should be weak and designed to have synergy with another trait.

2: Do away with weapon-based traits. Adjust weapon Cool Downs to compensate. Replace the old traits with a more generalized version of the trait. For example, Forceful Greatsword could be changed to give might on crit with every weapon, but with a short ICD. Now, if you don’t want to take Strength you don’t feel like your GS is inferior because of it.

3: Try to design traits in such a way that one class can’t be good at everything, for example the old D/D Ele. It’s OK for builds to have major weaknesses, it is a team game after all. I see people complaining that Reaper is only good if supported, but imo that’s a GOOD thing. Now, I know that might make Solo Qing hard, but maybe someday the matchmaker can start grouping people up by looking at their traits and assigning them a role based on that so that it can try to create a balanced team comp?

4: Change skill CDs so that player’s aren’t just constantly “spamming” (for lack of a better word) so that there is more emphasis on timing like on launch. Before anyone says anything, I’m away launch balance was far from perfect, the I preferred the speed of combat compared o now.

5: I’ve said this a million times but I think the design of Conquest in general could do with borrowing some ideas from Conquest in the Battlefield series. This means that the side with the most players on it capture the point. If enemies are contesting the point, even if you have more players the captures are very slow. This would mean team fights are still important, but one tanky player can’t keep a point from flipping for an extended period of time. This would also allow for the capture points to be a bit longer, maybe kitten some terrain decoration so that the points are more than just flat circles.

Obviously, I don’t really see any of these things happening, but maybe a Dev will read this, because I know a good number of players that have left PvP for similar reasons to go back to games like LoL, Dota, or Battlerite. I WANT to come back, but the current meta keeps me from doing anything more than jumping into a dueling server to run a fun gimmick build or a unranked server with silly settings

+1

I am in a similar position where I like to try out theorycrafted builds and whatnot, and I was thinking, “What if I made a bunker warrior?”

Here was my thought process:
It needs blocks, okay lets add a shield.

It needs sustains, okay lets add stances.

What gives me the best heal? Healing signet

You get the idea. Eventually it turned into the meta Mace / Shield build (with gs instead of LB) but it was practically identical. That alone shows that the meta build does a lot on its own without any real drawbacks.

I had repeat experiences with Guardian and Engineer

I posted this stuff 2 years ago before anyone realised it happened and I got silenced by community members who just wanted buffs for their classes. Look at the game now. It is dead and I was right all along.

Spam a rotation is what this game is now. Used to be you would have a bunker guardian at mid who would pop stab when the warrior switched to hammer and use protection when a spike was coming onto a team mate. No more. Now its just spam and 24/7 boons.

Some great developers made this game but they must have left after launch. They cant go back now. Its a PvE game at its core. They cant nerf everything because all pve players would quit. The result is a game which can only get worse. Once power creep starts it cannot be stopped. GW2 is a case study in how to ruin a game imo.

I disagree that it can´t be stopped. It´s a matter of will not to add more and tweak a lot of skills and traits. It needs someone doing it. It would be a fulltime job for lets say two competent designers for a while. My expectation would be that this can be done within two seasons, but it would be more efficient to do balancing patches every two weeks between seasons.
Of course it won´t work well if someone overrides the devs telling them to do power creep for selling expansions. This will be a dead end. But it´s not uncommon to invest low resources and plan to make place for the next game.
Diversity is the key for long term exitement. If you plan to “Outage” a game you can go for power creep to squeeze out more money.

It’s just pathetic how they have balanced skills in the past year. I give them credit for trying but only reducing cooldowns won’t help much if there is zero synergy. Best example are physical skills on Warrior. Why would you ever drop a stance for that? They are not useless, but just a bad concept and easy to dodge.

Or whats up with Druid lately? Nerfing their healing is justified, but will they ever realise that having pets as a damage source is just a really bad idea? Why would you ever pick up a zerk Druid while your pet does the same damage with Magi?

I better stop ranting now.

Taking a break from PvP sounds like good idea, since you burn out encountering the same builds over and over. It will be interesting how expansion 2 will change things.

I took a break of almost 1 year i was hoping id come back to a balanced Ele gameplay but everything is the same.
I play Guardian and Ele in pvp and the difference is so large that it makes me cry. Ele can’t do anything, even staying alive is next to impossible when you get ganked by thief and Necro due to the absurd burst of condis you can’t cleanse and the physical damage.
My build is tanky but obviously not tanky enough since i die within 2seconds..

DH on the other hand is still very op and can more or less easily take on any fights.

Thank you ArenaNet for a great game, i just think you need to hire someone to come and do some ACTUAL balancing among ALL the classes not just 2-3.

I disagree with how you balance the game except for number 3 which is kind of the problem with HOT.

If i may add that you had to do things as a team to burst someone down or simply be better int he 1 vs 1 or 2 vs 2.

Now there is just so much spam, warrior F1 skill with mace is redicolous amounts of condi damage compared to sword and longbow. The ability to reappply so continuously makes it a unskilled build.

When you look at all HOT classes/specs it seems they didnt care about build diversity with in one area. For instance ohhh warrior uses strength-tactics-beserker in raids and defense-discpline-beserker. So that means we have build diversity, which it doesnt.

Its pretty simply how to rebalance the game, get rid of Op traits such as thiefs remove condition on dodge. Or warrior over the top power zerker trait line or the spam daze of traps from DH.

Go back to using certain skills/traits makes your build what it is. If you want to be more support you take a guardian shout giving stability or protection. If you want more damage go with a trap.

Like you said about the warrior meta in the game, warrior at no point could do everything. If you were s/s with longbow you did condi damage, greatsword-hammer you did DPS, shoutbow you were support.

Now everyone in the game has insanes amount of blocks, insane amounts of sustain, insane amounts of boons. Want to make to PvP better? Get rid of the spam but Anet wont because this is a PvE farming game.

A good summation of how GW2 has changed for the worse. I just don’t really understand the balance in this game anymore – it simply makes no sense. Almost every class can be built in a way that it has access to everything and opportunity costs (which make things fun and interesting) almost don’t exist in the game anymore. The combat has become a hyperactive mess of easily deliverable damage sources with a mountain of available active and passive sustain options. I really miss the thoughtful pacing that the game used to have.

This game is a fustercluck now and it makes me upset. I’d rather see it go back to the days before specializations when bunker guards and cele builds were the tanks of the game. Not bruisers that tank and 1 shot at the same time.

I’m just going to quote myself from another thread.

Daishi.6027:

GW2 PvP has no push, no joust, very little in terms of game phases within a round, no mid game counter building for a game supposedly about counters, and just boils down to restrictive builds and point rotations…

Which is poorly designed 5v5 pvp content.

Daishi.6027:

Also it just strait up kills the “Esports” campaign, because the uninitiated don’t want to watch the big mess of visual snow that the game type creates, and majority of the GW2 population would have to do a double take if they even cared enough.

This barrier to entry alone cuts off the amount of people who will watch or get involved. Which by the by, was the fear for why we didn’t balance for 1v1, but I’d wager we’d have a healthier population, and esport scene than we do now if we did.

beatthedown.2651:

Or whats up with Druid lately? Nerfing their healing is justified, but will they ever realise that having pets as a damage source is just a really bad idea? Why would you ever pick up a zerk Druid while your pet does the same damage with Magi?

I realize this comes as a shock after years of their being completely ignorable, but ranger pets are, in fact, supposed to be able to hurt you. Crazy, I know.

(and before you bark and whine about removing pets’ independent stats, look up what the stats on the bristleback and smokescale actually are, and consider whether you want to open the can of worms you think you do).

Hyper Cutter.9376:

beatthedown.2651:

Or whats up with Druid lately? Nerfing their healing is justified, but will they ever realise that having pets as a damage source is just a really bad idea? Why would you ever pick up a zerk Druid while your pet does the same damage with Magi?

I realize this comes as a shock after years of their being completely ignorable, but ranger pets are, in fact, supposed to be able to hurt you. Crazy, I know.

(and before you bark and whine about removing pets’ independent stats, look up what the stats on the bristleback and smokescale actually are, and consider whether you want to open the can of worms you think you do).

I would argue that having pets being a significant source of damage is just a poor design choice. Either you kitten the Ranger’s because of the pets, or you have the current situation of them being able to focus on sustain while still having decent damage due to pets.

It would have been much wiser to have pets be purely for utility. It would make it less devastating when a pet gets taken down and it would just make balancing the class easier overall. With how pets currently are they’re either too weak or too strong no matter what you do.

Tying the pets to mob AI causes a ton of issues too. If they were more of an extension of the player rather than a psudo-independent mob they would hopefully be more reliable. For example, your pet Wolf would stand right next to you until you give it an attack order, then when you give it it jumps right at your target, uses its attack, then comes back to you. One of the attacks could just be a simple lunge attack on a shorter CD so that it still feels like they are consistently attacking, but it’s more controllable, reliable, and predictable on both sides of the fight.

Heck, if you wanted to take this further, just remove health from pets entirely and just make them an extension of the player. That way you can make the damage they do tied to the player’s stats and you can be as glassy or as tanky as you want, but not be able to have it all in one build.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

beatthedown.2651:

Or whats up with Druid lately? Nerfing their healing is justified, but will they ever realise that having pets as a damage source is just a really bad idea? Why would you ever pick up a zerk Druid while your pet does the same damage with Magi?

I realize this comes as a shock after years of their being completely ignorable, but ranger pets are, in fact, supposed to be able to hurt you. Crazy, I know.

(and before you bark and whine about removing pets’ independent stats, look up what the stats on the bristleback and smokescale actually are, and consider whether you want to open the can of worms you think you do).

Have you ever played Ranger? All you need to do is running circles around an Object to outplay the pet. It’s just so bad as a damage source. I’m not crying because the pets do too much damage. The damage is just unreliable and it kills diversity.

All i wanted to say is that pets shoud provide utiliy instead of damage ( BurrTheKing already gave us some good points).

I main nearly the same Druid build since S1 and queued to legend with it. I tried out a lot, but why should I change build when I can play as thief, support, duelist and outnumbered fighter in one build? You can play something different, but you will have to drop at least one of these criterias. There is no diversity.

wait did u left pvp only or gw2? if so can i have all ur gold plz!

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if so can i have all ur gold plz!

This is the least original, least contructive, least funny, most cliché response ever. Seriously, what reaction do you actually expect us to give? It doesn’t even count as a joke and contributes nothing to a thread, and ending it with an exclamation mark is like laughing at your own “joke”.

NotASmurf.1725:

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if so can i have all ur gold plz!

This is the least original, least contructive, least funny, most cliché response ever. Seriously, what reaction do you actually expect us to give? It doesn’t even count as a joke and contributes nothing to a thread, and ending it with an exclamation mark is like laughing at your own “joke”.

I hope he gets a in game mail of like 500g from that person and he screen shots it just for you

kdaddy.5431:

NotASmurf.1725:

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if so can i have all ur gold plz!

This is the least original, least contructive, least funny, most cliché response ever. Seriously, what reaction do you actually expect us to give? It doesn’t even count as a joke and contributes nothing to a thread, and ending it with an exclamation mark is like laughing at your own “joke”.

I hope he gets a in game mail of like 500g from that person and he screen shots it just for you

I still play PvE so that ain’t happenin’.

I would return if they added new skills. Hands down. I am a player that would often donate to the cash shop to show my appreciation a few times a year. But I am not playing now because they left their original promise when gw2 opened and I don’t want to play a game that becomes a different game with time.

Some of the people designing and balancing the classes do not even know how to play them. Everyone remembers the epic Tempest demonstration when Karl couldn’t even beat Swanir with a spec he just designed himself.

No wonder the entire Tempest spec goes completely against the initial concept of playing elementalist and swapping attunements with haste.

Personally I felt I became really good at playing my class but now anyone can just use a meta tempest bunker build and randomly press keys to be useful. When they get bored of that they can switch to guard and do the same with 10x better results, it’s just insulting to those who have invested themselves seriously.

The problem remains about the gameplay primarily: It has become boring and doesn’t reward skillful play.

You can’t have good balance if you don’t promote good gameplay!

Therefore the concept of GW2 being an esport game will be absurd in my opinion until you have to calculate your moves, blasts, cleanses and counter better. Now it’s just “spam everything you got the build will carry you”.

The best meta that rewarded the most skillful play was at the time of the turret-engi. What they needed to do back then was to balance the game very carefully with small incremental adjustments. Instead they went overkill with a total turret nerf, celestial nerf, might nerf, condi buff, damage spike buff, dual shatter, etc. and made a new and worse trait system, reduced variety and promoted passive gameplay. Just wow, way to kitten up your own game.

Having some classic skullcrack>100b fun back would be nice

well never mind…

I do agree with the assessment the OP provided, it reflects my current opinion of the game today.

The GW2 of today doesn’t feel like the one I and friends used to enjoy and play hours in and hours out…You could say the charm and allure it used to have for us is just a pile of embers on a lake now. This is of course MY personal feelings about it but that does not mean that some other players don’t like the current stat of the game or that the game is a total wreckage train.

It’s probably an unreasonable thing to ask but having more variety in game modes in sPvP would be pretty fantastic. Over the entire course of the game we only got one extra game mode, stronghold. Maybe some CTF or TDM or hell, maybe even Every-man-for-himself deathmatch would be pretty cool. Or by the very least get the underwater maps back as the only one has been years ago never to be seen again.

NotASmurf.1725:

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if so can i have all ur gold plz!

This is the least original, least contructive, least funny, most cliché response ever. Seriously, what reaction do you actually expect us to give? It doesn’t even count as a joke and contributes nothing to a thread, and ending it with an exclamation mark is like laughing at your own “joke”.

lol i was serious, its hard to earn gold just pvping. if hes quitting the game, is there a problem if i ask for some gold?

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

NotASmurf.1725:

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

if so can i have all ur gold plz!

This is the least original, least contructive, least funny, most cliché response ever. Seriously, what reaction do you actually expect us to give? It doesn’t even count as a joke and contributes nothing to a thread, and ending it with an exclamation mark is like laughing at your own “joke”.

lol i was serious, its hard to earn gold just pvping. if hes quitting the game, is there a problem if i ask for some gold?

The guy took his time to prove some valuable insight going into details why he (and probably many others) left. Discussion and coming up for a solution can be vital for expanding the playerbase.

But every time there is a thread like this there’s at least one obligatory “lul u left m8 then give me sum gold XD XD” guy who adds nothing to the discussion and kittens on what OP was trying to do while thinking he’s dank. It gets irritating after a while.

Haven’t logged on in a while, did so just to comment on this post.

This game never had a PvP scene that was as large as, say, LoL or DotA, but it was still present and significant. I absolutely loved PvP and the flow of combat in the game. Dodging, attacking while moving, and actual mobility skills simply felt amazing.

Unfortunately, the amount of power creep in the game has pushed me away from it, just as it did to the OP. It started with the specialization and trait line update, continued with HoT, and has been steady since then. The game is not fun for me anymore, hence why I’ve stopped playing.

It’s not to say I haven’t got my money’s and times worth from the game, as I surely have, but it is sad to see something change so much from what it originally was.

I think we need to keep in mind that GW2 has exited the honeymoon phase with the player base and we can all look forward to game development philosophy of keeping the lights on instead.

Here’s Anet’s approach to the player base (4:05-4:50):
https://youtu.be/YLslqhBn3PU?t=4m5s

Keep this in mind if you’re feeling frustrated (like to OP) with the lack of content or balance changes or QoL or bug fixes or matchmaking, or compete lack of response/interaction from the devs, or increase in grind, etc etc etc (whatever your beef may be): Anet sees you only as a cash flow. And the longer you play the more money you will likely spend.

I’m not suggesting that OP or anyone quit, but I’m really encouraging them to give some thought as to how/what message they are trying to send. In this case being frustrated with the state of PvP and making a lengthy post on these forums (shoulda put it on reddit if you wanted to have a chance of dev reading/seeing your post btw), but then closing with that you are staying around to do PvE instead means Anet wins Your still playing, so they are still likely reaping the benefits from your cashshop purchases. Essentially, Anet doesnt have to change anything, no matter how frustrated you may be, because you’ve chosen to continue to pay them for operating exactly how they are. If you were in their shoes, would you do any differently?

Naix.8156:

Here’s Anet’s approach to the player base (4:05-4:50):
https://youtu.be/YLslqhBn3PU?t=4m5s

Thank you for this link!

PvP is only good for reward tracks and dailies, nothing more.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Go look at PvP from the launch of the game and compare it to now. The pacing is almost absurdly fast now. This is mostly due to the design of the Elite Specializations. Rather than being simply a new playstyle, many were just flat out upgrades. Berserker feels like Warrior+, Chronomancer adds a new ability, Dragon Hunter gets WAAAAY better virtues, etc. The only Elite Spec that felt truly like a different playstyle to me was Reaper. Instead of carefully using your skills, you’re almost constantly throwing skills around now. You see many players just using rotations regardless of what the enemy is doing.

Now, the Elite Specs weren’t the only reason for power creep, there was the merging of many different traits in the original Specialization update. It’s a system I like conceptually, but it may have been better if certain traits had just just disappeared or receive more significant nerfs before being merged together. Almost every class got a huge boost in overall power and then HoT came and added even more must-use traits.

I’m sure some players prefer this faster pace, but I for one can’t even be bothered to watch GW2 PvP anymore because the screen is just a mess of skills and particle effects – which is funny since that was a complaint you saw a lot at launch. Even with me knowing what is going on it can still be hard to make any sense out of it.

My other major issue that has also been present since launch is the overall class balance. We all know balancing a game like is is impossible, but GW2 has been one hell of a rollercoaster ride. Warriors started off at the ultimate noob killers, then were useless, then were dominating as Hambow, then they did nothing well, then Shoutbow became a thing, then it became weak again, and now they seem to be OK but are lacking much of the variety the class used to have. Ele also had a fairly similar experience of up-and-down balance.

OP, you are spot on. PvP really suffered because of the power-creep of elite specs and the new trait system. I’ve played this thing since release, elite specs raised the pace of this game to ridiculous levels. You just die too quickly, even with heavies. The damage and pace of this game is too high. There’s just barely any counterplay and trade-offs as there used to be.

For example, bunkers used to hold a point doing little damage. They couldn’t really hurt you much. Now they can hold the point AND kill you. Also, there’s barely any variety and diversity in gameplay. Everybody pretty much runs the same builds per prof.

I’ve stopped playing PvP, haven’t touched in two months. I’m reading that one of the balance devs is leaving. Does PvP even have a future at this point? Are we merely just trying to keep it going?

Soilder.3607:

Haven’t logged on in a while, did so just to comment on this post.

This game never had a PvP scene that was as large as, say, LoL or DotA, but it was still present and significant. I absolutely loved PvP and the flow of combat in the game. Dodging, attacking while moving, and actual mobility skills simply felt amazing.

Unfortunately, the amount of power creep in the game has pushed me away from it, just as it did to the OP. It started with the specialization and trait line update, continued with HoT, and has been steady since then. The game is not fun for me anymore, hence why I’ve stopped playing.

It’s not to say I haven’t got my money’s and times worth from the game, as I surely have, but it is sad to see something change so much from what it originally was.

The power creep drove me away. Looking back, I initially supported the new trait system. I didn’t foresee the effects until HoT opened my eyes. Now I look back at that new trait system as the first sign of trouble and start of the power creep. HoT, of course, was the crash lol.

You know, no matter how much money you invest in trying to make PvP competitive, it will always suffer if the gameplay suffers.

Naix.8156:

Here’s Anet’s approach to the player base (4:05-4:50):
https://youtu.be/YLslqhBn3PU?t=4m5s

Interesting video. I really would prefer that they focus on competitive archetypes. Spvp, WvW, and Raids. This game does not rate very high on twitch views outside of the finals, which in all honesty is not that interesting imo. I have no clue how much anet spends on the spvp tournaments with their sets, and getting people together from around the world and such.

My current fav. maps are those 2 beta maps. I feel there’s a good amount of maps atm.

One thing they could consider implementing is an in-game voice comm similar to other 5v5 style game. Typing something in team chat isn’t always a good option if you’re in-combat.

It would also be good if we could fight EU from NA. Is their a huge packet loss for this to be viable? What is preventing this from being an option? The pool of players to fight would be huge, and you know there would always be full groups at all hours.

Sad to hear that King, although I hope you’ll come back after realizing there is (almost unbelievably) still no other game atm with small scale pvp as fun as in GW2 (even after HOT).

I often take breaks to search for some other pvp fix, basically for the reasons you mentioned above, but always end up coming back.

Gonna toss my hat in here, and mention that I have pretty much taken a step back from gw2 in everything. I know I’m not some amazing pvp personality but there was a time when I would pvp so much, that I even had alts just to pvp some more, and test builds. I loved pvp in gw2. Loved it. Then the changes started to happen. I wanted to endure, would test builds. Play for fun you know? Ranger poison spam, twin pistol thief before twin pistols was even a thing. Mesmer that would stack bleeds, and use the rampager ammy. Was all in good fun, and I had a blast theory crafting, testing this or that. Necro chill build (before HOT), twin mace Warr. Was all stupid but somehow it still worked cause you could get away with stuff like that cause it was all some what balanced. The point I’m making is now you can’t, can only have the 1 build.

Crap ton of boons, fail safe game play, ridiculous ability to both tank, and inflict dps. It’s all way to much. The roller coaster of buffs, and nerfs. One update you’re top of the world, next you’re in the trash can. It doesn’t feel special anymore.

One Build to rule them all, One Build to find them,
One Build to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
In the Land of PVP where the Shadows lie.

Yasha.5963:

Sad to hear that King, although I hope you’ll come back after realizing there is (almost unbelievably) still no other game atm with small scale pvp as fun as in GW2 (even after HOT).

I often take breaks to search for some other pvp fix, basically for the reasons you mentioned above, but always end up coming back.

I disagree, currently enjoying pvp in World of Tanks, and Warships atm.

Crimson Shi.5047:

Yasha.5963:

Sad to hear that King, although I hope you’ll come back after realizing there is (almost unbelievably) still no other game atm with small scale pvp as fun as in GW2 (even after HOT).

I often take breaks to search for some other pvp fix, basically for the reasons you mentioned above, but always end up coming back.

I disagree, currently enjoying pvp in World of Tanks, and Warships atm.

Ah yes, but those are very different types of games. I mean specifically third person fantasy/rpg type “battlegrounds” with persistent characters.

I quite enjoy ESO for example, even though that is more like WvW, but I can’t stick at it long because you have to focus so much on gear/leveling it ends up feeling more like pve.

Then there are games like OW and so on, but they are first person shooters and don’t have anything like the build customization of GW2 (or other similar games).

So yes certainly there are other good pvp games, but nothing that brings together all the elements that gw2 does. Even upcoming games that are somewhat similar (like gigantic) look kind of lackuster in comparison.