Guild Wars 2

D/D Ele. Mesmer. Go. This shouldn’t be hard.

Actually I haven’t had any issues with Mesmers at all.

Because just because some people define them as “needed” doesn’t mean their right and there’s many varying opinions lol, as much forum discussion has shown.

The fact that mesmers are still mentioned in your post makes me think you’re just parroting back things you read on the forums. People complained about mesmer having very high burst, but then pretty much every aspect of that burst got nerfed.

People that had trouble killing mesmers before because they didn’t understand how to fight them are still gonna have trouble fighting them.

Mesmers are in a good spot right now and it’s nice seeing them around for the sake of class diversity. FYI, I don’t play one that well and am being unbiased.

They got nerfed already and if they get nerfed any further, they might end up as underwhelming as engies. Sure some engie builds can be viable and I still love playing mine but their traits don’t meld too well

Moonlit.6421:

Because just because some people define them as “needed” doesn’t mean their right and there’s many varying opinions lol, as much forum discussion has shown.

If you think the discussion is anywhere near 50-50, you are being biased. Pretty much everyone knows dd ele is God tier right now.

Mesmer needs a smaller reduction, but no where near ele.

Mesmer doesn’t need anymore reductions. Eles being “OP” (eh, no problems) stems from burn damage being a bit over the top. I speak as a power Necro on a the matter.

I think Mesmers are strong right now, but OP? Nah. They aren’t push-overs, but they aren’t impossible either. Arguably the wrong changes were made, but that’s not the topic at hand.
Elementalists can apply a little bit too much Burning, but if the stacks are reduced I think it’ll be fine too.

Tman.6349:

Mesmer doesn’t need anymore reductions. Eles being “OP” (eh, no problems) stems from burn damage being a bit over the top. I speak as a power Necro on a the matter.

The only things for mesmer that should happen is a supposed bug fix for The Pledge giving more cooldown then what it states(as some have posted in their sub forums) and/or PU getting reverted back to where it was pre-patch.

mesmers arn;t that strong, people just don’t know how to counter them.

sick of people just dying to classes and saying they need to be nerfed . . no you need to get better(and no i dont play a mesmer at all)

d/d ele being OP is more than just burning damage. Cutting down the number of burning stacks would be a good start, but it probably needs its damage and survival examined.

Mesmer is still too good, but it’s not completely broken like it was when the patch released. The burst is still easy to pull off and it’s far too forgiving of mistakes.

D/D Ele needs to be nerfed. This much is clear.

Now, what specifically needs to be nerfed and how? Much harder question. This one is probably why we haven’t seen any action from the devs regarding it yet; they don’t have a satisfactory answer at this point in time.

Pimsley.3681:

Mesmers are in a good spot right now and it’s nice seeing them around for the sake of class diversity. FYI, I don’t play one that well and am being unbiased.

They got nerfed already and if they get nerfed any further, they might end up as underwhelming as engies. Sure some engie builds can be viable and I still love playing mine but their traits don’t meld too well

literally nothing about mesmer aside from mirror blade getting one less bounce was nerfed.

PU is still untouched.
Confounding Suggestions is still incredibly poorly designed (the fix didn’t address the actual issue at all).
Mind Wrack still does more damage than backstabs despite being easier to land.
Blinding Dissipation is still stupidly strong for absolutely no reason, being stronger than GM traits that have similar functionalities; not to mention the absurd strength of blinds + distortions (can’t clear blind on invuln’d targets).

and let’s not forget to give mesmer a round of applause for causing a blanket nerf to air/fire because it had stupidly strong synergy with nearly every greatsword skill and shatters.

(PP) Thief > (PU) Mesmer
(A/F) Necro > (D/D) Ele
This is why they are not getting nerf imo. Its not that the builds are OP its just that people are not playing their counters. Again just my POV. Maybe if more people play the counters it can help the devs gauge the OPness of each builds more accurately.

mesmers are balanced.

d/d celele need its damage shaved.

Lucentfir.7430:

Tman.6349:

Mesmer doesn’t need anymore reductions. Eles being “OP” (eh, no problems) stems from burn damage being a bit over the top. I speak as a power Necro on a the matter.

The only things for mesmer that should happen is a supposed bug fix for The Pledge giving more cooldown then what it states(as some have posted in their sub forums) and/or PU getting reverted back to where it was pre-patch.

BUG fixes=\=nerfs. PU I don’t care about either way. It’s good vs. Thieves which were the majority of Mesmer’s problems. The solo queue teams I join that take 3 people to kill one Mesmer only make me sad inside and waste my time.

Zoso.8279:

(PP) Thief > (PU) Mesmer
(A/F) Necro > (D/D) Ele
This is why they are not getting nerf imo. Its not that the builds are OP its just that people are not playing their counters. Again just my POV. Maybe if more people play the counters it can help the devs gauge the OPness of each builds more accurately.

Maybe talk about the utility that is actually strong vs. those builds instead of just bad Weapon sets. Focused range\aoe and corruption\boon steal, respectively. P\p and A\f are meh.

sinject.4607:

Pimsley.3681:

Mesmers are in a good spot right now and it’s nice seeing them around for the sake of class diversity. FYI, I don’t play one that well and am being unbiased.

They got nerfed already and if they get nerfed any further, they might end up as underwhelming as engies. Sure some engie builds can be viable and I still love playing mine but their traits don’t meld too well

literally nothing about mesmer aside from mirror blade getting one less bounce was nerfed.

PU is still untouched.
Confounding Suggestions is still incredibly poorly designed (the fix didn’t address the actual issue at all).
Mind Wrack still does more damage than backstabs despite being easier to land.
Blinding Dissipation is still stupidly strong for absolutely no reason, being stronger than GM traits that have similar functionalities; not to mention the absurd strength of blinds + distortions (can’t clear blind on invuln’d targets).

and let’s not forget to give mesmer a round of applause for causing a blanket nerf to air/fire because it had stupidly strong synergy with nearly every greatsword skill and shatters.

I hear you on the nerf to air/fire sigil. I know PU mesmers are powerful but in capture mode, having more than 1 PU in your team could become a liability. Their stealth becomes a double edge sword.

The place where I absolutely hate PU mesmers is WvW. The roaming ones are untouchable. They induce rage and high blood pressure

I’d like to see a buff to thieves and engies. All leather armored classes seem underpowered.

Tman.6349:

Zoso.8279:

(PP) Thief > (PU) Mesmer
(A/F) Necro > (D/D) Ele
This is why they are not getting nerf imo. Its not that the builds are OP its just that people are not playing their counters. Again just my POV. Maybe if more people play the counters it can help the devs gauge the OPness of each builds more accurately.

Maybe talk about the utility that is actually strong vs. those builds instead of just bad Weapon sets. Focused range\aoe and corruption\boon steal, respectively. P\p and A\f are meh.

:P lol true true I can def give more detail. A/F-Staff Necro using Marauder and Spectral can “hard” counter D/D ele because it can sustain enough to take the hits transfer burns and boon rip and damage. Cele builds are good at everything but excel at nothing thats the balance involved in it. Marauder is all about attack so if u build around that giving more sustain with traits/utilities then you should be able to sustain long enough to out DPS the D/D.

Regarding build counter, you guys need to take the mobility/rotation into account.
There are always builds that counters you in a straight-on engage. But the question is can you work around it?

Mesmers don’t need to be touched. Anet just needs to keep adding more counters to stealth.

d/d ele and sig necro is broke, though.

aw come on…stop ele qq already, there were only 8 eles out of 15 players in last eu go4

they not gonna nerf it until everyone running (At least) 4 eles on each team

because, you know, balance is serious business here

sinject.4607:

literally nothing about mesmer aside from mirror blade getting one less bounce was nerfed.

Mantras ‘fixed’ to not recharge until all charges have been used. Equivalent to a reduction in their healing, cleansing and stun chain.

Akikaze.1307:

sinject.4607:

literally nothing about mesmer aside from mirror blade getting one less bounce was nerfed.

Mantras ‘fixed’ to not recharge until all charges have been used. Equivalent to a reduction in their healing, cleansing and stun chain.

He also missed the harmonious mantra nerf too and is just being selective in his claim that mesmer mind wrack does more damage than backstab. It only does with a full 2 clone and Mesmer shatter and up and only if target is using no skill, which is significantly harder to do than backstab due to its reliance on suicidal 2.4k paper thin clones.

Even then it also relies on full MW damage mod, one of the reasons thieves do less damage is they don’t pick up their own damage mod so really it’s just thieves being silly a lot of the time. 20% damage mods are huge, no wonder thieves are doing less damage if they’re picking up improvisation.

For reference Sinject these are crits from MW
1 clone mind wrack = ~3392 damage per hit (can be 2)
2 clone MW = ~2625 per hit (can be 3)
3 clone MW = ~2271 per hit (can be 4)

Thief backstab damage on crit:
No executioner: 6348
Executioner: 7618

If only 3 hits from a 3 clone shatter hit its only a little bit higher than a non executioner backstab damage. If only 2 hits from a 2 clone shatter hits it’s well below both thief backstabs. It really does emphasise how crucial it is to dodge that shatter and kill clones. Even dodging 1 of the clones is a lot of reduction, again, assuming it crits but then both classes have good fury access.

Hammerguard.9834:

Mesmers don’t need to be touched. Anet just needs to keep adding more counters to stealth.

d/d ele and sig necro is broke, though.

Are you kidding me, because thieves need more ways to be revealed >.>. Mesmer on the other hand can survive well without it.

Yes, that’s exactly it. Thieves and Mesmers need more ways to be revealed. Engineer has a sweet revealing trait but there needs to be more of that going around.

Engi has a reveal on gadgets but gadgets are one of the most underwhelming skills in the game next to ranger shouts which also happen to have the other reveal.

Hammerguard.9834:

Yes, that’s exactly it. Thieves and Mesmers need more ways to be revealed. Engineer has a sweet revealing trait but there needs to be more of that going around.

Revenant and dragon hunter say hi.