Why assume you need progress in tiers
You make NO sense.
Let me throw this back at you – Why compete in the first place?
Wow, this forum. Why aren’t delusional noob threads subject to infractions? I’m sure they drive a lot of people nuts.
Okeey, first of all thanks for being so kind and discrete, I appreciate the effort ^^ Turning subjects into personal assaults from post 1 is certainly the right way to go.
Second of all, multiplayer games have always had some form of rating and pooling. Look at the elo ratings of chess or age of empires; I’ve played years with those kind of ratings and at one point people get stuck at a certain rank or tier. Why? Because that’s how far their talent can take them. If you want to improve your tier or rating you should learn to improve your gameplay; not go after the devs who should come up with some magical rythm in which the natural balance of 50-50 wins can be overcome.
In theory a 50/50 win to loss ratio is the perfect rating system. You will keep going up to the highest position if you can improve that much or are just that good. If you cant then you’re 50/50 will plateau at some point, whether that’s high position or a low position should just depend on your skill.
It’s similar to chess leagues. The difference in chess is that each player has access to the EXACT same set of tools as the other player. The pieces, the playing field and the time.
This does not exist in MMO’s because of its inherent nature of multiple classes. You can’t expect a Mesmer to have the same skill set as a Guardian, and vice versa. Here is the first instance of balance that can skew with rating systems. For example you might beat me if you’re a Mesmer and I’m a Guardian, but if we were both playing Mesmer I would win you.
So who is better? Who’s rating should be higher?
That’s where balancing the classes comes in, so that given enough skill everyone should be able to out-play the other. It can be argued that teaming up, learning map objectives and rotations are part of someones skill and that is entirely true as these places are the playing fields of ranked leagues, aka the chess board.
Now everything mentioned above can be put down to skill in terms of playing classes against one another. The balance of these classes is up for debate however, imagine if playing chess and Player A’s Queen had abilities that Player B’s Queen didn’t. That is obviously just unfair and if Player B lost is not a true representation of his skills.
The problem is further exasperated with being able to duo queue/team queue in a ranked environment. That option should be it’s own queue, limited to 2 or at worst disabled. This function undermines all the ranking balance before it because of the obvious teamwork advantage that a pre-made set of players have. This is not something that is down to chance, this is not something within the opposition players control. They just have to deal with having two or more people who are able to synchronize themselves much better than people who have just queued into the same team.
‘Finding buddies’ should lead to a separate queue. It heavily distorts the ranking in solo queue.
And then lastly, you have the current system where people have recorded losing pips on a win, gaining pips on a loss. All in all, this game needs to sort out balance of classes and teams of players before its rating system can ever amount to anything respectable.
TL:DR. – If there are too many variables outside of a players control that can impact the outcome of their games then the result of those games (ranking) means nothing.
(edited by Acroniaz.1729)
So what you’re saying is that 5 casual pvp players have to go against PVP guilds or premade matches and then saying its their fault for not trying to improve when they lose?
I’m honestly wondering why people expect that they should be constantly progressing through the tiers. Tiers aren’t meant for that; reward tracks and rankpoints are. If you have a 50-50 win lose rate at a certain point, you’re at the right spot.
You might have a point if league divisions or tiers had anything to do with your mmr. Unfortunately, they aren’t – the moment your mmr matches your skill, and you get 50% win chance, you will stop progressing, but that can happen at Emerald as well as at Diamond. In fact, the current league system penalizes you for improving faster. A fast learner will reach the 50% plateau (and thus stop progressing) earlier than a slow one, and thus may end up stopping at a lower league division. Even if he is technically better.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
I’m honestly wondering why people expect that they should be constantly progressing through the tiers. Tiers aren’t meant for that; reward tracks and rankpoints are. If you have a 50-50 win lose rate at a certain point, you’re at the right spot. If you want to improve, either get better at soloq or find buddies.
Yes, it can seem unfair if you’re in a unfair matchup, but then again it happens the other way around as well.
Except for the part where MMR plays a huge role on the matchmaking system and didn’t get reset for leagues.
If the system is not exploited, the right spot will be mostly that one where the MMR settles, with next to zero relation with tiers or divisions.
so on my low mmr smurf account i’m supposed to be ruby but on my high mmr main account i’m supposed to be stuck in emerald? that makes absolute sense.
I’m honestly wondering why people expect that they should be constantly progressing through the tiers. Tiers aren’t meant for that; reward tracks and rankpoints are. If you have a 50-50 win lose rate at a certain point, you’re at the right spot. If you want to improve, either get better at soloq or find buddies.
Yes, it can seem unfair if you’re in a unfair matchup, but then again it happens the other way around as well.
It needed to be said
Thank you
I use the name Barbie on all of my characters.
I’m honestly wondering why people expect that they should be constantly progressing through the tiers. Tiers aren’t meant for that; reward tracks and rankpoints are. If you have a 50-50 win lose rate at a certain point, you’re at the right spot. If you want to improve, either get better at soloq or find buddies.
Yes, it can seem unfair if you’re in a unfair matchup, but then again it happens the other way around as well.
It needed to be said
Thank you
Are you guys friggin serious? Do you even read the posts that others make about this topic, or do you just read the titles and think to yourself “oh no, another whiner who needs to get gud”. Wtf guys. Yes of course at some point you will not progress any further without getting better, but with the current broken matchmaking it’s impossible to get to your actual skill category/ division. How am I supposed to gain pips when I’m constantly facing pre mades in solo q. Telling others to just get better in solo q is ignorant as kitten….
I’m getting really tired of people who think the league system actually works as a way to gauge player skill. It’s currently utterly broken and the divisions do in no way reflect a player’s abilities because, as others in this thread have pointed out, player MMR is not reflected in their division, nor is it taken into consideration when calculating pip gain.
I’m honestly wondering why people expect that they should be constantly progressing through the tiers.
Because that’s the way the system is designed. It was advertised as a way to gauge player skill, but it’s really just another reward progression system.
If you have a 50-50 win lose rate at a certain point, you’re at the right spot. If you want to improve, either get better at soloq or find buddies.
I’ll just copy my post from another thread:
“Two players could have the same win/loss % ratio, but one player could be facing more difficult opponents due to higher MMR.
You’re not really trying to beat the average with the league system, you’re trying to beat your average, which is why it is a lot harder for good players who played a lot pre-league and have high MMR than it is for people who just started; they’re already at their correct MMR and at the peak of their skill level, while simultaneously being in the bottom of the league system. It’s an uphill struggle all the way.
“Practice more” won’t really do much when you’re already at the top, but the league system won’t recognize it because it doesn’t discern between high MMR and low MMR."
To make things even clearer: according to your logic, the “right spot” for ESL players is in Amber league, lol.
(edited by Pakkazull.6894)