Guild Wars 2

I don’t know the situation of others, but in solo queue I have two really good even matches, win, and then right before I hit a winning streak seemingly every time I get put up against another team in which the match ends up being a complete blowout.

The other team’s comp is better, the players are miles above anyone on our team. (More like their builds are better and they are far more coordinated with chain cc’ing and focusing targets.)

Is there something in the matchmaking algorithm that seems to want to screw over solo queue players from getting a winning streak despite regularly winning 1 or 2 matches?

The times I lose I can immediately understand why, but in the games where I lose my chance at a winning streak the score ends up being something ridiculous like 500 to 100.

I don’t know if it’s impossible for many but it is for me.
So far since S3 started I’m 83 games played and 0 pips, can’t hold them.

I’ve won 5 out of 20 matches so far,so I would gladly settle for winning two then losing one.

Sheesh. I’m currently on a 16 game win streak all on my thief and all in solo Q. In fact, my overall record this season is 31-13. No duo, trio or full man premades. Just solo Q.

Solo Q 70% win rate to sapphire right now.

90 games should send you flags you need to change something.

Yah, the algorithm is what needs to change. People are experiencing effortless win streaks, and the reverse people are experiencing frustrating cumulative losses. The winners keep telling the losers that its their personal skill. But we all know that solo quers with losing streaks will continue to lose because of the mmr/matchmaking system, and possibly, but certainly not necessarily, and definitely not solely or definitely because of their personal skill or lack thereof. Losing can occur for any reason not connected to a solo q player’s skill, especially when the solo quer is paired with people with low mmr or losing streaks and pitted against pro teams on coordinated ts. Not a level playing field by any stretch of the imagination. And solo quers who r breezing thru r both lucky and have high mmr. When I finally eeked my way to dia last season after a 100 game losing streak in emerald, I was very tired of being told I was an emerald player who needed to get good, and I won against many of the people in ruby and dia who had beaten me in emerald.

Just had a winstreak of 28 as solo / duo Q from sapphire to diamond… so the chance is there.

Long win streaks are, imo, along with long losing streaks, evidence of bad matchmaking. Good matchmaking should be matching like skilled players with like skilled players against like skilled players. Truth be told, if the matchmaking is working correctly according to that model, then you should in the long run be winning approximately 50% of your matches. (If you’re good enough to be pushing that number higher, then you should find yourself matched against better players, thus bringing that average back down to norm, which is 50%.) Sure, there’s some degree of RNG in the mix, so win and loss streaks will happen —that is to say that you won’t always invariably follow a w-l-w-l pattern -- but when you’re winning (or losing) 10, 20, 30 matches in a row? That’s a matchmaking failure.

But what is clearly happening, from what I can gather from my experience in the game and from reading these forums, is that some people (like me) are getting stuck in MMR hell, constantly matched up with terrible teammates against at least competent competition, while others are experiencing the exact opposite, neither of which is particularly fun for anyone in the long run.

Season 1 was, imo, terrific. But then ANet’s motto kicked in for Season 2: “If it ain’t broke, hold on sec, we’ll take care of that.”

Feels like population issue also partially. If you can, play pvp in gw for your own “fun”. I do not care for progression, since in the end, anyone with enough games will hit legend by the end of the season.

If you keep having really terrible win/loss I don’t think it’s fair to keep blaming it on having bad teams. Since sPvP is only 5v5, a fairly low amount of players for some fairly large maps compared to other games, every person matters quite a lot and one or even two extreme baddies on your team can be offset by you yourself playing really well.

It’s all about recognizing what the situation requires. Has anyone harassed far? Is anyone guarding close? Are people just spamming mid one by one and getting slaughtered? Your response to these situations can make a big difference.

Take battle of kylo for example, are you losing all teamfights and constantly being outnumbered at mid? Go treb. If you’re decent at 1v1 they’ll have to divert two players just to deal with you and with some smart disengage the treb will barely have downtime because of it.

Matchmaking is terrible and here’s proof. There is literally nothing I can do to win those games nor lose those games.

The math might say one thing, but my experience says another.

Aapheus.5780:

Long win streaks are, imo, along with long losing streaks, evidence of bad matchmaking. Good matchmaking should be matching like skilled players with like skilled players against like skilled players. Truth be told, if the matchmaking is working correctly according to that model, then you should in the long run be winning approximately 50% of your matches.

This.

No, if you don’t get winstreaks it is not the matchmakings fault. On the contrary. Thus a correction is the last thing that needs to be done. That being said, if you experience problem with progression that can be due to multiple reasons:

- the MMR matchmaking system not working well with the progression pip system
- your rating rebalancing after an unjustified win-streak (maybe your opponents had bad days, disconnects, etc.)
- you having a bad day and getting a lose streak (either due to you not playing up to par, or member of your team)
- you actually being progression wise where you should be

The good thing about good mathcmaking though is, the bigger the pool and the longer the seasons, the further appart the field of players will get stretched. Meaning the super pro players will move futher up towards the top end while the good players will move up to below that and the mediocre players will move up behind them.

fishball.7204:

Matchmaking is terrible and here’s proof. There is literally nothing I can do to win those games nor lose those games.

The math might say one thing, but my experience says another.

Not sure, all I see is a 2-3 streak. Explenation wise all I can see is:

-> you trashed the enemy team -> your MMR increased a lot
-> you got destroyed by the enemy team -> your MMR got reduced (likely less than it was increased earlier)
-> you got destroyed by the enemy team -> your MMR got reduced even more
-> you got destroyed by the enemy team -> your MMR got reduced (by now likely past what your ranking should be)
-> you destroyed the enemy team -> once again your MMR increases a lot

While I understand this can be frustrating, from a balance standpoint it seems fine. Nothing that can’t be explained by saying:

- you are circling your proper MMR (and being quite close at that)
- some good/bad luck with team mates. Good luck when crushing the opponent and bad luck when losing.

Main problem is the small sample size of 5 games.

I have played over 100 games this season and most are uncompetitive. I’m not gonna screenshot the entire thing dude.

I don’t get why you can say ‘from a balance standpoint it seems fine’ when clearly it isn’t fine. Most games are lopsided and even when/if I get to where I belong (supposedly) the matches still aren’t balanced.

The variation of player skill I get on my team and my enemies is demoralizing. There’s just no justification to have such a poor system when my queues already go up to 9 minutes.

1 of my last 10 games were > 400 points one side.
1 of my last 10 games were between 350 and 400 one side.

The rest were uncompetitive so rip

I just ended a 13 win streak, all solo queue :p

I hit diamond on 2 accounts today with 85%+ win rates on both (a little higher if you count 1-2 DC losses per account). Solo queue every game. Could be luck, could be matchmaking. If you’re losing a lot, just take a break.

I am still getting games full pug vs 3-4 grouped + 1-2 random. Works as intended.

@Serkit good MMR is good. Gz on all diamonds.

Your personal skill matters a lot, also your build and your team composition.
When you pug you are also playing against pug, some are below average, some are average and 1 or 2 can be good so it eventually balance’s out for both teams. Yes you get a complete noob or afker once in a while but that alone shouldn’t send you on a losing streak.
Team composition also matters a lot, no matter how good your team is you will have very hard time winning if you are 2 thieves, 2 dragon hunters and 1 necro vs 1ele, 1 druid, 1 scrapper, 1 warrior and 1 necro. So don’t get attached to 1 class but atleast be good with 2 or 3 classes so that you can switch to whatever your team needs most.
Contrary to what most people say, getting win streaks are not difficult if you have the skills and right builds. No matter how good you are, if you are playing power ranger you are not gonna contend with my druid on point. Yes i have seen so many people playing power rangers, gs necros and other bad builds.

“When you pug you are also playing against pug” Actually no…..1-2 out of 3 games i am facing as i said above 3-4 grouped people (enemy) vs full pug. It has been increasing for the past 3 days.

Marckan.9526:

I just ended a 13 win streak, all solo queue :p

lol you are so lucky best winning streak i have had in solo Q is 2 wins. i took some advice to only go in with a pre-made team and things are 1000x better

Rebound.3409:

“When you pug you are also playing against pug” Actually no…..1-2 out of 3 games i am facing as i said above 3-4 grouped people (enemy) vs full pug. It has been increasing for the past 3 days.

That’s not how it works or atleast how it should work.
If you are sure you are playing against someone who are 2-3 group then your team will also consist of 2-3 ppl grouped. You might have solo queued but that doesn’t mean all others in your team are also solo. Match engine doesn’t pit 3 grouped ppl against 5 complete randoms who solo queued.
If you join as a 5 man party you will ALWAYS play against another 5 man party.

I’ve played vs a Duo+Trio as a solo q before. I’ve also played vs 5 man premades but my team had a duo (not me). Either way it’s not fair but w/e tired of arguing about it

@Pridedemon yes..i have stayed specifically after each match to check that…and as i said 1-2 out of 3 games i am facing as i said above 3-4 grouped people (enemy) vs full pug. I know it should not work like that…but at this very moment that’s what i am facing.

I did not join any party either before or after or whenever. I am a soloquer.

Either the system has some major issues or there are so few people left playing PvP that it struggles to find opponents and just throws “whatever” vs “whatever” just for the sake of a match. Would also explain the extremely long queues.

@fishball if your group had a party then i can understand why you faced another party. That’s actually normal and how it should have worked in the first place.

solo q 67 ranked played=49 wins (plus 2 wins but dc…. ty anet) 18 losses (3 dc…. ty anet again) (10 losses all at the start in amber… ty team -_-")
now i’m ruby.
solo q is possible.

You have very high MMR → you get really easy matches since MM favors you.
You have average MMR → you are stuck with win/loss/win/loss 50/50 algo.
You have low MMR → enjoy feeding players from above cases.

Matchmaking intentionally puts 1 winning team and 1 losing team together for the sake of progression for higher MMR players. They devs didn’t really care how unenjoyable it is for lower MMR players to be the fodder nor how unenjoyable it is for high MMR players to farm lower MMR. It gets bit better in diamond/legend but still same crap pretty much.

solo que’d 20 games

won 19

I sit on a perfect 50% w/l ratio. Soooo boring. I know I’m not a very experienced pvp’er ( I’m a wvw roamer), and I still make mistakes. But when I see ppl double capping ( or leaving point not recapping, forcing me to run back and cap the point !), or switching for daily profession and dying all the time, ppl fighting off point, dying in 3 sec at mid, 2-3 teammates killing beasts, I just want to stop this joke-of-so called pvp and go back to wvw.

It’s a really unpleasant experience so far. I don’t mind losing to better players, since I can learn something from the loss. Being outplayed, or losing 1v1 is a great experience and force me to become a better player. But losing to your own team because of RNG or MM or even profession dailies. Sigh…

12 streak highest here

Well i finally made it to diamond after struggling for a while due to both bad teams and occasionally getting destroyed by far better players.

< 50% win rate total lmao

It’s “possible” to climb solo q, just way harder than trio/duo imo since you can’t really control the comp or the team mates skills and MMR is wonky as hell especially during off hours which I play in.

I think I’ve played between 50 and 60 games over the past week, most of which being Saturday and Sunday (and we won’t even get into how awful Sunday was. omg), on my main account. Think I’m floating right around 50/50. My longest win streak being 6. Starting out on my tertiary class at the start of the season trying to get “x wins on a third profession” definitely didn’t help matters for me. I’m back to just aiming for my 3 matches each evening for the daily, since that’s all I need for my wings. 8 days to go…

I have yet to decide if I’m going to jump into the pond with my alt this time around.

It’s not impossible at all. The problem, like in S2, is it’s going to be hugely influenced by your MMR rather than your factual play skill at that moment.

If you have high MMR you could probably metaphorically sleep on your keyboard and win since you will be given players with the best odds of winning while having to fight players who are clear underdogs (the kind of matches you can win even if you have 1 of your teammate dc).

If you are of low MMR the MM will stack the odds so badly against you any pro players would loose too to what they would have to contend with if they were in your shoes.

The mid MMR zone is where you will have easy and hard matches with the consequence of making win streaks possibly very hard to get and keep going.

The most important factor in any game outcome is, and always will be no matter how godly you are, who the MM pair you with and against. Long story short, the MM still handle very poorly soloquing even if it is by far, at least I think it is, the way the huge majority play the game.

Yeah who I got on my team and who I was fighting was way more important than my personal skills. I’ve had plenty of games where I could probably just AFK and the outcome would not change.

Idk how ANet can fix this but it basically is a combination of MMR being inaccurate since it’s a team game and the fact that matchmaking isn’t very good.

It just comes down to MMR.

My main acct struggles to maintain win streaks where as my alt account is unstoppable again this season (much like last season).

Currently near the end of diamond with a 9 game win streak going on. 4 more and ill be in legendary.

Win streaks are definetly possible as solo que. But then I havn’t ever felt like my personnel skill didn’t matter while solo queing

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

It’s not impossible at all. The problem, like in S2, is it’s going to be hugely influenced by your MMR rather than your factual play skill at that moment.

If you have high MMR you could probably metaphorically sleep on your keyboard and win since you will be given players with the best odds of winning while having to fight players who are clear underdogs (the kind of matches you can win even if you have 1 of your teammate dc).

If you are of low MMR the MM will stack the odds so badly against you any pro players would loose too to what they would have to contend with if they were in your shoes.

The mid MMR zone is where you will have easy and hard matches with the consequence of making win streaks possibly very hard to get and keep going.

The most important factor in any game outcome is, and always will be no matter how godly you are, who the MM pair you with and against. Long story short, the MM still handle very poorly soloquing even if it is by far, at least I think it is, the way the huge majority play the game.

This is true. I had a pro ESL player play on my account, with me watching. He played 6 straight games and was only able to win one. There was zero team support because my mmr is so low. No way even a pro can carry a whole newbie/baddie/low mmr team to victory against ppl on teams w/ high mmrs/wins/win streaks. It was proven to me definitively for good by a pro on my own account.

I’ve had a decent experience this season. I’d say 70% of games are competitive and fun! Which I love, I haven’t had a giant win streaks but not big loss streaks either, get a 5-6 win streak here and there then some losses and the cycle continues lol. I’m not progressing quite as fast as last season, but this is much better than s1

Asherah.7651:

I’ve had a decent experience this season. I’d say 70% of games are competitive and fun! Which I love, I haven’t had a giant win streaks but not big loss streaks either, get a 5-6 win streak here and there then some losses and the cycle continues lol. I’m not progressing quite as fast as last season, but this is much better than s1

I experience the complete opposite. 5-6 lose streaks, then I get back 2 pips from recovering from it, then I lost everything and this is happening again and again, and I can’t get any higher.
The current season is just as bad experience for me like the first one, if not even worse. It’s nothing more, then a big RNG battle. If you get a decent team, you can roll on your face on the keyboard, you’ll win. If the RNG gods decides against you, not matter how good you know you class and your rotation, you’ll lose.

Bazs.1470:

Asherah.7651:

I’ve had a decent experience this season. I’d say 70% of games are competitive and fun! Which I love, I haven’t had a giant win streaks but not big loss streaks either, get a 5-6 win streak here and there then some losses and the cycle continues lol. I’m not progressing quite as fast as last season, but this is much better than s1

I experience the complete opposite. 5-6 lose streaks, then I get back 2 pips from recovering from it, then I lost everything and this is happening again and again, and I can’t get any higher.
The current season is just as bad experience for me like the first one, if not even worse. It’s nothing more, then a big RNG battle. If you get a decent team, you can roll on your face on the keyboard, you’ll win. If the RNG gods decides against you, not matter how good you know you class and your rotation, you’ll lose.

What you’re experiencing Bazs is what’s happening to me. Except I can’t win a single match no matter how hard I carry. I’m so super salty about it that I think I’m done with this current season. I can be at far on a decapped a point fighting two people and every time, in every match, my team of 4 other people can’t win against the other team’s 3 other people. I don’t get it. But I think that’s a prime example of bad luck and bad match making. This wasn’t even in a single day either, I played 3 games on two separate days and it was the same story. I give up and go do something else after 3 games, so it’s not tilt.

No, I had many streaks to get me out of Emerald, won a few in Sapphire, then bad luck set in so I’m taking a break from ranked since I’m still seeing Exalted Legends in Sapphire. My tightest games this season were 500-499 (but only because I had a disconnect) won and second tightest 500-497 (no disconnect so it was the closest legit game since in the other one they caught up because I wasn’t there doing Revenant stuff) won, and that one had a Primordial Legend on my team!

The MM is at least lot better than in S1 and S2

Clearly they got too handsy with the matchmaking and the algorithm is more likely to choose winners than player skill, you’ve all seen it. win a couple games, then get matched with people who seem like they’ve never played the game before in their life. I win 2 games and then get matched against a 4 man premade with 2 or 3 soloqueuers consistently.

While the matches might be better in terms of not getting like 50 games streaks, it’s still the same whatever class you play or how well ppl in most cases don’t:

a) use any sense whatsoever 75% of the time
b) don’t watch the minimap to reason where to go
c) don’t commicate, unless it’s flaming your team
d) do whenever the kittenever
e) usually nobody switches class to balance the comp unless it’s for the worse

You can still get wins if the enemy suck kitten real hard.

But whatever I play only full berserk thief without runes, sigils, traits and utility skills or weapons. Went 5x lege already. Git gud you scrub! Don’t know what que you plaing noob I’m pro so suck my kitten kitten!

I think the highest win streak I got so far this season was 3 or 4 wins. Last season I had 2 30+ win streaks then got stopped at diamond.
At this point I assume I’m going to lose if I get one or two wins in a row lol.

Caosaur.3871:

I think the highest win streak I got so far this season was 3 or 4 wins. Last season I had 2 30+ win streaks then got stopped at diamond.
At this point I assume I’m going to lose if I get one or two wins in a row lol.

I watched twitch streams today and there was Paul from PZ and lord Helseth from TCG both in ruby still so it’s not really surprising people that didn’t make it to legendary past 2 seasons to advance to diamond or legendary yet this season. So are you on a level with those players? You think you can carry your team against them if you play against them?

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

It’s not impossible at all. The problem, like in S2, is it’s going to be hugely influenced by your MMR rather than your factual play skill at that moment.

If you have high MMR you could probably metaphorically sleep on your keyboard and win since you will be given players with the best odds of winning while having to fight players who are clear underdogs (the kind of matches you can win even if you have 1 of your teammate dc).

If you are of low MMR the MM will stack the odds so badly against you any pro players would loose too to what they would have to contend with if they were in your shoes.

The mid MMR zone is where you will have easy and hard matches with the consequence of making win streaks possibly very hard to get and keep going.

The most important factor in any game outcome is, and always will be no matter how godly you are, who the MM pair you with and against. Long story short, the MM still handle very poorly soloquing even if it is by far, at least I think it is, the way the huge majority play the game.

This is true. I had a pro ESL player play on my account, with me watching. He played 6 straight games and was only able to win one. There was zero team support because my mmr is so low. No way even a pro can carry a whole newbie/baddie/low mmr team to victory against ppl on teams w/ high mmrs/wins/win streaks. It was proven to me definitively for good by a pro on my own account.

who was it

Booms.3952:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

It’s not impossible at all. The problem, like in S2, is it’s going to be hugely influenced by your MMR rather than your factual play skill at that moment.

If you have high MMR you could probably metaphorically sleep on your keyboard and win since you will be given players with the best odds of winning while having to fight players who are clear underdogs (the kind of matches you can win even if you have 1 of your teammate dc).

If you are of low MMR the MM will stack the odds so badly against you any pro players would loose too to what they would have to contend with if they were in your shoes.

The mid MMR zone is where you will have easy and hard matches with the consequence of making win streaks possibly very hard to get and keep going.

The most important factor in any game outcome is, and always will be no matter how godly you are, who the MM pair you with and against. Long story short, the MM still handle very poorly soloquing even if it is by far, at least I think it is, the way the huge majority play the game.

This is true. I had a pro ESL player play on my account, with me watching. He played 6 straight games and was only able to win one. There was zero team support because my mmr is so low. No way even a pro can carry a whole newbie/baddie/low mmr team to victory against ppl on teams w/ high mmrs/wins/win streaks. It was proven to me definitively for good by a pro on my own account.

who was it

Since it’s against the rules to have someone else play on your account (especially in competitive PvP) I think that’s a question better left unanswered.

So can you tank your mmr until you the enemy team is full of amber-playstyle players? So when you actually try you can win?

Or are you just going to be repeatedly placed against the same mmr level teams regardless of how low your mmr is?

I don’t know. I think it’s pretty kittenty that the system punishes people with lower mmr. Why not just match up similar mmr and see who wins? Isn’t that more skill related than forcing people to go against a team that’s theoretically better?

So can you tank your mmr until you the enemy team is full of amber-playstyle players? So when you actually try you can win?

I should hope not. My sense of sportsmanship is utterly offended at such a notion. A player by being on a team has a moral imperative to do what they can to help that team win.

I don’t know. I think it’s pretty kittenty that the system punishes people with lower MMR. Why not just match up similar MMR and see who wins? Isn’t that more skill related than forcing people to go against a team that’s theoretically better?

If a player is bad then their results need to reflect that. Allowing division drops would be a good solution so weak players would have credible chances of winning as they’d be facing each other. People may ask, “Why am I Bronze?” Because you have the technique and game knowledge of a Bronze. “But I did all this great stuff!” You aren’t rated by your best play but by your average play. If I run a race and do a 5:00 minute mile pace for half a mile yet finish at a 6:30 minute mile pace then should I be placed based on if I did my fastest time throughout the race or when I actually crossed the line (i.e., a 6:30 minute mile pace)?

I don’t feel like personal MMR changes mean anything in regards to your opponents. I’ve had 9 game loss streaks in high ruby where it was vs mostly the same mix of pro players. My opponents are literally RNG most of the time with some of them that die in 3 seconds or really high level players that are way better than me.

With 200 matches approx I can say with certainty that my experience is the same -> S2 rather than S1, my opponents are not based on my MMR or I wouldn’t get 500-0 wins/losses.

I don’t understand what they did to ‘take both seasons’ matchmaking into account because right now I only see the exact same thing as season 2.

So about that matchmaking balance… as i said before….2-3 out of 4 matches for me are like this: http://i.imgur.com/ST4SHtE.jpg

For me, this season is a kittentier version of season 1..nothing more. They took everything bad about season 1, everything bad about seasons 2 and that’s how season 3 was created.