Guild Wars 2

Ok look, I want to be honest.
Guild Wars 2 Player vs. Player is fun to play. It is the best at the moment but it is so underdeveloped when there is this giant monster called World vs. World.

World vs. World is fun and all. But if anything, it is killing every thing that could have been devoted to making PvP better in this game.

1. Designers
They are making Edge of the Mists, which is a very large WvW map. This new map is coming out this year. It took away designers that could have been deployed to make new PvP maps or improve existing ones (looks at Skyhammer)

Speaking of which, we’ve never heard about ANYTHING about new maps or upcoming game modes after Skyhammer. Are they being worked on, or the developers simply cannot do more than making empty promises saying “there will be new game modes” after 1.5 years of the game release?

2. Balance
I need to talk about the balance, but essentially a quick example~when PvP players complain about AoE being faceroll-strong WvW players whine about AoE not being strong enough to kill mindless zergs. HOW are you going to balance this game at all if people are completely asking for opposite balance changes???

3. Community focus
It is being taken away and distracted. Josh “Grouch” Davis is now being moved to the WvW forums as its new director.

I’m not saying it is a bad thing, yes alright, it is definitely a good thing for WvW crowds because Josh really knows how to improve this game. As you know, WvW has been even less improved than PvP. Players there are even less satisfied than we are.

WHY did this game have to make this WvW mode out of thin power is completely beyond me, but when one of our most talented community coordinator can no longer focus his attention on PvP——which is the soul of Guild Wars 2 e-sports~~~~I don’t know what future holds for us. Or if there can be any future. At all.

When there is so many other places to waste a HUGE amount of ArenaNet’s hard-earned money on~~Living Stories, World vs. World, Gem Store~~I don’t know how much could be left at all to even do any PvP stuffs.
We should feel really lucky they even bothered to add a new glory vendor on Dec. 10th, 2013….

It is not WvW killing or hurting sPvP per se, neither is it PvE.
The real issue lies in the decisions made by the developers.
They brought in so many changes many people over the whole game were not screaming for. Ascended Gear ? Seasons ?
I think these are really the flaws:

• Common balance: Skills and traits have various ranges, cool-downs, effects, etc. There are various different factors playing a role for taking one skill or trait over the other. Some stuff is more suited for PvE, some is more suited for WvW, some is more suited for sPvP. Trying to balance one will possibly bring imbalance to the other. There is no excuse for no split balance since there are cries of frustration from PvE- and WvW-players too.
  Also, balance goes from top to bottom. Can’t be emphasized enough for a competitive game type. (So balance is most crucial if there is a “broken” thing dominating all other options at highest level of play)

• Homogenization of PvE, WvW, sPvP: Keep them still seperate, no unlocks, this will just destroy sPvP even further. Saying that the game will be overwhelming for new players, well, excuse me, every new game for them can be. Instead bring in variety and let them learn more. Have them have to play differently and learn something new in sPvP. I mean, it basically screams of less variety.
  Give them a better tutorial. This is the real issue. They just jump in and do not know how to trait, what the npcs do in the mists and what the offer, what the locker is, how effects work, etc.. The initial tutorial (in each starting zone) is just as bad to be fair.

• Lowering of skill ceiling: A good, competitive game has a high amount of complexity and a high amount of skill involved at high levels. There is still a difference but what they did with each consecutive big change to sPvP was lowering the ceiling.
  They first locked weapon-sets and later on utility slots. It was not so bad per se, but the biggest issue came really last year with the changes to Necromancers and Warriors. These changes were not wanted. Dhuumfire ? Berserker Stance ? Healing Signet ?
  How can these things (among some others) be skillful ? How is it skillful to not be challenged by every decision in a much shorter time frame ? They just made it easier to make rewarding decisions and these decisions see even high-level play which makes it even more sad.
  It just slowed down too much.

• Lack of proper feedback: Still no open PTR. This is bad. Most of us cannot get in contact with the developers either (I understand it partially since the forums tend to be somewhat toxic from time to time) and have a transparent and reasonable discussion. Veteran players used to give really good recommendations but they were not listened to.

• eSports: It is never company-driven, it is player-driven. The developers just give the tools to allow a growth of playerbase and most importantly competition. Everything else is up to the players. Listen to them or there won’t be esports and it would be very beneficial for the good of the players to let them know that the plan about esports is ditched then.

I have come to the conclusion to wait and see if they will have a change of mind with their current work-ethic since the changes they implement are not really innovative nor are they very polished and more so half-baked. There are better solutions from player feedback in all honesty since they are the ones playing much more and more thoroughly while a developer has to spend their time on coding and designing.
If nothing crucial happens, I will also take my leave since I cannot support this company anymore then.

More people play WvW because it’s actually fun.

I can zerg around in a large group or I can go solo/small group tactics. I have the freedom to create whatever builds I choose, and I’m not be held back by gear. I don’t have to worry about standing is small circles for long periods of time. I can also work on PvE goals while I PvP.

It’s just a better gamemode.

Sari.9836:

• Common balance: Skills and traits have various ranges, cool-downs, effects, etc. There are various different factors playing a role for taking one skill or trait over the other. Some stuff is more suited for PvE, some is more suited for WvW, some is more suited for sPvP. Trying to balance one will possibly bring imbalance to the other. There is no excuse for no split balance since there are cries of frustration from PvE- and WvW-players too.

imo anet’s position to keep skills common between pve/spvp/wvw, while, where unavoidable, only allowing numbers tweaking is a golden middle and a must for mmo pvp. else game will disintegrate in three separate parts joined by name and logo only. three game modes are already quite separate in gear, leveling. they differ in many stats and now in quite a few skills. they differ in location. the only thing that still gives mmo rp experience is character skills.

if you want dedicated pvp balance you need to go moba this days. not that it’s better balanced, but to many it will appear so.

I agree with mobas, gesho, but there are other genres as well.
The point about anet’s position, no.
I think while it may be overwhelming at first, it brings in variety and allows a slightly difference experience. It opens up more playstyles.
The issue with balance as for now is however that the balance changes from last year’s summer were just incredibly horrible for the competitive aspect of the game. I feel it was due to a buff for condition builds in either WvW or PvE (no blame to the players here).
I really just wanto to see a sincere stance from Anet with the last remaining veterans and a clarification on the direction of further changes. So far, there has been a lot of neglect or flawed communication. So if things are clarified, players can either play or leave depending on the information.

Yeah i only play pvp but devs actually took time away from pvp to make something for another game mode but i only pvp so wtf Anet? I am paying customer

Esports

@OP WvW is taking up the debs time? What about the LS content every two weeks? Nope its obviously WvWs fault.

Sari.9836:

• Lack of proper feedback: Still no open PTR. This is bad. Most of us cannot get in contact with the developers either (I understand it partially since the forums tend to be somewhat toxic from time to time) and have a transparent and reasonable discussion. Veteran players used to give really good recommendations but they were not listened to.

Well, there is a closed PTR. Anet just doesn’t listen to any of the feedback given from the players on it.

Sari.9836:

It is not WvW killing or hurting sPvP per se, neither is it PvE.
The real issue lies in the decisions made by the developers.
They brought in so many changes many people over the whole game were not screaming for. Ascended Gear ? Seasons ?
I think these are really the flaws:

• Common balance:
• Homogenization of PvE, WvW, sPvP: * Lowering of skill ceiling: A good, competitive game has a high amount of complexity and a high amount of skill involved at high levels. There is still a difference but what they did with each consecutive big change to sPvP was lowering the ceiling.
• Lack of proper feedback:
• eSports:

Hit the nail on the head.

They are making changes/advancements that you might consider ‘late stage’.

Adding ongoing pve saga content, seasons/ladders for pvp, ranking, trying to push for esports is all stuff you might be doing to a game in it’s adolescent years. None of that is any good if the foundation work isn’t sound. And the state of pvp is far from good enough to start expanding into new territory like this.

Focus on balance and new game modes so people are at least having fun on a basic level then look for new ways to challenge them.

That being said, while it is probably too early to be looking at the kinds of changes they are making, it is also way too late to just start to look at some serious balancing. I think even if they unveiled huge sweeping class reworks tomorrow it’d be too late for most to turn things around.

Hype killed gw2 pvp. If they wouldn’t have hyped it so much and steadily built on it. Things would have been much better even without any additional development.

@NewTrain
I know and it is called Alpha if my memory serves right.
There have been posts on reddit about people involved in it as well.

@ azurzephyr
Yes, I consider the changes may come too late.
I still think though they should just revert changes on skills like berserker stance or diamond skin as well as traits like dhuumfire.

@ butch
Yup and this is why there are so many frustrated players which kept playing on that promise.

Kinda sucks Grouch is moving to WvW if that’s true. I actually care more about that then anything else from that list.

Sari.9836:

I agree with mobas, gesho, but there are other genres as well.
The point about anet’s position, no.
I think while it may be overwhelming at first, it brings in variety and allows a slightly difference experience. It opens up more playstyles.
The issue with balance as for now is however that the balance changes from last year’s summer were just incredibly horrible for the competitive aspect of the game. I feel it was due to a buff for condition builds in either WvW or PvE (no blame to the players here).
I really just wanto to see a sincere stance from Anet with the last remaining veterans and a clarification on the direction of further changes. So far, there has been a lot of neglect or flawed communication. So if things are clarified, players can either play or leave depending on the information.

its not so much complexity of divided game (which is an issue), but rather your point essentially reduces to rejecting the genre of mmo with multiple modes, single game having pve/spvp/openWorldPvp aspects. if those are separate locations, separate gear and then also separate spells, what is the idea of single game? just being slapped under single brand of “gw2”? what do you share across modes? friends list? gold? interface? in times of twitter and skype that’s non-issue.

i believe elder scrolls are doing just that, separate pve game and now separate ESonline for wvw. or better yet (and more genuinely) one can play LoL separate and elder scrolls pve separate, there you have two separate games.

imo balance is not that much of an downer, it’s still playable. on the other hand, i dont think separation of game modes helps it that much either (mobas? not better at balance). there will always be issues of team vs 1v1 balance, casual newbie vs highend skill-cap tier balance, capture vs dueling balance, etc, etc.

i think overall gw2 has it right. there are some issues, but they are known (healing sig, spirit ranger elite) and in pipeline for fixing.

So PvP should get new maps but when WvW gets a new map it’s unacceptable

They are trying to attract WvW players to PvP by providing the most efficient and fun way to level a character to 80 (exp scrolls) and by allocating some of the staff of PvP to care for WvW a little bit. These 2 being the only PvP game modes in the game at the moment it makes sense to try to mix population a bit to bring more people to PvP.

Sari.9836:

@NewTrain
I know and it is called Alpha if my memory serves right.
There have been posts on reddit about people involved in it as well.

Yup. Correct.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the reddit posts are from the same people I’ve spoken to.

Josh is still apart of the pvp team and balance team they just added him to the wvw team. I dont really know how thats gonna work out considering thats a lot for one person to handle.

But PVE is really the mode taking away resources from pvp and wvw alike

Guys—this thread comes up every few days in the WvW forum, except the other way around. It’s not a sign of a healthy community. Don’t become the WvW community.

Ferik.3127:

1. Designers
They are making Edge of the Mists, which is a very large WvW map. This new map is coming out this year. It took away designers that could have been deployed to make new PvP maps or improve existing ones (looks at Skyhammer)

Speaking of which, we’ve never heard about ANYTHING about new maps or upcoming game modes after Skyhammer. Are they being worked on, or the developers simply cannot do more than making empty promises saying “there will be new game modes” after 1.5 years of the game release?

I am fairly certain I have seen multiple sources discussing new maps, new modes, and the likes for PvP.

Like, multiple sources. A leak from some alpha stuffz (unless everything I have seen was proven false) showed a testing schedule for multiple new game modes, including TDM, king of the hill, and some others I can’t remember off the top of my head.

It was also revealed in a video (never kept up on the news, so no idea if it was fake) at least like 6 new maps for PvP. They were rough unfinished things, but they were in the process of making them…

So unless everything I have seen and heard was fake, they are working on lots of new things.

It makes sense to move more dudes to WvW, after all, even if spvp and WvW are pve sidekicks, atleast WvW is played by a considerable amount of players.
Also their decision making on balance is really weird, meaning, they do most of the balance with spvp in mind when it’s clearly the less played thing, they should balance with pve and WvW in mind.
By the way, it’s been months since anyone in arena.net tried to push the ezports, it was a good idea for the launch, tons of dudes bought the game with the ezports in mind, so it sold a nice amount of units. The bad thing is that the developers believed in it, it’s one thing for gw2 players to believe in advertising “next ezports”, because they know pretty much nothing about games, but for the developers to believe their own advertise… Months were lost trying to balance for spvp and giving away money for tourneys and stuff that nobody watched, i’m quite happy that they scrapped this ezports idea, now they can focus on what works, pve and a bit of wvw.

Baldric.6781:

By the way, it’s been months since anyone in arena.net tried to push the ezports, it was a good idea for the launch, tons of dudes bought the game with the ezports in mind, so it sold a nice amount of units.

there was an explanation, that eSports is under burner for now, they are waiting some features to be added before renewing push. imo this is proper

Its easy to blame wvw when it gets a new map. The first meaningful update since launch.

This is hilarious. Anet absolutely hates WvW. Just refer to the dev griefing the GvG incident.

The map and the bloodlust ruins are/were both additions that were not requested by WvW players. If you look at their layouts, they don’t feel like WvW at all. More like sPvP areas. The suspicion is that Anet wants to introduce WvW players to sPvP by creating more sPvP-like regions in WvW.

dude you cant be real.

just be thankful that Crit isnt getting nerfed in PvP, they r nerfing it in WvW because of some PvE dungeon boss, yeah kitten logic.

Juba.8406:

dude you cant be real.

just be thankful that Crit isnt getting nerfed in PvP, they r nerfing it in WvW because of some PvE dungeon boss, yeah kitten logic.

That’s the drawback of having silly PvE gear and runes, like Dire gear or Perplexity runes.
Not to say that Crit Dmg in WvW is just insane and that the maximum amount achievable on PvP is about 60% with no defensive stat whatsoever.
In PvE/WvW you can have 110% crit damage while having hight toughness and high vitality thanks to valkirye and cavalier, while still having high precision because of the food thingy.

WvW balance flat out sucks. Period.

sorrow.2364:

Juba.8406:

dude you cant be real.

just be thankful that Crit isnt getting nerfed in PvP, they r nerfing it in WvW because of some PvE dungeon boss, yeah kitten logic.

That’s the drawback of having silly PvE gear and runes, like Dire gear or Perplexity runes.
Not to say that Crit Dmg in WvW is just insane and that the maximum amount achievable on PvP is about 60% with no defensive stat whatsoever.
In PvE/WvW you can have 110% crit damage while having hight toughness and high vitality thanks to valkirye and cavalier, while still having high precision because of the food thingy.

WvW balance flat out sucks. Period.

Stats wise is pretty fine
it just requires you to use some more brain to build up your build or fight with other builds … not just picking up braindead amulets.

i dont think perplex is an issue anymore though

sorrow.2364:

WvW balance flat out sucks.

What balance?

Liza.2758:

Stats wise is pretty fine
it just requires you to use some more brain to build up your build or fight with other builds … not just picking up braindead amulets.

i dont think perplex is an issue anymore though

Sure man, “pretty fine”.
That’s why in PvE/WvW you can build having pretty much everything with no drawback whatsoever.

Fixed amulets are there for a reason, not because PvP players are dumb. They are there just to avoid unstoppable warriors with 3000 armor, 50/60+ crit dmg, 2000+ power and 24k HP.
Oh, and of course Thieves spamming interrupts with perplexity runes and dire gear, because, you know, they are not an issue…

And don’t let me even start talking about food buffs and conditions duration.

They followed the customer. The customer decided that WvW was more what they wanted than the developers imagined. Same holds true for PvE.

Frankly, PvP never got the following. That being said, it has the longest tail (meaning you will be playing PvP a bit longer than someone will stick around in PvE).

On the other hand, how do you monetize it? WvW leads to far more gem purchases.
After you buy a game, you need to be a consistent source of revenue too.

Overall, it makes all the sense in the World UNTIL they start to tie PvP into WvW which would make it quite focused. In other words, PvP results should matter to WvW players and that would immediately increase focus.

You know when you compare to game modes and say we want different things you should clarify.

1) aoe damage may be a problem and most people will tell you that lowering the damage would not be a problem. The problem aoe in wvw is the five player hit cap. In tpvp (5v5) you can always apply full aoe pressure on a team. In wvw it could be 5v20 allowing the 20 to apply full pressure and the 5 have there damage limited. So the change we would like would not effect tpvp.

2) yes Josh was given the job of talking to the wvw community, look at the post history by anet on the wvw page and tell me this was not needed?

3) the wvw dev team is separate from tpvp. I don’t see how EoTM “took” people away from spvp.

4) as for class balance we hate condi/bunker too. Also with the ability to gain more stats in wvw we get to see op builds at a maxed out potential. Also maining a necro and mesmer l have eatin more nerfs due to spvp then the other way around.

Lord Kuru.3685:

This is hilarious. Anet absolutely hates WvW. Just refer to the dev griefing the GvG incident.

The map and the bloodlust ruins are/were both additions that were not requested by WvW players. If you look at their layouts, they don’t feel like WvW at all. More like sPvP areas. The suspicion is that Anet wants to introduce WvW players to sPvP by creating more sPvP-like regions in WvW.

That dev incident may be the only reason why WvW is getting any love at all.

WvW is not getting “too much” attention. PvE is.

The main reason they are pushing EoTM is because they are going to launch in China where WvW queues will make NA tier 1 look like a ghost town.

Lol what have you been smoking? Wvw is almost as ignored as dungeons, and that’s saying a lot.
In case you haven’t heard it before:
They don’t balance the game around wvw
The only time they have ever changed something for wvw balance was the nerf to runes of perplexity.
GG troll thread.

Brando.1374:

Lord Kuru.3685:

This is hilarious. Anet absolutely hates WvW. Just refer to the dev griefing the GvG incident.

The map and the bloodlust ruins are/were both additions that were not requested by WvW players. If you look at their layouts, they don’t feel like WvW at all. More like sPvP areas. The suspicion is that Anet wants to introduce WvW players to sPvP by creating more sPvP-like regions in WvW.

That dev incident may be the only reason why WvW is getting any love at all.

I think this is definitely true. The outrage from this incident was enormous. It pretty much forced Anet to do something for WvW (though in the end EoTM is not something that most WvW players want).

sorrow.2364:

WvW balance flat out sucks. Period.

Of course. That’s because Anet balances with only sPvP in mind.

Juba.8406:

dude you cant be real.

just be thankful that Crit isnt getting nerfed in PvP, they r nerfing it in WvW because of some PvE dungeon boss, yeah kitten logic.

nah its because in wvw, the crit potential is higher than in spvp. there is soo many things that scale dmg way better in wvw. foodbuffs, ascended gear, guard leech, bloodlust buff. if u meet a glassthief there, he can easily crit u for 11-13k if u are a light armor. there is people running around with 105% crit dmg. what people dont understand is that devs mainly balance wvw around spvp.
the problem there is that every buff u do in spvp will make a big difference in wvw. the for example immobilize stacking and all cc buffs for war…they turned war into spvp dominat class, but this change turned the warrior into a beast in wvw. the healing signet buff created some almost unkillable warriors out there, etc.
so a wvw player might aswell could say that spvp destroys wvw.
thanks to spvp the mesmers in wvw are now veilbots, because everything else they had got nerfed to the ground.

Lord Kuru.3685:

Brando.1374:

Lord Kuru.3685:

This is hilarious. Anet absolutely hates WvW. Just refer to the dev griefing the GvG incident.

The map and the bloodlust ruins are/were both additions that were not requested by WvW players. If you look at their layouts, they don’t feel like WvW at all. More like sPvP areas. The suspicion is that Anet wants to introduce WvW players to sPvP by creating more sPvP-like regions in WvW.

That dev incident may be the only reason why WvW is getting any love at all.

I think this is definitely true. The outrage from this incident was enormous. It pretty much forced Anet to do something for WvW (though in the end EoTM is not something that most WvW players want).

yup too much pve in that imo. nice looking map though, but not something my guild would play.

sorrow.2364:

Fixed amulets are there for a reason, not because PvP players are dumb. They are there just to avoid unstoppable warriors with 3000 armor, 50/60+ crit dmg, 2000+ power and 24k HP.

Uh… add more power and you can easily get that on a warrior in pvp… I know I have one.

Instead of making a “balanced playing field” gearing issues hold back a lot of builds that can utilize a diverse gear set. For example I absolutely love my d/d ele in wvw but would never play it in spvp simply because its impossible to get adequate stats. What it does do is make classes with high baseline stats (i.e. warriors) ridiculously dominant.

@OP: This is the worst post ever. WvW has gotten basically nothing in a year. Some new ranks that no one wanted? A league that was a bad idea?

PvP has gotten 3 new maps in the same time period.

The better question is why hasn’t WvW gotten more than PvP given that it is more popular than PvP?

Lord Kuru.3685:

Of course. That’s because Anet balances with only sPvP in mind.

No, because WvW uses PvE stuffs and PvE balance, not because ANet balances with sPvP in mind.

gpassucc.5961:

Uh… add more power and you can easily get that on a warrior in pvp… I know I have one.

Instead of making a “balanced playing field” gearing issues hold back a lot of builds that can utilize a diverse gear set. For example I absolutely love my d/d ele in wvw but would never play it in spvp simply because its impossible to get adequate stats. What it does do is make classes with high baseline stats (i.e. warriors) ridiculously dominant.

You simply can’t get that situation in PvP. I dare you to make a screenshot with these kind of stats in PvP.

D/D ele is viable in WvW just because of the sharpening stones, otherwise it would be completely and utterly useless.

Warriors were not dominant before the buffs, while they still were extremely strong in WvW, so your point doesn’t make that much sense. PvP is not about tankiness as much as WvW.

style.6173:

@OP: This is the worst post ever. WvW has gotten basically nothing in a year. Some new ranks that no one wanted? A league that was a bad idea?

PvP has gotten 3 new maps in the same time period.

The better question is why hasn’t WvW gotten more than PvP given that it is more popular than PvP?

PvP had 3 new maps, which 2 of them flat out suck and aren’t used in tPvP.
Other than that, we’ve seen a leaderboard that barely works and a SoloQ plagued with leavers and bad matchmaking and after a whole year, a NPC that sells useless skins at insane prices for a dedicated PvP player and Tome of Knowledge to level up characters in PvP and finally some ways to make gold, whose ways went away along with the Winterstay Gift glory vendor.

WvW had all of the new gear coming from PvE updates including new runes, new stat combos and new skins, WvW ranks, WvW perks, season one, Bloodlust buff, Obsidian Sanctum arena and new Badge vendors.

PvP isn’t unpopular because it is bad, it is unpopular because it has so little features that only dedicated players care about. A PvE/WvW dude will do PvP only if he can use its PvE skins and make gold out of it. In fact, it is not a casualty that PvP population went skyrocketed when they added a profitable way to make gold in PvP.

sorrow.2364:

A PvE/WvW dude will do PvP only if he can use its PvE skins and make gold out of it. In fact, it is not a casualty that PvP population went skyrocketed when they added a profitable way to make gold in PvP.

The PvP population skyrocketed? Since when? Every day I see less and less people in the mists, last time I ran through it there was like 5 people there in the middle of primetime, lol. That’s far, far less than a year ago.

Its just to face facts – GW2 PvP is boring. Its not bad per say and tbh I think the balance between the classes with the more “moderate” stat builds are far better than the inflated PvE/WvW stats but its still a Sumo wrestling match, literally. And not many people find that fun in the long run.

WvW isnt going to kill PvP, Anet are killing it perfectly fine themselves without WvW getting in the way. Personally I think that it should be about actual PvP. Not trying to knock out your opponent from a ring to win.

It’s like nobody here watches the Dev’s Ready Up livestreams. This year, Anet is coming out with new Pvp maps and modes…

Dawdler.8521:

The PvP population skyrocketed? Since when? Every day I see less and less people in the mists, last time I ran through it there was like 5 people there in the middle of primetime, lol. That’s far, far less than a year ago.

Its just to face facts – GW2 PvP is boring. Its not bad per say and tbh I think the balance between the classes with the more “moderate” stat builds are far better than the inflated PvE/WvW stats but its still a Sumo wrestling match, literally. And not many people find that fun in the long run.

WvW isnt going to kill PvP, Anet are killing it perfectly fine themselves without WvW getting in the way. Personally I think that it should be about actual PvP. Not trying to knock out your opponent from a ring to win.

Yes, it did.
Queue time went from minutes long to almost instant.
PvP population isn’t based only off the lobby popularity anyway.

About the PvP fact, being only simple PvP will get boring extremely fast and will create a lot of frustrations, since some professions are designed to be a pain in the kitten to fight against in a simple deathmatch mode.
And, by the way, you don’t just win by knocking out someone off a node if he just walks in right after. You have to fight sometimes and the node is there just to not make professions with insane escapes (see Thief) extremely frustrating to fight against, it is something that forces people to play risky in order to win.

Ferik.3127:

Ok look, I want to be honest.
Guild Wars 2 Player vs. Player is fun to play. It is the best at the moment but it is so underdeveloped when there is this giant monster called World vs. World.

World vs. World is fun and all. But if anything, it is killing every thing that could have been devoted to making PvP better in this game.

Sure, honesty is good, but I think you concerns are misplaced.

1. Designers
They are making Edge of the Mists, which is a very large WvW map. This new map is coming out this year. It took away designers that could have been deployed to make new PvP maps or improve existing ones (looks at Skyhammer)

Speaking of which, we’ve never heard about ANYTHING about new maps or upcoming game modes after Skyhammer. Are they being worked on, or the developers simply cannot do more than making empty promises saying “there will be new game modes” after 1.5 years of the game release?

I would guess that map designers are a completly different role to mode designers – in which the fundamental point is balence (lol) rather than map design.

That being said, EOTM is sort of required, the current setup of WVW. For most players, you are either on a lower tier server (not active) or on an active server which you have to deal with queues. If you sign in and have to wait for queues constantly, a lot of people get fed up and stop playing. This is bad for anet.

WVW has seen very little content updates since release. The major one – the map changes, were hated by large numbers of people as they basically added a spvp map into the middle of wvw. Ranks were added, but again that was another ‘wtf are you doing this anet’ when most of them are blatent power creep while in reality provided no content change. PVP has seen far more focus and updates, even if many of those are misguided.

2. Balance
I need to talk about the balance, but essentially a quick example~when PvP players complain about AoE being faceroll-strong WvW players whine about AoE not being strong enough to kill mindless zergs. HOW are you going to balance this game at all if people are completely asking for opposite balance changes???

The game is balenced fully around pvp. WVW means nothing in terms of balence. I cannot think of a single balence change since release that was designed for wvw. The only minor exception was changing retal/confusion to their pvp levels instead of wvw levels in wvw, which was obviously required from the start – and worse was bugged for months and different maps did different amount of damage. gg testers.

I don’t think it’s fair to complain, in any sense, about wvw impacting balence.

Also for what it’s worth, the complaints about AOE are often tied to AOE being limited to 5 people rather than the strength of the skill.

3. Community focus
It is being taken away and distracted. Josh “Grouch” Davis is now being moved to the WvW forums as its new director.

I’m not saying it is a bad thing, yes alright, it is definitely a good thing for WvW crowds because Josh really knows how to improve this game. As you know, WvW has been even less improved than PvP. Players there are even less satisfied than we are.

Are you aware that the pvp forums were the only forums with any developer response for a long time? Other than small comments or casual remarks in pvp forums?

Are you aware the only dev who ever responded to wvw forums was Devon, who seems to have dissapeared, the majority of the time there was nothing?

Are you actually aware of how favored pvp is over other game modes on these forums? Grouch expanding to other sets isn’t a bad thing, especially when these forums have such little activity now. It’s not like it matters, half the posts from dev’s are pointless or full of mistakes anyway…

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In all respect, I have to ask, don’t you think your post and concerns are a little biased? PVP is not doing well, a lot of that is from decisions made by developers rather than focus from wvw/pve. I don’t anet make much, if any, money from the current state of pvp – yet every other game mode has to deal with the amount of attention given to esports and lack of actual balance again due to esports.

In reality, most of the points you said could be said on the wvw forum about pvp. The problem is decisions made by developers – you don’t have to take a team of wvw to fix healing signet. You don’t have to stop living story for a month to realize the dumbfire patch really messed up balance. But if you continue to allow the resources allocated to make the same mistakes over and over again, then your problem is far more concerning than what this post is referencing.

So yeah… please less ill informed threads pointing fingers at wrong thing and more telling anet to get their act together.

What?

Did I just read…. that WvW gets more attention than SPvP?

LOL!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!LL!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!L!

Wow.

I wish I played the same game as you, where WvW actually got attention.

The same game as you, where the player based doesn’t get ignored since launch.

Where the community backed ideas and suggestions and fixes get put into the game.

A version of GW2 where the emphasis isn’t on the gem store and PvE carrots.

That must be a good version of GW2 you’re playing, I’d definitely pay to play it.

The real enemy is PvE. Are you even aware?

sorrow.2364:

And, by the way, you don’t just win by knocking out someone off a node if he just walks in right after. You have to fight sometimes and the node is there just to not make professions with insane escapes (see Thief) extremely frustrating to fight against, it is something that forces people to play risky in order to win.

No, the node is there to make professions with insane tanking skills (see any bunker) extremely frustrating to fight against, its something that forces people to play bunker in order to win.

IMO Anet tried to make their version of Conquest (ie Battlefield) and its just bad. The zones are too small, the one-guy-block-all method of gaining control is crap, maps are too compressed, 3 caps for 10 guys is 1 too many to actually create decent group PvP as the main tactics is to gather everyone on one contested point whiling avoiding and recapping the other two, 3 caps for 16 guys is 1 too few instead.

The map with the protected keep lord you can kill is kind of a decent idea (better than the two fairly pointless bosses) and bring something in addition to the stale capping zones (not to mention that map also has the larger central zone for quite epic battles, another unique feature) but even there they managed to fail on the balancing for the worth of the keep lord, its ridiculous that a team can win a landslide victory by loosing for a large part of the round. Its the only map that actually try to somewhat follow the philosophy of having a clear line of battle rather than circle capping.

But then again what do I care, I’ll just play WvW while the love of developers rain down upon me and they fix everything that’s wrong with it by using the PvP team.

Harbinger.8637:

More people play WvW because it’s actually fun.

I can zerg around in a large group or I can go solo/small group tactics. I have the freedom to create whatever builds I choose, and I’m not be held back by gear. I don’t have to worry about standing is small circles for long periods of time. I can also work on PvE goals while I PvP.

It’s just a better gamemode.

It would definitely be the better pvp mode if it had the same balance spvp does.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Guys—this thread comes up every few days in the WvW forum, except the other way around. It’s not a sign of a healthy community. Don’t become the WvW community.

Except it’s actually kind a true that way.
If Anet has poured resources and focus into anything, it’s instanced PvP.

It kinda flopped and the whole games funding is folding (short of PvE a lil) but yeah, devs deffinitely thought of WvW as a secondary or shenanigans mode so mostly ignored it.