Guild Wars 2

Yes, the title says it all.

What is your ideal meta or a meta you would like to see happen? Are you waiting for the demise of the faceroll necros and spirit rangers? Or are you happy with the current meta? (Lol).

My ideal version of the meta, would be equality between power and conditions. Making both powerful, if built for it.
I would also like to add in that limited/reduced CC spam and stealth spam wouldn’t hurt either.

My favorite meta was when haste was 100% good times Time warp was a game changer warriors with haste ware beasts thief’s also it had much more intensity.
Now we got pointless condi spam I really don’t think anyone likes it.

Glass power everything.

There should be no classes that have 1 killer build that pwns all the others(like the OP rangers atm). Also if all the classes were well balanced there should be at least 2 builds for each class that are played by a lot of players instead of having classes where in 90 percent of cases only 1 build is played(like rangers 90 percent with spirits atm).

Then it’s good.

dreztina.4820:

Glass power everything.

Sounds like it could be fun in theory. But everyone would just be 1-shotting everything. It would get old quick lol

Achilles.2197:

dreztina.4820:

Glass power everything.

Sounds like it could be fun in theory. But everyone would just be 1-shotting everything. It would get old quick lol

Not really. Every class has dodges, invulnerabilities, blocks, etc. that allows them to avoid a very large number of attacks if used properly. If everyone were glass power, how long a fight lasted would be determined by how good the players were, rather than by their build.

dreztina.4820:

Achilles.2197:

dreztina.4820:

Glass power everything.

Sounds like it could be fun in theory. But everyone would just be 1-shotting everything. It would get old quick lol

Not really. Every class has dodges, invulnerabilities, blocks, etc. that allows them to avoid a very large number of attacks if used properly. If everyone were glass power, how long a fight lasted would be determined by how good the players were, rather than by their build.

Wouldn’t one glass thief backstab crit insta-down a glass ele? No recovery from that :/

My ideal meta is when there is no profession with incredibly high damage, neither condition or power.

In my ideal meta, raw damage can’t kill a thing without the pressure provided by conditions, while conditions can’t kill a player without raw damage.

In my ideal meta, strong skills are slow and highly telegraphed and all professions have access to tools to interrupt them.

In my ideal meta, you can drop a guardian to take another profession as a bunker.

In my ideal meta, CCs are short-lasting but with low cooldowns, pretty much like thief’s headshot. Every profession should have access to one or two long-lasting CCs at best on high cooldown.

In my ideal meta, if I want to play burst damage, I’m not forced to pick either a Mesmer or a Thief and if I want to play conditions, I’m not forced to pick a Necro, or a Engineer or a Ranger.

Glass-cannon power meta is as unhealthy as much as condition meta. It is stupid and skill-less on the offensive side and some professions with high evasion access have obvious advantages.

I think any decent player would want a glass power meta.

Unfortunately it’s also the least forgiving for new players, so there’s the dilemma of how to attract new players that won’t QQ after being one-shotted.

This is pretty much the situation as I’m aware; it was certainly how they justified the quickness nerf to the pvp crowd.

sorrow.2364:

My ideal meta is when there is no profession with incredibly high damage, neither condition or power.

In my ideal meta, raw damage can’t kill a thing without the pressure provided by conditions, while conditions can’t kill a player without raw damage.

In my ideal meta, strong skills are slow and highly telegraphed and all professions have access to tools to interrupt them.

In my ideal meta, you can drop a guardian to take another profession as a bunker.

In my ideal meta, CCs are short-lasting but with low cooldowns, pretty much like thief’s headshot. Every profession should have access to one or two long-lasting CCs at best on high cooldown.

In my ideal meta, if I want to play burst damage, I’m not forced to pick either a Mesmer or a Thief and if I want to play conditions, I’m not forced to pick a Necro, or a Engineer or a Ranger.

I agree with a lot of what you just said (most of it actually). The only 2 things I disagree with are in regards to interrupts and necros/conditions. I do not think every class should have easy access to interrupts, they should be centralized around mesmers (and if you ever played GW1, mesmers were the definition of interrupts). Mesmers in pvp were renowned for their skills at interrupting. You had to time your interrupts on key skills. It was all about precision. It was a very skilled role.

As for what you said about necros/conditions, well, necros have also been known for their inherent affinity towards condition control. They should have better incentives for using them/controlling them.

Other than that, HUGE +1

Edit: had to spellcheck

Achilles.2197:

I agree with a lot of what you just said (most of it actually). The only 2 things I disagree with are in regards to interrupts and necros/conditions. I do not think every class should have easy access to interrupts, they should be centralized around mesmers (and if you ever played GW1, mesmers were the definition of interrupts). Mesmers in pvp were renowned for their skills at interrupting. You had to time your interrupts on key skills. It was all about precision. It was a very skilled role.

As for what you said about necros/conditions, well, necros have also been known for their inherent affinity towards condition control. They should have better incentives for using them/controlling them.

Other than that, HUGE +1

Edit: had to spellcheck

Well, to be honest, if you notice, right now pretty much every profession have access to interrupts.
They just need to encourage CCs to work more as interrupts than as stunlocks, since interrupts encourages skillplay and gives depth to the game, compared to raw stunlocks.

Of course Necros are better at condition control, but this doesn’t mean they should be better at conditions overall. Condition control is a different thing, it’s not always tied to condition builds.
A Necromancer is capable to have awesome condition control also with 0 condition damage. Just take Plague Signet, Well of Power, Dagger offhand (Deathly Swarm) or staff (Putrid Mark) and you have condition control with no need of condition damage.

What if they gave rangers their superior interrupting abilities back? That could be interesting. Dshot, anyone?

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

On the small scale there is a meta.

Significantly reduce the damage for power and making condition builds actually require something more than hitting a button. I think something like the ranger’s shortbow where you have to be position in the or hit your attack in a specific manner or location to trigger them but make the damage higher to compensate for the amount of work require.

ADDED:The point being that the main mode of damage would be power, but players can focus on critical or conditional damage.

Or introduce skills passive abilities that are only achievable for reaching a specific crit, power, vitality, toughness or condition damage threshold.

Introduce global cool downs to minimize the amount of button spamming certain classes have for all skills other than skill 1 for each weapon.

Increase animation time for all high power skills so that the oponent actually has enough time to interupt puts the skill on a 10 second CD.

Nuka Cola.8520:

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

Another useless suggestion from Nuka Cola. This is about using improving the current system not building a time machine.

sorrow.2364:

My ideal meta is when there is no profession with incredibly high damage, neither condition or power.

In my ideal meta, raw damage can’t kill a thing without the pressure provided by conditions, while conditions can’t kill a player without raw damage.

In my ideal meta, strong skills are slow and highly telegraphed and all professions have access to tools to interrupt them.

In my ideal meta, you can drop a guardian to take another profession as a bunker.

In my ideal meta, CCs are short-lasting but with low cooldowns, pretty much like thief’s headshot. Every profession should have access to one or two long-lasting CCs at best on high cooldown.

In my ideal meta, if I want to play burst damage, I’m not forced to pick either a Mesmer or a Thief and if I want to play conditions, I’m not forced to pick a Necro, or a Engineer or a Ranger.

Just this…. Its long time i feel like the game needs a global tone down, not a boost anywhere.
AoE needs a serious reduction, i’m ok with them being strong, but its not ok at all for them to be so much available on short CDs. They should definitely be “Strong Skills” so that → “In my ideal meta, strong skills are slow and highly telegraphed and all professions have access to tools to interrupt them.”

I would be really glad to see a gameplay more oriented to interrupting the right skill and using the right skill at the right time rather than spamming everything is off CDs.

I would prefer conditions to be just a support to damage, not a source of damage itself.

Direct damage is just…damaging you, while condition spam puts pressure on you (and the whole team cause usually they are AoE) and ALSO dmg.

I would just take condition damage away actually, cause….why if i light you up my flames should hurt more than someone else fire ?
Conditions should be something to use at the right time aswell, so i would reduce access to them, in matter of quantity and rate of fire (CDs), in trade for some stronger but more meaningfull effects.
Like I would take away poison dmg, but make its effect of reducing heals stronger, like 50% reduction.
I would bring back confusion damage, with the chance of applying more stacks in a short timeframe but having a short duration and a decent CD on this action.

and more…..

I know i’m being quite radical on some changes but i’m sure this will never happen, but still i hope in some changes in the right direction.

It’s ridiculous how many of us share the same ideal meta, and have been praising those ideas non-stop since release, yet the meta has only moved further away.

I want glass to be high risk high reward (which it really isn’t right now)

Steady Damage including condi to be the middle of the road where they exist to weaken Enemies down, but it being a spin off, off power for prolonged sustain (as opposed to survivability while doing awesome pew pew condi condi) being a core force for team fight and feasible 1v1 based on out playing another foe.

And bunkers to resist both to be a sturdy body on the battle field something that will still die if they take to much but can turn a fight around with properly timed skills. (Guardians got it right. Ele pre nerf and Rangers where they just consistently out heal burst and sustain. Is not good.)

The ideal meta is one where there are interrupt builds and they are viable.
(i.e when you actually have to pay attention to your opponents)
But this wombo combo game can be fun I guess… who ever gets theirs off first wins..

Multiple, nearly unlimited team composition, consisting of multiple, nearly unlimited build that is fun!

I really loved the game like 3-4 months ago. I would change a few things from that time though. I would nerf engi granades to bring necro back into the game and I would give warrior a passive root skill with a around 1min cd somewhere in one of there trait lines and move boon hate some where to make it more use able.

I agree 100% with Prysin, and mostly with sorrow. I do like the idea of having interrupts on shorter CD’s than long-CC’s, but they shouldn’t be easy to spam. I think that CC should be scarce enough that you save it for the right time, rather than just spam it out to lock-down a target. I would also like to see a 0.5-1s immunity to daze/cc after being cc’d to prevent stun-chains, which are not fun at all.

I think classes should matter. I think each class should excel at something so that teams are forced to make smart choices. I think that team support should be a viable option. I think a team should have to balance taking out a high DPS class vs a class that is going to strengthen the whole team. Right now too many teams are forced into whatever class is OP at the time and there is no place in competitive high level play for a “support” class that actually makes a difference. Multiple builds, multiple classes = multiple strategies and that is what this meta is lacking right now.

Physical damage as the standard.
Condition teams as viable but not typical without a dedicated teams a condition user ended up as more support-damage or became the primary damage only when the rest of the phys team was being hard-walled.
AI users with strong back-point play but significantly diminished power in team fights.
Aoe used to zone people off of points and strong when hitting multiple people but lackluster on an individual level unless it requires melee range/set-up (Dragon’s Tooth).
Banners, Venoms and Aurasharing are again not typical but strong enough to be built around on well plugged in teams.

silvermember.8941:

Significantly reduce the damage for power and making condition builds actually require something more than hitting a button. I think something like the ranger’s shortbow where you have to be position in the or hit your attack in a specific manner or location to trigger them but make the damage higher to compensate for the amount of work require.

ADDED:The point being that the main mode of damage would be power, but players can focus on critical or conditional damage.

Or introduce skills passive abilities that are only achievable for reaching a specific crit, power, vitality, toughness or condition damage threshold.

Introduce global cool downs to minimize the amount of button spamming certain classes have for all skills other than skill 1 for each weapon.

Increase animation time for all high power skills so that the oponent actually has enough time to interupt puts the skill on a 10 second CD.

Nuka Cola.8520:

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

Another useless suggestion from Nuka Cola. This is about using improving the current system not building a time machine.

game has no trinity for strategic spiking, everyone has access to spammish aoe, anet has no idea how to balance and you’re seriously even trying to find an idea to fix the current mess? After this crappy meta is gone, another will be born which is also all about spamming aoe/pets and yay WIN.

Nuka Cola.8520:

silvermember.8941:

Significantly reduce the damage for power and making condition builds actually require something more than hitting a button. I think something like the ranger’s shortbow where you have to be position in the or hit your attack in a specific manner or location to trigger them but make the damage higher to compensate for the amount of work require.

ADDED:The point being that the main mode of damage would be power, but players can focus on critical or conditional damage.

Or introduce skills passive abilities that are only achievable for reaching a specific crit, power, vitality, toughness or condition damage threshold.

Introduce global cool downs to minimize the amount of button spamming certain classes have for all skills other than skill 1 for each weapon.

Increase animation time for all high power skills so that the oponent actually has enough time to interupt puts the skill on a 10 second CD.

Nuka Cola.8520:

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

Another useless suggestion from Nuka Cola. This is about using improving the current system not building a time machine.

game has no trinity for strategic spiking, everyone has access to spammish aoe, anet has no idea how to balance and you’re seriously even trying to find an idea to fix the current mess? After this crappy meta is gone, another will be born which is also all about spamming aoe/pets and yay WIN.

Guild wars 2 has A LOT of fundamental problems, we can all agree on that. We can also agree ARenanet never had any idea how to balance their games. Guild wars 1 certainly wasn’t balance and got progressively more unbalance as time went on.

so really, what was the point of your original comment? Bringing back those classes does absolutely nothing except feed off of your nostalgia. So short of building a time machine your suggestion is useless, they are not going to copy and paste guild wars 1 into 2.

An ideal meta is when there is no meta. Meta’s exist because certain things are percived as superior to others, in a game without a meta, everyone can play how they want and be considered valid.

So… cast bars ? That or rework half of the animations of the game, i think cast bars are cheaper .

Baldric.6781:

So… cast bars ? That or rework half of the animations of the game, i think cast bars are cheaper .

I believe a strong portion of reasoning behind the absence of cast bars were in GW1 many players were glued to watching the bars instead of enjoying the action. This was especially true for mesmers

I can’t give an exact example, but more of a system. If amulets are kept as they are (aka no new combinations), then damage should be reworked to match ideal time to kill based on the offensive AND defensive stat investments.

Let’s say that a berserkers geared, full direct damage builds ideal time to kill is 10 seconds. That then should be the fastest time to kill. Following should be a series of calculations to determine what amulets provide what bonuses and the times to kill for each of them.

For instance, now take a rabid build. Well, conditions are direct damage, and damage over time. They are stronger in that sense than direct damage, which is mitigated through toughness, evaded, or dealt with through invulnerability. So, the time to kill should be calculated as longer, but equate to a higher sustained pressure damage if the target allows itself to have stacks built onto itself.

Then, we have to account for toughness being a defensive stat. Since 100 toughness roughly equates to be like a 3-4% damage reduction, then a rabid amulet provides about a 20% direct damage reduction. Now let’s combine everything. Let’s say, condition damage at full stacks also takes 10s to kill, but it takes an addition 10s to reach full stacks, so 20s total. However, because it’s constantly stacking and doing more damage, instead of being 20s in actuality, it’s probably more like 15-16s. Then, factor in the toughness, and take the fastest time to kill in the game of 10s, and add 20% to compensate for rabid having that defense that berserkers don’t, meaning for rabid, 12s full stack kill, 10 more seconds to stack, actual time to kill, 17-18s.

That’s just an example, but that would be the base starting point that is needed. If spam to win skill styles are kept, than their damage needs to be reduced so that the pace of the game slows down and more skill is required in damaging your opponent in more opportune manners that don’t rely so heavily on blowing all cooldowns, sometimes in a particular order, and things melting.

I’d like more active counterplay to conditions and CC.

Tough, survivable conditions builds need have a drawback.

An idea might be that any Active condition removal also makes you invulnerable to any removed condition types for a small period of time (3 seconds?). Would have to make sure that everyone had access to Active removal (eg. Rangers).

Similarly, any stun break should make you invulnerable to stun for a short period of time.

Another idea would be to have Power provide mitigation to condition damage.

In this way, power builds could be a counter to condition builds, while the toughness of condition builds is a counter to Power builds.

It’s pretty easy.

A meta with:

- Cond damage e DD damage balanced
- no evade skills + perma vigor
- no CC lock
- less Aoe Damage
- no auto ress spell
- AoE Stealth no so long (SR and Combo field Stealth)
- less passive benefits
- less IA and more control on pets
- no stupid elite like MoA
- no stupid mechanical

And i really like the idea about new combo fields that generate strong aoe effects between two or more classes instead of single aoe spells for every classes, this would promote cooperation between classes instead of “In combat i think only for myself to survive and to kill” Main Theme.

Tracker.6483:

Another idea would be to have Power provide mitigation to condition damage.

Crit bonus + vulnerability counters toughness too , like conditions :P
But i like the ;

An idea might be that any Active condition removal also makes you invulnerable to any removed condition types for a small period of time (3 seconds?)

My ideal meta is slower. DPS be wicked quick, yo!

But one other thing: I’d like the ideal meta to be incomprehensible. There wouldn’t be some kind of dominant tactic: it would be a hodgepodge of classes and builds, with every team stranger than the next. When you have no idea what the meta is, is when the meta is ideal.

silvermember.8941:

Nuka Cola.8520:

silvermember.8941:

Significantly reduce the damage for power and making condition builds actually require something more than hitting a button. I think something like the ranger’s shortbow where you have to be position in the or hit your attack in a specific manner or location to trigger them but make the damage higher to compensate for the amount of work require.

ADDED:The point being that the main mode of damage would be power, but players can focus on critical or conditional damage.

Or introduce skills passive abilities that are only achievable for reaching a specific crit, power, vitality, toughness or condition damage threshold.

Introduce global cool downs to minimize the amount of button spamming certain classes have for all skills other than skill 1 for each weapon.

Increase animation time for all high power skills so that the oponent actually has enough time to interupt puts the skill on a 10 second CD.

Nuka Cola.8520:

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

Another useless suggestion from Nuka Cola. This is about using improving the current system not building a time machine.

game has no trinity for strategic spiking, everyone has access to spammish aoe, anet has no idea how to balance and you’re seriously even trying to find an idea to fix the current mess? After this crappy meta is gone, another will be born which is also all about spamming aoe/pets and yay WIN.

Guild wars 2 has A LOT of fundamental problems, we can all agree on that. We can also agree ARenanet never had any idea how to balance their games. Guild wars 1 certainly wasn’t balance and got progressively more unbalance as time went on.

so really, what was the point of your original comment? Bringing back those classes does absolutely nothing except feed off of your nostalgia. So short of building a time machine your suggestion is useless, they are not going to copy and paste guild wars 1 into 2.

point of my original post is, enjoy current mess cuz you aren’t getting anything much better and if it annoys you that much, go play another game that is balanced and has fun pvp. If spvp was 2v2 only then you wouldn’t be seeing the insane spam fest pvp brings to the table.

Nuka I know we all want quick fixes. We all do. However, let us not forget that even in this game’s predecessor a lot of these things did not happen overnight, or the first year of the game’s lifespan.

We can choose to be unconstructive about how we approach it, and moan to make ourselves feel justified. Or, offer our thoughts and solutions to hopefully contribute to making things better. It took me a while to make this conclusion but ultimately I think it will pay off.

Achilles.2197:

Nuka I know we all want quick fixes. We all do. However, let us not forget that even in this game’s predecessor a lot of these things did not happen overnight, or the first year of the game’s lifespan.

We can choose to be unconstructive about how we approach it, and moan to make ourselves feel justified. Or, offer our thoughts and solutions to hopefully contribute to making things better. It took me a while to make this conclusion but ultimately I think it will pay off.

Seems like a pretty naive conclusion. Also, if something is just plain crap, it does not deserve constructive criticism.

People said the same thing about GW1 before it hit it’s first anniversary.

It easily became the strongest PvP game I’ve ever played. Don’t be so quick to discredit it.

Achilles.2197:

People said the same thing about GW1 before it hit it’s first anniversary.

It easily became the strongest PvP game I’ve ever played. Don’t be so quick to discredit it.

Then again, for every 1 game that somehow climbs back up, there is 100 that do not.

I wouldn’t classify GW2 anywhere near the other 100.

My thoughts on the current state of PvP: tragic.

Examples:

Downed state – overly rewarding
Rally – excessive
Lack of healer or power heals – makes gameplay a spamming mess of AoE (as of right now) that takes tactical precision out of teamfights
Unviable professions as a result of QL nerfs – elementalist
Maps too small for such small objectives – see capricorn
Water Combat – needs a massive overhaul

Etc etc etc…

But I don’t see anything that isn’t able to be fixed.

sorrow.2364:

My ideal meta is when there is no profession with incredibly high damage, neither condition or power.

In my ideal meta, raw damage can’t kill a thing without the pressure provided by conditions, while conditions can’t kill a player without raw damage.

In my ideal meta, strong skills are slow and highly telegraphed and all professions have access to tools to interrupt them.

In my ideal meta, you can drop a guardian to take another profession as a bunker.

In my ideal meta, CCs are short-lasting but with low cooldowns, pretty much like thief’s headshot. Every profession should have access to one or two long-lasting CCs at best on high cooldown.

In my ideal meta, if I want to play burst damage, I’m not forced to pick either a Mesmer or a Thief and if I want to play conditions, I’m not forced to pick a Necro, or a Engineer or a Ranger.

Glass-cannon power meta is as unhealthy as much as condition meta. It is stupid and skill-less on the offensive side and some professions with high evasion access have obvious advantages.

Achilles.2197:

I agree with a lot of what you just said (most of it actually). The only 2 things I disagree with are in regards to interrupts and necros/conditions. I do not think every class should have easy access to interrupts, they should be centralized around mesmers (and if you ever played GW1, mesmers were the definition of interrupts). Mesmers in pvp were renowned for their skills at interrupting. You had to time your interrupts on key skills. It was all about precision. It was a very skilled role.

As for what you said about necros/conditions, well, necros have also been known for their inherent affinity towards condition control. They should have better incentives for using them/controlling them.

Other than that, HUGE +1

Edit: had to spellcheck

i’d rather not see this kind of speccing. i like about gw2 that you can solo pvp. you may not win, you may miss a lot of game and enhancement, but you’ll get core of combat mechanics. still gw2 manages to make professions distinct in ways other than breaking up combat mechanics among profs.

My ideal meta? Something where when two people fight each other, no matter what builds or traits, the fight is not over in 5s, but the fight WILL be decided in 20s at most, short of one of the players disengaging if he can. IE, the death of the builds that just won’t die.

That and something that has a big room for team fights that matter. I want to a game where positioning is important, so much that the two teams face each other uneasily, then a clash starts, then people fight, then one team is dead and the other collects some rewards.

Nuka Cola.8520:

silvermember.8941:

Nuka Cola.8520:

silvermember.8941:

Significantly reduce the damage for power and making condition builds actually require something more than hitting a button. I think something like the ranger’s shortbow where you have to be position in the or hit your attack in a specific manner or location to trigger them but make the damage higher to compensate for the amount of work require.

ADDED:The point being that the main mode of damage would be power, but players can focus on critical or conditional damage.

Or introduce skills passive abilities that are only achievable for reaching a specific crit, power, vitality, toughness or condition damage threshold.

Introduce global cool downs to minimize the amount of button spamming certain classes have for all skills other than skill 1 for each weapon.

Increase animation time for all high power skills so that the oponent actually has enough time to interupt puts the skill on a 10 second CD.

Nuka Cola.8520:

2 monks, 1 derv, 1 ranger, 1 warrior, 1 nec, 1 mez, 1 ele. garbage in gw2 isn’t a meta but a cluster*#(@ of spam

Another useless suggestion from Nuka Cola. This is about using improving the current system not building a time machine.

game has no trinity for strategic spiking, everyone has access to spammish aoe, anet has no idea how to balance and you’re seriously even trying to find an idea to fix the current mess? After this crappy meta is gone, another will be born which is also all about spamming aoe/pets and yay WIN.

Guild wars 2 has A LOT of fundamental problems, we can all agree on that. We can also agree ARenanet never had any idea how to balance their games. Guild wars 1 certainly wasn’t balance and got progressively more unbalance as time went on.

so really, what was the point of your original comment? Bringing back those classes does absolutely nothing except feed off of your nostalgia. So short of building a time machine your suggestion is useless, they are not going to copy and paste guild wars 1 into 2.

point of my original post is, enjoy current mess cuz you aren’t getting anything much better and if it annoys you that much, go play another game that is balanced and has fun pvp. If spvp was 2v2 only then you wouldn’t be seeing the insane spam fest pvp brings to the table.

Ya, non of that really fixes the meta. IF you want 2v2 say, don’t come to a this thread and complain about a 2v2 even though it won’t really fix the issues with the current meta.

If everyone complains about everything, and no one is happy, we’re in a good spot.

Everybody wants change, no body wants the change to effect them.

stof.9341:

My ideal meta? Something where when two people fight each other, no matter what builds or traits, the fight is not over in 5s, but the fight WILL be decided in 20s at most, short of one of the players disengaging if he can. IE, the death of the builds that just won’t die.

That and something that has a big room for team fights that matter. I want to a game where positioning is important, so much that the two teams face each other uneasily, then a clash starts, then people fight, then one team is dead and the other collects some rewards.

20sec means you only have single access to cooldowns

Duels shouldn’t last 20 seconds. That would be incredibly boring. The meta should never allow that if it wants combat to be in depth and engaging imo.