Guild Wars 2

Does reducing the torment from 12s to 8s really matter at all? I mean if you leave it on for 8s you will 100% die just like if you leave it on for 12s. So it really doesn’t matter in the slightest.

The only reason I can possibly see for not nerfing this skill is with adrenaline degenning out of combat then the main weapon to use with offhand sword (axe) will probably be nerfed more than any other weapon on warrior.

I never understand this change though. How hard was it to just make it 3 stacks of torment instead of 5? Or increase the CD to 25s.

Even at 8 seconds of torment this skill is absurd. Think about it logically:
1, 15s cd (compare to other 15s cd skills and see the power level)
2, Harder to cleanse than other skills
3, 5 stacks of torment is a huge amount
4, Almost no cast time
5, Basically zero animation
6, A ranged skill so cant be kited easily

All this for 5 stacks of torment on a 15s cd is ridiculous. It is so overpowered. I would swap any weapon skill on any other class in the game for this skill. It is the best weapon skill in the game all things considered.

I agree. It is indeed the best condition skill in the game. I have no idea why anet doesn’t make those changes you mentionned in your post. +1

Very good points especially about the poor animation, I can barely see it being thrown or distinguish it from the axe #3, for such a powerful effect.

I would trade it for necro staff #4.

I honestly believe Torment was the worst decision they made when adding a new condition.

Brigg.6189:

I would trade it for necro staff #4.

Wait till you compare Necromancers Dark Pact with Warriors Pin Down.

It’s these little things that make you laugh till you cry.

Oh anet, lets nerf torment on other classes on their coolest and most balanced builds like the axe/sword LB or pure condi war, and turn mesmers into a purple torment spam win class. I’m actually more afraid of condition shatter builds now that PU abuse should be less tear inducing to fight against.

Wolf.5816:

Brigg.6189:

I would trade it for necro staff #4.

Wait till you compare Necromancers Dark Pact with Warriors Pin Down.

It’s these little things that make you laugh till you cry.

Don’t stop there, you could compare signet of spite to the warrior condi utility… oh wait there’s not one.

You can’t compare class skills in a vacuum. It’s just not that simple.

I think this needs a few things to make it balanced:

1. Only 4 stacks of torment
2. Animation that is vastly distinctive to Throw Axe. Even add in a shiny effect to make it obvious.
3. Increase the cast time.

This thing is super powerful with almost no animation. A small torment duration nerf is not the way to go. It’s okay that it is powerful. It’s not okay that it’s powerful and extremely difficult to counter purposefully.

Most the time you get hit by it you are running away, I don’t see animation changes really changing anything.

Brigg.6189:

Wolf.5816:

Brigg.6189:

I would trade it for necro staff #4.

Wait till you compare Necromancers Dark Pact with Warriors Pin Down.

It’s these little things that make you laugh till you cry.

Don’t stop there, you could compare signet of spite to the warrior condi utility… oh wait there’s not one.

You can’t compare class skills in a vacuum. It’s just not that simple.

u mean the shorter CD full condi cleanse signet , or the regular broken immunity stance?
Oh, u mean offensive? well u get stupid pressure just from weapons, so you can take 3x defensive utiltys necs need 1-2x offensive just to win a 1v1
Youre right, u realy shouldnt compare stuff

a t s e.9614:

They should remove torment from all classes by the way.

I agree. Skills that keep you from moving or using skills need to be kept to a minimum and monitored carefully. It makes for bad pvp to have them just spammed in on weapon skills. My general rule of thumb, if the skill can not be found in League of Legends then its bad for pvp.

I remember WHO having a similar skill on witch elves and it was OP so it got nerfed into the ground.

I don’t know if torment should or shouldn’t exist – I would lean towards shoiuldn’t -but it lasts really long and hits really hard that being able too apply it so easily is insane.

just reflect it, or just open ur eyes, not that hard to dodge :/

Lordrosicky.5813:

I would swap any weapon skill on any other class in the game for this skill.

how about infiltrator strike ? #kappa

That skill has splenty cast time. Trying to land any melee weapon’s projectile without feeling like a spazz is absolutely impossible for me. I just get frustrated playing off-hand Sword and longbow.

Bedrax.3294:

just reflect it, or just open ur eyes, not that hard to dodge :/

>6, A ranged skill so cant be kited easily

It misses like 75% of the time if you strafe properly.

a t s e.9614:

They should remove torment from all classes by the way.

this!!

i want to instantly dish out 10 stacks of torment to any enemy who gets closer than 6000 units. plx make this for main hand focus and offhand staff elethief, kthx!

From distance is dodgable if you pay attention but in a short range is pretty hard.

And yes, it’s a very strong skill, maybe too strong but there is a little nerf in this patch.

Btw bad animation is a general problem, imho EVERY “important” skill (high damage/cc) should have telegraphated animations like the new pin down.

Necro Ds fear and staff 4 are worst, Ele s/x instant damage and guardian medi are laughable, thief gap closer, engi burning etc.

Long list.

Emphatic bond: Pet periodically removes 3 conditions from you.

Impale>EB kicks in and removes the torment>1 second later you have 2 stacks>then 3…

Even if you cleanse the first stack of torment, the remaining 4 will still apply themselves when using EB.

However in fairness, duel sword warrior is the gentle and highly forgiving build that makes newer and average players feel good. Because of this, as soon as you see the 2 swords, 99% of time it is always the opening attack they’ll use before swapping out to the ubiquitous longbow.

Kolly.9872:

a t s e.9614:

They should remove torment from all classes by the way.

this!!

Care to return our confusion post nerf?

nearlight.3064:

Oh anet, lets nerf torment on other classes on their coolest and most balanced builds like the axe/sword LB or pure condi war, and turn mesmers into a purple torment spam win class. I’m actually more afraid of condition shatter builds now that PU abuse should be less tear inducing to fight against.

So much hate for the mesmer class from you as usual. I bet you get kitten d by mesmers all the time.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Emphatic bond: Pet periodically removes 3 conditions from you.

Impale>EB kicks in and removes the torment>1 second later you have 2 stacks>then 3…

Even if you cleanse the first stack of torment, the remaining 4 will still apply themselves when using EB.

However in fairness, duel sword warrior is the gentle and highly forgiving build that makes newer and average players feel good. Because of this, as soon as you see the 2 swords, 99% of time it is always the opening attack they’ll use before swapping out to the ubiquitous longbow.

EB removes 3 conditions periodically. So it can clean just one stack of torment or clean all stacks plus burning and bleeding in one time.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Does reducing the torment from 12s to 8s really matter at all? I mean if you leave it on for 8s you will 100% die just like if you leave it on for 12s. So it really doesn’t matter in the slightest.

The only reason I can possibly see for not nerfing this skill is with adrenaline degenning out of combat then the main weapon to use with offhand sword (axe) will probably be nerfed more than any other weapon on warrior.

I never understand this change though. How hard was it to just make it 3 stacks of torment instead of 5? Or increase the CD to 25s.

Even at 8 seconds of torment this skill is absurd. Think about it logically:
1, 15s cd (compare to other 15s cd skills and see the power level)
2, Harder to cleanse than other skills
3, 5 stacks of torment is a huge amount
4, Almost no cast time
5, Basically zero animation
6, A ranged skill so cant be kited easily

All this for 5 stacks of torment on a 15s cd is ridiculous. It is so overpowered. I would swap any weapon skill on any other class in the game for this skill. It is the best weapon skill in the game all things considered.

The only thing this skill need is a proper animation + 0.5 cast time. Other than that it already can be blocked/reflected/removed/give it back to the warrior/dodged/blinded.
With the cast time and good animation is in a perfect spot.

Relentliss.2170:

a t s e.9614:

They should remove torment from all classes by the way.

My general rule of thumb, if the skill can not be found in League of Legends then its bad for pvp.

1 charracter at Dota have this skill…So devs play dota more then lol )))

If torment was a necro only skill, I think it’d actually be good for the game on multiple levels.

Flumek.9043:

Brigg.6189:

Wolf.5816:

Brigg.6189:

I would trade it for necro staff #4.

Wait till you compare Necromancers Dark Pact with Warriors Pin Down.

It’s these little things that make you laugh till you cry.

Don’t stop there, you could compare signet of spite to the warrior condi utility… oh wait there’s not one.

You can’t compare class skills in a vacuum. It’s just not that simple.

u mean the shorter CD full condi cleanse signet , or the regular broken immunity stance?
Oh, u mean offensive? well u get stupid pressure just from weapons, so you can take 3x defensive utiltys necs need 1-2x offensive just to win a 1v1
Youre right, u realy shouldnt compare stuff

My point exactly.

good change, but it could be better (nerfed harder), the skill is pretty toxic.
noone would ever think about using the follow up skill with Impale doing the damage that it does.