Guild Wars 2

Would it reduce the power creep and passive carry?
Would it increase build diversity?

We should go back even further to 30-30-10! /s

It’s not going to happen, particularly because of elite specializations.

The simplest method that this could be done having the 3 slots, where we have 2x Major Specs, and 1x Minor, which doesn’t even fully match the functionality from before (people could do 6-4-4 or even 4-4-2-2-2 if they wanted to).

With Elite specs it’d have to be redesigned.

14/14/14/14/14 masterrace

1 minor trait to unlock a whole elite spec does seem bad. Maybe move that to GM minor?

June 23 patch of 2015 imo definitely was the beginning of the crazy powercreep. Like who kitten was the pothead who thought it was a good idea to scrap the trait system that they had been balancing for 2 yrs? And when HoT was released hell was unleashed.

In the old trait system, I recall multiple traits needed involving a single utility type. For example, warrior shouts had 2 individual traits which now has been made into one trait with the new system. Also many traits were made passives, such as mantras giving additional toughness on mesmer.

One thing I liked about the specialization trait system was the philosophy of getting rid of traits-line stats. That needed to go because it limited the creativity of builds. However, traitlines still offer stat buffs (for example, gain 250 HP when you have regen in inventions).

In summary, the new trait-system gave players too many traits, thus spiking powercreep, and severely reducing the skill to play pvp.

akaCryptic.2389:

Would it reduce the power creep and passive carry?
Would it increase build diversity?

The answer to both is “not really”. You may see some gains, but you’d also see some powerful builds become even more cemented.

There was some power creep from the trait changes from the June 2015 patch, but the power creep comes predominately from elite specs. The 4 stat amulets aren’t helping either (more total stats).

The current trait system has major advantages over the old system, but ANet didn’t do a good job of capitalizing on those advantages.

• Mutual Exclusion The new system can force you to choose a trait and at the same time exclude you from having another. Mutual exclusion allows for powerful or unique traits which would have been problematic in the old system (too many possible trait pairings).
• No "Low Hanging Fruit The biggest problem with the old system was that many traits were lower in the lines but still relatively strong. That caused the same lower traits to always be taken and make most high tier traits unappealing because you had to give up multiple strong lower tier traits. Each trait needed to not only compete within its line, but with every other line; balance is extremely hard to achieve like this.
• Trait Line Cohesion Another problem with the old trait system was that most trait lines didn’t or couldn’t develop a theme(s). ANet didn’t want one aspect of a profession becoming far too strong. In addition, the low-hanging fruit problem made trait line themes – usually requiring going to grandmaster – less appealing.

So the idea is sound, but here’s where the execution went wrong:

• More total traits You used to have 14, but now you have 18. 4 additional traits is bound to power creep. Hindsight being 20/20, ANet should have considered reducing the number of traits per line, possibly on a trait-line basis (e.g. one may have 4, another may have 6).
• Trait consolidation Lots of weaker traits were rolled into a single trait, which basically gave you the equivalent of additional old traits.
• Limited use of mutual exclusion Very few traits which should compete with each other did not. In fact, ANet originally had two strong elementalist arcane traits being mutually exclusive, but changed their stance after lots of whining.
• Underdeveloped themes There was a lot of potential to re-arrange scattered traits and make them work together in a single line, but they were left scattered.

I loved the old trait system. Honestly everything post “specializations” has felt like rolling a snowball down a hill.

Also in my opinion the only justification for specializations over trait lines is the issue with stat locked trait lines. Other than that they were fine.

Loved old trait system. The extra 4 points are partly responsible with power creep.

I remember back when you could be 30-30-10-0-0 it was great perfect trait customization.

or you could also 25-15-30 or customize a lot your build. Was more fun and creative.

I disagree. The new trait system is much more elegant and effective.
Between the different amulets and the runesets available you can choose which breed of glass you want to be, since Anet hates bunkers despite forcing bunkers.

I’d like to see the old system implemented with the ability to max 3 lines still but then do some trait rearranging to avoid people getting the “all in one” type builds.

What would help with build diversity in addition to this system would be removal of the amulet system and instead just having every gear piece have selectable stats from the game (Excluding things like nomad and dire that would be too much of a problem). Then you end up with more diversity in how people build, trait, and play.

Quick reasoning as to the suggestion of selectable stats:
Some builds/profs are completely usable in places like wvw due to the ability to min max their stats in the game mode but then are unusable in pvp due to limited choices and fewer stats.

The old trait system was better, specially because you had stats attached you your distributed points. It’s what kept the balance in check. Since they removed that the balance and variety went to kitten.

The New system is functional in its current form i don’t think it will be good as the old 6-6-2 system until we have more elite specs available though. Why is that taking so long?

Exedore.6320:

akaCryptic.2389:

Would it reduce the power creep and passive carry?
Would it increase build diversity?

The answer to both is “not really”. You may see some gains, but you’d also see some powerful builds become even more cemented.

There was some power creep from the trait changes from the June 2015 patch, but the power creep comes predominately from elite specs. The 4 stat amulets aren’t helping either (more total stats).

The current trait system has major advantages over the old system, but ANet didn’t do a good job of capitalizing on those advantages.

• Mutual Exclusion The new system can force you to choose a trait and at the same time exclude you from having another. Mutual exclusion allows for powerful or unique traits which would have been problematic in the old system (too many possible trait pairings).
• No "Low Hanging Fruit The biggest problem with the old system was that many traits were lower in the lines but still relatively strong. That caused the same lower traits to always be taken and make most high tier traits unappealing because you had to give up multiple strong lower tier traits. Each trait needed to not only compete within its line, but with every other line; balance is extremely hard to achieve like this.
• Trait Line Cohesion Another problem with the old trait system was that most trait lines didn’t or couldn’t develop a theme(s). ANet didn’t want one aspect of a profession becoming far too strong. In addition, the low-hanging fruit problem made trait line themes – usually requiring going to grandmaster – less appealing.

So the idea is sound, but here’s where the execution went wrong:

• More total traits You used to have 14, but now you have 18. 4 additional traits is bound to power creep. Hindsight being 20/20, ANet should have considered reducing the number of traits per line, possibly on a trait-line basis (e.g. one may have 4, another may have 6).
• Trait consolidation Lots of weaker traits were rolled into a single trait, which basically gave you the equivalent of additional old traits.
• Limited use of mutual exclusion Very few traits which should compete with each other did not. In fact, ANet originally had two strong elementalist arcane traits being mutually exclusive, but changed their stance after lots of whining.
• Underdeveloped themes There was a lot of potential to re-arrange scattered traits and make them work together in a single line, but they were left scattered.