Guild Wars 2

1) Scrapper
2) Druid
3) Rev

Honorable mention:
4) Tempest
5) Chronobunker

So everyone saying
“everyone is OP and should be nerf except me?”

Ragnarox.9601:

Revenant (1 tier above all-need nerfing all aspects of it)
Tempest (perma 40% protection need to go to 15 sec cd, 20% dmg decrease)
Chrono(tone down all stuff by 25%)
Druid (daze from 4sec to 1 sec, 25% less heal, 30% less pet dmg)
DH (daze need to go home, increase cd of traps)
DD ( decrease vault dmg by 50%)
Reaper (decrease dmg of chill by 50% if wearing bers or marauder amulets, decrease effective hp)
Bers ( somehow balanced if they nerf those above: edit: actually gunflame needs big nerf in wvw – 15k dmg on 2.9k armor is too much)
Scrapper (somehow balanced if they nerf those above – meed minor tweaking)

Scrapper is too easily able to reset fights.

Nerf the kitten out of the stealth gyro (Seriously. ANet nerfed PU Mesmer, and for some reason thought it was a good idea to add something that has even MORE stealth than that?)
Remove reflect from electro whirl. (If it’s going to hit for 3400 & be a finisher ON A 6 SECOND COOLDOWN, it doesn’t need reflect)

Delete recovery matrix, switch out with something offensive. Hell if I know what.

And that I think is a reasonable start.

Ofc, I think its damage needs to be adjusted. But A LOT of classes need their damage adjusted.

MailMail.6534:

Terrorsquad.4802:

- Bunker Mesmer (too much pressure while sustaining 2v1 at the same time, even if the point isnt not in its favor, it can keep 2-3 enemies busy. Turret Engi 3.0)

This scenario sounds REALLY idiotic. Worse off, I can’t say I’m surprised to see statements like this. Why are 2-3 people keeping a bunker Mesmer busy on a neutral point?

Because my statement is based in general situations, not only the experienced environment. We both know u could leave 1 player on that point contesting but new/average players, which is a big part of the community, dont know.

Thats why I said Turret Engi 3.0, because they got nerfed due the big part of the community couldnt handle it.

The biggest changes needed:
Tempest: stupidly OP
bunker Mesmer: still too strong
rev: easy mode

Honorable mention:
DH traps need some adjustment

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Remove reflect from electro whirl. (If it’s going to hit for 3400 & be a finisher ON A 6 SECOND COOLDOWN, it doesn’t need reflect)

Delete recovery matrix, switch out with something offensive. Hell if I know what.

Electro Whirl has a SINGLE WHIRL FINISHER, which is the weakest finisher you can have of all. That it has reflec is totally fine, it fits perfectly because the scrapper is a full defensive trait line.

And so we come to Recovery Matrix. Replace it with something offensive on a defensive trait line… seriously, what do people expect? A defensive trait line shouldn’t be defensive nowadays?

Terrorsquad.4802:

MailMail.6534:

Terrorsquad.4802:

- Bunker Mesmer (too much pressure while sustaining 2v1 at the same time, even if the point isnt not in its favor, it can keep 2-3 enemies busy. Turret Engi 3.0)

This scenario sounds REALLY idiotic. Worse off, I can’t say I’m surprised to see statements like this. Why are 2-3 people keeping a bunker Mesmer busy on a neutral point?

Because my statement is based in general situations, not only the experienced environment. We both know u could leave 1 player on that point contesting but new/average players, which is a big part of the community, dont know.

Your statement is significantly more adverse to Mesmer balance, because simply having 3 clones is kitten OP for newer players. Mesmer, no matter how much you nerf it, will always be a hard class to fight against if you’re new.

Also, if we’re still using your “general situation”, your statement applies to ANY bunker that is capable of handling 2-3 enemies at one time. Not just Mesmer bunkers.

1. Bunker Mesmer – So powerful it actually made a team member ragequit on a ESL stream.
2. Auramancer – Condition Immunity, aura spamming, stupid ammounts of healing.
3. DHs – Traps are just way too easy to use right now in conquest.

Kodama.6453:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Remove reflect from electro whirl. (If it’s going to hit for 3400 & be a finisher ON A 6 SECOND COOLDOWN, it doesn’t need reflect)

Delete recovery matrix, switch out with something offensive. Hell if I know what.

Electro Whirl has a SINGLE WHIRL FINISHER, which is the weakest finisher you can have of all. That it has reflec is totally fine, it fits perfectly because the scrapper is a full defensive trait line.

And so we come to Recovery Matrix. Replace it with something offensive on a defensive trait line… seriously, what do people expect? A defensive trait line shouldn’t be defensive nowadays?

Oh I’m sorry.
I didn’t realize that offensive traits weren’t allowed on a trait line with Mass Momentum, Perfectly Weighted, and Expert Examination.

I apologize.
/s

Now that we’ve got that out of the way.
A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN IS UNACCEPTABLE.

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, AND 3000+ DAMAGE IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

Scrapper is defensive? Do you not see all of the offensive damage this class brings for a “defensive elite”.

Ragnarox.9601:

Revenant (1 tier above all-need nerfing all aspects of it)
Tempest (perma 40% protection need to go to 15 sec cd, 20% dmg decrease)
Chrono(tone down all stuff by 25%)
Druid (daze from 4sec to 1 sec, 25% less heal, 30% less pet dmg)
DH (daze need to go home, increase cd of traps)
DD ( decrease vault dmg by 50%)
Reaper (decrease dmg of chill by 50% if wearing bers or marauder amulets, decrease effective hp)
Bers ( somehow balanced if they nerf those above: edit: actually gunflame needs big nerf in wvw – 15k dmg on 2.9k armor is too much)
Scrapper (somehow balanced if they nerf those above – meed minor tweaking)

Scrapper Balanced?AAAAAAAAAAAAHHAHAHHAHAHHA

Terrorsquad.4802:

Mine is:

- Revenant (both DPS and Condition)
- Bunker Mesmer (too much pressure while sustaining 2v1 at the same time, even if the point isnt in its favor, it can keep 2-3 enemies busy. Turret Engi 3.0)
- DH (too many cc’s on trap)

he problem is beyond these four builds. The problem PvP is dominated by interrupt/power combos. The strategy is to make it so your opponent is stunned and helpless as their health goes from max to zero before they have any opportunity to pop any skills. The strategy comes down to being the first to get the interrupt chain going. It’s ridiculous. It’s not fun. It should have never made it out of beta testing.

But if I had to narrow the problem down to the most problematic build, it would be the four meta builds which are.

Herald – Condi Mallyx
Scrapper – Marauder Hammer
Tempest – Auramancer
Chronomancer – Alatcrity Bunker

The game would be better if every one of these builds were nerfed. To sort them by most OP to least

1. Tempest (this must be dealt with ASAP)
2. Herald (already toned down, still needs tweaking)
3. Chronomancer (already got toned down, still needs tweaking
4. Scrapper -could use a mild nerf. really not OP, difficulty to play balances it out.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Oh I’m sorry.
I didn’t realize that offensive traits weren’t allowed on a trait line with Mass Momentum, Perfectly Weighted, and Expert Examination.

Mass Momentum: Gain power based on your toughness. Also Might if ou have stability.
So we get rewarded for defensive stats (using toughness gear) → gain offense by being defensive

Expert Examination: If you stun a foe, you inflict weakness and vulnerability. Weakness is a semi-defensive mechanic, because the damage of the enemy will be reduced in the next time.

Perfectly Weighted: Damage for hammer (like close to all other weapons) and stability if you evade an attack → defense against cc

All this traits are kind of defensive. Some turn defense like stun and toughness in offense (might and vulnerability). It fits the theme. Same for Electro Whirl, reflec is defensive and turns this defense in offense.

It has 6s cd and is strong, I admit it, but the reflec lasts for one second and so it has to be timed right. I really enjoy the reflec and would hate to lose it. I would rather like to reduce the damage of Electro Whirl a bit than to get rid of its reflec.

Nerfing chronobunker seems fair… But once it done, mesmer needs a buff!!!

Let me point out some problems i have with this class, yes i main mesm…

1. Clones and phatasm have way to low health… Seeing people oneshot or AoE them down in 1 hit, just makes our lifes miserable… Especially in group fights… Mesm class is revolved alot around its clones…

2. Fix that sword blurry skill, I do hate how it works now, make it work like the revenant and other simular skills… Or atleast fix so we dont get root while using it… So annoying… Been like this since beta days…

3. Fix the “create clone on dodge trait” ( yes i forgot its name, and to lazy to look it up), you get forced into that all the time… Its way to important, and should be a class passive skill…

The chrono trait line does help a bit, but its not enough… It makes more sence having that as a passive, then the chrono trait… But having to spec one trait line to get one thing (that should be a class passive mechanic), is horrible…

4. Fix the shatter skills… Seriously, the fuq…. its really wonderful having that confusing shatter, or daze (long cd, look at kittening druid and others…), while not in condi build, and doing zero dmg… Mesm should be able to make use of those shatters in all builds… Its a class mechanic kitten, and it should do reasonable amount of dmg, becouse you shatter all ur clones while using those…

5. Forcing us into illusion when we wanna run condi, look at revenant and other classes… really, having that one “op shatter” that applies 3 stacks of confusion (doing very little dmg), ye that kills people right… Should be on pair with the scepter confusing skill… Should apply torment, bleeding and other stuff as a passive, and would Open up more builds in this class…

6. Buff staff dmg, yes it has defensive abilities blah blah blah, but the dmg is shiet really… Stop make us so dependant on the greatsword… Make it channeled, make it do something useful dmg wise………..

Only problems i have with this class! Nerfing bunkerchrono yes, I agreee, it must happen!!! But not forget about fixing the rest that needs to be looked at, and fixed for this class…

Mesm is not ezzzmode, and has never been… Like some people might think…

While the chronobunker takes some “skillz” to play successfully, I do think the learing curve is quite low… But the rest takes it mesm to do… Its not phew phew fotm class, u need some skillz to play it fairly well…

So my 3 I wanna nerf, I already mention in several other threads… But here I go…

1. Necromancer reapers… Tanky, dish out lots of dmg, “life force to healing I win button”, chill chill chill… This needs a fix, I know for a fact that there are players on this forum defending this, but it is not balanced whatsoever! And keeping distance does not help, becouse they move very fast in schroud… And not everyone run around with 100% uptime swiftness (lol) so they can get away…

2. Revs! The amount of dmg this class puts out needs to be toned down by a huge amount… hammer skill 15k one hit, crazy, just crazy… And then we have the condi thing aswell…

3. Ele. I think everyone knows that diamond skin needs to go, but there are other stuff that needs toning down too… Also buff their base hp, if nerfing… Its way to low…

Then ofc we have….

4. Druids

5. scrappers

I already mention chronobunker, and its high up there, but way behind necro, becouse it does not by any means dish out that amount of dmg, and the mobility is shiet… Ur skills for alac is ground based, you cant run out of that ring while ur attacked 2vs1, then u die… Not if u wanna trying be alive… Its a broken spec, with one purpose only, holding points…

Necros go way beyond that… We all know, “necro overlords” someone said… Yes, nerf now plz!

Also… Warrior do need a buff, even when things get toned down, i feel sorry for them… And thief, Iam not sure I agree… Ive seen thief kill people in 2-3 sec, and finish them off in stealth… I would agree you wouldnt wanna stand in that AoE as a thief, but the mobility and spike dmg window, goes beyond otehr classes.

As a thief you can allways run away, if things dont go your way… Nothing forcing you to stay there and fight 1vs2… I played alot of stealth based classes before, you never been suppose to be able to “take lots of dmg”! Its fast in and fast out…

Making them stronger in group fights then they are now, and buffing both their dmg and survivability, will make them win every 1vs1 they would encounter… Just nerf AoE, it needs toning down…

/Your friendly neighborhood rabbit

The only issue with bunker mesmer is their mobility, the rest is fine in my opinion.

Rev needs seriously some toning down in damage, I agree, or survivability, but not both.

Druid pets have more survivability than core specs…

The fact that reaper and daredevil are almost never mentioned it’s why anet doesn’t bother with forums and only aim to balance the game around pro league.
I mean the OP of this thread is a thief, 60% of the replies are from necros, ofc daredevil doesn’t need even to get mentioned because most elite specs can still deal with it but reaper…wow…do people seriously think that everybody get nerfed and reaper would be left as it is?…talk about delusional.

That chill dmg is ridiculous, “Chilled to the kitteneaper shroud spin to win” among other things…stupidly OP

The amount of necros hunting the forum is a testimony of how OP reaper is, give it time…you reapers will see your nerfs no doubt

P.S Daredevil would easily stand out once bunkers are toned down, as I said in a previous thread : nerfs come for everybody soon or later, asking for nerfs on other professions won’t save yours from the hammer of justice.

It’s like me asking for nerfs on reaper when I know tempest will get eventually nerfed….in the end both will be nerfed no doubt but those who lose now..will lose later still so…

My top 3 nerf needs are:

1- the idea that one skill nerd can solve everything. Instead we should have a proper balance team.

2-not fixing bugs should be covered by redundant buffs and nerfs idea is also nerfeable. There are too many bugs in this game.

3- Not listening the need of players and making opposite changes for money. Rangers wanted more pew pew, guardians wanted better support, ele wanted valid dps build for pvp, everyone wanted new bl to be changed, pvp match system is bad …etc what did anet do? We have a pew pew guardian and bunker ranger now (this is an example, a metaphor)

As long as these stay, this game is doomed to fail. One class nerf or bufd is just an illusion of balance, made to veil the real problems.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

I’d like to scale everything back by a large amount, and have longer (meaningful) fights.

WAT? Fight already take forever in this bunker meta. You need to nerf damage fo DH traps that are tad strong and nefr the bunk potential in general.
Fights need to last less and be way more dependent on reflexes and skill, not a crapload of boons and easy CD to 5→100% you health in 2 secs..

Coming from a Warrior perspective here….

Tempest: Hella tanky and come with great support. Their main source of damage has a decently long cooldown and is easily avoidable. Killable if CC’d. I don’t see much wrong with this other than it can potentially kill a bruiser build, which doesn’t make sense since it’s supposed to be tanky. POSSIBLE FIX: Reduce the damage output on this build.

Druid: WAY TOO MUCH DAMAGE! This build is supposed to be for tanking/supporting, but their pets are 1) Way too tanky (especially since they can be swapped out); whoever decide it was a smart idea to make it harder to kill a rangers pet is probably on crack or something… 2) Pet damage is insane…I’m looking at the current smokescale & bristleback duo. Like, da kitten is that booty?

Scrapper: Why do their defensive abilities have such high damage output? 1) Remove damage from hammer 4, compare this trait to shield 5 on warrior and it’s pretty obvious that kitten is broken. 2) hammer 3 does too much damage for an evade attack. It’s potentially like hitting nearly a full hundred blades but with evades and you move to your target…bad idea.

Chronomancer: The hell is with this sustain? For how much damage they do, they should not have that kind of sustain. Now, their damage is pretty avoidable but still deals a ridiculous amount. I suggest changing up shield 4, as well as increase the cd on Continuum Split. Alacrity is far too strong.

Revenant: Way too high of resistance up time (this is worse than diamond skin). Reduce the sources of resistance for revs. Also, torment up time is ridiculous on this class too. Sword 3 should be dodge-able. There’s no reason for the attack to continue if they missed the initial hit. Also, the slow in their downstate is pretty stupid. Just saying. Being able to access their pets during downstate is pretty broken imo.

Dragonhunter: The up time of traps is too kitten high. Their traps shouldn’t go on cd until they’re proc’d or canceled. Also the daze should have a bit of a icd. Multiple dazes in a row…really? might as well make it a stun (sarcasm). Also, true shot hits too much for a skill on only a 4 second cd. Reducing the damage on this skill would be the best bet, but increasing the cooldown could also work.

Reaper: Too much life force gain.

Warrior and Thieves as well as their elites are obviously way under powered compared to the new meta builds, so there real is no need to change these until changes are made to the other classes/elites.

General nerf: Protection. There’s way too many sources for this currently…

#EndRant.

Reborn D.2769:

So everyone saying
“everyone is OP and should be nerf except me?”

Yep they do. And naming classes they cant kill, while solo queuing.

Reborn D.2769:

So everyone saying
“everyone is OP and should be nerf except me?”

Asking for a Earth Shield nerf would be funny.

But I believe that Wash the Pain Away could enjoy a 50% heal nerf on allies. But, to even the odds, make the first pulse to 240 up from 180 and the second to 360 up to 240 radius.

Same healing to allies nerf for the guardian heal trap, and mesmer well (but I have not studied those one).

1. chrono
2. tempest
3. reaper – more then nerf, he needs some of the good things moved to base necro, which is pretty horrid without the reaper spec.

1. Chronomancer.
2. Reaper.
3. Tempest.

It is very hard to decide so I am gonna make another list.

1. Chronomancer, Reaper, Tempest, Revenant, Druid. (Way to OP and needs a big nerf)
2. Scrapper, Dragon Hunter. (Very Stronk and needs a nerf)
3. Warrior, Thief. (Is fine)

So in other words, tone down Elite specs and get rid of all masses of Blocks, evade, immunity and CC.

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

1. Chronomancer.
2. Reaper.
3. Tempest.

It is very hard to decide so I am gonna make another list.

1. Chronomancer, Reaper, Tempest, Revenant, Druid. (Way to OP and needs a big nerf)
2. Scrapper, Dragon Hunter. (Very Stronk and needs a nerf)
3. Warrior, Thief. (Is fine)

So in other words, tone down Elite specs and get rid of all masses of Blocks, evade, immunity and CC.

Reapers don t have any BLocks,Evades,Immunity they go down easy with a cc and good focus.I think you have a l2play Issue against Reaper.

1. Warrior / theif is useless – get on my level
2. Everyone else balanced.

all elites/classes should be brought down to thief/war level

Reborn D.2769:

So everyone saying
“everyone is OP and should be nerf except me?”

Pretty much this. Conclusion: Nerf everything.

Ppl just don’t have enough understanding of other classes when they make some statements. DH traps for example, they are strong yes, but they are almost all DH really has. DH is not that strong overall, quite weak actually, when ppl learn how to deal with them.

Another thing is ranger pets they apparently deal too much damage while druid is too hard to kill. Pretty much everyone seems to hate pets, even rangers themselfs. Ranger and pet combined deal pretty much the same amount of damage than other professions. And when the pet is dead ranger loses a big portion of their damage, this was a major problem in dungeons and fractals. So the damage pet deals is not a bonus ranger gets, it is more like Anet took a part of rangers damage and put it on a pet. But the thing is, pet damage is not effected by the gear ranger is using. This means that with zerk gear you will not reach the damage numbers of some other classes. Pets work well with druids because if pet is around 20% (just a rough estimate) of power ranges sustained damage output, the celestial druid has 20% of power rangers damage on top of their own, not to mention heals and sustain. So you can’t just nerf pet damage by 50% (some have been asking for) because power rangers would suffer pretty much.

Before HOT no-one was complaining about ranger pets being too powerfull (annoying they were still) but in ranger forum everyone was constantly complaining that they are too weak and die too fast in dungeons.

I have been trying to play all classes to understand how they work and how do deal with them when they are in the opposing team. I don’t really have a top 3 for nerfs, I think that if we have core profession as a baseline, even Daredevil is a way too strong.

And yes, I do main ranger and think that something should be done about it too, but nerfing pet damage is not the way to go. One thing that some rangers have asked for is to make pets optional and have the dps back to ranger when you have no pet. If Anet impemented this, they could do it so that to get a powerful pet, druids had to sacrifice something.

But to be frank, with Anet’s history with ranger, I think they just end up nerfing pets because it is the easiest fix…

Sorry if I strayed a bit off topic here

Cynz.9437:

all elites/classes should be brought down to thief/war level

do u realise how selfish u r it will make 90% of the players quit pvp

Extreme.8350:

Cynz.9437:

all elites/classes should be brought down to thief/war level

do u realise how selfish u r it will make 90% of the players quit pvp

oh rly? how come?

Remove pets and give us something else for the love of god. Pets should be optional. I main ranger and hate the pet mechanics. I think they either should be replaced or be optional without breaking the profession.

I can see how serious anet is when I still have pet name bugs. Yeah bug fix and balance is stronk!

may be thats whats needed though, get rid of passive vs passive and bring back player vs player.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Scrapper is too easily able to reset fights.

Nerf the kitten out of the stealth gyro (Seriously. ANet nerfed PU Mesmer, and for some reason thought it was a good idea to add something that has even MORE stealth than that?)
Remove reflect from electro whirl. (If it’s going to hit for 3400 & be a finisher ON A 6 SECOND COOLDOWN, it doesn’t need reflect)

Delete recovery matrix, switch out with something offensive. Hell if I know what.

And that I think is a reasonable start.

Ofc, I think its damage needs to be adjusted. But A LOT of classes need their damage adjusted.

You ever tried stealth gyro?…that thing is slow and often get stuck on random rock.

PU and especially mesmers have lots of stealth and ANET nerfed it because it was almost perma stealthed in most of fights. Actually it needs more nerfs.
Reflect on whirl only reflect projectiles so it don’t reflect 99% attacks.
Recovery matrix is fine, engies needed that protection.

Scrapper is most balanced class atm, it has medium burst capability, have good escape options and heals, very good sustain. Irenio did a good job.

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Oh I’m sorry.
I didn’t realize that offensive traits weren’t allowed on a trait line with Mass Momentum, Perfectly Weighted, and Expert Examination.

I apologize.
/s

Now that we’ve got that out of the way.
A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN IS UNACCEPTABLE.

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, AND 3000+ DAMAGE IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

Scrapper is defensive? Do you not see all of the offensive damage this class brings for a “defensive elite”.

It reflects only projectiles, 99% attacks are not projectiles unless you are using Ranger and RF on him while he used reflect. I killed few DH’s using TS with 9kdmg, It just reflected back and killed him. Plus that skill lags a lot.

Ragnarox.9601:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Scrapper is too easily able to reset fights.

Nerf the kitten out of the stealth gyro (Seriously. ANet nerfed PU Mesmer, and for some reason thought it was a good idea to add something that has even MORE stealth than that?)
Remove reflect from electro whirl. (If it’s going to hit for 3400 & be a finisher ON A 6 SECOND COOLDOWN, it doesn’t need reflect)

Delete recovery matrix, switch out with something offensive. Hell if I know what.

And that I think is a reasonable start.

Ofc, I think its damage needs to be adjusted. But A LOT of classes need their damage adjusted.

You ever tried stealth gyro?…that thing is slow and often get stuck on random rock.

PU and especially mesmers have lots of stealth and ANET nerfed it because it was almost perma stealthed in most of fights. Actually it needs more nerfs.
Reflect on whirl only reflect projectiles so it don’t reflect 99% attacks.
Recovery matrix is fine, engies needed that protection.

Scrapper is most balanced class atm, it has medium burst capability, have good escape options and heals, very good sustain. Irenio did a good job.

OMG HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAA yeah scrapper is balanced….sureeeeeee

for maradeuer they have bunker survival… totally balanced man

To the dude writing in caps lock bold font that Electro Whirl is also a finisher, you can relax that topic, because it could be removed and the skill would not lose even .01 of its value. One bolt being shot in a random direction is beyond worthless.

Hammer is a very strong HoT skill kit overall, pretty much the only shift in playstyle that the Elite spec brings. Keep in mind, in the meta Marauder might stack build, the Engineer becomes like a Warrior’s kit, very weapon heavy.

I think individually the Hammer has no skills that carry the weapon in effectiveness, (Overcharged Shot, Hip Shot). When things like Rev, Chrono and Scrapper are being brought down, I can see the smartest way putting the cooldowns on defensive skills up, damage nerfs, no thanks.

Also I haven’t used Recovery Matrix in many PvP builds, I think stability on Function Gyros give insane value outside of 1v1, and let’s your team run riskier builds.

My only wish for Scrapper offense is that Rocket Charge could be made faster, single target instead of 5 target AoE spam, and be a must-land burst ability. Hammer would be so much more fun.

i cant believe the people who are saying Scrapper is fine and also seeing DH being on the list to be nerfed….. LMAO

MailMail.6534:

Terrorsquad.4802:

MailMail.6534:

Terrorsquad.4802:

- Bunker Mesmer (too much pressure while sustaining 2v1 at the same time, even if the point isnt not in its favor, it can keep 2-3 enemies busy. Turret Engi 3.0)

This scenario sounds REALLY idiotic. Worse off, I can’t say I’m surprised to see statements like this. Why are 2-3 people keeping a bunker Mesmer busy on a neutral point?

Because my statement is based in general situations, not only the experienced environment. We both know u could leave 1 player on that point contesting but new/average players, which is a big part of the community, dont know.

Your statement is significantly more adverse to Mesmer balance, because simply having 3 clones is kitten OP for newer players. Mesmer, no matter how much you nerf it, will always be a hard class to fight against if you’re new.

Also, if we’re still using your “general situation”, your statement applies to ANY bunker that is capable of handling 2-3 enemies at one time. Not just Mesmer bunkers.

Exactly, but this is top 3 so I picked the 3 most OP in my opinion.
Not rly sure where you’re trying to go with this but this isnt rly the right thread to discuss it.

Gaaroth.2567:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

I’d like to scale everything back by a large amount, and have longer (meaningful) fights.

WAT? Fight already take forever in this bunker meta. You need to nerf damage fo DH traps that are tad strong and nefr the bunk potential in general.
Fights need to last less and be way more dependent on reflexes and skill, not a crapload of boons and easy CD to 5->100% you health in 2 secs..

I think you missed the “(meaningful)” there.

A lot of classes do way too much damage, and have way too much sustain on top of that.

However, long(er) fights are more fun than everyone going 100-0 the moment a burst build looks at them because “skill”.

I’ve played Shatter Mes & Thief pretty much from day one of me picking up this game.
There have been times when neither took much skill to get things done.

Despite them being “risky” builds.

Chaith.8256:

To the dude writing in caps lock bold font that Electro Whirl is also a finisher, you can relax that topic, because it could be removed and the skill would not lose even .01 of its value. One bolt being shot in a random direction is beyond worthless.

Hammer is a very strong HoT skill kit overall, pretty much the only shift in playstyle that the Elite spec brings. Keep in mind, in the meta Marauder might stack build, the Engineer becomes like a Warrior’s kit, very weapon heavy.

I think individually the Hammer has no skills that carry the weapon in effectiveness, (Overcharged Shot, Hip Shot). When things like Rev, Chrono and Scrapper are being brought down, I can see the smartest way putting the cooldowns on defensive skills up, damage nerfs, no thanks.

Also I haven’t used Recovery Matrix in many PvP builds, I think stability on Function Gyros give insane value outside of 1v1, and let’s your team run riskier builds.

My only wish for Scrapper offense is that Rocket Charge could be made faster, single target instead of 5 target AoE spam, and be a must-land burst ability. Hammer would be so much more fun.

The finisher doesn’t bug me.
The reflect does.

I only added emphasis on the finisher (and damage), because I believe a reflect on a 6 second CD is already over the top.
As, hilariously, the builds that have always been able to pressure an engineer, happen to be long range. cough Ranger cough
Now it doesn’t even get that, as you’ll just be able to fling a lot of its damage back, on a skill that does damage, and that I see most scrappers just mindlessly using on CD because why not? It’ll be back in 6 seconds anyway.

Also, frankly I want to reduce the protection up time every class has, which is why I picked out Recovery Matrix. Stabilization core doesn’t seem too ridiculous. I get its powerful, but it doesn’t stand out as OP to me. A little bit of stab isn’t that bad.

Supreme.3164:

The fact that reaper and daredevil are almost never mentioned it’s why anet doesn’t bother with forums and only aim to balance the game around pro league.
I mean the OP of this thread is a thief, 60% of the replies are from necros

Why would anyone mention Daredevils?
Me, as a thief, I honestly believe thief shouldnt be buffed or nerfed. The rest is just overwhelming atm and does thief’s job better for less cost.

Also I believe Pro League will indeed be a good example of whats happening, looking at the last EU Pro League’s stream. It was boring, stalemate and barely matches ending with a 500-count.

This will also be in favor for Warriors and Thieves as there arent any in the Pro League.

And yes, Im a thief, feeling useless mostly but still spamming my Vault

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

The finisher doesn’t bug me.
The reflect does.

I only added emphasis on the finisher (and damage), because I believe a reflect on a 6 second CD is already over the top.
As, hilariously, the builds that have always been able to pressure an engineer, happen to be long range. cough Ranger cough
Now it doesn’t even get that, as you’ll just be able to fling a lot of its damage back, on a skill that does damage, and that I see most scrappers just mindlessly using on CD because why not? It’ll be back in 6 seconds anyway.

Also, frankly I want to reduce the protection up time every class has, which is why I picked out Recovery Matrix. Stabilization core doesn’t seem too ridiculous. I get its powerful, but it doesn’t stand out as OP to me. A little bit of stab isn’t that bad.

Ok, so when you type something insignificant for the sake of having a second point with caps and bold font, it’s not a good thing.

Reason why Electro Whirl is used on Cooldown for damage is because it’s not a clutch ability for most Engineers – the reflect starts .5 seconds after casting, and lingers for .5 seconds after the cast. This gives you about a quarter of a second to react and reflect True Shot, so it’s better used predictively instead of reactionary, causing it to appear ‘spammed on CD’ if the Engineer didn’t predict it. That, and there’s not much else worth saving a reflect for in everyday play.

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

The fact that reaper and daredevil are almost never mentioned it’s why anet doesn’t bother with forums and only aim to balance the game around pro league.
I mean the OP of this thread is a thief, 60% of the replies are from necros

Why would anyone mention Daredevils?
Me, as a thief, I honestly believe thief shouldnt be buffed or nerfed. The rest is just overwhelming atm and does thief’s job better for less cost.

Also I believe Pro League will indeed be a good example of whats happening, looking at the last EU Pro League’s stream. It was boring, stalemate and barely matches ending with a 500-count.

This will also be in favor for Warriors and Thieves as there arent any in the Pro League.

And yes, Im a thief, feeling useless mostly but still spamming my Vault

I wouldn’t keep high hopes if I’d be you…everybody including Anet remember the age of pistolwhip and permadodge clowns with lyssa runes , given the crap base design of thieves and mesmer, the devs are now well aware of the consequences of buffing stealth based classes.

Chronomancers and Reapers are the last example of this trend and why I believe Anet now realize that buffs/nerfs should never be based on general player feedback

The only feedback that should be taken in consideration is the one coming from TOP players representative of each profession and by TOP players I mean players coming from winning teams only, you know like @Chaith for engi, @nos for necro( shame Zombify is gone), @Frostball or @helseth for mesmer, @Narcarsis for thief , @Phanta for ele and so on.

The devs do well in ignoring 3/4 of the garbage spouted on this forum

“My class is fine and take skill..the profession I lose to ,it’s OP and needs huge nerfs”..yeah right

Typical thief answer when you die to a thief

lloydst.6985

let me guess you are not running any toughness and dont know how to dodge

The same bullkitten story since launch :" lol noob put some toughness in your build, have more sustain", then come on the forum to cry if people have toughness/sustain…because it’s too much and you can’t oneshot them anymore from stealth or abusing permadodge bullkitten

Did I miss anything?

1) chrono bunker – remove the build, mesmers should never be bunkers, they should be a DPS roaming class like thief as they have been for 3 years, they have way too much survive through invuln and boons namely stab and continuum rift the rez potential is too much there is just no place for them as bunkers IN MY OPINION

2) I would have elementalists be the ultimate duelist like last meta than have a trait that makes them invincible

3) reduce the damage unrelenting assualt, or sword auto attacks, or surge of mist, or take away some evade skills from Revenant, condi rev is fine and be beaten, power rev is a lot more sustainable

Syde.5961:

Coming from a Warrior perspective here….

Tempest: Hella tanky and come with great support. Their main source of damage has a decently long cooldown and is easily avoidable. Killable if CC’d. I don’t see much wrong with this other than it can potentially kill a bruiser build, which doesn’t make sense since it’s supposed to be tanky. POSSIBLE FIX: Reduce the damage output on this build.

Druid: WAY TOO MUCH DAMAGE! This build is supposed to be for tanking/supporting, but their pets are 1) Way too tanky (especially since they can be swapped out); whoever decide it was a smart idea to make it harder to kill a rangers pet is probably on crack or something… 2) Pet damage is insane…I’m looking at the current smokescale & bristleback duo. Like, da kitten is that booty?

Scrapper: Why do their defensive abilities have such high damage output? 1) Remove damage from hammer 4, compare this trait to shield 5 on warrior and it’s pretty obvious that kitten is broken. 2) hammer 3 does too much damage for an evade attack. It’s potentially like hitting nearly a full hundred blades but with evades and you move to your target…bad idea.

Chronomancer: The hell is with this sustain? For how much damage they do, they should not have that kind of sustain. Now, their damage is pretty avoidable but still deals a ridiculous amount. I suggest changing up shield 4, as well as increase the cd on Continuum Split. Alacrity is far too strong.

Revenant: Way too high of resistance up time (this is worse than diamond skin). Reduce the sources of resistance for revs. Also, torment up time is ridiculous on this class too. Sword 3 should be dodge-able. There’s no reason for the attack to continue if they missed the initial hit. Also, the slow in their downstate is pretty stupid. Just saying. Being able to access their pets during downstate is pretty broken imo.

Dragonhunter: The up time of traps is too kitten high. Their traps shouldn’t go on cd until they’re proc’d or canceled. Also the daze should have a bit of a icd. Multiple dazes in a row…really? might as well make it a stun (sarcasm). Also, true shot hits too much for a skill on only a 4 second cd. Reducing the damage on this skill would be the best bet, but increasing the cooldown could also work.

Reaper: Too much life force gain.

Warrior and Thieves as well as their elites are obviously way under powered compared to the new meta builds, so there real is no need to change these until changes are made to the other classes/elites.

General nerf: Protection. There’s way too many sources for this currently…

#EndRant.

People are so used to ranger’s pet being non-existent, can’t hit anything, can’t do anything, so they can have a free kill on ranger.

Now when ranger’s pet becomes something, they suddenly think it’s OP instead of learning how to deal with pets…

To be fair, Smoke Assault dm has been cut by 70% post BWE3, and their auto hit like wet-noodle. Bristleback has their hp decreased from 32k to 16k, which already become very easy to kill with some cleave and stuff.

Resistance up-time of Rev has been cut drastically (up-time decreased by 250%), and I rarely see cond mallyx anymore in Rank Que.

Guess someone haven’t play much pvp recently.

Spartacus.3192:

i cant believe the people who are saying Scrapper is fine and also seeing DH being on the list to be nerfed….. LMAO

Scrapper is almost perfectly balanced, couse it does not excel in dmg and heal like other classes do. It has good sustain good dmg good heal and defense.

While DH excells in HUGE MEGA bursts ( I know I own one) and constant pressure from range or close. But it does not offer nothing else. DH is just plain dumb build that I dont even play couse its stupidly easy to make bursts or to kill someone.
Why DH dont have place in ranked META? Because Tempests nullifies their dmg with 40% protection + blocking projectile area + cause Revenants do much more dmg and heal + cause Mesmers are gods now…

Ragnarox.9601:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Oh I’m sorry.
I didn’t realize that offensive traits weren’t allowed on a trait line with Mass Momentum, Perfectly Weighted, and Expert Examination.

I apologize.
/s

Now that we’ve got that out of the way.
A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN IS UNACCEPTABLE.

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

A REFLECT ON A 6 SECOND COOL DOWN, WITH A FINISHER, AND 3000+ DAMAGE IS EVEN MORE UNACCEPTABLE

Scrapper is defensive? Do you not see all of the offensive damage this class brings for a “defensive elite”.

It reflects only projectiles, 99% attacks are not projectiles unless you are using Ranger and RF on him while he used reflect. I killed few DH’s using TS with 9kdmg, It just reflected back and killed him. Plus that skill lags a lot.

LOL..

Outside of Meta-class, yes, around 50% of the range attack in this game are projectiles.
And the spec that depend on projectiles mostly are kick out of Meta because it’s not viable. A class need random AOE + CC spam to survive in the current Meta.

Chaith.8256:

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

The finisher doesn’t bug me.
The reflect does.

I only added emphasis on the finisher (and damage), because I believe a reflect on a 6 second CD is already over the top.
As, hilariously, the builds that have always been able to pressure an engineer, happen to be long range. cough Ranger cough
Now it doesn’t even get that, as you’ll just be able to fling a lot of its damage back, on a skill that does damage, and that I see most scrappers just mindlessly using on CD because why not? It’ll be back in 6 seconds anyway.

Also, frankly I want to reduce the protection up time every class has, which is why I picked out Recovery Matrix. Stabilization core doesn’t seem too ridiculous. I get its powerful, but it doesn’t stand out as OP to me. A little bit of stab isn’t that bad.

Ok, so when you type something insignificant for the sake of having a second point with caps and bold font, it’s not a good thing.

I typed it in bold caps because the guy didn’t read what I said the first time.
Edit: And no, this isn’t back peddling.
This is me admitting I misspoke.

My first comment the only thing capped was the 6 second cooldown, which is honestly ridiculously low.
Keep it as is, increase the cooldown by say, 8 seconds. And maybe I’d let off of it.

But with everything it currently has, including the finisher, it either needs some of those things shaved off (I suggested removing the reflect), or to have its CD hit.

Extreme.8350:

Cynz.9437:

all classes should have to work for their wins like thief and war

omg you’re so selfish

lmao

Honestly they need to nerf all elite specs to the levels of Daredevil and Beserker.

Those are the ONLY balanced elite specs in this game. I’m not even going to get into which builds are super OP and need nerfed, because all of them need to get pummeled with the nerf bat repeatedly

Azukas.1426:

Honestly they need to nerf all elite specs to the levels of Daredevil and Beserker.

Those are the ONLY balanced elite specs in this game. I’m not even going to get into which builds are super OP and need nerfed, because all of them need to get pummeled with the nerf bat repeatedly

When that happen is the time when i quit pvp
1.1.1.1 with sword zzzzzz

you know mesmer used to be free kills for theif for 2 years .
Only some gimmick build which was not viable for anything had a chance.
Now we have a fighting chance and suddenly its op you guys had it too easy.
Also there was a time when hambow could sit on a point
with longbow and never die with insane passive defense.
you had you’re fun do not bring mesmers down to useless again.

1. All elite specs
2. All elite specs
3. All passives n elite specs

forum bug buhehe