Guild Wars 2

There’s blocking. I’m fine with blocking. It has counterplay, it has it’s role and price. Take a look at warrior or engi blocks. These are fine and healthy – a block is channeled leaving room for conterplay (unblockable interrupt) or at least doing what it should do – blocking damage while at the same time nor allowing for excessive damage from the character which is blocking – if you’re defending, then you’re defending.

And there’s the dragon hunter F3 cancer.

Is it channeled? Nope.
Does it respect proper counterplay? (unblockable interrupt) – Nope.
Can you prevent it’s casting, given you can’t kill it when it’s already up? – Nope.
Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time? – nope.
Can you bypass it in 1v1 matchup? If you got unblockable immobilize then that’s a big..maybe. If not, no way guard will show you his back for longer then it takes to break stun on fear (given it wasn’t blocked before it even happened).
Does it have at least a long cooldown? Well yes…ah wait, elite that renews all virtues…sooo…nope!

Yeah, this move has more cheese in it then swiss cheese factory, about time to look into it and do some balancing…

ZeftheWicked.3076:

There’s blocking. I’m fine with blocking. It has counterplay, it has it’s role and price. Take a look at warrior or engi blocks. These are fine and healthy – a block is channeled leaving room for conterplay (unblockable interrupt) or at least doing what it should do – blocking damage while at the same time nor allowing for excessive damage from the character which is blocking – if you’re defending, then you’re defending.

And there’s the dragon hunter F3 cancer.

Is it channeled? Nope.
Does it respect proper counterplay? (unblockable interrupt) – Nope.
Can you prevent it’s casting, given you can’t kill it when it’s already up? – Nope.
Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time? – nope.
Can you bypass it in 1v1 matchup? If you got unblockable immobilize then that’s a big..maybe. If not, no way guard will show you his back for longer then it takes to break stun on fear (given it wasn’t blocked before it even happened).
Does it have at least a long cooldown? Well yes…ah wait, elite that renews all virtues…sooo…nope!

Yeah, this move has more cheese in it then swiss cheese factory, about time to look into it and do some balancing…

How exactly do you propose it get nerfed? It’s a unique skill that’s fun to use albeit mildly overpowered. It may need a small shave, but not a nerfbat. I’ll address the plausability of a nerf with respect to each of your complaints:

“Is it channeled?” – Having f3 be channeled wouldn’t at all be an acceptable tradeoff (compared to base guard) unless it blocked 360 degrees. Even then it’d still be too big a nerf. DHs wouldn’t ever use f3 anymore unlessthey were retreating or playing bunker.

“Does it respect proper counterplay?” / “Can you prevent its casting…” – It is a 1/4s cast. You couldn’t interrupt that purposefully anyways. Also, it’s 1/4 of a second that the DH must spend not attacking. The obvious animation and resulting huge shield in front of them should be enough of a tell for you to change gears.

“Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time?” – You’re correct but there are plenty of other skills like this that can be made out as op when compared to similar skills across other classes.

“Can you bypass it in a 1v1 matchup?” – Yes. Disengage, kite, stealth, use your own defensive utilities/skills because you know when a DH uses f3, they’re about to lay on the hurt.

“Does it at least have a long cooldown?” – A valid argument. The cooldown could stand to have a few seconds added to it as one possible nerf.

I’d say really the only two things then that would be reasonable nerfs to this skill would be 1. a reduction in blocking time. Reduce it from 5 to 4 seconds for example or…. 2. An increase to the skill’s cd. It doesn’t have a whole lot of counterplay but it’s supposed to function as a very powerful skill, not just as a tradeoff like other blocks.

Everything about DH is awful now that we’re losing to it.

The DH F3 and Purification are without a doubt the biggest offenders in making DH obligatory over core Guardian. Proper shaves on those two and nothing else should need to be nerfed or changed about DH as long as other equally imbalanced things in other especs are shaved accordingly as well. DH is much less of a problem than Druid, Warr and Rev anyway.

Dragonhunter:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Courage
75secs cooldown
5 seconds block

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block + reflect projectile

Mesmer
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Echo_of_Memory
30 seconds total cooldown
2 blocks
internal cooldown of 10 seconds. + alacrity

Revenant
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Hibernation
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: Projectile Reflect while blocking. In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED and REFLECTED 9 seconds total
Revenant: Autoprock Shield + Cast Shield. That means a net worth of 12 seconds worth of blocking in 75 seconds
Mesmer: Double block on a 30 second cooldown. That’s aprox 9 seconds of block in 75seconds + the alacrity

Renewed focus gives me another 5 seconds of block?!!
OH MY GOD UNFAIRNESS, 10 seconds of block total on a 75 second cooldown is too powerful!!!!.
Please tell me how other classes don’t use elite skills.
If any of the DH elite skills were to become viable I would gladly swap Renewed Focus for it. But I’d have only 5 seconds of block uptime and I would carry that burden willingly.

If we had to spend 5 times blocking and unable to attack with a virtue which is the class mechanic I would’ve quit the game long ago.

DH lose offensive capabilities to carry renwed focus which is pro support.
Less QQ more Pew Pew.

If you see a white wave in front of the guard let me tell you a secret… go to its back, it doesn’t block from behind, learn to play, adapt, develope strategies.

Have you tried hitting behind them

Balancing DH is a double edged-sword. Once you understand their rotations, they are pretty easy to kill (coming from a power warrior).

holychampion.7386:

Dragonhunter:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Courage
75secs cooldown
5 seconds block

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block + reflect projectile

Mesmer
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Echo_of_Memory
30 seconds total cooldown
2 blocks
internal cooldown of 10 seconds. + alacrity

Revenant
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Hibernation
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: Projectile Reflect while blocking. In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED and REFLECTED 9 seconds total
Revenant: Autoprock Shield + Cast Shield. That means a net worth of 12 seconds worth of blocking in 75 seconds
Mesmer: Double block on a 30 second cooldown. That’s aprox 9 seconds of block in 75seconds + the alacrity

Renewed focus gives me another 5 seconds of block?!!
OH MY GOD UNFAIRNESS, 10 seconds of block total on a 75 second cooldown is too powerful!!!!.
Please tell me how other classes don’t use elite skills.
If any of the DH elite skills were to become viable I would gladly swap Renewed Focus for it. But I’d have only 5 seconds of block uptime and I would carry that burden willingly.

If we had to spend 5 times blocking and unable to attack with a virtue which is the class mechanic I would’ve quit the game long ago.

DH lose offensive capabilities to carry renwed focus which is pro support.
Less QQ more Pew Pew.

If you see a white wave in front of the guard let me tell you a secret… go to its back, it doesn’t block from behind, learn to play, adapt, develope strategies.

“Hello Apple, I am Orange. We have nothing in common except we’re both called ‘Fruit’.”

Comparing DH to Warrior to Mesmer’s block skills is a silly pursuit when DH, Warrior, and Mesmer are fundamentally nothing alike whatsoever. Forever and always, for all time.

holychampion.7386:

Dragonhunter:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Courage
75secs cooldown
5 seconds block

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block + reflect projectile

Mesmer
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Echo_of_Memory
30 seconds total cooldown
2 blocks
internal cooldown of 10 seconds. + alacrity

Revenant
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Hibernation
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: Projectile Reflect while blocking. In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED and REFLECTED 9 seconds total
Revenant: Autoprock Shield + Cast Shield. That means a net worth of 12 seconds worth of blocking in 75 seconds
Mesmer: Double block on a 30 second cooldown. That’s aprox 9 seconds of block in 75seconds + the alacrity

Renewed focus gives me another 5 seconds of block?!!
OH MY GOD UNFAIRNESS, 10 seconds of block total on a 75 second cooldown is too powerful!!!!.
Please tell me how other classes don’t use elite skills.
If any of the DH elite skills were to become viable I would gladly swap Renewed Focus for it. But I’d have only 5 seconds of block uptime and I would carry that burden willingly.

If we had to spend 5 times blocking and unable to attack with a virtue which is the class mechanic I would’ve quit the game long ago.

DH lose offensive capabilities to carry renwed focus which is pro support.
Less QQ more Pew Pew.

If you see a white wave in front of the guard let me tell you a secret… go to its back, it doesn’t block from behind, learn to play, adapt, develope strategies.

Way to justify it,

Shield of Courage is 65 seconds traited, can also be casted twice with renewed focus.

Can be used for stomping, ressing vs the blocks you mentioned that don’t (This is the biggest advantage of such a long block)

It blocks attacks for allies too if they stand behind it vs those you mentioned that don’t

Traited also breaks stuns, and grants stability so good luck CCing it.

fishball.7204:

Have you tried hitting behind them

Have you tried that on a non-thief? if you have and succeeded 1v1 then props to you, my DH opposition does not have tendency for reavealing their back when i 1v1 them and their shield of courage blocks any attempts at immobilizing them.

And even if I did succeed, hitting them behind does not break their shield of courage, so around 1/4s later they’ll be facing me anyway.

holychampion.7386:

Dragonhunter:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Courage
75secs cooldown
5 seconds block

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block + reflect projectile

Mesmer
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Echo_of_Memory
30 seconds total cooldown
2 blocks
internal cooldown of 10 seconds. + alacrity

Revenant
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Hibernation
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: Projectile Reflect while blocking. In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED and REFLECTED 9 seconds total
Revenant: Autoprock Shield + Cast Shield. That means a net worth of 12 seconds worth of blocking in 75 seconds
Mesmer: Double block on a 30 second cooldown. That’s aprox 9 seconds of block in 75seconds + the alacrity

Renewed focus gives me another 5 seconds of block?!!
OH MY GOD UNFAIRNESS, 10 seconds of block total on a 75 second cooldown is too powerful!!!!.
Please tell me how other classes don’t use elite skills.
If any of the DH elite skills were to become viable I would gladly swap Renewed Focus for it. But I’d have only 5 seconds of block uptime and I would carry that burden willingly.

If we had to spend 5 times blocking and unable to attack with a virtue which is the class mechanic I would’ve quit the game long ago.

DH lose offensive capabilities to carry renwed focus which is pro support.
Less QQ more Pew Pew.

If you see a white wave in front of the guard let me tell you a secret… go to its back, it doesn’t block from behind, learn to play, adapt, develope strategies.

What you are saying for ESL rules or even 1 guardian in a team. 100% correct, i think the issue is that the stacking of DH in ranked matches.

I mean alot of the 4-5 man premade teams ive seen run 2 DH and are obviously in team speak taking turns running the F3 skill. That with a rev giving boons in a mid fight, i found to be over the top. Then you have the ranger on a corner and with what ever the 5th is.

In ranked play where Anet cant seem to find the class balance in matches or stop people from switching. DH can be a problem with the F3 block where you can attack too. Every other class when they block they are blocking which creates a window or free damage and a even longer one in coordinated fights.

If i may, i have no idea how to balance the HOT specs and im 100% Anet doesnt know how to either since 1-2 classes die every season.

But many classes can not counter this. Warrior endure the pain can still receive condi damage. Beserker stance can still take physical damage. Anet changed stone skin and diamond skin so the class has been on nerfs since before HOT.

I mean when you say 10 sec of blocking while attacking, 5 sec of being untouchable damage, a heal with 3 condi cleanse (2x) and pulsing stability with aegis trap.

Its not to say that DH is OP in any way because most of the HOT specs are, its just that any one can pick it up and be decent at it which is causing frustration.

Add channel to F3? Sure, just give us Warrior regen heals during it.

Actually, Warriors has everything to gain because being a Warrior means that everyone is against time as Wars keep getting stronger.

Lower the 2day long cd on F3 in addition to having Warrior like healing.

There we go.

The f3 skill is pretty much on par with other blocks ingame given the cooldown and duration, it’s not even a full block, it’s 180° block.

I’d much rather see the f2 nerfed, the amount a guard can heal via this and meditations ontop of the heal skill is ridiculous for a build that isn’t using healing power or vitality.

That is OK. all fine. LOL

Saiyan.1704:

Add channel to F3? Sure, just give us Warrior regen heals during it.

Actually, Warriors has everything to gain because being a Warrior means that everyone is against time as Wars keep getting stronger.

Lower the 2day long cd on F3 in addition to having Warrior like healing.

There we go.

show me a video of a warrior healing 17k in seconds and then well talk.

Everything needs a nerf when you dont know how to counterplay it. Especially skill that last 5 sec, blocks front attacks and cooldown is 65 sec. Guess you need to practice with your necro more. Or go exploit condi cancer build like everyone else.

Please nerf mesmer’s blurred frenzy and add cast time to their shatters before doing that.

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it) and there’s reneved focus that cuts that cooldown if needed right after 3 secs of invulni (at least this one is a proper channel and doesn’t let guard attack while channeling it.).

holychampion.7386:

Dragonhunter:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Courage
75secs cooldown
5 seconds block

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block + reflect projectile

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: Projectile Reflect while blocking. In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED and REFLECTED 9 seconds total

Warrior shield doesnt reflect by default, its with the trait.
So if you count in the warrior trait, then you should also count in the guardian traits aswell, and then there is Renewed focus (wich is 3sec invul on its own also).. and then tons of aegis etc etc.. you cant really compare classes like this

And the biggest thing you miss is that warrior is blocking and cant do other stuff UNLIKE guardian.. so again nope totally not a good way to compare

All three of the F skills are considerably more powerful than the vanilla Guard version. I think buffing the normal guard virtues would be better than nerfing the DH virtues.

Its a good example of how damaging this expansion has been to the game though, totally crushes build diversity.

Kaim.5483:

Please nerf mesmer’s blurred frenzy and add cast time to their shatters before doing that.

Lol.

Mesmer and Guardians are vastly different on a myriad of levels even before looking at individual skills, so you’ve lost this one before you’ve even begun.

Specifically though, Blurred Frenzy is a rooted channel, so you can’t reposition or cast any other non-instant skills while channeling it. Shatters themselves can be used with immediacy, but doing so without clones reduces their effects dramatically.

Of course any good player knows AoE pressure nukes mesmer clones in an instant, and DH with their excessive on point aoe pressure can do away with them best of all XD

So what’s the big take away from this? Clone generation takes multiple skill use with cast times (among other conditions) to generate (some, not all), can be shut down with cleave/aoe pressure, and assuming you overcome those caveats (and its reasonable that, yes, mesmers can work around that to some degree) only then do their shatters make an impact. But here’s the kicker, you can still block/invuln/dodge those clone shatters XD

Lol

It’s only 5 seconds in duration on a 75s to 65s cooldown.
You can attack from behind or the sides.
Use unblockable skills or AoE attacks.

Signet of Might hard counters it.

Or just do the same as you do against Endure Pain, disengage and stay away during the duration instead of trying to face-tank and mash buttons.

All classes are balanced in this game, unless you face-tank damage and mash buttons, but unfortunately the people that play like that only have the intellectual capacity to play like that. Then whine on the forums.

So the forums are full of whining bad players, and the players with patience, dodge keys, knowledge and the ability to use skills situationally are just playing the game and enjoying it.

holychampion.7386:

Mesmer
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Echo_of_Memory
30 seconds total cooldown
2 blocks
internal cooldown of 10 seconds. + alacrity

Mesmer’s Shield block is channeled, it blocks multiple attacks during the duration, not just 2.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it) and there’s reneved focus that cuts that cooldown if needed right after 3 secs of invulni (at least this one is a proper channel and doesn’t let guard attack while channeling it.).

Because

And no, not everyone traits it, in fact most people don’t trait it. Especially if you look at the regular Guardian whine posts, actually we all apparently trait Hunter’s Determination because we all have 100% Stability up-time. Or something.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it)

no one traits for longer duration over hunter’s determination…

literally no one.

and this is why I take 0 of these whine posts seriously.

the effing loudmouths don’t even know what traits/skills they’re complaining about.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it)

lol

There is so many options versus “block”.

Read that to get better:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Unblockable

Print it and read it before sleep. After 2 weeks you will laugh at your own old ignorance.

Jourdelune.7456:

There is so many options versus “block”.

Read that to get better:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Unblockable

Print it and read it before sleep. After 2 weeks you will laugh at your own old ignorance.

It’s not that easy, guardian block is quite unique that it is not a channel. Channelled blocks are quite common and the counter play unblockables give is a lot higher. Because if you are blocking and you het hit by a blockable skill you are most likely not being able to react to it or you have to give up on your block. Some unblockable skills even break block like wail of doom. This resulted in a lot of unblockable skills being a lot weaker. Just compare thunderclap with reapers mark /wail of doom/static field. However guardians don’t suffer this disadvantage so unblockables are not that great against them.

Unless you use signet of might.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

There’s blocking. I’m fine with blocking. It has counterplay, it has it’s role and price. Take a look at warrior or engi blocks. These are fine and healthy – a block is channeled leaving room for conterplay (unblockable interrupt) or at least doing what it should do – blocking damage while at the same time nor allowing for excessive damage from the character which is blocking – if you’re defending, then you’re defending.

And there’s the dragon hunter F3 cancer.

Is it channeled? Nope.
Does it respect proper counterplay? (unblockable interrupt) – Nope.
Can you prevent it’s casting, given you can’t kill it when it’s already up? – Nope.
Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time? – nope.
.

Actually DH F2 & F3 are easilly disrupted, and only blocks frontal damage.

The only way for DH cast those is to use virtues with stability on f3 or use a shout with stability.

U cant just expect to spam to… even thiefs can go behind and 2 or 3 backstabs and Dh is dead…

Not knowing how to beat DH f3 situation is a huge l2p issue :\, or u just want to get close press keys and expect to win.

holychampion.7386:

Warrior
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
25 seconds cooldown
3 seconds block

Let’s analyze it further:
Warrior: In 75 seconds you will have BLOCKED 9 seconds total without the ability to attack

Fixed for you.

It helps a lot to know the classes.

Edit:
Forget to add that can be disrupted right after the use of shield stance.

Darknicrofia.2604:

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it)

no one traits for longer duration over hunter’s determination…

literally no one.

and this is why I take 0 of these whine posts seriously.

the effing loudmouths don’t even know what traits/skills they’re complaining about.

Most players are used to be carried by Anet easy damage and spam skills, most expect to press keys and do alot of damage, DH f3 counters a litle bit of that, while skill is easilly disrupted and countered, players whine cause they dont want much effort, just want their skills to do damage and win every match, GW2 dont want to think they want every to work with a few keys, i guess Anet made them to play like that…

Aeolus.3615:

Darknicrofia.2604:

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it)

no one traits for longer duration over hunter’s determination…

literally no one.

and this is why I take 0 of these whine posts seriously.

the effing loudmouths don’t even know what traits/skills they’re complaining about.

Most players are used to be carried by Anet easy damage and spam skills, most expect to press keys and do alot of damage

This is the true definition of DH. It’s the reason lot of players changed for DH in PvP.

silentnight warrior.2714:

Aeolus.3615:

Darknicrofia.2604:

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it)

no one traits for longer duration over hunter’s determination…

literally no one.

and this is why I take 0 of these whine posts seriously.

the effing loudmouths don’t even know what traits/skills they’re complaining about.

Most players are used to be carried by Anet easy damage and spam skills, most expect to press keys and do alot of damage

This is the true definition of DH. It’s the reason lot of players changed for DH in PvP.

That is another issue, stil related with that offc.

You see, balance team made pvp team remove alot os stats from that game mode, while some stats were to strong on some classes, they were fine in others, and to be fair pvp team remove stats for all classes, some classes now are super glassy with the actual stats, and they will melt against even a unsklilled DH if caught by traps, and when u get JI’ed by 2 DH with traps well… that is aoe free damage.
Game has alot of aoe in a spammy way…

Still meditrap build is to strong compared with other builds guardian/dh has…. but that is how game is suposed to work, play what Anet increases damage output (and if it is aoe the better).
That is how Anet lures players to the game, they incease damage on those classes, in hope changes are well accepted.
Remmember ranger damage with 3-4k on auto atacks patch before HoT? all they did was increase damage so rangers would not feel a week class, instead of tunning the class itself, or the game to be more accepting toward ranger gameplay, its all placebos based changes that are ruining the game.

Aeolus.3615:

ZeftheWicked.3076:

There’s blocking. I’m fine with blocking. It has counterplay, it has it’s role and price. Take a look at warrior or engi blocks. These are fine and healthy – a block is channeled leaving room for conterplay (unblockable interrupt) or at least doing what it should do – blocking damage while at the same time nor allowing for excessive damage from the character which is blocking – if you’re defending, then you’re defending.

And there’s the dragon hunter F3 cancer.

Is it channeled? Nope.
Does it respect proper counterplay? (unblockable interrupt) – Nope.
Can you prevent it’s casting, given you can’t kill it when it’s already up? – Nope.
Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time? – nope.
.

Actually DH F2 & F3 are easilly disrupted, and only blocks frontal damage.

What do you mean with disrupt? When i use magnet and pull the guardian (no stability) the block doesn’t go away.

santenal.1054:

Aeolus.3615:

ZeftheWicked.3076:

There’s blocking. I’m fine with blocking. It has counterplay, it has it’s role and price. Take a look at warrior or engi blocks. These are fine and healthy – a block is channeled leaving room for conterplay (unblockable interrupt) or at least doing what it should do – blocking damage while at the same time nor allowing for excessive damage from the character which is blocking – if you’re defending, then you’re defending.

And there’s the dragon hunter F3 cancer.

Is it channeled? Nope.
Does it respect proper counterplay? (unblockable interrupt) – Nope.
Can you prevent it’s casting, given you can’t kill it when it’s already up? – Nope.
Does it in some way limit dps loadout options, given you’re supposed to be blocking at that time? – nope.
.

Actually DH F2 & F3 are easilly disrupted, and only blocks frontal damage.

What do you mean with disrupt? When i use magnet and pull the guardian (no stability) the block doesn’t go away.

F3 adds one aegis(on 5 allies) + shield effect on 180 degree on the caster, mostly disrruptive skills against f3 are ground(360 effect so it will hit DH with f3) targeting anything else u need to hit behind them.

F3 only saves guardian from direct and frontal damage sources.

Drop supply crate near DH, carefull with trap zone and go arround it, might work, DH need to choose from facing you or get cc’ed from behind (turrets).
DH and guardian no matter health or blocks they are easy to beat(imo most easy class to beat), the issue is the meditraps builds that are most dangerous, everything else on that class it is easilly beatable.

Well, first off, F3 is meant to be a strong defensive virute on a long CD. There’s a gaping opening behind anyone using F3, whether you have it traited or not.

Renewed Focus is an elite, and there’s nothing wrong with how it resets virtues.

No one was complaining about these things to this extent until they started losing to DH

I honestly don’t mind DH f3. It has a lot of counter-play. Coming from thief, I like to drop sb4 under their feet and maybe weaponswap/go in for burst if i can get behind them without being nuked. honestly the unblockable, inexpensive, pulsing poison field by itself goes a long way though. I get that people are upset that DHs can burst while defending with it, but that’s kind of thematic of HoT. If you want to address that, there would need to be some pretty sweeping changes across the board.

Small shave? Maybe, but i can live with it as is. I can live with DHs as is in general. This is the first time for the entirety of HoT, I’ve been terrified of them as a thief, which I should be.

As for the criticism that it can be used as a communal defense… well yeah, they’re guards.

It’s probably one of the most obnoxiously designed skills in the game. Coupled with traps and longbow it is extremely oppressive. I think Anet thought that the backside window would be enough counterplay but this just doesn’t work against anyone who isn’t a keyboard turner. I wouldn’t be surprised if it does receive some changes.

I still think one of the worst parts of DH is Spear of Justice. Upon playing around with it, it seems to actually pull people out of evade frames and it looks like you can activate the pull before the spear materialises on your target – bit like the old Into Void trick that was eventually nerfed. Seems a little off.

I remember doing some pvp and most people said that DH was a joke and one of the worst to play in pvp…….now people want it nerfed even after it has already had nerfs. So t went from a joke to OP? xDE

Make that thing use stacks, like focus shield , or make guardian rooted while casting afterall is dragonhunter and they can use bow.

The amounts of blocks and heals is too much, just look how many guardians you can find in pvp, that doesnt says anything?

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Every dh white knight says “5s on 65s cooldown”.
It’s 7s (cause everyone traits it) and there’s reneved focus that cuts that cooldown if needed right after 3 secs of invulni (at least this one is a proper channel and doesn’t let guard attack while channeling it.).

I am not a white knight, I main guard for 4 years and I know all class problems and weaknesses.

Who traits it? I am not anyone and would never trait it cause stability trait trap work miracles. Dont talk in my name. You know nothing Jon Snow!

Renewed focus gives invulnerability and still you can die to condition dmg.

Warrior and Scrapper and Chrono have all channeled block with their shield skills, so why DH/guard dong have channeled block too? I WANT SAME SKILLS ON MY SHIELD. lol.

I suggest you pick some friend who plays DH/guard and learn from him what to do. Or make DH/guard and learn yourself. And stop embarrassing yourself on the forums.

And btw I encountered so many DH meta in few days, and that meta still sucks. Ill rather have fight vs 3 DH than vs 3 scrappers or other classes.

Funny well here you go.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Kaim.5483:

Please nerf mesmer’s blurred frenzy and add cast time to their shatters before doing that.

Lol.

Mesmer and Guardians are vastly different on a myriad of levels even before looking at individual skills, so you’ve lost this one before you’ve even begun.

Specifically though, Blurred Frenzy is a rooted channel, so you can’t reposition or cast any other non-instant skills while channeling it. Shatters themselves can be used with immediacy, but doing so without clones reduces their effects dramatically.

Of course any good player knows AoE pressure nukes mesmer clones in an instant, and DH with their excessive on point aoe pressure can do away with them best of all XD

So what’s the big take away from this? Clone generation takes multiple skill use with cast times (among other conditions) to generate (some, not all), can be shut down with cleave/aoe pressure, and assuming you overcome those caveats (and its reasonable that, yes, mesmers can work around that to some degree) only then do their shatters make an impact. But here’s the kicker, you can still block/invuln/dodge those clone shatters XD

Lol

Lol?

Blurred frenzy is 3s invul on a 9.75s cd which is also a burst so there you go offensive + defensive in one skill (it’s also an invul so unblockable skills are useless here). Mesmer also has 4s invul on shatter on a 42s cd that you can use twice. Then you also have those low cd block, teleport, stealth. Also guess what? You can spam your shatter while doing all those things because they don’t have cast time. Now should a class that is designed to confuse enemies with clones and use those split seconds of confusion to their advantage have more “active defense” than a class that is designed to be a bunker with no way to escape?

Clone generation? It’s not even a problem anymore with chronomancer.

Your shatter can be blocked/dodged? So is everyone else’s attack.

Kaim.5483:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Kaim.5483:

Please nerf mesmer’s blurred frenzy and add cast time to their shatters before doing that.

Lol.

Mesmer and Guardians are vastly different on a myriad of levels even before looking at individual skills, so you’ve lost this one before you’ve even begun.

Specifically though, Blurred Frenzy is a rooted channel, so you can’t reposition or cast any other non-instant skills while channeling it. Shatters themselves can be used with immediacy, but doing so without clones reduces their effects dramatically.

Of course any good player knows AoE pressure nukes mesmer clones in an instant, and DH with their excessive on point aoe pressure can do away with them best of all XD

So what’s the big take away from this? Clone generation takes multiple skill use with cast times (among other conditions) to generate (some, not all), can be shut down with cleave/aoe pressure, and assuming you overcome those caveats (and its reasonable that, yes, mesmers can work around that to some degree) only then do their shatters make an impact. But here’s the kicker, you can still block/invuln/dodge those clone shatters XD

Lol

Lol?

Blurred frenzy is 3s invul on a 9.75s cd which is also a burst so there you go offensive + defensive in one skill (it’s also an invul so unblockable skills are useless here). Mesmer also has 4s invul on shatter on a 42s cd that you can use twice. Then you also have those low cd block, teleport, stealth. Also guess what? You can spam your shatter while doing all those things because they don’t have cast time. Now should a class that is designed to confuse enemies with clones and use those split seconds of confusion to their advantage have more “active defense” than a class that is designed to be a bunker with no way to escape?

Clone generation? It’s not even a problem anymore with chronomancer.

Your shatter can be blocked/dodged? So is everyone else’s attack.

This is the problem with this forums. Please get your facts straight before acting you know it all.

• Blurred Frenzy is an EVADE not an INVULN shocking aura proc goes through it. so please, educate yourselves first people before making a claim.

Protect me Taunt also goes through it. Again it is not an Invuln.

• Second, You CANNOT SPAM shatters, shatters are dependent on clones 0 clones = 1 hit shatter with IP(If you blow it off) before you can actually spam or whatever term you wanna use on shatters, this requires heavy investment with MI, Energy/Vigor Sigils,etc. It only look spamming because all of the mesmer’s shatter skills are off CD.

• 4 Second shatter = 3 clones + yourself, You have to have the perfect scenario here. Every shatter is dependent on the number of clones. Please do not make it look like “Mesmers have a 4 second invuln” Yes IF you have 3 clones that are alive. IF you do blow it off, What else do you have for offense?

Kaim.5483:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Kaim.5483:

Please nerf mesmer’s blurred frenzy and add cast time to their shatters before doing that.

Lol.

Mesmer and Guardians are vastly different on a myriad of levels even before looking at individual skills, so you’ve lost this one before you’ve even begun.

Specifically though, Blurred Frenzy is a rooted channel, so you can’t reposition or cast any other non-instant skills while channeling it. Shatters themselves can be used with immediacy, but doing so without clones reduces their effects dramatically.

Of course any good player knows AoE pressure nukes mesmer clones in an instant, and DH with their excessive on point aoe pressure can do away with them best of all XD

So what’s the big take away from this? Clone generation takes multiple skill use with cast times (among other conditions) to generate (some, not all), can be shut down with cleave/aoe pressure, and assuming you overcome those caveats (and its reasonable that, yes, mesmers can work around that to some degree) only then do their shatters make an impact. But here’s the kicker, you can still block/invuln/dodge those clone shatters XD

Lol

Lol?

Blurred frenzy is 3s invul on a 9.75s cd which is also a burst so there you go offensive + defensive in one skill (it’s also an invul so unblockable skills are useless here). Mesmer also has 4s invul on shatter on a 42s cd that you can use twice. Then you also have those low cd block, teleport, stealth. Also guess what? You can spam your shatter while doing all those things because they don’t have cast time. Now should a class that is designed to confuse enemies with clones and use those split seconds of confusion to their advantage have more “active defense” than a class that is designed to be a bunker with no way to escape?

Clone generation? It’s not even a problem anymore with chronomancer.

Your shatter can be blocked/dodged? So is everyone else’s attack.

Your mesmer knowledge/claims show your ignorance of the class. Stickerhappy was nice in his rebuttle as he could have made a much bigger show of it.

Anyway, Blurred Frenzy is also on the MH sword weaponset. So even if you want to point at it’s low CD you’ve forgotten to point out that you have to have your weapon swap available (depending on when you use blurred frenzy and weapon swap thereafter, you may not have access to sword/blurred frenzy before that CD is up).

Also, BF isnt instant cast or a stun break. So if the mesmer is dazed/stunned he has no access to BF. It also has a cast time. And blur (the evade) is only 2.5s. It also procs retaliation, and many’a mesmer has gone down due to using this defensivly and eating unforeseen retaliation.

Neither Illusionary Reversion or Chronophantasma in the Chronomancer line themselves generate clones. First a Mesmer has to generate clones via his weapon skills (or DE, but nobody takes DE anymore) and then shatter. Shattering with these Chrono traits active allows him to get a return on his shattered clones. However any clones destroyed, even during the shattering process (running into AoE/cleave and dying) are not regenerated.

So yes, “LoL”, you have poor knowledge on what you’re trying to talk about.

Herald has some traits that counter blocking. Devastation’s Malicious Reprisal comes to mind and Invocation’s Cruel Repercussion. Though I’m not too sure about Cruel Repercussion, it deals bonus damage on next attack after one attack is negated. I don’t know if the trait’s description is saying after a negated attack, next attack can’t be blocked because it has to deal more bonus damage.

Tricky wording.

I’m guessing all classes have traits that deal/counter blocks.

Only thing I try to do is spam auto attack until the blocks end. I have mixed results with that.

Good luck all.

What’s getting annoying about this whine thread is that everyone’s lumping DH’s together, as if we all use one build. I was whispered the other day from an enemy DH and they asked how I healed for so much. The simple answer was, I’m invested in healing!!!! So when one DH hit’s like a truck, they are built for it. When another DH heals for75%, they are invested in it. None of them can do everything, it’s simply multiple variants. This thread is way off course when it comes to the exaggerations of what a DH can do.

btw, double Melee DH is the first double Melee build I’ve ever enjoyed. Four years and finally feels like a Guardian!

DeWolfe.2174:

What’s getting annoying about this whine thread is that everyone’s lumping DH’s together, as if we all use one build. I was whispered the other day from an enemy DH and they asked how I healed for so much. The simple answer was, I’m invested in healing!!!! So when one DH hit’s like a truck, they are built for it. When another DH heals for75%, they are invested in it. None of them can do everything, it’s simply multiple variants. This thread is way off course when it comes to the exaggerations of what a DH can do.

btw, double Melee DH is the first double Melee build I’ve ever enjoyed. Four years and finally feels like a Guardian!

This so much. Menders and Marauder’s amulets are both used by Dragonhunters, often on the same build for different strengths (Sustain vs. Offense), and there are a bunch of Dragonhunter builds (That run different combinations of traps and meditations). From the forum whining, we’re all running Sword+Scepter+Shield+Focus+Longbow all at the same time, with the Healing Power of Menders, Damage of Marauder, and Durability of Paladin all at the same time.

go away forum bug