many people were disappointed when gw2 came out because there were as good as no bomber builds compared to gw1.
bomber builds are used for very fast burst at the cost of your own life if you’re able to pick the right moment for it.
the most used bomber build was the necro/assassin contagion bomber.
after this stale meta it would be refreshing to have something that is a bit more bursty.. warranted that there is enough counterplay and i feel like a high risk / high reward bomber build could benefit the game.
A bomber is a type of build which purpose is to deal a high amount of AoE damage in a short amount of time, similarly to nuking or spiking, by using skills with an AoE centered on the user, therefore requiring to enter a group of foes. The main difference with spiking builds such as those based on Vow of Strength or Hundred Blades is the endangerment of the bomber, which is often a caster such as a Necromancer, an Elementalist or a Ritualist. Due to the low armor rating, the frontline position, the frequent use of Death Nova and the tendency of some builds to self-sacrifice (especially with Necromancers), a bomber usually dies in the process.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
A bomber is a type of build which purpose is to deal a high amount of AoE damage in a short amount of time, similarly to nuking or spiking, by using skills with an AoE centered on the user, therefore requiring to enter a group of foes. The main difference with spiking builds such as those based on Vow of Strength or Hundred Blades is the endangerment of the bomber, which is often a caster such as a Necromancer, an Elementalist or a Ritualist. Due to the low armor rating, the frontline position, the frequent use of Death Nova and the tendency of some builds to self-sacrifice (especially with Necromancers), a bomber usually dies in the process.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
Burst meta would just be as bad as this one. All of your deaths and all of your kills would be the result of cooldowns.
If you want a refreshing and good meta, ArenaNet just needs to balance their game. There are so many things beyond OP right now and the power creep is stupidly high.
Stability when you dodge and an instant staff charge that can crit for 10k? An infinite supply of party wide regen, vigor and protection? Being extra tanky with glassy amulet? Being able to bunker 2 points at once thanks to portal? Powerful CC on traps and a free 1200 range pull? Blowing up people with tons of condition and CC spam?
The reason why the meta is so god awful is because the balance is god awful.
Burst meta would just be as bad as this one. All of your deaths and all of your kills would be the result of cooldowns.
If you want a refreshing and good meta, ArenaNet just needs to balance their game. There are so many things beyond OP right now and the power creep is stupidly high.
deaths should obviously be the result of cooldowns, what else. why should you survive if you used everything you have?
bomber builds wouldn’t lead to a burst meta because generally they are not the best 1v1 builds so you need to support and protect them. arenanet wants fast gameplay for their esports, there you have the key to it.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
A bomber is a type of build which purpose is to deal a high amount of AoE damage in a short amount of time, similarly to nuking or spiking, by using skills with an AoE centered on the user, therefore requiring to enter a group of foes. The main difference with spiking builds such as those based on Vow of Strength or Hundred Blades is the endangerment of the bomber, which is often a caster such as a Necromancer, an Elementalist or a Ritualist. Due to the low armor rating, the frontline position, the frequent use of Death Nova and the tendency of some builds to self-sacrifice (especially with Necromancers), a bomber usually dies in the process.
I fail too see how DH isn’t a bomber build by that definition.
because it’s not a suicide build. contagion bomber killed enemies by sacrificing its own life. laying down traps involves no risk for the dh at all lol.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
@Jekkt is right..we need Akbar to return…akbar was a term used to describe this plight over the gw1 pop…god I hated that monkey necro/assassin rushing over to the quarry..there was no way to stop him..god
after this stale meta it would be refreshing to have something that is a bit more bursty.. warranted that there is enough counterplay and i feel like a high risk / high reward bomber build could benefit the game.
Adding more burst isn’t going to fix the bunkers. Adding more burst just cements the bunker meta because anything not a bunker would just get annihilated.
bombers weren’t the best 1v1 builds. they were not meant to fight prolongued fights but to nuke. in gw2 that translates to finding the right opportunity to dive in and kill, by killing yourself.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
because it’s not a suicide build. contagion bomber killed enemies by sacrificing its own life. laying down traps involves no risk for the dh at all lol.
self-sacrifice is a awful mechanic.
In order to make a suicide build effective you’d have to make the suicide effect a near guaranteed kill as otherwise if the suicide doesn’t kill anything then the death was in vain.
Of course if the suicide effect is so strong, it leads to a terrible PvP experience for anyone fighting against such a build, along with a bad experience for the bomber themselves since they are always dying.
because it’s not a suicide build. contagion bomber killed enemies by sacrificing its own life. laying down traps involves no risk for the dh at all lol.
self-sacrifice is a awful mechanic.
In order to make a suicide build effective you’d have to make the suicide effect a near guaranteed kill as otherwise if the suicide doesn’t kill anything then the death was in vain.
Of course if the suicide effect is so strong, it leads to a terrible PvP experience for anyone fighting against such a build, along with a bad experience for the bomber themselves since they are always dying.
that’s where downed state comes into play. as i said, bombers are not 1v1 fighters so it’s up to your team if your death will be (because downed state) in vain or not.
it can either lead to you wiping the whole team or your whole team getting wiped. imo that’s enough risk vs reward.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
there aren’t enough “on downed” traits to make a bomber build in gw2,
gw1 worked because it had several skills that had effects when you died, when the spell ended, or when you dropped the item, you could stack them all since you had 2 professions to go wild with.
bombers weren’t the best 1v1 builds. they were not meant to fight prolongued fights but to nuke. in gw2 that translates to finding the right opportunity to dive in and kill, by killing yourself.
If there is enough counterplay then the bomber will just end up like DH and gunflame warrior – a gimmick for killing new players in the low MMR bracket, and that has no place in high level play.
bombers weren’t the best 1v1 builds. they were not meant to fight prolongued fights but to nuke. in gw2 that translates to finding the right opportunity to dive in and kill, by killing yourself.
If there is enough counterplay then the bomber will just end up like DH and gunflame warrior – a gimmick for killing new players in the low MMR bracket, and that has no place in high level play.
that’s why i said enoug, not too much. one such a counter would for example be kiting. in gw1 a bomber had to get in melee ranger (hence why they took shadowstep) a necro in gw2 obviously can’t take shadowstep.. so you could immob the necro in order to prevent him from coming to you, or stun. your team on the other hand could cleanse you or give you stability. that’s what counterplay is.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
that’s why i said enoug, not too much. one such a counter would for example be kiting. in gw1 a bomber had to get in melee ranger (hence why they took shadowstep) a necro in gw2 obviously can’t take shadowstep.. so you could immob the necro in order to prevent him from coming to you, or stun. your team on the other hand could cleanse you or give you stability. that’s what counterplay is.
If there is any counterplay, a bomber is worthless. Killing downed is easier than rezzing. Which means any self-sacrifice build must be able to guarantee a kill as otherwise it’ll just be giving free kills to the enemy team in higher levels of play.
I fail to sere how such builds could be useful in GW2.
If you think about it, PvP in GW1 was about killing enemy team to win.
While GW2 is about not dying yourself while standing on node, your task isn’t to kill enemy players at all, you can win without hurting anybody feelings.
that’s why i said enoug, not too much. one such a counter would for example be kiting. in gw1 a bomber had to get in melee ranger (hence why they took shadowstep) a necro in gw2 obviously can’t take shadowstep.. so you could immob the necro in order to prevent him from coming to you, or stun. your team on the other hand could cleanse you or give you stability. that’s what counterplay is.
If there is any counterplay, a bomber is worthless. Killing downed is easier than rezzing. Which means any self-sacrifice build must be able to guarantee a kill as otherwise it’ll just be giving free kills to the enemy team in higher levels of play.
it would certainly be possible if anet wanted to. afaik robert gee was even a gw1 balance dev so he might remember the stuff.
Has it not occurred to you that there is perhaps a reason the devs decided not to bring bombers back in GW2?
Self-sacrifice builds will either be useless or a cheap gimmick. Period.
it’s still around in gw1. if it was deemed unhealthy it would have been nerfed dead, like many other builds before. and it’s also not a cheap gimmick but a very effective build with pros and cons.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
I fail to sere how such builds could be useful in GW2.
If you think about it, PvP in GW1 was about killing enemy team to win.
While GW2 is about not dying yourself while standing on node, your task isn’t to kill enemy players at all, you can win without hurting anybody feelings.
oh my, seems like you played too long in this meta :^)
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
it’s still around in gw1. if it was deemed unhealthy it would have been nerfed dead, like many other builds before. and it’s also not a cheap gimmick but a very effective build with pros and cons.
Oh please, Guild Wars 1 is practically in maintenance mode. Take off those Harry Potter sized rose tinted glasses of yours.
I fail to sere how such builds could be useful in GW2.
If you think about it, PvP in GW1 was about killing enemy team to win.
While GW2 is about not dying yourself while standing on node, your task isn’t to kill enemy players at all, you can win without hurting anybody feelings.
oh my, seems like you played too long in this meta :^)
Any Conquest meta is bad, because objective is bad. GW2 need redesign to Conquest objectives – and I don’t mean nodes have to be removed, but point gains should have completly different weight to make more tactics, stategies and builds useful.
it’s still around in gw1. if it was deemed unhealthy it would have been nerfed dead, like many other builds before. and it’s also not a cheap gimmick but a very effective build with pros and cons.
Oh please, Guild Wars 1 is practically in maintenance mode. Take off those Harry Potter sized rose tinted glasses of yours.
fact is, gw1 is more balanced than gw2 and has shorter queue times. i don’t need harry potter glasses to see that.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
it’s still around in gw1. if it was deemed unhealthy it would have been nerfed dead, like many other builds before. and it’s also not a cheap gimmick but a very effective build with pros and cons.
Oh please, Guild Wars 1 is practically in maintenance mode. Take off those Harry Potter sized rose tinted glasses of yours.
fact is, gw1 is more balanced than gw2 and has shorter queue times. i don’t need harry potter glasses to see that.
I see how this thread works.
It’s just another “it was better in the old days” threads written by people suffering from dangerous amounts of cognitive bias.
When I played SWTOR we had the SWG fanboys always talking about how SWG did it better, here in GW2 we just have the GW1 fanboys.
If GW1 was so good, it would still be healthy. But it’s not, it’s nothing but a dying husk.
because it’s an outdated game and the company decided to create a sequel instead of updating everything step by step like WoW.
i’m not the type of person that lives in the past but one cannot deny that gw1 pvp was more popular, had better build diversity and more interesting builds (partly because of the system).
if a company created something in the past that was deemed good, it’s not shameful to go back and look for ideas. they also tried to bring back power block mesmer (although it kinda failed).
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
problem with bringing bombers back is that then you would have to make mesmers viable like they used to be for counterplay , you know centered on interrupts ,also the type of map that the bomber was used on had multiple NPCs on a shrine that had to be nuked and killing all 6 of them was worth the death and respawn time as the shrine flipped on the death of the last NPC . even in stronghold there is no objective that would make the self-death worth it and it was always fairly useless against other players who had a modicum of heal/interrupt ability. now bringing touch rangers back would be a great 2 week interlude of hate
As a necro main I’d love a minion bomber build to be available.
In the betas you could kind of get something to work with Rise, DeathNova and Lich Form, but they changed it so lich/plague wouldn’t destroy your own minions anymore, so that build never got off the ground
Necromancer Main
Taking a break from GW2 to play various
Nintendo games..
currently there is 0 oneshotting in this meta. if you get oneshot then that’s your lack of skill. 2nd, oneshotting (if the enemy lets you) at the cost of your own life is different than simple oneshotting.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
The dynamic of Guild Wars 2 is completely different than Guild Wars 1. To really understand what is wrong with the balance of Guild Wars 2 you need to examine the job roles & functions of those job roles pertaining to the activities provided in Guild Wars 2 thus far and how they have developed. Much of the perceived imbalance is due to dramatic changes in class physics that disrupt the theory of how players have learned to play the game thus far.
I could go more in to this but I’m in the mood this morning. What’s important is that forum posters start thinking about concise and accurate ways to explain to the dev team “what is exactly wrong with the current state of the game with actual explanation behind it”. Otherwise, these posts are in vain.
I had no problem having burst builds but with only condition, they should actively land their skills.
It should not be this Malyx/Shiro Revenant turn Banish Ench, Unyielding kitten and Elite and everything dies,
Or Chronomancer places Well Precognition and everything evades or Well of Action and everything slows.
If you pay attention, that forms the %80 of a META team, they just don’t have to land any weapon skills to be effective, just turn these toggles, then you are golden.
This idea of “bomber builds” is actually what is wrong with this meta. We do not need more AoE nuking, we need less AoE nuking. All of the jacked up AoE DPS has actually destroyed a lot of the conquest dynamic.
