Guild Wars 2

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I have a question for you Amityel: How much Hp + mobility+survability skill you got on your Mesmer.
Getting nerf or not that’s not the problem, the problem is: in PVP now we see only Mesmers and Elementalists… :/

Actually, i think you got something here. Rather of constantly figthing the nerfs. I think we should encourage it from all our classes and all the traits and builds considered OP. I will promise that even after burn get’s nerfed i will simply keep creating a new powerfull burn guardian and destroy you over and over again, Infact I encourage every kitten ’’OP’’ Class. To keep creating the same build over and over again and keep them viable. Abuse the heck out of it. We should teach people the difference between making a viable build and ’’broken’’ mechanics.

BTW: I’m not sarcastic at all. I honestly agree. the source of all OP builds lies mostly with the players themselves. nearly all ridiculous bun builds up for example is due a kittenload of stacking.

I don’t want other classes nerfed, I want my class buffed. Bring necros up a slight bit.

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Wetpaw.3487:

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me.

If mesmers are playing with a lot of reflects nowadays, how about not mindlessly spamming longbow skills from afar. How about observing the skills that are activated.

There are so many bad mesmers running around now I dont know why you guys have so much trouble killing them. Mesmers still use the same old greatsword mindwrack rotation theyve always done to spike people. This burst wad insane before the patch and is still insane now.

Yes it sucks when they sneak up on you during a fight and drop you to the ground, but theyve always been able to do this and so have many other classes. Im lookin at you mr rapid fire.

The issue with mesmers now is the abnormally high stealth uptime which allows for repeated stealth bursts → no counterplay. That and the blind on shatter (bug) and a few traits.

ReaperJr.5967:

The issue with mesmers now is the abnormally high stealth uptime which allows for repeated stealth bursts -> no counterplay. That and the blind on shatter (bug) and a few traits.

In PvP stealth should have a cap. So it isn’t abnormal. Mesmers have always been able to stealth as much as they have. The problem is mesmers along with every burst spec is doing prepatch thief burst. People don’t like it because it’s from stealth, same as thief, so they will whine. Just like they whined about thief.

Honestly I think most of the people whining over mesmers are the ones who had trouble with them prepatch. Because now most of the good players have figured out builds that shrug at mesmers.

They weren’t able to stealth as long as now pre patch lol. I really hope you’re kidding. Their stealth uptime was highly buffed post patch. It’s not whining when something is evidently op.

fluxit.8247:

Wetpaw.3487:

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me.

If mesmers are playing with a lot of reflects nowadays, how about not mindlessly spamming longbow skills from afar. How about observing the skills that are activated.

There are so many bad mesmers running around now I dont know why you guys have so much trouble killing them. Mesmers still use the same old greatsword mindwrack rotation theyve always done to spike people. This burst wad insane before the patch and is still insane now.

Yes it sucks when they sneak up on you during a fight and drop you to the ground, but theyve always been able to do this and so have many other classes. Im lookin at you mr rapid fire.

I don’t play a LB Power build in spvp. Besides the LB cd bug a decent condi build can produce better results.

and I never said you can do all of that in one build for the common response “Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me."

Oh look, another one of these threads. I bet it’ll have completely unique and productive conversations. Definitely nothing like “PU is OP in 1v1/roaming” or “My build can’t counter mesmers anymore just by blocking a telegraphed mirror blade” and “I should be able to deal with the rising condi meta but also be able to deal with zerker mesmers and still be able to deal good damage because a build with a weakness makes no sense at all”. I could go on, but seriously people, play a mesmer at least for a while before you come to forums to cry. Sure you may surprise someone from stealth and burst a squishy down, but you’d be surprised how little PU offers to an organized team compared to the other options.

Wetpaw.3487:

fluxit.8247:

Wetpaw.3487:

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me.

If mesmers are playing with a lot of reflects nowadays, how about not mindlessly spamming longbow skills from afar. How about observing the skills that are activated.

There are so many bad mesmers running around now I dont know why you guys have so much trouble killing them. Mesmers still use the same old greatsword mindwrack rotation theyve always done to spike people. This burst wad insane before the patch and is still insane now.

Yes it sucks when they sneak up on you during a fight and drop you to the ground, but theyve always been able to do this and so have many other classes. Im lookin at you mr rapid fire.

I don’t play a LB Power build in spvp. Besides the LB cd bug a decent condi build can produce better results.

and I never said you can do all of that in one build for the common response “Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me."

Well, you don’t have to explain anything, since mesmers indeed can do most of those things in one build anyway.

I do think they should get automatic reveal after they stealth with PU trait on. This way a class like ranger or engineer with stealth revealing skills can have a chance if they play right.

Necrotize.2974:

Oh look, another one of these threads. I bet it’ll have completely unique and productive conversations. Definitely nothing like “PU is OP in 1v1/roaming” or “My build can’t counter mesmers anymore just by blocking a telegraphed mirror blade” and “I should be able to deal with the rising condi meta but also be able to deal with zerker mesmers and still be able to deal good damage because a build with a weakness makes no sense at all”. I could go on, but seriously people, play a mesmer at least for a while before you come to forums to cry. Sure you may surprise someone from stealth and burst a squishy down, but you’d be surprised how little PU offers to an organized team compared to the other options.

+1 .people are freaking out because there are so many mesmers. well after being underpowered and unwanted in pvp teams for so long, of course now that mesmers are strong and can actually apply dmg like other classes without having to walk an extra 10 miles, everyone unshelved their mesmers, I usually play my necro in wvw, because I was sick and tired of being a stupid veilbot. since the patch i have finally fun again in wvw on my mesmer. of course the glass mesmers have a strong burst, so does the glass thief and ele and guard and engi and warrior…… and yes PU…i dont even use it in spvp as chaotic interruption is better.
people whine about pu and chaotic interruption…well fyi people, we can only choose 1 and chaotic is way better than pu which is the only stealth that got buffed!

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

ReaperJr.5967:

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

Sorry, you seemed to have missed the conversation helseth had when he admitted to mesmer being a liability for his team.
If a Top tier mesmers admits that he could help his team more playing something else. Then yes, mesmers are underpowered compared to other classes that could fill it’s roaming role, secondly, even in ToL and the world series mesmers were taken on teams MUCH less than say an ele, or thief.

But I guess you have been following the top tier meta for a while so you of course knew that already right?

Solori.6025:

ReaperJr.5967:

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

Sorry, you seemed to have missed the conversation helseth had when he admitted to mesmer being a liability for his team.
If a Top tier mesmers admits that he could help his team more playing something else. Then yes, mesmers are underpowered compared to other classes that could fill it’s roaming role, secondly, even in ToL and the world series mesmers were taken on teams MUCH less than say an ele, or thief.

But I guess you have been following the top tier meta for a while so you of course knew that already right?

Indeed. I seem to have. Mind linking the vod or video where he said that? And how long ago was that?

Solori.6025:

ReaperJr.5967:

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

Sorry, you seemed to have missed the conversation helseth had when he admitted to mesmer being a liability for his team.
If a Top tier mesmers admits that he could help his team more playing something else. Then yes, mesmers are underpowered compared to other classes that could fill it’s roaming role, secondly, even in ToL and the world series mesmers were taken on teams MUCH less than say an ele, or thief.

But I guess you have been following the top tier meta for a while so you of course knew that already right?

i remember that and i also remember him play an evade thief. yes mesmers were completely underpowered in team pvp. our f1-f4 skills were only useful if ip trait was active, because the condis and aoes would destroy every illusion out there and render shattering useless without ip. then endless cooldowns, not enough dmg sustain, terrible access to stability, a messy trait system, horrible condi cleanse, overnerfs to the class without any buffs and then around 30 unfixed bugs…..that will sorta make u more of a liability than a great teammate!
now mesmers got fixed up and yes people that loved the class and even played with all the issues are super hyped to finally play on mes and have fun without having to improvise so much just to deal as much dmg as ANY other class. and u know we still get destroyed and no we cant blind u 24/7, there is a cooldown, we cant pu and chaotic interrupt together …..seriously just give it some time till people are used to the new mesmers and then we can talk buffs and nerfs!

ReaperJr.5967:

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

So a class is only underpowered if there’s literally no one who is good at playing it? Guess that means classes with lots of competitive players must be OP and should be nerfed right?

Eh you’re making a logical fallacy here. Just because it isn’t underpowered doesn’t mean it’s over powered. That wasn’t my point anyway. My point was that if someone could play it properly and make it viable at high level, then it isn’t underpowered.

Mesmer really needs nerf….

Their burst with shatter and mantras was already strong before patch….. now its just broken with the added condi damage.

The OP said it himself…. the build was already strong…. and it will still be strong if it is reverted back to its old functionality.

…and PU is even more broken than shatter is.

No one takes (or shouldn’t take) PU in PvP. CI and BD are so much better and works vastly better.

But your standard power shatter is Dom/Dueling/Illusions. Which doesn’t even get PU and doesn’t rely on stealth other than The Prestige (torch 4).

With that said, your standard lockdown is Dom/Dueling/Chaos and that takes CI instead of PU.

Anyways, the vast majority of people complaining about Mesmer have a complete lack of understanding of the class. Mesmer was a fairly hard class to be good at but now they made it so the build almost plays the character for you. Which isn’t a bad thing (other than cele shoutbow warrior!) but one differentiation is that Mesmers die so quick if they don’t use their cooldowns properly.

High risk, high reward. That’s the new meta and it’s not leaving.

EDIT: People are too hung up on PU when they clearly overlook that Shatter causes Blind up to 5 targets in a decent radius (240 units). With IP being baseline, that’s 4 Blind’s they can pull off if need be in rapid succession and still do their burst damage.

While I agree with some of your points, you overlooked that fact that spvp is not the only form of pvp per se. You must also take into account wvw. Moreover, blind on shatter would be OK if not for the bug affecting it atm. The main issue is that mesmer have too many active defenses WHILE being able to dish out a load of damage and cc.

It doesn’t exactly take a genius to play mesmer so I don’t really see the risk here.

I didn’t overlook WvW because we are in the PvP subforum which is exactly what I’m referencing.

I’m not entirely sure not being able to evade blind on shatter is a bug but I’ll let that play out with ANet.

As I said, Mesmer builds pretty much play themselves but that doesn’t mean it’s your old shoutbow cele Warrior. You have to time your interrupts, you have to time your blurred frenzys, you have to setup your clones/blink/mind wracks. You cannot just sit there, blow all of your cooldowns and expect to live. That’s the high risk, high reward piece.

My bad, kinda forgot about this being pvp sub forum and all. Anyway, I’m not saying mesmer is faceroll or easy, but just that compared to other classes, it has a much higher reward for a similar amount of risk. Bar ele and engi ofc.

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

u go gurl

phokus.8934:

EDIT: People are too hung up on PU when they clearly overlook that Shatter causes Blind up to 5 targets in a decent radius (240 units). With IP being baseline, that’s 4 Blind’s they can pull off if need be in rapid succession and still do their burst damage.

Mhmm, that’s why people complain about this in every second mesmer thread.

people qqing about PU dunno what are truly powerful traits ;-) and PU isnt one of them

Amityel.5324:

people qqing about PU dunno what are truly powerful traits ;-) and PU isnt one of them

Have you even played PU since patch?

just because condi shatter is more broken than PU doesn’t mean PU isnt broken also

TheBlackLeech.9360:

Amityel.5324:

people qqing about PU dunno what are truly powerful traits ;-) and PU isnt one of them

Have you even played PU since patch?

just because condi shatter is more broken than PU doesn’t mean PU isnt broken also

You are so right. Condi shatter is broken. Anet broke it when the nerfed MtD from 2 stacks to one stack. Other than that condi shatter is pretty much like it was pre-patch. Yeah it can stack more confusion but uh that’s easy enough to avoid high condi spikes from it.
As for PU. Visit the Mesmer forums. There’s been enough discussions on ways to make reduce it so it isn’t as strong you should be able to stop complaining. Same with Confounding Suggestions which is why lockdown is as strong as it is.

ReaperJr.5967:

Solori.6025:

ReaperJr.5967:

I don’t know where you got the idea that mesmer was underpowered pre patch. Ever heard of Lord helseth? Watched him play?

Most of the people who didn’t play mesmer pre patch were daunted because mesmer had a high skill floor and ceiling. Ding ding ding, what’s new?

Now post patch, bad mesmers who get carried by buff are shouting ‘we are finally viable stop crying and l2p whiners’.

Sorry, you seemed to have missed the conversation helseth had when he admitted to mesmer being a liability for his team.
If a Top tier mesmers admits that he could help his team more playing something else. Then yes, mesmers are underpowered compared to other classes that could fill it’s roaming role, secondly, even in ToL and the world series mesmers were taken on teams MUCH less than say an ele, or thief.

But I guess you have been following the top tier meta for a while so you of course knew that already right?

Indeed. I seem to have. Mind linking the vod or video where he said that? And how long ago was that?

I found the thread. The video was on an old stream that was taken off of twitch but someone seems to have gotten the transcript of it.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/balance/sPvP-Helseth-Sensotix-Quit-Mesmer/first#post3588776

Nerf this burn trash for guards and eles, their application of it and the burn strength itself, and THEN you can nerf mesmers a tad.

Henrik.7560:

Nerf this burn trash for guards and eles, their application of it and the burn strength itself, and THEN you can nerf mesmers a tad.

Mesmer doesn’t have issues vs burn guards and what about the other classes burning? Isn’t mesmer standing out more than people walking in and out of fire fields and complaining?

fluxit.8247:

Wetpaw.3487:

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me.

If mesmers are playing with a lot of reflects nowadays, how about not mindlessly spamming longbow skills from afar. How about observing the skills that are activated.

There are so many bad mesmers running around now I dont know why you guys have so much trouble killing them. Mesmers still use the same old greatsword mindwrack rotation theyve always done to spike people. This burst wad insane before the patch and is still insane now.

Yes it sucks when they sneak up on you during a fight and drop you to the ground, but theyve always been able to do this and so have many other classes. Im lookin at you mr rapid fire.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQJAsflsnha1YZawNNwsGLnGk5OgMALIoljo5hD

I didn’t complete the build but you get the idea.

Distortion – Default with F4
Reflect – Mirror Heal plus MoM trait
Blur – Sword 2
Instant casts – Default with F1-4, some weapon skills are insta
Portal – Portal
Teleport – Blink
Transform – Moa
Blinds – Torch 4
Rip boons/pass condi – Arcane Thievery
…stealth – Torch 4

Yes, they can do everything he said in one build.

Kill this thread.. plzzz. same old ppl complaining about the mesmer on all other threads… It’s just a bunch of trollers attempting to have the dev nerf the mesmer. nothing new.

Gabriell.4856:

fluxit.8247:

Wetpaw.3487:

Amityel.5324:

I can still beat them!!!

nerf my class and i will still burst pple down and they will still call for mesmer nerf
really……I hope ANET balance team has a brain and wont judge classes based on solo queuers and hot joiners

I don’t want the mesmer to be nerfed.

I would be happy if Anet gave my Ranger half of the tricks a mesmer can pull off and call skill. Forget half, how about just one thing like pets that actually hit moving targets, distortion, reflect, blur, instant casts, portal, teleport, transform, blinds, rip boons, pass condi…stealth!

The added stealth blows my mind, Mesmers shouldn’t even have access to stealth in the first place.

Show me 1 single mesmer build that can do ALL that. Show me.

If mesmers are playing with a lot of reflects nowadays, how about not mindlessly spamming longbow skills from afar. How about observing the skills that are activated.

There are so many bad mesmers running around now I dont know why you guys have so much trouble killing them. Mesmers still use the same old greatsword mindwrack rotation theyve always done to spike people. This burst wad insane before the patch and is still insane now.

Yes it sucks when they sneak up on you during a fight and drop you to the ground, but theyve always been able to do this and so have many other classes. Im lookin at you mr rapid fire.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQJAsflsnha1YZawNNwsGLnGk5OgMALIoljo5hD

I didn’t complete the build but you get the idea.

Distortion – Default with F4
Reflect – Mirror Heal plus MoM trait
Blur – Sword 2
Instant casts – Default with F1-4, some weapon skills are insta
Portal – Portal
Teleport – Blink
Transform – Moa
Blinds – Torch 4
Rip boons/pass condi – Arcane Thievery
…stealth – Torch 4

Yes, they can do everything he said in one build.

You know,the best part is,
He did not specifiy this build had to actually work, he just said it had to be all in one build.

You win sir