Guild Wars 2

A: They are not OP for any expirienced players, they will counter them always.

Here is where ANet went wrong, it scrares off casual players that want to give sPvP a try. So many I heard that went in sPvP, checked out a couple builds on Youtube, found one they want to try, just to get faceplanted into the floor by a more expirienced Burst / Glass cannon build or loltrops thief.

It is simply discouraging for the NEW players and will mean over time a dead PvP aspect in this game, my main is a warrior, sometimes i spec for glass cannon, most times i play shout support, also from time to time i play faceroll the keyboard as a thief to rack up some fast Glory points.

So in short, I USED THEM, remove these builds, I don;t care, even if I use them, i;ll make another build, just get NEW PLAYERS and CASUAL players back into PvP!!

A couple of things:

1) Yes, new players can be driven away by more experienced players. In fact, I believe that those hundred blades burst builds, among other super-burst builds, are designed specifically FOR new players. I mean, people constantly complain about these builds being OP, but people also complain about Noob-tubing in FPS’s. It’s a way for new players to feel strong.

2) The unfortunate thing about this is that new players and experienced players are playing together in matches. This means that someone like me, who sucks at PvP, will get owned by a random noob using this skill, while someone who is actually decent at PvP will stomp them pretty much every time, leading to frustration.

3) As with GW1, part of the problem is the community itself. I remember doing a hot join PvP game as a Monk in GW1 and essentially getting insulted and laughed off the team for using the Mending skill (widely considered the worst use of energy a monk could use). Nobody felt the need to instruct me, or teach me. They just thought I sucked and didn’t want me on the team, even if I helped win multiple matches. If new players seem to be having trouble, or if someone is using a particular skill that doesn’t work with their strat, the community needs to be more open about helping, rather than pushing new players away.

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/balancing-for-skill

Obly.9243:

So in short, I USED THEM, remove these builds, I don;t care, even if I use them, i;ll make another build, just get NEW PLAYERS and CASUAL players back into PvP!!

1 – Seems you never met a decent player, because those “OP” builds are counterable if you know how they work…have you ever played tpvp or just whining for hot join?

2 – If someone quits pvp instead of l2p it’s not a game problem, ppl with a brain usually try to get better and win…not just cry and ragequit…

3 – PvE is a really massive world, if you are not able to play spvp go PvE/WvsW and get easy candies…

Casual will ever be facerolled by hardcores…it’s not a matter of builds…it’s just skills, and i’m really sorry for you and for others raging bout this…but you can’t nerf experience and skills…find a serious tpvp guild and start getting better instead whining…

Everyone facerolling you now, spamming wolves and tigers into your face time ago was probably a noob too….but they didn’t quit, and now you can see the difference..

anet should implement a shortcut which give you instant victory in s/t pvp. so maybe people will stop complaining about funny stuff.
experience will make you win. and you can’t pretend a newbie to be experienced. but i think whiners want all and fast.

who quit the game did because lack of content. who did quit because something op deserve the quit.

evilapprentice.6379:

http://penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/balancing-for-skill

That brings up the problem of the poor distribution of easy to play specs. Thieves are the one of the two or three professions that have builds suited to introduce them into PvP. You can easily argue that players can always switch to the thief, but this is an MMORPG. Players in this genre are generally more attached to the class they most resonate with in than the ones most, and will tend to be more frustrated when it doesn’t function the way they want it to. If they’re not a thief in hotjoin they’re really getting the short end of the stick from their perspective.

Additionally some of these builds are effective to an extreme, and this is evident when those easy to play GC builds can instagib within 1-2 seconds. This certainly doesn’t help when the current hotjoin meta is zerg for glory. Furthermore, the lack of a much needed bridge between hotjoin and tournament PvP exacerbates the problem with understanding the feedback new players and how important it is.

Lets face it if you know a build you should know if you can counter it or not. For instance i cant for the life of me counter chatter mesmer on my ele because I am not tanky enough. However on my beast master ranger its rather simple. I can accept there are things I cant counter and builds that will rip me apart, but what most players don’t realize is that they consider every loss no matter the circumstance as something they can blame the other guy being OP for. The problem with experienced players is that they see every win as their skill alone.

I will tell you right now some builds are flat out OP but there are very few. Even backstab thief full burst isn’t actually OP. DD ele is countered by range (no one realizes this). Hundred blades does not cc on its own if the bull misses so does the skill. Necro marks can be countered by pets. Etc etc it just goes on.

Casual players deserve one thing ranked ques. Honestly we all do.

Nerf bunker eles, nerf bunker guardians and everything is good!

Dunno man, seven years later and many great warriors encountered in RA didn’t prevent the occasional wammo, warrior with fire storm and so forth, and i’m only taking warriors as an exemple, i don’t think they get disheartened for some reason.

Meanwhile it seems this type of request is tied with a more recent mentality of gamers, seen the same during SWTOR and Fallen Earth back when it was p2p, but their pvp actually included gear progression.

Frankly i don’t think packing newbies with newbies will help anyone, sure the learning curve is a bit rough when you’re mixing everyone but you’re also learning a lot more and a lot faster in the end.

Learning how to counter these builds is sort of a basis, you know, it’s pretty important.
Once you realize they arent much of a threat to you (of course you can still get caught off guard or exhausted every once in a while) a whole new other world opens before your eyes.

Pwn an all-thief team in tpvp with only 4 guys. Not sure why you whine too much about thief being OP. Study their class and learn to counter.

SUPERPOGI.1780:

Pwn an all-thief team in tpvp with only 4 guys. Not sure why you whine too much about thief being OP. Study their class and learn to counter.

LOL those ppl really went to suicide….well probably being very low ranked they actually thought that thief = win ….and they probably got this idea on forum xD Bad news for them…sometimes hurts knowing that it’s not your opponent who’s op…that’s you that suck….everyone at one point comes into this realization in every game… well not ever, someone just goes on forums and cry Running on ppl with full health and faceroll them? Yeah in hot join maybe…a thief in tpvp is just a support, both for cond dmg and for take down 50% health targets…if someone here thinks that you can kill everything with a glass cannon thief (And i don’t suggest to run glass expec in tpvp) simply never played one…even with a balanced one like mine you have always to be aware of many things…much more than, let’s say a necro or a guardian….all you can do if things are getting bad it’s go stealth and get away…but good players rarely let you do that easily…

SUPERPOGI.1780:

Pwn an all-thief team in tpvp with only 4 guys. Not sure why you whine too much about thief being OP. Study their class and learn to counter.

If rank numbers are any indication of skill, your team of 4 far outclassed those thieves. Furthermore, you’re on a bunker build. My bunker engi can easily handle two thieves while tanking, healing the team and clearing conditions. Would your team have done so well if you were non-bunker spec? Maybe, maybe not.

Slan.5496:

SUPERPOGI.1780:

Pwn an all-thief team in tpvp with only 4 guys. Not sure why you whine too much about thief being OP. Study their class and learn to counter.

If rank numbers are any indication of skill, your team of 4 far outclassed those thieves. Furthermore, you’re on a bunker build. My bunker engi can easily handle two thieves while tanking, healing the team and clearing conditions. Would your team have done so well if you were non-bunker spec? Maybe, maybe not.

Not for sure…5 thieves team is going to implode in tpvp vs almost everyone r20+ who knows just a bit about how thieves work….a bunker engi doesn’t matter at all…as i said before thief is a support class, and with 5 of them you’re going nowhere…

For clarification, I do now how to counter them, this is not the reason, its not a QQ post, I am simply saying that because of these builds we are losing a lot of intial players / casual players that wish to participate in s and tPvP.

And honestly, I welcome a larger PvP playerbase, with potentially better players when they get more expirience like the r30+.

Problem is they get put off from this because of the early stages of expirience in this PvP. L2P is NOT a valid point, I am sorry, all games you have too L2P, them coming into games to L2P should be met by for instance, as some1 in another post suggested, a rank matching system, or que list, through which people can try builds and get the basic expiriences down, before proceding more into depth. Learning how to counter glass cannon builds is of course one of these learning curves, but if new players that generally start off in hot join matches, not many start in tournament style, are immediately bombarded by HB warriors and loltrops thieves, which in overall gives them a negative expirience and thus puts them off from exploring the PvP aspect of this game further.

or so it seems to me.

Archaon.6245:

Obly.9243:

So in short, I USED THEM, remove these builds, I don;t care, even if I use them, i;ll make another build, just get NEW PLAYERS and CASUAL players back into PvP!!

1 – Seems you never met a decent player, because those “OP” builds are counterable if you know how they work…have you ever played tpvp or just whining for hot join?

2 – If someone quits pvp instead of l2p it’s not a game problem, ppl with a brain usually try to get better and win…not just cry and ragequit…

3 – PvE is a really massive world, if you are not able to play spvp go PvE/WvsW and get easy candies…

Casual will ever be facerolled by hardcores…it’s not a matter of builds…it’s just skills, and i’m really sorry for you and for others raging bout this…but you can’t nerf experience and skills…find a serious tpvp guild and start getting better instead whining…

Everyone facerolling you now, spamming wolves and tigers into your face time ago was probably a noob too….but they didn’t quit, and now you can see the difference..

You did not at all read my post correctly. This is not a QQ thread, I know how to counter glass cannons, they are not a problem for me, I simply suggested, as further explained in the above post I made, that new players / “noobs” are put off by their first encounters with these builds.

A possible fix would be a ranked list eg: rank 1-5 go into same games, and 6-10, 11-15, etc etc etc, this should more balance out people’s expirience level towards eachother.

Edit: I love how the learning curve is quite steep myself, some get put off and rather have a slow one, therefor I also suggest a spectator mode, lets say with a 3-5 minute delay of the actual match to make sure there can be no spying / cheating using this mechanism. It will give new players a good look on how people play classes, how they work and how people handle them.

Obly.9243:

A possible fix would be a ranked list eg: rank 1-5 go into same games, and 6-10, 11-15, etc etc etc, this should more balance out people’s expirience level towards eachother.

Do not think that rank always mean that someone is better…yes maybe there’s a difference between r10 and r30 …but there are also many r20s playing better than many r30s so it would not be balanced anyway…..and i personally think that being killed by someone more experienced than you should not lead to rage, it’s normal…everyone got killed when he started pvp and after sometime you’ll start to do the same to new players and so on…you will not learn much playing only vs someone at your skill level, you need to face the devil if you want to learn how to fight him…..as usual if you want to achieve something you have to suffer, and this makes your achievements also more rewarding imo..